Family Session at Beach - Question

anonymouscuban

So I'm doing a family session at the beach this Sunday. We'll be starting at around 5:30PM and sunset is at 8PM so we will have plenty of time with nice sidelight to get a variety of shots. I checked the Photographers Ephemeris for direction of the sun when choosing the locale and picked a good spot where I can capture some nice front and back lit shots with good composition of the shoreline and rocks and such.

My question has more to do with off camera fill and the size of the family. It will be a family of 6. The parents and four children ranging in age from 8 to 20. They don't want poses that are too forced. They want a few posed shots but they want more of a lifestyle portrait feel.

Do you think I'll need any fill light? If so, I was thinking of going the large reflector route instead of off camera flash. I have a large 5-1 round reflector. Will that be enough. Or do you think I'm better off using my speed light, off camera, with a large shoot-through or reflective umbrella? Or should I just slap the speedlight on camera, with a stofen and use it as on camera fill?

I don't want it too look too flashy and normally, with one or two people, I would opt for the reflector but with such a large group, I'm a little concerned that the reflector won't give me enough coverage for the posed shots.

What say you all?

anonymouscuban

*crickets

divamum

My thoughts, FWIW -

- Reflected light would LOOK great, but probably hard to control with that many people who don't really want to "pose". It would need to be a pretty big reflector, too, to be sure not to throw hotspots onto individuals rather than the whole group.

- flash is good but, again, I think you'll have trouble lighting a group that size with one flash. Can you go for two+umbrellas/SBs? That would be what I'd probably do. Two speedlights strategically placed - especially with the sun as a rim/backlight - could be really nice.

- Look for natural reflectors - sand, water pools etc etc. Also, you might get away with putting a big white blanket or sheet down in front of them for added fill.

Disclaimer: I haven't shot this particlar scenario, so am not speaking from experience. YMMV. I hope some of the others chime in with some ideas!

anonymouscuban

Diva,

I do have two SBs/umbrellas so that is doable. My concern is I only have one assistant so I'm a little afraid of my SB becoming a kite.

I did already consider the fact that the sand and water will probably help a lot when it comes to fill. Hoping some others will be able to share their thoughts.

Cuong

Off camera speed lights with umbrellas will give you much more flexibility in term of light output and directional control. Hopefully you'll have assistants to handle the lighting equipment since wind and umbrellas and water and lights aren't a good mix.

Cuong

anonymouscuban

Hmm... I think I'm going to pick up a 60" x 72" reflector tomorrow just in case. I could use it anyway so what the heck.

Dreadnote

Well on the bright side you'll have plenty of sand with which to fill sand bags for your light stands. Bring a bunch of them and a shovel

divamum

Dreadnote wrote: »

Well on the bright side you'll have plenty of sand with which to fill sand bags for your light stands. Bring a bunch of them and a shovel

Actually, kidding aside, if you do'nt have sandbags, just take some empty milk jugs with straps/bungees/zip ties attached to them - you can easily fill them with sand and hang them on your stands. Saves carrying the weight from car to beach

dlscott56

Well, my only experience with this is watching some Kelby Training videos by Erik Valind, lifestyle photography, and Tony Corbell, outdoor lighting. In both cases they did quite a bit with diffusers and reflectors. Erik used the large reflector, like you were talking about getting, quite a bit. If you have access to it I would recommend watching the Erik Valind video as it seems to be right on for what you're trying to do.

Fill light was used in most every shot. Lots done with reflectors but strobes used as well. It also seems that the reflector method would be more flexible for moving around with less set up and tear down. Particularly since you have limited help.

Mitchell

Our beach tends to get quite windy in the evening for sunset photos. I've given up on umbrellas except for morning beach shoots. I've had my best luck with an assistant holding an SB800 with the diffuser attachment on a monopod. Just have your assistant follow with you and keep the flash 3-4 feet above and to the side of the camera. Remember, this is just for fill, so keep the power down and you won't have shadow issues or look too flashy.

anonymouscuban

divamum wrote: »

Actually, kidding aside, if you do'nt have sandbags, just take some empty milk jugs with straps/bungees/zip ties attached to them - you can easily fill them with sand and hang them on your stands. Saves carrying the weight from car to beach

I do have sand bags and filling them at the beach is a great option. However, I'm concerned by umbrellas will still end up getting blown away or inverted/damaged due to the wind.

dlscott56 wrote: »

Well, my only experience with this is watching some Kelby Training videos by Erik Valind, lifestyle photography, and Tony Corbell, outdoor lighting. In both cases they did quite a bit with diffusers and reflectors. Erik used the large reflector, like you were talking about getting, quite a bit. If you have access to it I would recommend watching the Erik Valind video as it seems to be right on for what you're trying to do.

Fill light was used in most every shot. Lots done with reflectors but strobes used as well. It also seems that the reflector method would be more flexible for moving around with less set up and tear down. Particularly since you have limited help.

. I've watched both. Actually, the Lifestyle Photography one I watched earlier this week. There are a few others that I've watched on outdoor portraiture and they almost all use reflectors exclusively.

Mitchell wrote: »

Our beach tends to get quite windy in the evening for sunset photos. I've given up on umbrellas except for morning beach shoots. I've had my best luck with an assistant holding an SB800 with the diffuser attachment on a monopod. Just have your assistant follow with you and keep the flash 3-4 feet above and to the side of the camera. Remember, this is just for fill, so keep the power down and you won't have shadow issues or look too flashy.

That's a great suggestion Mitchell. I'm going to bring the umbrellas along with me, just in case, but I too think it's going to be too windy to use them. Like I said, I'm buying a 60x72 reflector today and also a 1-stop diffuser. I've needed both for a while so now is a good a time as any to get them. I want to be prepared. Ultimately, it may work out that using the sun as my main and a flash with diffuser off camera is the most practical option.

Mitchell

Do you have an SU-800 or do you use your on camera flash as commander? I've found a bit better range outdoors with the SU-800. Changing settings is also much faster. If using your on board flash as commander, make sure to turn off your on camera flash in the menu.

anonymouscuban

Mitchell wrote: »

Do you have an SU-800 or do you use your on camera flash as commander? I've found a bit better range outdoors with the SU-800. Changing settings is also much faster. If using your on board flash as commander, make sure to turn off your on camera flash in the menu.

I would either use my on camera flash as commander or I will use a knock-off wireless trigger I have. The onboard first but it it gives me issues since I need line of sight, I will switch to the trigger. The downfall with the trigger is I lose TTL ability and have to go manually. Not a problem, just a bit more work.

dlscott56

anonymouscuban wrote: »

. I've watched both. Actually, the Lifestyle Photography one I watched earlier this week. There are a few others that I've watched on outdoor portraiture and they almost all use reflectors exclusively.

That's funny. Guess it's true what they say about great minds

williaes

I have a really simple suggestion that may not be worth anything but wanted to put it out there for you. If you have room to get them there stop by your local home hardware store and buy two 4x8 sheets of insulation board. They make one that has a foil side and the other side is white. They are styrofoam and very light wieght. You could lay one on the ground for some reflective light and have your assistant hold one. That is a large source of light at 32 square feet each.

Another note if you have to you can cut them and then buy some of the newer style metal duct tape and tape it back once you are there.

I have used one full sheet once and 1/4 sheet before. They are cheep (less than $5.00 each) and you have white and silver.

Just a suggestion.

anonymouscuban

williaes wrote: »

I have a really simple suggestion that may not be worth anything but wanted to put it out there for you. If you have room to get them there stop by your local home hardware store and buy two 4x8 sheets of insulation board. They make one that has a foil side and the other side is white. They are styrofoam and very light wieght. You could lay one on the ground for some reflective light and have your assistant hold one. That is a large source of light at 32 square feet each.

Another note if you have to you can cut them and then buy some of the newer style metal duct tape and tape it back once you are there.

I have used one full sheet once and 1/4 sheet before. They are cheep (less than $5.00 each) and you have white and silver.

Just a suggestion.

I've used what you're talking about before but I'm afraid they may be too difficult to handle if the wind kicks up. They're break quite easily.

I did manage to pick up a large collapsable reflector today. It's 6'x5' so its just a tad smaller that the insulation sheets you mention. I actually got a white/silver reflector and another thats a white diffuser to subtract light if I need to. Hopefully these will work out.

anonymouscuban

Thanks all for all the help. Getting ready to leave for the shoot. Should be a lot of fun.

Dreadnote

So how did it go?

zoomer

If it is windy put the sun at their backs and blow out the background with natural light. Also from the front later when the light is soft, a quarter from the sun.
If it is not windy use a softbox/umbrella with a speedlight to light the off side for fill. I hate reflectors...never use them....more trouble than they are worth unless you have soft light and a person who knows how to use one.
6 people is a very small group, get the light as close a possible.

...oops sorry...just noticed I am late.
Can you give us a report, how was it?

If it were me I would use natural light and keep the shoot flowing and fun.

anonymouscuban

Hey all. Thanks for all the replies. I wanted to post sooner but I've been so busy with work and stuff around the house.

So we did the shoot on the 22nd. It was far from perfect. I want to use the word disaster to describe it but I can't because we had a lot of fun. First, it was quite windy. 20-25 MPH winds. Made it impossible to use any kind of light modifier although I did try. The wind also resulted in a lot of photos with faces full of hair. I did manage to get some good shots though... well, until a rogue wave soaked mom and kid 1 and 2 from head to toe. They wanted to take photos on a rock. It was dry enough and I hadn't seen the surf come close to it so I got them settled and as I turned around to walk to my mark, BAM!!! Wave comes through and soaks them from behind. If only for another second or two, I would have caught the soaking in photo. We called it a day at that point. They were cold and covered in sand and salt water. We've rescheduled for another go in a couple of weeks.

Here are a few of the shots I did manage to get. BTW, I've shared the gallery and they love them. They wanted to place an order for prints already but I suggested they wait until the next shoot.

1


2


3


4

Dreadnote

I think that they are great! I love number 2.

That wave story reminds me of when I was living in Carmel Valley which is next to Carmel of course and the Big Sur coast. Every year we'd have families sitting on the rocks for pictures (mostly snap shots by tourists) and every year about two or three of them would be clobbered by a "rogue wave" and sucked out to sea. It would have been hysterical except that the coast is so rocky that it's quite dangerous to be knocked off the rocks unexpectedly. All the same whenever we'd drive past and see people taking pictures we'd stop and watch.

Anyway, good job in a difficult situation.

Qarik

kick ass stuff so far!

Hackbone

I think you did one heck of a great job......3 & 4 just are wonderful. Care to explain your lighting?

Bryce Wilson

Wow, really good stuff!

I REALLY like the first one. The expressions and activity combine to make a image that is fun to look at. Nice how you kept the detail in the white shirts too!

I am wondering how the background ended up less exposed than the subjects without an off camera light source.

dlscott56

I can see why they wanted to purchase some prints right away! Awesome stuff.

anonymouscuban

WoW... thanks all. I like them a lot but I wasn't sure what you all would say. Like I said, I ditched trying to use off camera lighting after my poor wife almost blew away a few times trying to hold the reflector. I didn't even try the umbrellas because I was scared they'd get all bent.

I took Diva's advice and used what nature provided. The sand and water was doing a great job of reflecting the light so I just placed them accordingly. I think their white shirts actually working in my favor since it also was reflecting light. I spot metered on their faces to make sure I was blowing out the whites. Fortunately, I had no issue with exposure on the background.

I did very little post on these which was quite surprising to me. I thought for sure I'd have to do some exposure adjustments. It had a hard time chimping from glare on my LCD so I was going by the histogram to make sure I was getting things as right as possible. I just sharpened them and did a minor vignette. I'm bummed they got drenched because we were just getting into a nice groove.

Mitchell

Nice!! Horizon police says to straighten #2 before printing. You had some sweet light and a very photogenic family. Good shooting.

anonymouscuban

Mitchell wrote: »

Nice!! Horizon police says to straighten #2 before printing. You had some sweet light and a very photogenic family. Good shooting.

Thanks Mitchell. No go on the horizon. I think a cut off hand is worse than the horizon being askew. They are jumping in the air so I could claim that was a creative addition.