Personal Photos on Professional site

CMAldridge

How do you guys handle personal pictures. IE, pics you took with your camera at a summer cookout. You want to share them, heck, someone may even want to buy some. Why not get a small cut instead of just handing them over so they can print ones out at wal mart? It also directs traffic to your site so they can see your other work, you never know!

Where do you put them on the site? Do you make it publicly visible?

Andy

I have mine in a category only known to my family, and they're in galleries that are unlisted so nobody sees them unless I want them to see them. And I use sharegroups to share the galleries.

idiotabroad

I don't charge Grandma. End of story. And Andy has the right answer.

jasonscottphoto

We have all of ours in a category called "Personal" where every gallery has the same password. Once they know it for one, they can open all. And I have the category hidden with some javascript or css or something so customers can't see it.

Oh yeah, and really, charging family?

Demian

I wouldn't recommend it. You'll either hurt your image by showing mediocre pics, or you'll excessively censor yourself for fear of the former.

Glort

Sorry, I fail to see the relevance of Photos you took with your pro equipment". So what? Don't see it matters what the heck you took them on. I take all my pictures on " pro equipment" because I don't own anything else. To me it's just my/a Camera, never think of it as pro equipment.

AS for putting them on a Professional Website, I'd have to say if you have your happy snaps you took at grannys BBQ on the same site your customers are looking at your work on, then your site is anything BUT professional!

I shake my head when I see shooters that put their pics of flowers and mountains and other crap on their site when they are purporting to be Portrait or wedding shooters or whatever completely unrelated market they are touting to.
No one is going to hire you because they like the Pic Of a Wombat you took in the bush when they are looking for someone to shoot their wedding pics.

I think this is just a misconception by amateurs who think more and Irrelevant is better.

With sharing, I usually just cut a disk for whomever wants the pics ad give it to them. Easier for me and less trouble than uploading and mucking round. I couldn't care less if they got to K-mart or anywhere else to have them printed. The notion that these places produce crappy, reputation ruining prints is either a load of bunk or an outdated concept to me.
Whenever I have been to these places the prints are very good and dirt cheap as well.
If I want them to access pics quickly, like others have said I just make a folder on my web server and upload the pics there.
You don't have to hide your house for someone not to find it, you just don't give them your address.

Making a cut from friends or family is something I would NOT ever do.
That's one distinction between them and clients.
To me making money off friends and family is cheap, penny pinching and just low. There is no doubt anyone would be more than happy to pay whatever I asked but while they may be fine with it, I'd feel like a pathetic loser myself.

I don't have a currency with my friends and family.
We help one another out where we can with our time and effort, we don't charge one another a profit and we really don't even bother to accept payment for smaller things we may have had to pay for. If something costs me $20-30 to get for friends or family, I wouldn't dream of asking for payment or accepting it when it were inevitably offered. Next time when I need a favor, they never ask me for small amounts either.
Sure, if someone wants a canvas print and framing worth $300, I'm going to hit them up for cost price, but not a cent more.

Actually, Thinking about it, I tell a small lie.
Payment between us for work is always by food and drink. If you go to someones place to help out with something, the requirement that is well understood is you should be given coffees and cold drinks abundantly and without asking, a lunch and/or dinner should be laid on to stuff oneself with completely and generally you are able to make a complete pig of yourself the entire time you are there.
Personally, my friends and family would be happy to come over and rebuild my house as long as I kept them supplied in Pizza from my wood fired oven.
This small thing of food and drink makes work almost pleasurable and is all the payment ever required between us.

For it's all swings and roundabouts.

Not putting anyone down whom may have a different approach, cultures and mindsets may be different without being in any way wrong, just the idea of making money off MY family and friends is something I just personally find very distasteful.

Moving Pictures

Glort wrote: »

I'd have to say if you have your happy snaps you took at grannys BBQ on the same site your customers are looking at your work on, then your site is anything BUT professional!

[... hacckity ...]

To me making money off friends and family is cheap, penny pinching and just low. There is no doubt anyone would be more than happy to pay whatever I asked but while they may be fine with it, I'd feel like a pathetic loser myself.

Two things:
a) That's what Facebook is for: snapshots. Right?
b) I see no reason for family to cover costs of stuff. If Aunt Martha wants a big giclee print of that sunset pic you took in 2008, well, yeah, she should give you what it costs to order the print ...

CMAldridge

Thanks for the suggestions

You guys tripped on irrelevant details

idiotabroad wrote: »

I don't charge Grandma.

jasonscottphoto wrote: »

Oh yeah, and really, charging family?

and

Glort wrote: »

Sorry, I fail to see the relevance of Photos you took with your pro equipment". So what?

Your family and my family are probably very different. I'm mostly talking about unrelated second cousin's friends who I don't know. FWIW, if I had a grandma I probably wouldn't charge her tho.
-and-
I have pictures. I want to share them. I was not "hired" to take them. More on why I think I can/should benefit regardless of the audience below.

Glort wrote: »

.....that put their pics of flowers and mountains and other crap on their site

I agree.

If I have a specific set of pics for a small, specific group I can always create a gallery and password it.

I'm considering options for the more general word of mouth group to easily access them.

Interested in a solution that can lead people to my site. I want it to help bridge me as another person at the "BBQ" and me as the photographer. Even if they aren't looking for one. If they ever do, they may remember I'm the cool photographer guy at the BBQ and look me up. I would rather not depend on X degrees of separated people/friends/relatives for them to get back in touch with me.

My activities tend to be physically spread out, it's much easier to deliver electronically. I tried the disc method, and no one would ever be in the right place at the right time.

Why should walmart get $$$ for prints instead of smugmug, bay labs and/or ezprints who take care of me?

And...why charge someone who may be considered a family member, friend or relative? Here's my experience:

1) In my automotive profession I could be very busy doing work for free for friends and family. You have to draw the line very quickly.

2) I contributed to a small theatre company for a couple of years recently. The founder liked to discount and give away tickets to "friends". A large number could claim the friend card. It made it very difficult to even cover costs.

3) I don't get much on the reciprocal, mostly because I'm capable at many different "trades" and there are many I will do for free. Need help with your roof? I'm there, just feed me. Need me to do something I consider a profession? Pay up. The list of people who get professional free help is very small, and most of those still argue to pay me.

Your results may and probably do vary.

Friend and family are where it starts. If I keep doing everything for free for those who know me I'll never get off the ground!

Moving Pictures

CMAldridge wrote: »

Friend and family are where it starts. If I keep doing everything for free
for those who know me I'll never get off the ground!

My Scottish genes, which are small in number but congregate tightly around my wallet, agree with you ...

idiotabroad

I think I can put my finger on this one. Your're not a professional photographer but want to get paid like you are. If you have a legit business with all the little things like cards and ad's in local papers to the very very big things like your own studio then you can and will get paid. My personal preference I have all of the above and I never charge family or anyone they work with or deal with daily. They pay prints at cost but nothing more. This does two things for me. 1 makes my life easier to deal with family and friends as most can't bitch about free service, this is art remember everyone complains at some point. 2 this is the big one so listen up. FREE advertising. Yes I lose some of my time but it's well worth it. I can't count how many paying customers I get because they saw my prints at a friends house.

Back to the original question, easy answer; lock down galleries.

Last piece of advice to get you off the ground, don't ever use your family to boost your next career move.

Nikolai

Andy wrote: »

I have mine in a category only known to my family, and they're in galleries that are unlisted so nobody sees them unless I want them to see them. And I use sharegroups to share the galleries.

+1 Same here.

CMAldridge

Thanks Mark,

I really respect your opinion. Professional photographer, no. Aspiring yes. One way I know of to be a professional is to act like a professional.

Getting off topic, but none the less important to business: I have to point out that a gripe I've run across is professional photographers complaining about amateurs undercutting the market. Which is better, do your work for free, or try to bear the market and get paid accordingly? This is a struggle I am dealing with on a conference I may elect to do again. The first time, on a referral from a friend to her friend, was free. Expenses mostly paid and a nice thank you. No print sales, no further recognition save for a couple of golfing guys who crashed in on the banquet and wanted a picture for their website for free. Lots of work, 12 hour days for 2 days and PP time. That sounds like something that I should be getting paid to do.

I am taking this professional decision seriously. Practice, study, training, etc. Cards? yes, website? yes, studio? working on it. If i can't realize revenue one day, it's all for fun. I'm not willing to be that invested in it for fun.

Your business model works for you. That's great. Personally my free advertising that I have done in the last few years has only led to those that want free work.

While I may not be a fully invested professional photographer (yet), I am a fully certified automotive professional. Same thing, free led to free or cheap. Even freebies complain, that's people, art or not. And because I did it for free or cheap, my work had little value so they'll just take it to a real shop! Trust me, it happens!

On the last one, personal referrals and word of mouth are a huge asset. I think what I'm considering friends (of friends), and what you are considering referrals could be the same thing based on your example about your print at your friends house.

idiotabroad

Keep at it Chris, sounds like your're on the right path.