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Starting out in the business
Andy
Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
Hi everyone, I got this anonymously - and told the person to watch this thread for responses from everyone.
1. Have a unsatiable thirst for knowledge, and improving yourself. Shoot, yes, all the time - but then: ask for criticism. Put yourself out there, find out what other folks think... pros and lay-persons too.
2. Study - hard - new techniques, both for shooting and for in-post. In today's world, they go hand-in-hand.
3. Do some jobs - yeah the first job is hard to get so maybe you work with some friends, family, associates and do one or two for free or little money, and then use these folks as references.
4. Join a local photographer's club, community group, etc. Meet others in who are doing the same thing.
5. Frequent www.dgrin.com!
OK - I'm hushing up now, I know our good friends here in the dgrin community can add to this thread!
Anonymous wrote:Great looking site! Considering a switch from Pbase to Smugmug. From what I've read, looks like it's alot more user friendly for selling yourself. I, like many others have a passion for telling a story, however, haven't been able to make a break into this from the my regular job. I have the desire but not exactly sure the steps to take to get to the next level. Based on your experience, if you were asked to name the most important steps a person needs to do in order to make a p/t or f/t living out of this what would would they be? Please don't assume to much about what I may or may not already know.
1. Have a unsatiable thirst for knowledge, and improving yourself. Shoot, yes, all the time - but then: ask for criticism. Put yourself out there, find out what other folks think... pros and lay-persons too.
2. Study - hard - new techniques, both for shooting and for in-post. In today's world, they go hand-in-hand.
3. Do some jobs - yeah the first job is hard to get so maybe you work with some friends, family, associates and do one or two for free or little money, and then use these folks as references.
4. Join a local photographer's club, community group, etc. Meet others in who are doing the same thing.
5. Frequent www.dgrin.com!
OK - I'm hushing up now, I know our good friends here in the dgrin community can add to this thread!
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Dgrin's very own jdsphotography recently took some serious steps in this direction, his blog should provide some first-hand experience. Also watch for his posts in this section, they kinda provide a timeline what a person may go through.
Other than that Andy pretty much nailed it. Start doing it, do it all the time, keep learning, accept the critique (friendly or not), be flexible, think "business, not hobby" - and you'll be there!
HTH
As Nikolai stated I have started a blog to let others know what it takes to open/start a photography business. My plans are as of right now to open Jan 1, 06. I've been playing around with this idea since August. Finally in October I set my foot down because I'm tired of working for someone else.
A few things to think about;
1. Starting a business is going to be hard on you, and your family, be prepaired to work long hours, 7 days a week if you have to.
2. If you have any type of savings, you are going to need it. This is where I messed up and don't have much to go on, so I'll be trying for some SBA loans. If this is your route, don't get into deep. I'll be looking at $5K for some other equipment, and ADVERTISING.
3. Be prepaired to loose what you have in savings, according to the SBA it takes a business 3 years to show a profit. If this is something you don't want to take a risk on, then you might want to re-think the business.
4. Start a business plan, I currently have a friend helping me, he retired from IBM and started his own company, and within a year he had paid back the $100K he borrowed. BUSINESS PLAN BUSINESS PLAN BUSINESS PLAN.
5. Take a look at http://www.sba.gov/ They will have all the information you could ever want on starting a business. Once you have done that either hire a lawyer or fill out the paperwork yourself. I choose to do the paperwork myself as I felt it would benefit me to learn all the ways of doing it.
6. Once you have went to the SBA website and you still think you want to do this, then its time to setup to get your TIN (Tax Idenification Number) through the IRS. That can be find here, http://www.irs.gov/businesses/index.html You will also need to register in your home state and with your local government (I.E. city, county, etc)
7. Once you have all the required documents (which will take their sweet time getting here) you need to proceed to get a bank account, I'm at this stage now as I was looking into getting a business account. Come to find out most places have accounts for small business's, but require you to have atleast $1500-$2000 in the account to avoid fee's. The thing I'm looking at is setting up a personal account and set it up as a DBA (Doing business as) this will allow you to not have to keep a great amount in the bank, plus you can except checks either under your name or your business name.
8. Setup a domain name, get a website done. This is where its at, people are moving towards buying stuff offline now more then ever. I'm currently awaiting to have mine done.
9. ADVERTISE, ADVERTISE, ADVERTISE. There are many ways to do this, ranging from word of mouth, to handing out business cards, to running ad's in your local newspaper. Whatever way you choose to do it, ths is one of the biggest things. Can't work if you don't have anyone using your services.
There is going to be alot more, but this is the basic's for now. As Andy stated you have to have the drive and desire to want to do this, once you get into it, it'll be hard to quit without loosing everything. So set down and talk to your wife/g/f if you have one and see what they say. This will be a huge step for the both of you.
I am a former rep for a company so I can be a resource for more info on this topic if needed.
Or, for instance, into Yahoo Yellow Pages? What are the steps? Ballpark prices?
Thanks!
I have just received my order of my new business cards from the overnightprints. Now I need to put them around. But I kinda forgot the card holders
But google (i.e. froogle) is my friend, and pretty soon I found this:
http://www.buyingpartners.com/product.php?co=UNV&number=12590
$0.44 each, clear or black. 3day UPS shipping from east cost is less than $8.
HTH
I figured out for myself that the most profitable things for me would be
- weddings
- artistic family portraits
- family events (birthdays, bar/batmitzvas, quincenneras, etc)
- corporate events (xmas, receptions, etc)
So in search of the clients I'm gonna attack:- bridal shops
- floral shops
- fashion boutiques in the malls
- and, last but not least, churches (where many of the said events actually take place:-)
And while we have only a handful of florists and bridal stores in the area, we do have 200+ churches in Conejo Valey alone. If I can get only 5% of this, I think that would get me covered for a while:-)HTH
Thanks..this gives me ideas on where to put mine.
Have you thought of bridal fairs?
Internet search
Having venues like your work
referels from customers
internet ads
other vendors who like your work
web service directories (free and subscription)
networking with people
referals from booked photographers
Has not worked for me:
Magazine ads
newspaper ads
bridal fairs/shows
phone book
"special" newspaper inserts
Most of the traditional advertising methods have turned out to be pretty worthless for me. I know some have good results, but I have not.
"Failure is feedback. And feedback is the breakfast of champions." - fortune cookie
I only learned of their existence today:-) I'm from a *very* different world originally, remember?
But I'm also looking at what Shay said and thinking maybe I didn't lose much from not knowing:-)
Glad you likes some of my ideas:-)
Cheers!
Thank a lot, man, very insightful and helpful, as always!
what about colleges... maybe offer free services for there sports? Would that also help? And about the web page part... Would you say your smugmug account be worht it or should you do a web site plus your smugmug for sales?
All feed back is welcomed!!
http://www.dipphoto.com/
:lust :lust
I agree with Shay that spending big $$ here is not a good idea for a new photographer. But getting your listing and your website listed can run as little, depending on the market as $20 - $40 a month. You can put a cell number and you don't necessarily need a business land line. If someone has used you or heard about you they might not remember your phone number or website address. I have found that I have gotten calls from people who saw my listing and website, checkout the site and other sites from the phone book and then called me because of my work.
I know my small investment paid of last month on one job that paid for the year of the cost of the book. If it cost you say $360 for a year and you get one wedding from it, then everything else is gravy. But don't expect that the ratio stay the same as you go up. I have seen yellow page adversting work great for some business categories and not well at all for others. Now with the internet so prominent, prudent customers will ask and look at websites to help decide who to call IMHO. IMHO the site doesn't have to have wiz bang features, etc but your work should be good. Hey not all photographers are great web site people.
a couple things have really worked for me:
the most important thing is that you love what you do. i love taking pictures and i also love to edit them, however there are some things i don't like. one client asked for me to produce a slideshow of the pictures for her and i absolutely hated working on it, so i don't do those anymore.
when i just started everything, i ordered 1000 white business cards from staples for something like $25. they don't display my work, but they're professional looking and have all of my information on them. that's my best tactic for getting new clients.
i got into wedding photography through another photographer. i was too skilled to be just an assistant and carry a photographer's stuff around, but i wasn't ready yet to shoot weddings on my own, so i worked as a second photographer. the first job i did with him paid me very little, especially considering i shot 1600+ pictures. after that first wedding he loved my work and payed me a lot more. now i still work as a second photographer sometimes but i do a lot of weddings myself. what i liked about being a second photographer was that sometimes i wouldn't have to edit the pictures, i'd just shoot them and the other photographer would take care of them.
smugmug has been a huge key to my success. selling prints from my site is starting to generate some decent money.
i hope this was helpful.