Senior From Today And A Question

Bryce Wilson

Just did this session this morning and picked a few to post. I did a bunch more, but haven't got to them yet. I did a quicky yearbook shot of him at the last minute a couple weeks ago and his parents really liked it and booked an outdoor session.

This is going to be the first full year that I am shooting seniors. I put a flyer out last week and have gotten five bookings already. This kind of leads me to believe that I might not be charging enough. What do you guys think I should be charging for:

2 hour location session
Unlimited wardrobe changes during the session.
and...

an 11x14 canvas
2 - 8x10's
4 - 5x7's
40 wallets

Chosen from any two poses. Additional poses extra.

Here are a few from today.

1


2


3


4


5


6

lifeinfocus

Not sure about pricing, but number 4 photo is my favorite. Nice work.

Phil

Hackbone

Bryce, you asking to be abused aren't you!! 2 hrs unlimited clothing changes, what do you normally make per hour at your normal job. Then add insurance, camera equip and lighting costs, gas, travel etc. Might add up to about $50 per hr. for you time. Realize that every hour you shoot your probably spending an hour on computer time. Now we're up to $100 per hour. Would be nice to be paid for that also.

I like the idea of extra poses additional. I do charge a fee of $7 extra per outfit past the amt of poses indicated in the package. You are hurting your sales by including wallets in the package. Wallets should always be offered as extras. The 11x14 is up to you. The folks in my area think an 8x10 is a wall portrait, YIKES!

Bryce Wilson

Hackbone wrote: »

Bryce, you asking to be abused aren't you!! 2 hrs unlimited clothing changes, what do you normally make per hour at your normal job. Then add insurance, camera equip and lighting costs, gas, travel etc. Might add up to about $50 per hr. for you time. Realize that every hour you shoot your probably spending an hour on computer time. Now we're up to $100 per hour. Would be nice to be paid for that also.

I like the idea of extra poses additional. I do charge a fee of $7 extra per outfit past the amt of poses indicated in the package. You are hurting your sales by including wallets in the package. Wallets should always be offered as extras. The 11x14 is up to you. The folks in my area think an 8x10 is a wall portrait, YIKES!

Thanks for the input Charles. And, I don't mind being abused, I'm married to a Sicilian, I'm immune!

I refuse to spend more than one hour on the computer with the images I take for these sessions. I am so used to shooting the vintage kids stuff in jpg and not doing ANYTHING to them, that I'm spoiled. As far as unlimited wardrobe changes, I don't see the problem with offering that. They have me for two hours, if they spend an hour of that changing clothes, it just cuts into their shoot time. I've been suggesting girls wear a body suit under their clothes so we don't have to make trips to a "changing room".

Believe it or not, about one third of my "vintage kids sessions" customers purchase a 16x10 canvas or larger. I just don't see anyone putting an 8x10 on a wall as a stand alone, but I'm sure it happens.

GREAT point on the wallets! I think the next flyer will have them removed.

FWIW....I am currently at $269.99 for the above. Based on the response, I'm thinking I could go to 299.99. Thoughts?

Hackbone

I would do at least $350 and without wallets. They make a pop-up changing tent that unfolds like a large reflector. Really neat to have, big enough for one person and about $35.

Bryce Wilson

Hackbone wrote: »

I would do at least $350

Hey! I took a few business and sales and marketing classes....

$349.99

jeffreaux2

My senior "package " (I only offer one....take it or leave it!) is based on a 3 hour shoot. I figure I spend 6 hours total from consulting ahead of time to delivery of prints.

My time is valuable to me and I like to be compensated for that.

The prints I basically give away. (In the package) but add ons do help up the ante.

I allow unlimited clothing changes, but explain that the time spent changing is lost for shooting.

It includes a 20 pose limit....which is a lot for my area...but I like to make my clients feel as if they get their moneys worth as well. I provide all 20 proofs on 4x6 as well as a digital watermarked "web sized" copy for facebook etc.

Hackbone

Instead of the 20 images how about an album of about 35 images for $275 plus pkg?

Bryce Wilson

jeffreaux2 wrote: »

I provide all 20 proofs on 4x6 as well as a digital watermarked "web sized" copy for facebook etc.

May I ask why you choose a 4x6 instead of a 3.5 x 5 or 4x5 to be closer to a 5x7 or 8x10 crop?

zoomer

Yes you are priced pretty low for all that stuff, but then you are not doing a lot to the pictures and not at the uppermost level quality wise....yet....
I charge $300. Don't care what they wear or how many times they change. I normally deliver 60-100 fully processed photos on a disc. Processing normally takes me about 3 hours and 2 hours for the shoot. I don't mess with prints.

You could go to $299 and no one would notice the difference...bookings would not change.
If you charged $399 you would notice a drop in the number of bookings, but probably still pocket the same money in the end.

I like 4 also, the last shot had a lot of potential....but he looks posed and stiff in the shot.

troopers

I don't include/charge for prints. Never thought it was 'fair' when I was on the other end, and still don't...especially nowadays where high quality printing labs are abundant and available to the masses. Images are delivered here on smugmug, up to the original size.

jeffreaux2

Bryce Wilson wrote: »

May I ask why you choose a 4x6 instead of a 3.5 x 5 or 4x5 to be closer to a 5x7 or 8x10 crop?

They are cheap.

Frames are easily available.

My package = 2 8x10, 8 5x7, 20 4x6's, 80 wallets and the web sized copies. I thought long and hard about the package, and set it up so kids with divorced/remarried parents would have prints enough for double grandparents/parents, etc. I felt as though the photog we hired to do my son's sr photos really held them for ransom. I decided I wouldn't do that to folks and at least make an honest attempt to provide excellent and fast service along with an abundance of product. I already knew what my portrait clients spend with me on average. May as well put plenty of paper(prints) in their hands to pass around and spread the good word about JK Mann Photography!:D

Of course....Ive never been accused of being a business tycoon. And never will.

Dooginfif20

lot of great info put out already because I too am in the development of pricing phase. I think Hackbone hit the most important part in my opinion. How much do you want to make an hour? I wish I could find the article that PPA put out about what you should charge based on if you are a studio or home based photographer. When you throw a studio in the mix there are ton of things that need to be considered to cover overhead. I dont remember the exact formula, but I will go off memory. First decided what you want your hourly wage to be. Next after much trial and error calculate the average time it takes you to process an image. If you plan on using the same image for multiple prints then great, if not then you have to add that in. If you are going to do the "only show 20-30 retouched images for them to choose from" avenue then thats another thing to figure in. On average from watching many webinars, instructional DVDs and such I have noticed most of these pros are running between 1-3 min per image. Lets say you want to make $50 an hour. You process images in 2 min per. Thats 30 images in an hour. $50 devided be 20 = $2.50 an image.

As for the packages PPA suggest if your out of your home to charge 2-3x the amount it cost you to create it. If an 8x10 cost you $1.99 to have it printed and cost your $2.50 to retouch you should charge in the ball park of $10-15 for that image. Hackbone brought a good point to add in all the other added cost like equipment replacement, gas, insurance, permits, and so on. After figuring out all that look at your pacakges and see if your estimate in price is spot on. Also PPA suggest if you own a studio (if you dont thats ok, but if you plan to good) that your prices should be 3-4 times the amount to create.

Dooginfif20

oh crap and about the pictures I liked all of them except 2 and 5. They just dont stack up to the rest. I agree 6 looks a little stiff but its a very good picture!

e mari ad terram

jeffreaux2 wrote: »

They are cheap.

Frames are easily available.

My package = 2 8x10, 8 5x7, 20 4x6's, 80 wallets and the web sized copies. I thought long and hard about the package, and set it up so kids with divorced/remarried parents would have prints enough for double grandparents/parents, etc. I felt as though the photog we hired to do my son's sr photos really held them for ransom. I decided I wouldn't do that to folks and at least make an honest attempt to provide excellent and fast service along with an abundance of product. I already knew what my portrait clients spend with me on average. May as well put plenty of paper(prints) in their hands to pass around and spread the good word about JK Mann Photography!:D

Of course....Ive never been accused of being a business tycoon. And never will.

Not to derail the thread about the images... but i had some questions about pricing too. BTW - my favs are 1,3, and 4... I like the angle with the crossbow, seemed like a different edge to something the subject is in to... and the lighting/fill in them works well. i wish we had some nice shady outdoor locations here in AZ. they are few and far between!

About the pricing, Jeff I was curious about the package you offer... I have been through your site, and your tips and there is some great info in there I have used at multiple shoots. How do you use SMugmug with ordering/packaging? I see in the comment above you have a set amount of prints. Do you allow them to choose one pose for all of them, or more than one or a mix? Do you then make this order yourself and deliver, or have the site open for regular purchase from the client? What does your package set cost generally? I am trying to build a similar setup so there is an actual package I offer. Currently I just charge a session fee and have a price list for prints, but have seen mixed sales results. Ideally, I would like to simplify and have one price that includes prints.