How to price touch up addition work with prints

mrhoni

How do other photographers handle this?

Charge a session fee and paid day of session.

Discuss with client if any special work is desire, such as involved touch up or maybe a collage.

Originally I was thinking of not having the gallery open for prints, do the work and upload the new updated photo, invoice and when paid, then open the gallery for printing. This seemed to ensure payment before the work done could be printed or downloaded.

I've been rethinking this strategy.

New workflow is to open the gallery for prints right away and get client to start ordering. Then we can discuss additional work.
I can, for example, create the collage and upload it.

The idea I had was to create a new price list and assign to the specific photo and bump up the price for the amount I would have charged separately.

As I write this I may be answering my own question. Maybe I ask the client what size prints they want and only choose those products for the new price list and bump up their prices. But still, if they decide the want 3 8x10, then they would pay 3 times the cost of the additional. Then the later want another 8x10. Now they pay too much again.

I want the workflow to be simple.

What suggestions do people have?

Angelo

I'm moving this to MYOB in hopes it will be seen by a larger audience.

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Art Scott

I do the shoot- already paid for....have clients look over semi processed images (this includes a few special effects I think the client will like), pick the ones they want in their package, ask about blemish removal if needed...process and run thru Portrait Pro..... print package for client...upload to gallery for reorders....
Once I know what blemishes need taken care of it is normally just a few minutes for the whole shoot.... so I do not jack up thje price for processing...it would be different if I was still shooting film and having to have negs or slides touched up by an artist, but then, I never charged more than what I was charged for the touch up....same now if I have to have an artist do it then I charge what I was charged....

Also I try to have no more than 4-6 packages offered at any one time, the fewer the better, but be flexible if someone does not want a 16x24 then offer 2 8x12 in its place and so on... ... ... I offer all of mine as units a unit being equal to 1 8x10 or 8x12 depending on how you shoot and process ... ... ... the packages I list are simply a guidline as to what they can get... ... ... it has worked for me for over 30yrs ... ... Good Luck

GerryDavid

Touchups are included in my print pricing. I don't want to nickle and dime them. In the past I use to charge extra for it and very few went for it and the resulted prints were not the best examples of my studio. and touchups don't really take that much time any ways.

mrhoni

I wasn't planning to charge for most touch up, but wanted to be prepared. However, what if they would like me to design a collage or graduation card. Just thinking ahead. Maybe I'll find no need to charge extra.

GerryDavid

The cost of the process is included in the "storyboard" and the cards. I've found with cards its easier to just buy templates and toss a picture or two into it. then customize it a bit.

For example I want to make $xx amount off of each pose I process, so if they want a storyboard with 4 pictures, I charge for the 4 poses in it. plus the cost of the print.

mrhoni

GerryDavid wrote: »

The cost of the process is included in the "storyboard" and the cards. I've found with cards its easier to just buy templates and toss a picture or two into it. then customize it a bit.

For example I want to make $xx amount off of each pose I process, so if they want a storyboard with 4 pictures, I charge for the 4 poses in it. plus the cost of the print.

For the story board, how do get paid for it? Do you ask, at what point, and the person says they want an 8x10 with 4 photos and you tell them how much and they pay you then? I'm expecting to load it to their gallery and if I do does it get assigned a price list. This is where I'm getting stuck.

What is a good workflow? How does Smugmug shopping cart fit in with creating and getting paid for something like a storyboard?

Thanks

GerryDavid

For me storyboards start at 11x14 and larger, its not worth the price of an 8x10 to me plus each picture is to small to really see. For example if I want to make $40 per pose that I edit and my 11x14's start at $200 and includes the cost of the first edited image, I would charge $320 plus tax for a 4 pose storyboard. Its all spelled out on my price sheet. Left column are the packages and the right column is the a la carte.

I use to create custom storyboard templates but now I just use the ones I purchased from a designer and customize them to suit the pictures. so the time it takes to put it together is minimal.

GerryDavid

I just noticed the 2nd part of your question. I do my picture viewings in person, nothing gets ordered online unless its a reorder. Then it gets sent off to the lab I have been working with for years then I preview the final prints before giving them to the customer. I don't like the idea of shipping directly to the customer.

mrhoni

GerryDavid wrote: »

I just noticed the 2nd part of your question. I do my picture viewings in person, nothing gets ordered online unless its a reorder. Then it gets sent off to the lab I have been working with for years then I preview the final prints before giving them to the customer. I don't like the idea of shipping directly to the customer.

Thanks Gerry.

I plan to do the picture viewings in person. What do you do to keep track of what photos they want and what size? That I thought was the beauty of having printing turned on for the gallery with an assigned price list. I like the idea of the prints coming to you/me to preview them first, but if you are paying for the printing, when do you require payment? Before sending to lab or when you present the prints to the client?

In your workflow when do you discuss your example storyboard and when do they pay? Is this after they view the photos and then you discuss what they want. My thought would be to view photos, discuss storyboard, create storyboard, send to gallery for client to view - then what point to take payment before or after work done?

GerryDavid

I use to just use windows picture viewer and a piece of paper and a pen, go through the pictures and write down the ones they liked, give them a short break while I moved the selected pictures to a folder and go through them again to narrow it down to the ones they really like, while trying to keep it to 40 or more. I now use lightroom, it saves a lot of time and makes the workflow a bit faster, but I still write down on the back of the order form details of the albums, storyboards, etc.

I always take payment in full before any postwork is done. After I ordered a few albums from the lab before getting paid and having two of them take 3 months to pay me and the third never paying me, I decided to take payment before hand instead of using my own money to pay the lab. That way I don't spend any money out of pocket and never have to worry about having to have the funds to fulfill an order.

Usually I go through the pictures once, that way they have an idea of what they are and how much they love them, then I show them what I have to offer. wall prints, canvas, metal, storybords, albums, accordion albums, deluxe wallets etc. Its not a sales pitch, just showing what the options are so they can make an informed decision. Then I usually hand them the price list and options unless they have asked for it before hand. They usually look it over and decide what they like and what they can afford. I don't pressure them into anything, I let the pictures sell themselves and they end up with what they want and don't feel like they were pressured into spending money they don't have.

Once I started to offer press printed books *aka the albums* my sales went way up. Out of a normal senior portrait there is 200-300 pictures with 3 to 5 pictures of each pose, after the first round of selections they narrow it down to 1/3 usually because of all the duplicate shots. Then the second round brings it down from 100 to about 50. This is usually when I tell them that when people love to many pictures and cant decide, they usually go for the album and that way its easier on them. People don't like trying to decide what to do and if you make it easier on them they may take it.

I have 4 portrait packages for them to choose from, each one doubling in price, so $150 gets them a few prints, $400 gets them more, $800 gets them more plus other stuff like a wall print and the $1600 package gets them a whole bunch of prints, an album, and a canvas wall print.

If they order a product that I have to design, Ill send them web proofs later to get their ok before it goes to the lab.

mrhoni

Gerry
Thanks for the details.

Glort

GerryDavid wrote: »

I always take payment in full before any postwork is done. After I ordered a few albums from the lab before getting paid and having two of them take 3 months to pay me and the third never paying me, I decided to take payment before hand instead of using my own money to pay the lab. That way I don't spend any money out of pocket and never have to worry about having to have the funds to fulfill an order.

I learned this the hard way as well. When I had my first really successful / profitable year over 20 years ago I remember my secretary coming to me telling me there wasn't enough money in the bank to pay her.

I freaked wondering how this could be as we had been going great guns.
It was the same thing, I'd paid for exactly a dozen wedding albums and prints and they were all sitting in the cupboard waiting to be paid for by the client and collected. Well over $20 grand worth. That was a huge amount of money back then. I got her on to getting the people in but like yourself, some took months.

Right then I made a policy of NOTHING gets done till it's paid for up front. In the last 20 years the longest anyone ever held out on paying for their album was 3 weeks.

I have 4 portrait packages for them to choose from, each one doubling in price, so $150 gets them a few prints, $400 gets them more, $800 gets them more plus other stuff like a wall print and the $1600 package gets them a whole bunch of prints, an album, and a canvas wall print.

Which package sells the best?

Have you looked into projecting your images at the sales presentation?
A guy I know who does a lot of portrait work has a system where he can project actual size images onto a screen. He sets the images up as a slide show with upbeat music for the first showing then shows HIS selection of images. Rarely he says they want to go through them all themselves but they will occasionally remember a shot from the show and want to see it again which is no problem.

He averages close to $7K a sitting now ( hard to believe but I know he does) and his sales more than doubled as soon as he started projecting. It really brings the images to life and the slide show creates a mood and emotional bond with the images.

I know this takes a few $$ to set up but that is insignificant when you can increase your sales so much more.

Even if you didn't want to do that, I'd suggest at least going and buying a 40" LED TV and a half decent cheap sound system and run the slide show. I do this for weddings, Portraits and even events and it works well too. Not as well as projecting and the huge sizes you can get with that but certainly a hell of a lot better than with just a computer monitor.

I always take payment in full before any postwork is done.

I take it you mean as far as layouts rather than retouching of the images themselves?

GerryDavid

My goal is to eventually get a large screen tv and use software so I can show them exactly what a 16x20, 20x24, etc will look like. Not everyone knows how big things are, even a 5x7 or 8x10. It always surprises me for a second. But right now I don't have space for that in my studio. There's only one good wall for that and I have examples of various wall portraits. Its my goal to eventually have a larger studio and a nice sitting room with a couch for the picture viewings to create a more relaxed environment.

I don't even work on the pictures until I get paid. I may do a teaser or two but thats about it. Unless I get bored or know if I don't do it then Ill be swamped later. Ive had customers take a year to get back to me to finish the payments. My new studio policy is post dated checks if they want a payment plan. It can be as little as they want per month but I get the checks in hand or I wont be able to guarantee the price of what they are ordering. More than once they said they would make three payments for 3 months in a row, then the second payment takes months to come in, something came up. If I had the second check in hand they would make sure the funds were there.

Most seem to go for the 2nd package plus a la carte or the third package. They may make a substitution or two but the package price doesn't go down. I love it when they go for the 4th package.

GerryDavid

I still have that album that was ordered 2 years ago. I'm trying to decide what to do about it. its a 5x7 album, after that album I stopped offering that size and stuck to square in case the customer wanted to order a larger size, that way I didn't hve to redesign anything. So I can't use it for a studio example. It was pretty odd to, she had ordered $800 worth of portraits which was the best I had done up to date on a regular portrait, and then she ordered the album so I was thinking sweeeeeeet!. I did the work, got her approval, ordered it and then she was never ready to pick it up. After 9 months she was ready so I was going to meet her in a small town for the delivery. an hour goes by and I call her and shes still at the dr appt, I'm free that day and really wanted to get rid of the book so I stick around for another hour, I call and shes still busy at the dr's, then I find out shes an hour away and couldn't have made the original delivery time for sure! I finally gave up. A few months goes by and she tells me to drop it off by where she works, I go there and there's no answer at the door.

The sad thing is its only $200, if I were to make that today I would probably charge at least $700 for the same thing.

Glort

With storage for 2 years, multiple delivery attempts, interests and sundrys, it IS now $$700!

GerryDavid

I sent her a message if she wants it before it gets shredded. no reply yet, didn't expect one.