First Motocross Venue.

canon400d

This Sunday I will be attending my first Motocross venue. I was intending using my 7D rather than the 5D. The two lenses I had in mind are 70 - 200 F.4 and 24 - 105 which has IS.
I would really appreciate any tips and advice especially at the angles to take these guys whilst flying through the air. Is it best to shoot them head on or on their side.
Also the mode, shutter speed, apperture and ISO to use.
I have seen loads of fantastic shots on this forum and found them very stunning indeed.
Needless to say I am very much looking forward to this event and hopefully I will achieve some good shots.
Thanks once again.
Bob

mercphoto

70-200 hands down. Zero need for IS, you need reach. There are two schools of thought with MX photography. One is to get wide-open and get background separation and frozen action. You see this a lot in the MX magazines (why, I don't know, I don't like the frozen look). The other is to go shutter-priority and get a shutter speed that shows some motion blur, ranging from a little to a lot.

When I shot MX back in 2006-2007 I usually shot shutter-priority around 1/640 or 1/500 and panned with the bikes. You will get a touch of wheel blur, just enough to let you know the bike is moving, but not so much that panning is hard. For head-on shots that is a good time to go wide open instead. Sometimes you can get nice shots at very slow shutters, like 1/100 or below, but those are very very hit or miss because of how much vertical bouncing a dirt bike goes through.

canon400d

mercphoto wrote: »

70-200 hands down. Zero need for IS, you need reach. There are two schools of thought with MX photography. One is to get wide-open and get background separation and frozen action. You see this a lot in the MX magazines (why, I don't know, I don't like the frozen look). The other is to go shutter-priority and get a shutter speed that shows some motion blur, ranging from a little to a lot.

When I shot MX back in 2006-2007 I usually shot shutter-priority around 1/640 or 1/500 and panned with the bikes. You will get a touch of wheel blur, just enough to let you know the bike is moving, but not so much that panning is hard. For head-on shots that is a good time to go wide open instead. Sometimes you can get nice shots at very slow shutters, like 1/100 or below, but those are very very hit or miss because of how much vertical bouncing a dirt bike goes through.

Thanks ever so much Bill very useful indeed and very much appreciated.
Bob

Zerodog

70-200
Settings?? It all depends on the situation. Just like any other photograph. There is no 1 right setting. I shoot manual. I pick the ISO and the aperture that will yield the shutter speed I can tolerate with the depth of field I want for a given situation. It is as simple as that. It doesn't matter if it is broad daylight or in an indoor arena.

mercphoto

Zerodog is fundamentally correct in that there is no magic bullet setting for photography. But the question wasn't an overly general question, it was at least a bit specific. But he's right, you can answer these questions on your own if you just ask yourself what are you trying to get the final image to look like? Ask the question of what you are trying to capture and it will lead you to the exposure settings you need, every time, regardless of situation.

Are you wanting background separation or do you need lots of depth of field?
Is the subject matter moving or stationary? If moving, how much motion are you trying to convey?

Even just answering those two questions can get you to a ballpark setting with relative ease. Now shoot, chimp, adjust. Shoot, chimp, adjust. Repeat until you get the results you want.

canon400d

mercphoto wrote: »

Zerodog is fundamentally correct in that there is no magic bullet setting for photography. But the question wasn't an overly general question, it was at least a bit specific. But he's right, you can answer these questions on your own if you just ask yourself what are you trying to get the final image to look like? Ask the question of what you are trying to capture and it will lead you to the exposure settings you need, every time, regardless of situation.

Are you wanting background separation or do you need lots of depth of field?
Is the subject matter moving or stationary? If moving, how much motion are you trying to convey?

Even just answering those two questions can get you to a ballpark setting with relative ease. Now shoot, chimp, adjust. Shoot, chimp, adjust. Repeat until you get the results you want.

Thanks once again Bill and you too Zerodog. I am sure from what you have told me as been very helpful indeed. I am more confident knowing the areas to be in to achieve some decent shots.
Thanks again for your kind help which I truly appreciate.
Bob

Zerodog

Manual, in most cases with this stuff is your friend. Any auto setting will freak out on backgrounds or jerseys and give you wildly different exposures even in a rapid sequence. Most important is have fun!

mercphoto

I disagree. I shot 4+ years of karts, motocross and car racing, all in shutter priority, and never had an issue with exposures.

canon400d

mercphoto wrote: »

I disagree. I shot 4+ years of karts, motocross and car racing, all in shutter priority, and never had an issue with exposures.

I really do appreciate what you are both saying. TV allows you to sort out the shutter speed and the rest is done for you.
I appreciate manual mode I would set the shutter speed around 1/640 to 1/1000 set the app at possibly around F.4 tp F.11 and the ISO at 100 pending on the light.
Cheers
Bob

ian408

I tend to go the manual route as well. I find I have a higher keeper rate. If I pre-focus, even better.

Zerodog

Yes manual yields consistent results for easy post processing. If I do auto anything it is aperture priority. DOF is important for me to control.

LRussoPhoto

I agree with zero, manual always gets me the best results. 2 things to consider though, first a semi auto mode will let u be faster on the fly and not limit u to that one shot without resetting your exposure. More importantly he is not using a lens the with give him a fixed low aputure setting throughout the zoom range. So shooting in manual with his type of lens, imo is very difficult and time consuming if he want to be able to zoom in and out. With that 70-200mm I'd stick with a semi auto mode.

amadeus

canon400d wrote: »

Is it best to shoot them head on or on their side.
Also the mode, shutter speed, apperture and ISO to use.

the short answer is - there is no short answer. shoot shoot and shoot some more. don't ever forget the riders make the pictures not the photographer. don't think that shooting the same jump with an annoying tree in the backround that the jump will ever surrender that tree if you shoot it enough times. if the best jump/turn/whoop/tabletop etc etc isn't in a photograph friendly light/setting/backround, don't shoot it. shoot as close as possible without being in harms way. don't be afraid to drop the camera and wave off an oncoming bike to help a rider who is down. auto ISO is your friend as is cloudy/sunny white balance. think think and think some more. shoot manual as much as possible. panning to one degree or another is paramount. learn the basics on the histogram.

I shot Alex here at 1/30th shutter, the light meter dictated the aperture. shooting the same way every day will get photos that look the same way every day.

Zerodog

Awesome panning shot Amadeus! I suck at panning. I do try sometimes but it is not my strong suit. I like roost and angles to imply speed for me it's more reliable. But it is all a question of preference.

amadeus

Zerodog wrote: »

Awesome panning shot Amadeus! I suck at panning. I do try sometimes but it is not my strong suit. I like roost and angles to imply speed for me it's more reliable. But it is all a question of preference.

thanks. the problem with waiting for a big roost is that sometimes it just ain't going to happen. ecspecially with the little ones on the little bikes. the cool thing about panning is that it can take an ordinary ride by and make it look great. another nice thing about the little guys (and girls) is that they tend to be SO intense so even if they aren't flying by in 4th gear with the front wheel in the air and a hail of roost and rocks behind them, a good panning slow shutter shot can still get some great captures with their eyes.

one of the things I've tried to keep in mind, is if you get a shot that looks like the rider could have recreated it in his front yard by handing someone a camera and telling them to take a picture when I ride by, why bother. no knock on the plus 40 C class or some of the beginner classes, but they jsut aren't going to provide endless epic shots along the lines of what Justin Barcia does on the skyshot at Unadilla. again, just ain't going to happen but you pan a rider coming into a ho hum turn and get some nice clarity on the bike and rider and nice blur on the wheels and backround you've got an epic shot out of nothing. and the best thing with digital, take a few hundred, why not?

amadeus

and on that note. time for Supercross on Speed at Daytona!

canon400d

amadeus wrote: »

and on that note. time for Supercross on Speed at Daytona!

Wow!! there sure is some great advice in these posts. I love the panning shot. I haven't done any panning before. Is there any advice that would help me. Am I right in saying one should only pan with a back ground. In other words it wouldn't work if the rider is in the air with the sky as a back ground.
Thanks again
Bob