Need some legal advice about printing another photographer's work.
michaelglenn
Registered Users Posts: 442 Major grins
So my buddy has been married for about a year. Their wedding photographer was supposed to give them a high resolution disc of the images for their wedding, prints, and a wedding album. They only received the disc and it has been over a year. They are in the process of suing him, and apparently this guy has cheated 8 other couples out of prints and an album. I found him on wedding wire and his ratings average to 0.7/5. With that being said, I recently did a lifestyle shoot for my buddy's family and found out this information. They may want to use me to make an album out of their wedding photographs from the high resolution disc. I still need a copy of his contract. Is there anything I should look out for when reading his contract? If the contract gives them rights to use and print the images from the disc, does this also give me the right to do so?
Share your thoughts. I'm not sure if it is happening yet. I still need to do my homework on this.
Share your thoughts. I'm not sure if it is happening yet. I still need to do my homework on this.
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Or, of course, simply look at the contract. Most of the time, the couple is allowed to do anything that falls within "private use licensing", which does INCLUDE them paying another professional to design and/or print an album. Or, if it's truly a 'BUDDY", you might be doing this for them for free, in which case I'd bet you're totally in the clear if their contract even remotely grants them printing license.
Unfortunately, if you're into lawsuit territory already, you're probably not going to get a very happy response from the photographer, and they may even be looking for a way to counter-sue. So, be careful!
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum
I would, (Not necessarily recommending you do this), try to contact the original photographer with out mentioning the pending legal action see what his take is on you making an album. This would allow you to see if in fact there is another side to the story and if you should steer clear.
If the original photographer breached the contract and hasn't fulfilled the contract after a year and I was the client, I wouldn't give him a free pass for anything.
As the photographer asked to create a wedding album to complete the contract I wouldn't worry about the original photographer suing me at all.
Again these are just MY thoughts.
Sam
I would personally toss this back at your friends who want you to design the album. If they are in the "process" of suing the photographer, I would think that they would have an attorney. If they don't have a lawyer I wonder how serious they are about pursuing their claims -- pro se litigants (folks without an attorney) usually don't fare well in court. Ask your friends to get with their lawyer and for the lawyer to seek to obtain a copyright release or provide at least some type of written opinion that the original contract granted them printing rights. I can tell you that if I were your friend's lawyer, I would want my own clients to let me know what they are doing in this regard.
No way would I intervene with the original photographer.
If the contract or any emails between the couple/photog includes printing of images (very likely considering a disc was given), then they are printing them -- through you, a friend (I'm assuming you're doing this on a personal, private matter -- not charging them). If you are doing it for a fee, then I would consider it a reasonable concern. But considering that this guy is STILL scamming people, I'd love for him to try and take me to court for anything, if I were the couple. It's going to be hard to argue to a judge why the couple can't make prints with their own disc that the photographer provided them when the only reason they are printing them is because the photographer hired simply isn't giving them what they pay for. It'd be like BMW taking your money for an oil change this week (assuming you signed a contract to have it done this week) and then wanting to sue your brother who just came over and changed it for free 2 years later. Of course, IF the contract says that NO ONE is allowed to make any albums with their disc of images, then MAYBE you'd have an issue. But not when the photographer has an outstanding debt for that exact item to the couple he'd be suing.
If it were me and I were worried (which I have to admit, I wouldn't be), I would make a design from the photos and send those files to my friend -- letting him know where a good place to get it printed up at would be.
Is there some chance of this going sour? I'm sure it's possible. But barring some odd requirement in the contract/agreement/emails, I believe it'd be like worrying about whether or not to own a toilet out of fear that perhaps one might fall and drown in it (totally happens -- just so rarely that we rightfully don't worry about it).
Sidenote, I've been obsessed with law for a good 15 years and it has paid dividends in my career (have had to fight for a few things and always have had positive outcomes) -- but being an actual lawyer would make those rare times where you actually need a lawyer wonderful!
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Although the first idea sounds like a civil way to deal with the situation, I think I would just be attracting negative attention for him to counter sue once he does get sued. From reading the negative reviews on him, more than one bride is already in the process of suing him. So, I'm pretty sure talking to him would be a BAD idea haha.
Personally, I'd rather go with the second option. I just need to obtain their contract and read over it. If it looks legitimate, I would think about creating a contract including the customer granting me permission to use their disc to print an album for them.
Thanks for your input, Sam! If the photographer gets sued and the client wins, then that means the client is getting reimbursed for the services that were breached from the contract. I feel that if that happens, that would give me the right to make prints. Although, these are questions I would have to ask an attorney.
They are getting an attorney. The copyright release is a good idea, thanks for your input!
You're rant made me laugh pretty hard! But you're right! I'm not too nervous about the situation, although I just don't want to deal with court if he ever decided to counter sue.
I appreciate all the input from everyone! My girlfriend's stepfather is a lawyer, so I did ask him about the situation. He isn't a contract lawyer, but he told me that the disc would be property of the client. It is something they paid for, and if they have printing rights to the disc, they should be able to do what they want with it. If the photographer is sued, it means they breached their contract. Therefore, it shouldn't be a problem if I did the service that should have been provided from the other photographer.
I also talked to another friend in their final year of law school. He mentioned it would be a good idea to obtain a copyright release. He also mentioned that it would be hard for the photographer to even know I did any work unless the album was publicly posted on Facebook/twitter/etc.
Overall, I'm not too nervous about the situation. I won't know for a while until he actually gets sued. I appreciate the input from everyone, as I've never had a situation like this come up yet.
Whether or not the photographer breached his contract regarding the rest of the deliverables seems irrelevant to the reprint issue, at least to me. Just because the scam photog didn't deliver prints he promissed doesn't automatically cause his rights to the images to transfer to the customer. Unless a judge legally order such a rights transfer as part of just compensation for the paid but undelivered prints, OR the rights were transferred to the customer as part of the original contract, those rights stay with the photographer.
It seems to me, however, that if the contract between the customers and the original photog gives them rights for personal printing, then that would include the right to have reprints made by another professional service, so long as those reprints are strictly for the personal use of the customers, and not for commercial purposes or publication. The fact that they got a hi-resolution disk sort of reinforces that; why else WOULD you get a hi-res disk, if it didn't inbclude rights for future reprints without going back to the original photographer?
In short - look at the original contract and make your decision based on that and that alone (preferably with advice from your own lawyer, if at all possible), and don't allow the original photographer's failure to deliver promissed prints distract you from the central issue - do the customers have personal reprint rights, or do they not?