Latest in Flash Brackets?

TommyboyTommyboy Registered Users Posts: 590 Major grins
edited June 21, 2012 in Accessories
I realize that this is an oft-broached topic, but a search of this forum revealed discussions that were a year old or more.

I'm tired of not being able to have my flash above the camera when I shoot vertically. In fact, I shoot nearly everything horizontally as a result. I have an ancient Storboframe, but that's not my speed any more.

I shoot hand held with a 580EXII—currently on a 40D and soon on a 5DIII.

Some cursory research has led me to the Ray Flash Rotator and the Newton Camera Bracket. Both look appealing: compact, good for hand-held, and not too obtrusive.

Can anyone recommend either of these, or point me in the direction of something else?

Thanks.
"Press the shutter when you are sure of success." —Kim Jong-il

NEW Smugmug Site

Comments

  • ziggy53ziggy53 Super Moderators Posts: 24,133 moderator
    edited May 26, 2012
    Of these two, I would greatly prefer the Newton bracket and design. The Ray Flash Rotator design interferes with access to the lens. While you might be OK to use many prime lenses if you stuck to AF only, a zoom lens ring or manual focus ring would be difficult to access.

    I can still recommend the Stroboframe Pro-T for many applications. I appreciate the way that the Pro-T mounts and keeps ready access to both camera and lens controls. Unfortunately, tripod use with the Pro-T is less than optimal, but still usable.

    584025027_Yv7GE-X2.jpg

    584025653_QgFur-X2.jpg
    ziggy53
    Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
  • CowboydougCowboydoug Registered Users Posts: 401 Major grins
    edited May 27, 2012
    OM hell... The newton setup seems to have been designed while someone was hitting the crack pipe... What a train wreck...
    Stroboframe is a great choice... Another I found recently that seems to rival RRS stuff is http://promediagear.3dcartstores.com/
    I'm a Kidnapper... I take terrible pictures of people, then hold them for ransom.

    Cowboydoug
    Certified Journeyman Commercial Photographer
    www.iWasThereToo.com
  • IcebearIcebear Registered Users Posts: 4,015 Major grins
    edited May 27, 2012
    Good find, Doug. Looks very well thought out.
    John :
    Natural selection is responsible for every living thing that exists.
    D3s, D500, D5300, and way more glass than the wife knows about.
  • puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited May 27, 2012
    Cowboydoug wrote: »
    OM hell... The newton setup seems to have been designed while someone was hitting the crack pipe... What a train wreck...
    Stroboframe is a great choice... Another I found recently that seems to rival RRS stuff is http://promediagear.3dcartstores.com/

    Whilst I've never used (or seen in the flesh) a newton bracket, I made a rig based on the same principle - specifically for macro purposes - because I wanted the flash head to be in the same position relative to the lens front element in either position.

    Whilst the promedia rig looks very nice / well made, the flash to lens distance changes - probably irrelevant for 'normal' work - but could be an issue.

    pp
    Website

    Flickr
  • Manfr3dManfr3d Registered Users Posts: 2,008 Major grins
    edited May 30, 2012
    Hi,

    consider the RRS WPF-1 Wedding Flash Bracket (video):http://reallyrightstuff.com/WebsiteInfo.aspx?fc=43

    Works great and packs very small.
    “To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
    ― Edward Weston
  • TommyboyTommyboy Registered Users Posts: 590 Major grins
    edited June 1, 2012
    I appreciate all the replies and suggestions.

    I think I've settled on one of two brackets, both Really Right $tuff. I want an L-Bracket and one of their ball heads, so one of their flash brackets seems natural.

    Medium Portrait Perfect Package vs. Wedding Pro Flash Bracket

    The Wedding Pro has a number of advantages:

    Much less expensive
    Folds flat for storage
    The rectangular aspect-ratio of the flash follows that of the imaging sensor when rotating the camera

    The Portrait Perfect is more expensive, more difficult to store, and when you shoot a portrait shot, the flash remains in the "landscape" position.

    In spite of these shortcomings, I vastly prefer the elegant design of the Portrait Perfect bracket. It also seems as though it would be a superior rig for macro work. The Wedding Pro is oversized and ungainly; although very functional, it leaves much to be desired in terms of design ethos.

    So my question is this: How big a deal is it if the flash and the imaging sensor are perpendicular rather than parallel?

    Thanks in advance for any advice.
    "Press the shutter when you are sure of success." —Kim Jong-il

    NEW Smugmug Site
  • puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited June 2, 2012
    Tommyboy wrote: »
    In spite of these shortcomings, I vastly prefer the elegant design of the Portrait Perfect bracket. It also seems as though it would be a superior rig for macro work.
    .

    Neither looks ideal (to me) for macro work.

    Many (most?) macro flash rigs that use std flashes invariably have an articulated arm with at least one (small) ball head somewhere in the linkage to allow as much versatility as possible.

    Especially important if the (macro) lens in use changes its length for different magnification ratios.

    Not being able to place the flash where you want it will drive you nuts :)

    pp
    Website

    Flickr
  • Manfr3dManfr3d Registered Users Posts: 2,008 Major grins
    edited June 2, 2012
    Tommyboy wrote: »
    The Wedding Pro is oversized and ungainly; although very functional, it leaves much to be desired in terms of design ethos.

    So my question is this: How big a deal is it if the flash and the imaging sensor are perpendicular rather than parallel?

    Thanks in advance for any advice.

    On the very contrary, the WPF (Wedding Pro) is one of smallest and fastest (switch form horizontal to vertial)
    flash bracket I've ever used. The other one is the better setup for macro and RRS used to advertise
    it in the last years only for that. Not sure why they stated to recommend it for weddings and portraits.

    I've used the WPF for macro work and it worked although there are much better solutions (from
    the Wimberly) it worked. The biggest drawback is that you can't tilt the flash downwards on the WPF.

    Why don't you order both, try them side by side and and keep only the one you like most?
    “To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
    ― Edward Weston
  • TommyboyTommyboy Registered Users Posts: 590 Major grins
    edited June 5, 2012
    Cowboydoug wrote: »
    The newton setup seems to have been designed while someone was hitting the crack pipe... What a train wreck...[/url]

    Yours is the only negative comment I can find on Newton products. They have a sterling reputation on multiple forums. What is your specific complaint with his brackets? Have you held one or used one?

    I'm looking hard at the FR3. It does everything I want: L bracket, low flash profile, rotating flash. . . . It even has a built in stand.

    I'm not trying to be argumentative. . . . I'm just wondering if you've had negative experience or if you hate it in theory. Either way, I'd be interested in knowing why.
    "Press the shutter when you are sure of success." —Kim Jong-il

    NEW Smugmug Site
  • Manfr3dManfr3d Registered Users Posts: 2,008 Major grins
    edited June 6, 2012
    The Newton flash bracket looks a bit ugly and unhandy indeed. But this is a highly subjective assessment of course.
    “To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
    ― Edward Weston
  • TommyboyTommyboy Registered Users Posts: 590 Major grins
    edited June 6, 2012
    Manfr3d wrote: »
    The Newton flash bracket looks a bit ugly and unhandy indeed. But this is a highly subjective assessment of course.

    Subjective indeed. What a flash bracket "looks like" is definitely a secondary, of not tertiary concern. It is, after all, a tool. Having said that, the RRS wedding bracket is the most awkward looking and cumbersome bracket out there—judging by appearances, yet you and others swear by them. I can appreciate its functionality and its compact size, though it does not appeal to me.

    I look at the Newton bracket and see form supported by numerous functions. I don't want my flash a foot above my camera; I don't need it. I only need my flash above my camera when shooting vertical. Everything I shoot is bounced or diffused so shadows are a non-issue. I do need an L-plate, though and I would like to use my existing Manfroto set up with its proprietary QR plates. And I want a small, light weight bracket. And I don't want the flash to flip on its side putting undue stress on the foot and causing the hold rig to be out of balance.

    In my research, only the Newton FR3 offers all of that, in addition to providing a stand on which to rest your camera. I don't usually even consider price, and generally buy the best that I can afford. But I do note that the Newton provides all of the above for a price less than $300. I've read a half-dozen reviews of his brackets that rave about its build quality, its function, and its lack of maintenance. People seem to really dig them.

    Were I to go with an RRS Portrait Perfect Package, I would need to buy an A/S ball head. That, the L-plate, and the flash bracket would cost well over $750. That's a big difference. Their design, fit, and finish are unquestionable. What is questionable is whether it's worth more than double the price. I've contacted RRS, Pro Media Gear, and Newton. All were responsive and helpful, but Robert Newton offered the most detailed and personal response. He recommended the FR-3 and if I didn't like it, he would sell me a different bracket or refund my purchase price. Kind of hard to argue with . . . .

    As you have indicated, though, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If I wind up buying the Newton, I'll post a review here.
    "Press the shutter when you are sure of success." —Kim Jong-il

    NEW Smugmug Site
  • Manfr3dManfr3d Registered Users Posts: 2,008 Major grins
    edited June 6, 2012
    Sounds like you've made your mind up thumb.gif
    “To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
    ― Edward Weston
  • puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited June 6, 2012
    I've not used or seen in the flesh any of the brackets mentioned, but what I liked about the Newton approach was its simplicity and the fact that the lens centreline to flash distance didn't vary between L and P. Arc based ones offer no distance change + intermediate positions but (imo) are somewhat unweildy. What they look like is secondary to me, provided it works ok.

    My macro rig version, based on the Newton linkage has proven to be very easy to use and quick in operation over many 1000s of frames.
    I suspect the 'proper' one is even smoother in operation than mine :)

    pp
    Website

    Flickr
  • TommyboyTommyboy Registered Users Posts: 590 Major grins
    edited June 6, 2012
    puzzledpaul wrote: »
    I suspect the 'proper' one is even smoother in operation than mine :)

    Paul,

    You've mentioned your home-made rig a couple of times. I'd love to see a photo of it—just for curiosity's sake.
    "Press the shutter when you are sure of success." —Kim Jong-il

    NEW Smugmug Site
  • puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited June 7, 2012
    Tommyboy wrote: »
    ... love to see a photo of it

    Stuff to do atm, so may be a few days ...

    pp
    Website

    Flickr
  • puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited June 7, 2012
    Had a few mins this eve, so this is one of a few quick snaps with a pns.

    Originally made for a 20D + 550ex (now use a 40D) and 3 lenses
    100mm macro (non usm) / mpe65 / 180 Tamron
    4 led ring clips into the groove at front of the 2 Canon lenses.
    Shown in Lscape.
    Can be locked in both L and P
    3/8in tripod mount.
    Whole arm removable via split clamp arrangement.
    flash arm pivoted to provide greater forward 'throw' when using the 180
    Off cam flash cord fixed into top of small ball head.
    Cam fixed by screw poking thro' flat base plate @ upper centre of pic.
    'Teeth' - white nylon, base of large ball head are for locating in 'bean pole' ... when used ... as per LordV technique ...
    Idea worked thro' using Wings3D - a free (but excellent, in my biased opinion :)) modelling app. before cutting metal.
    I found the flipper alone (arm removed) useful on a tripod for L/P changes - and fast.
    Most of the macro pics on site taken with this or with same base / different arm.

    hth
    pp



    IMG_0089mod.jpg
    Website

    Flickr
  • TommyboyTommyboy Registered Users Posts: 590 Major grins
    edited June 7, 2012
    That's definitely cool. Thanks for satisfying my curiosity.
    "Press the shutter when you are sure of success." —Kim Jong-il

    NEW Smugmug Site
  • photogreenphotogreen Registered Users Posts: 180 Major grins
    edited June 16, 2012
    puzzledpaul wrote: »
    Had a few mins this eve, so this is one of a few quick snaps with a pns.

    Originally made for a 20D + 550ex (now use a 40D) and 3 lenses
    100mm macro (non usm) / mpe65 / 180 Tamron
    4 led ring clips into the groove at front of the 2 Canon lenses.
    Shown in Lscape.
    Can be locked in both L and P
    3/8in tripod mount.
    Whole arm removable via split clamp arrangement.
    flash arm pivoted to provide greater forward 'throw' when using the 180
    Off cam flash cord fixed into top of small ball head.
    Cam fixed by screw poking thro' flat base plate @ upper centre of pic.
    'Teeth' - white nylon, base of large ball head are for locating in 'bean pole' ... when used ... as per LordV technique ...
    Idea worked thro' using Wings3D - a free (but excellent, in my biased opinion :)) modelling app. before cutting metal.
    I found the flipper alone (arm removed) useful on a tripod for L/P changes - and fast.
    Most of the macro pics on site taken with this or with same base / different arm.

    hth
    pp



    IMG_0089mod.jpg

    cool.
    you should market this :)
  • IcebearIcebear Registered Users Posts: 4,015 Major grins
    edited June 20, 2012
    Took the plunge
    Tommyboy, thanks for starting this thread. It got me thinking and looking very hard at the images I was getting with my Demb Flip-it. After digesting all the offerings on the market, I pulled the trigger on the Newton Di100FR2. Waiting anxiously.
    John :
    Natural selection is responsible for every living thing that exists.
    D3s, D500, D5300, and way more glass than the wife knows about.
  • puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited June 21, 2012
    Icebear wrote: »
    ...I pulled the trigger on the Newton Di100FR2. Waiting anxiously.

    Looks simple and effective (to me) - be interested to hear how you get on with it.

    << cool.
    you should market this :) >>

    Dunno about 'cool' - I came across issues - like trying to see fruit flies in a poorly lit kitchen - during shooting (macro) and tried to solve them. Other ppl manage to produce way better shots than me with simpler rigs :)

    Newton's design is patented.

    pp
    Website

    Flickr
Sign In or Register to comment.