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CR2 Files.

canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
edited August 26, 2013 in Finishing School
Hi Ziggy,
I appreciate that this is not on the correct forum but as you previously discussed with me about CR2 files can I please explain - After downloading all images from camera using EOS Utility. Next the images all appear on DPP I then do a Batch Process on DPP and all the images appear in 'My Pictures' I then find a file in the top left corner containing CR2 files. All the other images are sized 5760 x 3840. I would like to know if these images are the same as what is in the CR2 file. (which I am now saving to an external)
I have been in the habit of resizing these 5760 x 3840 using Irfan View. Again I have stopped this procedure.
What I would like to know is if I use a 5760 x 3840 image from 'My Pictures' on ACR is this the same as a CR2 image?
Am I correct in saying once the image goes into Photoshop it becomes in my case a Jpeg image.
I have never really understood this and I hope I have made myself clear.
Thanks Ziggy,
Bob
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    ziggy53ziggy53 Super Moderators Posts: 23,867 moderator
    edited August 21, 2013
    Yes, I am moving this to the Finishing School forum, where we discuss software issues and techniques. Edit: Someone beat me to it. thumb.gif

    You can use either the Canon DPP software to convert Canon CR2 (RAW) image files, or you can use Adobe ACR (often launched from within Photoshop Bridge), since you appear to have Photoshop CS5. I'm not sure if PS CS5 supports the Canon 5D MKIII CR2 files, so maybe you are best to use DPP for now. Do make sure that you have the latest version of DPP, since the copy shipped with the camera may be a little old.

    http://www.canon.co.uk/Support/Consumer_Products/products/cameras/Digital_SLR/EOS_5D_Mark_III.aspx?type=download&page=1

    The basic workflow that I recommend is to use your computer's file management system to copy the CR2 files into a new directory on your computer. Then make a copy of those CR2 files onto another hard drive or burn a data DVD, or do both of these things to make sure that your CR2 files are protected from loss.

    Then use DPP to do the basic corrections, like white balance, color balance, tone curves, exposure, brightness, contrast, input/capture sharpening, etc. If you intend to do more work on the files in Photoshop, save the files as 16 bit TIFFs. 16 bit TIFF files have a massive improvement over JPG files in terms of retaining color quality and with minimal aliasing/stair-stepping and other JPG compression artifacts. Yes, 16 bit TIFF files are large in size, so only convert those you really wish to work on in Photoshop.
    ziggy53
    Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
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    cmasoncmason Registered Users Posts: 2,506 Major grins
    edited August 21, 2013
    The hardest thing to remember is that the .CR2 or RAW file is NOT a photo! The RAW file is to a photo what a recipe is to a meal, or what a computer code is to an application. It is just data. This data must be interpreted by a RAW converter, which then converts it to a JPEG image. Using DPP Batch process converts these RAW files to .JPEG photos, which is when you see them in My Pictures.

    Photoshop can display both .JPEG and .CR2 files. If you open ACR, then you are viewing .CR2 files, as ACR is Adobe Camera RAW, the RAW converter. Photoshop can convert to .JPEG, but usually converts to .PSD, which is an interim Photoshop file format, that you EXPORT to make a .JPEG. So, a RAW file in Photoshop won't become a .JPEG until you EXPORT the file to JPG format (no magic occurs).

    Confusingly, a RAW file usually contains a low resolution .JPEG image embedded, which means you cant see the .JPEG file on your computer, but your computer shows a thumbnail image of the photo, so that the RAW .CR2 file looks like it is a photo, but it is not, this is simply the OS or application extracting the .JPEG file and displaying it. This is why these .CR2 files look so bad when you try to view them in larger sizes.

    I recommend that you set Windows (or Mac OSX) to show the suffixes of files on your computer (e.g. .JPG, .CR2, .DOC) to avoid confusion. This way you can see that a .CR2 file is just that, while a .JPG file is a JPEG.
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    puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited August 21, 2013
    Bob - dunno about others, but I use a card reader and just drag and drop the day's CR2 files from the card into an appropriately named folder in the relevant place (by date, in my case)?

    Then similar to above comments.

    I dump all the junk CR2 files (generally most, haha), back up the ones I want to keep, and only convert (and possibly re-size) the ones I want to mess around with / use in some way ... like post on my site or Dgrin (for example)

    I never throw the RAWs of decent pics away ... apart from them holding the original data in a form that allows non-destructive editing, RAW converters will, over time, generally improve ... and whilst you'll never be able to make a silk purse out of a sow's lug'ole, it's well worth keeping the RAWs so that you can re-visit them in the future (been recently doing just this with some '08/'09 pics) with an improved version.

    Dumping all your RAWs / CR2s is, imo, like dumping your film negs / slides and just keeping prints ... you've got rid of the original data.

    pp
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    jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited August 21, 2013
    canon400d wrote: »
    What I would like to know is if I use a 5760 x 3840 image from 'My Pictures' on ACR is this the same as a CR2 image?

    Maybe, maybe not. 5760 x 3840 is just the size of a 5D3 image. A CR2 (Canon Raw version 2) file is a raw image file, it may be 5760x3840, but a jpeg may also be 5760x3840. If you shot with your camera in RAW+JPEG mode, you will have one of each file type for each image. If not, you will have one or the other.

    I don't think ACR will open a jpeg, but I'm not sure. I can't imagine why it would.

    If you really want to be sure what type of file you're working with, find it in your file system first, right click it, and select "open with..."
    Am I correct in saying once the image goes into Photoshop it becomes in my case a Jpeg image.

    While you are working on it in Photoshop, the file is a psd - a Photoshop Document. This is nothing you would ever use to print or display online. From there you can do a save-as and convert the file to jpeg, tiff, whatever.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 21, 2013
    Maybe, maybe not. 5760 x 3840 is just the size of a 5D3 image. A CR2 (Canon Raw version 2) file is a raw image file, it may be 5760x3840, but a jpeg may also be 5760x3840. If you shot with your camera in RAW+JPEG mode, you will have one of each file type for each image. If not, you will have one or the other.

    I don't think ACR will open a jpeg, but I'm not sure. I can't imagine why it would.

    If you really want to be sure what type of file you're working with, find it in your file system first, right click it, and select "open with..."



    While you are working on it in Photoshop, the file is a psd - a Photoshop Document. This is nothing you would ever use to print or display online. From there you can do a save-as and convert the file to jpeg, tiff, whatever.
    Thanks everyone at last I now know what I am doing. As I have said I have found it all very confusing and I have never kept CR2 files because they took up so much space on my hard drive. I am now saving them on my 500GB external hard drive. I will only keep the good image CR2's and trash the rubbish. If I display an image on Dgrin and someone asks for the CR2 file of that image, do I post thr CR2 through Smugmug in the same way as I post an image?
    Cheers
    Bob
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    jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited August 21, 2013
    canon400d wrote: »
    If I display an image on Dgrin and someone asks for the CR2 file of that image, do I post thr CR2 through Smugmug in the same way as I post an image?

    You would need to upload the file somewhere and then post an http link to it. CR2 files cannot be displayed online (yet), but they can be linked.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
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    ziggy53ziggy53 Super Moderators Posts: 23,867 moderator
    edited August 21, 2013
    ... I don't think ACR will open a jpeg, but I'm not sure. I can't imagine why it would. ...

    Yes, you can open both JPG files and TIF files in ACR. The primary advantage, IMO, is because ACR has much finer control over Hue and Saturation, plus gradient processing for some operations.

    By default, ACR will not open JPG or TIF image files. You would need to enable this in Preferences inside of Photoshop. Then Adobe Bridge should be able to open those file types in ACR.
    ziggy53
    Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 21, 2013
    You would need to upload the file somewhere and then post an http link to it. CR2 files cannot be displayed online (yet), but they can be linked.

    Thanks Jack I follow exactly what you have said.
    Cheers
    Bob
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 21, 2013
    ziggy53 wrote: »
    Yes, you can open both JPG files and TIF files in ACR. The primary advantage, IMO, is because ACR has much finer control over Hue and Saturation, plus gradient processing for some operations.

    By default, ACR will not open JPG or TIF image files. You would need to enable this in Preferences inside of Photoshop. Then Adobe Bridge should be able to open those file types in ACR.

    Thanks a lot Ziggy and also for the update for DPP.
    Cheers
    Bob
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    thonsuthonsu Registered Users Posts: 64 Big grins
    edited August 21, 2013
    ziggy53 wrote: »
    Yes, you can open both JPG files and TIF files in ACR. The primary advantage, IMO, is because ACR has much finer control over Hue and Saturation, plus gradient processing for some operations.

    By default, ACR will not open JPG or TIF image files. You would need to enable this in Preferences inside of Photoshop. Then Adobe Bridge should be able to open those file types in ACR.

    Or, in Photoshop, choose File > Open As. Select the JPG, and in the drop-down list of file types, choose Camera Raw.

    Or, in Photoshop CC, open the JPG like normal and go to Filter > Camera Raw Filter.
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 22, 2013
    canon400d wrote: »
    Thanks everyone at last I now know what I am doing. As I have said I have found it all very confusing and I have never kept CR2 files because they took up so much space on my hard drive. I am now saving them on my 500GB external hard drive. I will only keep the good image CR2's and trash the rubbish. If I display an image on Dgrin and someone asks for the CR2 file of that image, do I post thr CR2 through Smugmug in the same way as I post an image?
    Cheers
    Bob

    As I said above, will only keep the good image CR2's and trash the rubbish. I took a couple of hundred shots this morning at the nature reserve. I copied and pasted the file containing all my CR2 files from 'My Picture' to my external hard drive.
    Out of the couple of hundred shots I have decided to keep half of them. I now find that the corresponding number 1 to 200 on the CR2's does not match the number 1 - 200 of my images.
    As you can imagine this is a problem finding the CR2 to correspond with the image I want to keep as a CR2.
    Bob
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    pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,698 moderator
    edited August 22, 2013
    Do you have Lightroom 4 or Lightroom 5, Bob?

    I think a Lightroom workflow would sort out a lot of your issues, and yes, LR4 or LR5 5 will handle 5DMK3 RAW files just fine.

    Lightroom is a great image database that stores your RAW, psd, tifs or jpgs and help you keep track of them. The RAW engine in Lightroom is the same Raw engine in CS5 or 6, and quite easy to use. It handles RAW, tffs, jpgs, and psds I know.

    How often to you need to use selection tools and layer blending in Photoshop? If you use those tools often, then you may still need to use Photoshop as well for those tasks, but I find I only use Photoshop for maybe 10-20% of my images today. Itis quite easy to export an image from LR to PS and back, so that is not an issue.

    If you decide to try Lightroom, just make CERTAIN, that you import ALL your image files into ONE catalog on an separate ( internal or external ) hard drive, and store all your catalog and image files on that single drive. Make CERTAIN that you back up that drive with at least 2, or better 3, other hard drives for safeties sake. You do have 2 or 3 backups for your present image files stored away don't you anyway?
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 22, 2013
    pathfinder wrote: »
    Do you have Lightroom 4 or Lightroom 5, Bob?

    I think a Lightroom workflow would sort out a lot of your issues, and yes, LR4 or LR5 5 will handle 5DMK3 RAW files just fine.

    Lightroom is a great image database that stores your RAW, psd, tifs or jpgs and help you keep track of them. The RAW engine in Lightroom is the same Raw engine in CS5 or 6, and quite easy to use. It handles RAW, tffs, jpgs, and psds I know.

    How often to you need to use selection tools and layer blending in Photoshop? If you use those tools often, then you may still need to use Photoshop as well for those tasks, but I find I only use Photoshop for maybe 10-20% of my images today. Itis quite easy to export an image from LR to PS and back, so that is not an issue.

    If you decide to try Lightroom, just make CERTAIN, that you import ALL your image files into ONE catalog on an separate ( internal or external ) hard drive, and store all your catalog and image files on that single drive. Make CERTAIN that you back up that drive with at least 2, or better 3, other hard drives for safeties sake. You do have 2 or 3 backups for your present image files stored away don't you anyway?

    I used to use Lightroom I think it was Lightroom 2 about 5 years ago. Since then I have used CS3 CS4 ans I am now on CS5. I have a reasonable knowledge of it for what I want to do. I have all the tutorial discs from Canon Plus magazine if I want to do anything special. I would prefer to stay with CS 5 if possible Brian as I have been with it so long. I do tend to get confused if I attempt something new. if there is a way of achieving this in CS5 I would very much prefer it but if not I would have to consider Lightroom.
    Yes I do back up on two 500GB hard drives.
    By the way this morning it was really dull amongst the trees when I was at the nature reserve and I did as you said about using Auto ISO on TV mode with MK3 and every single image was perfect not a sign of grain and picture colour was brilliant too with readings as high as 4000 ISO. I am still amazed by the reselts. Thanks a lot.
    Bob
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    pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,698 moderator
    edited August 22, 2013
    Photoshop does not keep track of your images. Yes, you can file them in folders, various drives, floppy discs or whatever with Bridge. If you only have 50 pictures, that works fine. But when you have 50,000 - and if you shoot much digitally you soon will - then a database file manager makes real sense.

    Bob, I was just like you when Lightroom was first introduced. I was quite comfortable with Photoshop, and not really interested in learning yet another piece of software. Yuck, what an unappetizing think to contemplate.

    Yet, as Lightroom progressed from L1 -> L4 it really does offer a lot of advantages. I, currently have over 80,000 images on my external hard drive array, and I can find almost any one of them in less than 15 seconds, no matter where I left them. I can also batch process images very easily, whether just 2 or 3 portraits, or 400 shots of wildlife during a mornings shoot.

    I have grudgingly adopted Lightroom 4 ( soon to be Lightroom 5 ) as my standard workflow, and only occasional images get exported out to pass through Photoshop anymore. Despite that decrease on PS use, I think my images continue to grow closer and closer to how I want them to actually look when I am done editing. I would not go back to a Photoshop based workflow without a fight. I like LR that much better. It used to be that if you wanted to use other imaging plug ins, you almost had to use Photoshop. But now almost all the standard Photoshop plug ins are also available for Lightroom as well.

    From the amount of races and wildlife you shoot, you must generate a substantial number of files. Keeping track of them will just be so much easier for you via Lightroom, and I think your editing will be much faster too after a brief learning curve. Unless you are doing sophisticated selections and blending modes, you really don't need PS that often anymore. You can still get a discount on LR5 if you purchase or upgrade before the end of August too I think

    Glad to hear that Tv with Auto ISO produced results for you as well. The 5DMkIII is a pretty darn nice camera
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
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    PeanoPeano Registered Users Posts: 268 Major grins
    edited August 23, 2013
    canon400d wrote: »
    Am I correct in saying once the image goes into Photoshop it becomes in my case a Jpeg image.

    No, a jpeg image is compressed. The image you open in Photoshop from ACR isn't compressed. You still have access to all the image data that's in the raw file. Incidentally, when you move from ACR to Photoshop, it's a useful practice to open in Photoshop as a smart object. That will allow you to return to ACR for further adjustments there, and also to generate multiple "exposures" for recovering shadow and highlight details.
    I never throw the RAWs of decent pics away ...
    Dumping all your RAWs / CR2s is, imo, like dumping your film negs / slides and just keeping prints ... you've got rid of the original data.

    Another advantage of opening raw files in Photoshop as smart objects is that all the raw data is saved in the PSD file, so you don't need to save the CR2. Just for what that's worth ...
    I don't think ACR will open a jpeg, but I'm not sure. I can't imagine why it would.

    ACR will open jpegs, and it's often a very useful way to edit jpegs, because ACR has some editing capabilities that Photoshop lacks.
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    puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited August 23, 2013
    Peano wrote: »
    Another advantage of opening raw files in Photoshop as smart objects is that all the raw data is saved in the PSD file, so you don't need to save the CR2. Just for what that's worth ..

    Think this is assuming the version of PS that's in use supports ACR for the cam being used ... which, for me, isn't the case :)

    pp
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    PeanoPeano Registered Users Posts: 268 Major grins
    edited August 23, 2013
    Think this is assuming the version of PS that's in use supports ACR for the cam being used ... which, for me, isn't the case :)

    pp

    If convert CR2 to DNG, the camera-support issue goes away.
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    puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited August 23, 2013
    Peano wrote: »
    If convert CR2 to DNG, the camera-support issue goes away.

    Fair point - I tried the DNG route some time ago (possibly because of this) ... but as I'm used to using DPP for what I do, I couldn't see the point in (even) more messing around :)

    I also suspect (but don't know without checking) that the version of ACR that'd be compatible with my PS version is going to be some way behind the latest version of ACR ... whereas I can (and am) using the latest DPP.

    pp
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    PeanoPeano Registered Users Posts: 268 Major grins
    edited August 23, 2013
    Fair point - I tried the DNG route some time ago (possibly because of this) ... but as I'm used to using DPP for what I do, I couldn't see the point in (even) more messing around :)

    I also suspect (but don't know without checking) that the version of ACR that'd be compatible with my PS version is going to be some way behind the latest version of ACR ... whereas I can (and am) using the latest DPP.
    pp

    If you like DPP, rock on. That's another way to make the problem go away.
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    ziggy53ziggy53 Super Moderators Posts: 23,867 moderator
    edited August 23, 2013
    Peano wrote: »
    If you like DPP, rock on. That's another way to make the problem go away.

    I like DPP for pushing underexposed Canon RAW files. (Better control over pattern noise than ACR.) Phase One Capture One is also very good at that, possibly followed by a modern noise reduction software.

    For volume work, it's hard to beat ACR for speed.
    ziggy53
    Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 24, 2013
    pathfinder wrote: »
    Photoshop does not keep track of your images. Yes, you can file them in folders, various drives, floppy discs or whatever with Bridge. If you only have 50 pictures, that works fine. But when you have 50,000 - and if you shoot much digitally you soon will - then a database file manager makes real sense.

    Bob, I was just like you when Lightroom was first introduced. I was quite comfortable with Photoshop, and not really interested in learning yet another piece of software. Yuck, what an unappetizing think to contemplate.

    Yet, as Lightroom progressed from L1 -> L4 it really does offer a lot of advantages. I, currently have over 80,000 images on my external hard drive array, and I can find almost any one of them in less than 15 seconds, no matter where I left them. I can also batch process images very easily, whether just 2 or 3 portraits, or 400 shots of wildlife during a mornings shoot.

    I have grudgingly adopted Lightroom 4 ( soon to be Lightroom 5 ) as my standard workflow, and only occasional images get exported out to pass through Photoshop anymore. Despite that decrease on PS use, I think my images continue to grow closer and closer to how I want them to actually look when I am done editing. I would not go back to a Photoshop based workflow without a fight. I like LR that much better. It used to be that if you wanted to use other imaging plug ins, you almost had to use Photoshop. But now almost all the standard Photoshop plug ins are also available for Lightroom as well.

    From the amount of races and wildlife you shoot, you must generate a substantial number of files. Keeping track of them will just be so much easier for you via Lightroom, and I think your editing will be much faster too after a brief learning curve. Unless you are doing sophisticated selections and blending modes, you really don't need PS that often anymore. You can still get a discount on LR5 if you purchase or upgrade before the end of August too I think

    Glad to hear that Tv with Auto ISO produced results for you as well. The 5DMkIII is a pretty darn nice camera

    Thanks ever so much Pathfinder. I have not been in long having taken 600 images at a MotorX Fun Day.
    Yes I am sure you are right as you have explained. I have checked and I think it is going to cost me around £100 for Lightroom 5. I am sure you will appreciate I paid quite a substantal sum for CS3 and the additional for CS4 and CS5. I also bought the 5DMk11 when the Mk111 came out thinking I was doing myself a favour. Anyhow, I was foolish as I am now left with the Mk11 and it has cost me full price for the Mk111 with the Canon battery grip.
    I will shortly take on Lightroom 5 as a result of what you have told me which I truly appreciate.
    It must be old age but can I please ask. I have probably asked this before! When the images have downloaded from DPP into My Pictures with the CR2 folder and all the images displayed. If I saved all these unsized images in a folder. I would be able to use them at a later date. Because I always use these images initially in ACR.
    The thing is Brian I have never ever sold a photo as this is a hobby and it gives me great pleasure to give my images to the youngsters etc etc etc. I only want to give of my very best as I am sure you appreciate. Once again todays shots with the MK3 and the 100-400L are incredible and don't need anything done to them.
    Thanks again.
    Bob
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    BinaryFxBinaryFx Registered Users Posts: 707 Major grins
    edited August 25, 2013
    Bob,

    As explained in the PDF files in the following link back in the original topic thread, raw camera data is not the same thing as a processed JPEG or TIFF file:

    http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=1899374&postcount=30

    Although one can work processed files in ACR/ALR or other raw processing apps, the raw sensor data is generally the best to use.


    Stephen Marsh
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    puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited August 25, 2013
    canon400d wrote: »
    ...
    The thing is Brian I have never ever sold a photo as this is a hobby and it gives me great pleasure to give my images to the youngsters etc etc etc. ...

    Whilst I'm not suggesting that you're in a similar situation, Bob - I couldn't help but be reminded of the linked blog when reading the above.

    Btw - I find many of the posts on this blog worth a look / read.

    pp

    http://blog.northshots.com/2013/08/donating-the-shirt-off-your-back/
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 25, 2013
    Whilst I'm not suggesting that you're in a similar situation, Bob - I couldn't help but be reminded of the linked blog when reading the above.

    Btw - I find many of the posts on this blog worth a look / read.

    pp

    http://blog.northshots.com/2013/08/donating-the-shirt-off-your-back/

    Thanks PP for that very interesting indeed. I must admit I have never looked at it like that.
    Cheers
    Bob
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 26, 2013
    BinaryFx wrote: »
    Bob,

    As explained in the PDF files in the following link back in the original topic thread, raw camera data is not the same thing as a processed JPEG or TIFF file:

    http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=1899374&postcount=30

    Although one can work processed files in ACR/ALR or other raw processing apps, the raw sensor data is generally the best to use.


    Stephen Marsh

    What do you think of this procedure Stephen:-
    Once I have uploaded the images in EOS Utility and the folder containing the CR2 files appear in 'My Pictures' I copy and paste the folder to an external hard drive.
    Next open DPP and click on Folder View and then click on my external hard drive all the images appear in DPP as CR2 images. I can then see them and delete the trash and I can make a note of the CR2 image I want to put in ACR.
    I can then open CS5 and bring up the folder of CR2 files from my hard drive and from the note I initially made of the CR2 image and select it and the CR2 file opens in ACR. I hope I have made myself clear Stephen.
    Cheers
    Bob
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    puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited August 26, 2013
    canon400d wrote: »
    What do you think of this procedure ...

    Bob, I noted that this was apparently pointed at me last night, but I saw it too late to comment (been out with cam and mrs pp using net comp :) )

    As a non - Lightroom user, I'm probably atypical around here, so whilst it works for me, my 'workflow' probably isn't worth serious consideration for some tasks / people.

    Take pics
    Remove card, transfer CR2 files from card (using card reader) to a newly created, dated folder in appropriate month / year.
    View all CR2 files (in this newly created folder) in DPP, dump the junk, mark up those of interest using the DPP check mark / rating tools.

    Back up these edited CR2 files (no point in copying / saving junk imo) to external drive.
    (at this point CR2s are on 3 drives as card hasn't been re-formatted)

    If I've taken so many pics that I've not been able to edit before going out again with cam (rare) I'll use another card(s)

    Convert - using DPP - any file of specific interest to tiff / jpg (depending on use) and open in PS and tweak as necessary.

    Re-visit all saved CR2s on an occasional basis and re-edit / cull - sometime later when got a fresh (and less emotionally attached) pair of eyes - I've dumped many of my earlier efforts this way, because - even at that time I took them, I knew I wanted to get down to water level, but needed to get round problems in doing so - including council regulations :)

    No doubt Lightroom is a fine piece of s/w - but I don't take many 1000s of frames at a time and have to deliver excessive (imo) pics to - for example - ppl who'll get divorced after a couple of years and be tearing any prints in half :)

    pp

    Glad you found PC's blog of interest - as previously mentioned, many of the subjects are worth a read (imo)
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    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 26, 2013
    Bob, I noted that this was apparently pointed at me last night, but I saw it too late to comment (been out with cam and mrs pp using net comp :) )

    As a non - Lightroom user, I'm probably atypical around here, so whilst it works for me, my 'workflow' probably isn't worth serious consideration for some tasks / people.

    Take pics
    Remove card, transfer CR2 files from card (using card reader) to a newly created, dated folder in appropriate month / year.
    View all CR2 files (in this newly created folder) in DPP, dump the junk, mark up those of interest using the DPP check mark / rating tools.

    Back up these edited CR2 files (no point in copying / saving junk imo) to external drive.
    (at this point CR2s are on 3 drives as card hasn't been re-formatted)

    If I've taken so many pics that I've not been able to edit before going out again with cam (rare) I'll use another card(s)

    Convert - using DPP - any file of specific interest to tiff / jpg (depending on use) and open in PS and tweak as necessary.

    Re-visit all saved CR2s on an occasional basis and re-edit / cull - sometime later when got a fresh (and less emotionally attached) pair of eyes - I've dumped many of my earlier efforts this way, because - even at that time I took them, I knew I wanted to get down to water level, but needed to get round problems in doing so - including council regulations :)

    No doubt Lightroom is a fine piece of s/w - but I don't take many 1000s of frames at a time and have to deliver excessive (imo) pics to - for example - ppl who'll get divorced after a couple of years and be tearing any prints in half :)

    pp

    Glad you found PC's blog of interest - as previously mentioned, many of the subjects are worth a read (imo)

    Thanks PP I am eventually getting there. I must get myself a card reader as the system you are using is a very good idea.
    This procedure I 've adopted is quite straight forward as I have been trying a number of CR2 files on ACR. I am gob smacked with the result of an image I am producing in ACR. I have found the only thing to do with it in PS is to resize it.
    I am so disgusted with myself and ashamed to say that all the images I have put into ACR for all these years have been Jpegs and I was thinking they were CR2 images. So emabarrassing.
    As I say the quality from a CR2 file from a Jpeg in ACR is amazing.
    Have you any recommendations on a card read reader?
    Cheers
    Bob
  • Options
    cmasoncmason Registered Users Posts: 2,506 Major grins
    edited August 26, 2013
    So far, there have been mentions of Lightroom, but I am not sure its really clear why folks talk about Lightroom so much. Let me try to explain with my workflow and benefits using Lightroom:

    1. Start Lightroom
    2. Plug in camera or insert card into card reader. Lightroom will offer to transfer the .CR2 files to the location of your choice, and will add those images to the Lightroom library. Lightroom will remember your choices, so the next time, you just click Import.
    3. Using the Library view, examine images, tagging 'keepers' with a hit of the 'P' key, which flags them.
    4. In Lightroom Library view, choose Attribute Filter>Flagged. Only Flagged images show on screen.
    5. Adjust Whitebalance. Copy Whitebalance settings to all other images.
    6. For each image, adjust contrast, brightness, exposure, saturation, noise reduction, apply lens correction. (lots of available automation to make this even faster)
    7. Done

    The most important thing to remember about Lightroom: it does not touch your .CR2 files. Ever. All edits remain in the Library, and are only applied when you decide to 'Export'. Export is when Lightroom creates a JPEG.

    Therefore, you don't have the create a JPEG until you need one. And since you can create one anytime, there is no need to save them!! This makes a big difference in hard drive space and organization. I do not save any JPEG. I upload to Smugmug and never keep them, as I don't need to.

    By the way, Lightroom is great with Photoshop. Lightroom replaces Bridge, and ACR. Do most of your editing in Lightroom, and you can easily click and image and tell Lightroom to 'Edit in Photoshop". Photoshop will launch with your image, you make edits, then close, and the .PSD (or .TIFF) is saved right there in Lightroom. When you want a JPEG of this image, Lightroom will create it when you choose Export.

    Lightroom makes it incredibly simple to manage and edit photos. Its all in one place, your RAW files are never touched, and you don't have to save JPEGs, or lose your investment in Photoshop.
  • Options
    puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited August 26, 2013
    canon400d wrote: »
    ...
    Have you any recommendations on a card read reader?

    Yes ... and no, Bob - typical politician's answer ... )

    I'm using a Kingston FCR - HS219/1 ... and never had any problems for the yrs have been using same.

    Problem is that it's been discontinued (as far as a quick check looks) ... I'd think that any reader from a decent manufacturer would be ok, though.

    Pleased you're getting things sorted.

    pp
  • Options
    canon400dcanon400d Banned Posts: 2,826 Major grins
    edited August 26, 2013
    cmason wrote: »
    So far, there have been mentions of Lightroom, but I am not sure its really clear why folks talk about Lightroom so much. Let me try to explain with my workflow and benefits using Lightroom:

    1. Start Lightroom
    2. Plug in camera or insert card into card reader. Lightroom will offer to transfer the .CR2 files to the location of your choice, and will add those images to the Lightroom library. Lightroom will remember your choices, so the next time, you just click Import.
    3. Using the Library view, examine images, tagging 'keepers' with a hit of the 'P' key, which flags them.
    4. In Lightroom Library view, choose Attribute Filter>Flagged. Only Flagged images show on screen.
    5. Adjust Whitebalance. Copy Whitebalance settings to all other images.
    6. For each image, adjust contrast, brightness, exposure, saturation, noise reduction, apply lens correction. (lots of available automation to make this even faster)
    7. Done

    The most important thing to remember about Lightroom: it does not touch your .CR2 files. Ever. All edits remain in the Library, and are only applied when you decide to 'Export'. Export is when Lightroom creates a JPEG.

    Therefore, you don't have the create a JPEG until you need one. And since you can create one anytime, there is no need to save them!! This makes a big difference in hard drive space and organization. I do not save any JPEG. I upload to Smugmug and never keep them, as I don't need to.

    By the way, Lightroom is great with Photoshop. Lightroom replaces Bridge, and ACR. Do most of your editing in Lightroom, and you can easily click and image and tell Lightroom to 'Edit in Photoshop". Photoshop will launch with your image, you make edits, then close, and the .PSD (or .TIFF) is saved right there in Lightroom. When you want a JPEG of this image, Lightroom will create it when you choose Export.

    Lightroom makes it incredibly simple to manage and edit photos. Its all in one place, your RAW files are never touched, and you don't have to save JPEGs, or lose your investment in Photoshop.

    Yes I am sure Lightroom is the way to go and I appreciate the steps you have outlined in your work flow. Pathfinder and Ziggy have explained this to me. I have looked and see it is going to cost around a £100. As I explained to Pathfinder in a previous post I have spent a hell of a lot recently on cameras and a 100 - 400L lens. But I will take the plunge soon.
    Thanks again for your kind help. I will certainly keep those steps in mind.
    Bob.
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