Ruin

CornflakeCornflake Registered Users Posts: 3,346 Major grins
edited January 29, 2012 in Other Cool Shots
Criticism would be appreciated. My black-and-white processing is weak and I've been working on it.

Wupatki-bw-II-1-of-1-XL.jpg
Don
Gallery: http://cornflakeaz.smugmug.com/

Comments

  • JuanoJuano Registered Users Posts: 4,890 Major grins
    edited January 28, 2012
    I like it, it is contrasty, with good texture on the rocks. I'm not sure I like the effect that the white clouds give, but I'm not sure you can do something about it.
    Cristóbal


    www.mind-driftphoto.com
  • CrokeyCrokey Registered Users Posts: 195 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    There is a ton of potential in that location, and I love the different textures between the smooth wavey rock and the brick work(what is it by the way?), but I'm not sure the clouds are helping. You could try toning them down a bit, maybe something as simple a tone curve anchored everywhere except the highlights(or you could play with the channels to get them isolated). Maybe burn the foreground a bit as well? I think you could probably darken the image overall to give it a more moody feel which I think the subject requires. It'll be interesting to hear what others say.
    Regards,

    Colin Croke

    http://colincroke.smugmug.com/
  • CWSkopecCWSkopec Registered Users Posts: 1,325 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    The only problem I see with this image is that it isn't mine.

    I like the effect of the clouds, creating a cut out fell and emphasizing (at least on the right) that it's just a solitary wall left standing after hundreds of years.

    You've got a wonderfully compelling composition and I love the rock in the foreground, pulling the eye up and into the ruin.

    As far as your b&w treatment goes, I think you nailed it (though I am judging on my iPad, not a properly calibrated screen). You have wonderful textures through out and the b&w is highlighting the shapes and forms in the image. And isn't that what should be highlighted when color is removed from a scene?

    In other words, very nicely done! thumb.gif
    Chris
    SmugMug QA
    My Photos
  • CornflakeCornflake Registered Users Posts: 3,346 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Juano, Colin, Chris, thanks very much for commenting.

    I could go back on a clear day and avoid the clouds but I don't think it would be an improvement. I did process the clouds differently, to keep the contrast down and keep them darker, and there's more tonal variation in them than may be obvious on a screen.

    I'll see if darkening the foreground or the entire image helps. Thanks again.
    Don
    Gallery: http://cornflakeaz.smugmug.com/
  • DonRicklinDonRicklin Registered Users Posts: 5,551 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Don, is this at Wupatki? We haven't been out there in 20 yrs and 20 yrs before that. (yep, so due this year!)

    Love this stuff! Looking forward to lots of similar shots for myself! thumb.gif

    :D

    Don
    Don Ricklin - Gear: Canon EOS 5D Mark III, was Pentax K7
    'I was older then, I'm younger than that now' ....
    My Blog | Q+ | Moderator, Lightroom Forums | My Amateur Smugmug Stuff | My Blurb book Rust and Whimsy. More Rust , FaceBook     .
  • CornflakeCornflake Registered Users Posts: 3,346 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Don, yes it is. If you're going there and haven't visited much, send me a PM and I can suggest one or two photogenic places to check out.
    Don
    Gallery: http://cornflakeaz.smugmug.com/
  • DonRicklinDonRicklin Registered Users Posts: 5,551 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Don, Like I said, been that area twice, but ages ago! I'll PM with some questions.

    Thanks,

    Don
    Don Ricklin - Gear: Canon EOS 5D Mark III, was Pentax K7
    'I was older then, I'm younger than that now' ....
    My Blog | Q+ | Moderator, Lightroom Forums | My Amateur Smugmug Stuff | My Blurb book Rust and Whimsy. More Rust , FaceBook     .
  • toragstorags Registered Users Posts: 4,615 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Nice Cornflake.

    Those clouds limit how far you can go, did you try a little more shadow across the frame

    Good work
    Rags
  • NikolaiNikolai Registered Users Posts: 19,035 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Nice shot, great location and smart angle! thumb.gif
    Since you went to BW (and, btw, you could also make a one step further and go duotone, thus preserving the magnificent red color of the local rocks) it's very easy to do whatever you want with the sky, especially considering the rocks are red and the skies are blue, i.e. the humble RGB space places them in completely different channels and you can edit them independently. You can make sky completely white, you can make sky totally black, all that without affecting your rocks and ruins (no masking or selection required). deal.gif
    "May the f/stop be with you!"
  • CornflakeCornflake Registered Users Posts: 3,346 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Rags, Nikolai, thanks for the feedback. The reactions to the sky have convinced me to rethink how I handled it. It's easy enough to give it another shot.
    Don
    Gallery: http://cornflakeaz.smugmug.com/
  • DonRicklinDonRicklin Registered Users Posts: 5,551 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    I don't know what's wrong with a little dramatic sky.

    :D

    Don


    Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk
    Don Ricklin - Gear: Canon EOS 5D Mark III, was Pentax K7
    'I was older then, I'm younger than that now' ....
    My Blog | Q+ | Moderator, Lightroom Forums | My Amateur Smugmug Stuff | My Blurb book Rust and Whimsy. More Rust , FaceBook     .
  • NikolaiNikolai Registered Users Posts: 19,035 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Cornflake wrote: »
    Rags, Nikolai, thanks for the feedback. The reactions to the sky have convinced me to rethink how I handled it. It's easy enough to give it another shot.
    If you shot RAW (as you always should deal.gif) you can easily re-process this one. Compositionally it's very nice, and I don't see any exposure problems. thumb.gif
    "May the f/stop be with you!"
  • CornflakeCornflake Registered Users Posts: 3,346 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Nikolai wrote: »
    If you shot RAW (as you always should deal.gif) you can easily re-process this one. Compositionally it's very nice, and I don't see any exposure problems. thumb.gif

    I do shoot in RAW and it was fairly easy to reprocess it. :D This version is better, I think, thanks to all the suggestions.

    Wupatki-VI-1-of-1-XL.jpg
    Don
    Gallery: http://cornflakeaz.smugmug.com/
  • NikolaiNikolai Registered Users Posts: 19,035 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Cornflake wrote: »
    I do shoot in RAW and it was fairly easy to reprocess it. :D This version is better, I think, thanks to all the suggestions.
    Unless my eys or my (calibrated) monitor fail me, the change is rather subtle... headscratch.gif
    Out of curiosity, did you try to "black out" blue/cyan channels in ACR/PS to see how it would look with "infrared"-ish type of skies? Just an idea...
    "May the f/stop be with you!"
  • DonRicklinDonRicklin Registered Users Posts: 5,551 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Nikolai wrote: »
    Unless my eys or my (calibrated) monitor fail me, the change is rather subtle... headscratch.gif
    Out of curiosity, did you try to "black out" blue/cyan channels in ACR/PS to see how it would look with "infrared"-ish type of skies? Just an idea...
    They seem fairly different on my MBP, Nikolai. I put the images alone on separate tabs in my browser. Switching back and forth I can see major diferences...

    More detail in the clouds and more darkness in the foreground boulder.

    ne_nau.gif

    Don
    Don Ricklin - Gear: Canon EOS 5D Mark III, was Pentax K7
    'I was older then, I'm younger than that now' ....
    My Blog | Q+ | Moderator, Lightroom Forums | My Amateur Smugmug Stuff | My Blurb book Rust and Whimsy. More Rust , FaceBook     .
  • CornflakeCornflake Registered Users Posts: 3,346 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Nikolai, I tried the equivalent with an orange filter and local brightness adjustments in Silver Efex Pro. I didn't care for them when they were that dark. It upstaged the ruin. But I'm often wrong....
    Don
    Gallery: http://cornflakeaz.smugmug.com/
  • NikolaiNikolai Registered Users Posts: 19,035 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    DonRicklin wrote: »
    They seem fairly different on my MBP, Nikolai. I put the images alone on separate tabs in my browser. Switching back and forth I can see major diferences...

    More detail in the clouds and more darkness in the foreground boulder.

    ne_nau.gif

    Don
    Now that you pointed out where to look I can see the enhancements, too :-)
    "May the f/stop be with you!"
  • NikolaiNikolai Registered Users Posts: 19,035 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    By any chance, would you be willing to share the color version, even a small one? I'm really curious to see if my own duotone advice holds any water... I promise I won't post any modifications without your explicit permission...
    "May the f/stop be with you!"
  • CornflakeCornflake Registered Users Posts: 3,346 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Nikolai wrote: »
    By any chance, would you be willing to share the color version, even a small one? I'm really curious to see if my own duotone advice holds any water... I promise I won't post any modifications without your explicit permission...

    Coming your way in a PM, and feel free to post anything you come up with. I'd be interested to see it. I'm trying to learn and I don't have a fragile ego. :D
    Don
    Gallery: http://cornflakeaz.smugmug.com/
  • NikolaiNikolai Registered Users Posts: 19,035 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Cornflake wrote: »
    Coming your way in a PM, and feel free to post anything you come up with. I'd be interested to see it. I'm trying to learn and I don't have a fragile ego. :D

    Thanks!

    I think I meant something like that. I tried to preserve the primary rock color and neutralize the sky a bit to avoid "red skies" effect.
    I used Black and White adjustment layer with Tint option and RGB Curves Adjustment layer with most edits in Blue channel (for clouds) and Red (for general contrast)

    There is a visible halo along the top ruin border. This is mostly due to the small image size, aggressive jpeg compression and, last but not least, my personal laziness, as I didn't want to spend a lot of time on this, just wanted to get the general idea working.

    Let us know what you think, and thanks again for the opportunity! thumb.gif
    "May the f/stop be with you!"
  • DonRicklinDonRicklin Registered Users Posts: 5,551 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Hey, I like this, too! : thumb

    Thanks for sharing, Nikolai

    Don


    Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk
    Don Ricklin - Gear: Canon EOS 5D Mark III, was Pentax K7
    'I was older then, I'm younger than that now' ....
    My Blog | Q+ | Moderator, Lightroom Forums | My Amateur Smugmug Stuff | My Blurb book Rust and Whimsy. More Rust , FaceBook     .
  • CornflakeCornflake Registered Users Posts: 3,346 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    I like this! I'll have to think about how you said you did it. You're way ahead of me on processing.
    Don
    Gallery: http://cornflakeaz.smugmug.com/
  • DogdotsDogdots Registered Users Posts: 8,795 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    I really like the clouds in this photo. Gives my eyes a feeling of movement with something so stationary as the focal point.
    Mary
    www.Dogdotsphotography.com
  • NikolaiNikolai Registered Users Posts: 19,035 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Cornflake wrote: »
    I like this! I'll have to think about how you said you did it. You're way ahead of me on processing.
    I have been doing this for a while...;-) You'll get to it, no worries...
    "May the f/stop be with you!"
  • NikolaiNikolai Registered Users Posts: 19,035 Major grins
    edited January 29, 2012
    Dogdots wrote: »
    I really like the clouds in this photo. Gives my eyes a feeling of movement with something so stationary as the focal point.

    I agree. And, technically, it would be awesome to retake this shot with a ND3+ (10 stops) filter to get 30..60 second exposure and thus get the real movement.

    However, just like I said before, this image provides an awesome opportunity to reach many effects in post, since the rocks and the skies are so easy to separate.
    Basically, select sky, apply Motion blur, blend to a taste... et voila!
    Plus you get to control the wind direction ;-)

    Below is a version of just that, with 20 pixel motion blur blended at 77%. Really took me less than two minutes, most of the time spent trying to find a right blur distance and a proper opacity...
    "May the f/stop be with you!"
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