Boy's regular

lensmole · December 13, 2012

I like the geometry ,texture, lighting and especially the various items . You might want to try lifting some of the shadow . The bamboo diagonal entering the corner of the frame bothers me,I would consider cropping some of the bottom just above the Barbers fold in his pants,not sure about the color, maybe try a B & W. Just my thoughts.

Patti · December 14, 2012

Thanks for taking time to comment. Here is a B&W crop with your suggestions. Short of cloning out the bamboo, I'm stuck with the visual distraction.

lensmole · December 14, 2012

Patti wrote: »

Thanks for taking time to comment. Here is a B&W crop with your suggestions. Short of cloning out the bamboo, I'm stuck with the visual distraction.

This is your image and I would not want to influence the style of any photographer,but I much prefer the second composition. As for the B & W verses color

it is questionable. IMHO.

joshhuntnm · December 14, 2012

is the focus on the boy or the bike?

Garet · December 15, 2012

I'm not sure whether the composition of one or the other versions is "better". But the two versions tell a somewhat different version of the story. In the first there is a sense as I look at the image, of a barber shop. The bamboo diagonal and the bicycle form the sense of looking into the shop through the front. There is a hint of parallel wall on the other side of the barber chair in the bench and what looks like another bamboo support to the unseen roof. And there against the wall at the back of the image are the barber's tools, and the mirror. Instead of being a distraction, the bamboo pole is an important part of the story
The first version seems to be ever so much more complete and complex and interesting.

TonyCooper · December 15, 2012

The bamboo pole doesn't bother me at all. It seems, if anything, to frame-within-frame the boy and the barber.
The bicycle forms another part of the frame-within- frame.

I don't see the point of the crop.

I am much more of a color person than most here, evidently. But, the red is too red for the rest of the image.
The figures are so dark that the red seat becomes the focal point. I'd go with the black and white here.

Patti · December 16, 2012

Interesting comments. Thanks for responding. I see the draw of the red bike from the main (intended subject) of the boy and the barber. I find the bamboo defines the barber's 'room' if you will. I will try the original crop in b&w. I like the bike in the frame - I wonder if the boy rode it or if it's the barber's means of transport to work each day.

michswiss · December 16, 2012

Patti, I hate seeming to be a negative nelly. I really like your work. But your recent stuff is mostly from behind. Shots of backs. All the scenes have such potential and you are sensitive to lovely compositions.

The bamboo is not a distraction. As you and anyone that's spent time in Asia or on the subcontinent will know, there will always be foreground elements in the urban setting. I prefer the B&W version. Not because it's been nicely converted, but that the composition works better, and the bike's still there. Getting the colour version to work will likely take a little time.

I'm imagining now. The shot would have been three side steps to the right or to have moved to the other side of the chair and close to the wall. Looking back at the man and the boy with the bike and the (assumed) alley in the background. A wide lens would keep some of the shaving and cutting paraphernalia in the frame.

Patti · December 16, 2012

Thanks for your thoughtful critique. I really appreciate your feedback. It is so much more helpful than 'this doesn't work for me'. I hear you about the shots from behind although not all that I've posted from the India trip have been from behind. Those that have, have been shot from a moving vehicle. I will post some more that are not from behind.

I like your imagined shot. How do you pull that off without the subjects becoming very aware of your presence? Perhaps I've missed the definition of documentary shooting and it is acceptable for subjects to be aware of your camera. I seem to have difficulty getting a feel for this and keep rushing myself for fear of missing the moment but will keep at it.

TonyCooper · December 16, 2012

Patti wrote: »

I like your imagined shot. How do you pull that off without the subjects becoming very aware of your presence? Perhaps I've missed the definition of documentary shooting and it is acceptable for subjects to be aware of your camera. I seem to have difficulty getting a feel for this and keep rushing myself for fear of missing the moment but will keep at it.

I suppose everyone has their own view of what the "rules" are, but I certainly
don't think that it's unacceptable for the subject to be aware of the camera.

Sometimes subject awareness, and the interaction between the photographer
and the subject, add to the image. That baleful look that the subject has,
or that delighted look that others have about being in the photo actually
make the photo in some cases.

Look at MichSwiiss's recent "At a party" shots. #3's subjects were certainly
aware of her. I don't know that I'd include those shots in the "Documentary"
genre, but she's not shy of posting them here. I'd classify those shots as
"Candid" even though they "document" some event.

The only restriction I have is that the photographer should not direct or
pose or otherwise control the subject. That's for the "People" forum.
Even with this restriction, I don't see a problem with "Hey! Look up!".
as long as you don't say "and do this".

Sometimes I think we worry too much about definitions (ie: Street,
Documentary, Candid) and don't see that a compelling photograph
is what we're after.

michswiss · December 16, 2012

I pretty much agree with most of what Tony said. Camera awareness is not really an issue. Posing and arranging can even sometimes be OK. What is an environmental portrait if not documentary? The most important thing though is the ability to engender trust in your subjects such that they start accepting you within their environment and simply move on with their day.

The imagined shots might have taken only a minute or two longer or an hour. It really depends on that trust thing. I'm a firm believer that, while you should always be ready, street and documentary are slow forms of photography. If only that it takes time to develop a true understanding of the environment, social economics, the people, the settings, the light, patterns of interaction. It's when that happens that the better pictures come through.

lensmole · December 16, 2012

TonyCooper wrote: »

I suppose everyone has their own view of what the "rules" are, but I certainly
don't think that it's unacceptable for the subject to be aware of the camera.

Sometimes subject awareness, and the interaction between the photographer
and the subject, add to the image. That baleful look that the subject has,
or that delighted look that others have about being in the photo actually
make the photo in some cases.

Look at MichSwiiss's recent "At a party" shots. #3's subjects were certainly
aware of her. I don't know that I'd include those shots in the "Documentary"
genre, but she's not shy of posting them here. I'd classify those shots as
"Candid" even though they "document" some event.

The only restriction I have is that the photographer should not direct or
pose or otherwise control the subject. That's for the "People" forum.
Even with this restriction, I don't see a problem with "Hey! Look up!".
as long as you don't say "and do this".

Sometimes I think we worry too much about definitions (ie: Street,
Documentary, Candid) and don't see that a compelling photograph
is what we're after.

If you look back in history many so called street shots were posed shots and I might add that a Bystander was sometimes paid to be in a photograph.

lensmole · December 16, 2012

TonyCooper wrote: »

The bamboo pole doesn't bother me at all. It seems, if anything, to frame-within-frame the boy and the barber.
The bicycle forms another part of the frame-within- frame.

I don't see the point of the crop.

I am much more of a color person than most here, evidently. But, the red is too red for the rest of the image.
The figures are so dark that the red seat becomes the focal point. I'd go with the black and white here.

The point of the crop was suggestion to keep the very strong diaognal line from entering the corner of the frame. It could have been cropped on the right side to achieve the same ,but would have totaly eliminated some of the items.

lensmole · December 16, 2012

Patti wrote: »

Thanks for taking time to comment. Here is a B&W crop with your suggestions. Short of cloning out the bamboo, I'm stuck with the visual distraction.

The bamboo dioganal line dosn't bother me . It was the way it entered the frame from the corner.

Patti · December 17, 2012

Thanks for all the comments. You've given me lots of food for thought which I greatly appreciate. Despite the draw of the red bike, for some reason I continue to favour the original crop in colour.

Boy's regular

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