Young actress

divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
edited December 7, 2013 in People
C&C always welcome!

Did my annual mini-headshot-session shoot for the acting class at the school where I teach (they each get about 20 minutes), and was quite taken with the results for this young actress.

Experimenting with more 3/4 and full length. I suck at it. These are better than some, but mainly because she was a natural and only needed a very little posing guidance; I really need to take a fashion posing class somewhere to get more ideas. The Sue Bryce seminars are awesome, but I feel I want even more range of ideas than that. I can easily adapt to "real people", I think, but gotta get more familiar with fashion/commercial looks, since they seem to be drifting across into EVERYTHING these days. :deal

Hardest thing about this one is that she HATES photos of herself - I have no idea if she'll go for any of the ones we got or not. I think she really has "the look" goin' on and will be interested to see how she responds.......

5dII/70-200 2.8 II/natural light throughout (indoors I have a beautiful atrium/corridor to shoot in at that location, and it was bright and sunny out).

1. i-WGSfG5N-XL.jpg

2.
i-4pj5MSH-XL.jpg

3.

i-Pm7pJLH-XL.jpg

4.

i-jG6ZtRh-XL.jpg

Comments

  • jonh68jonh68 Registered Users Posts: 2,711 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2013
    I like the set, and how you blurred out the backgrounds to make her the focus while keeping the backgrounds an important part, if that makes sense. I need to do more above the head angle like you do. It makes for a stronger jaw line.

    A tip I learned from models and one that non models appreciate is learning how to pose to enhance curves. In 3 for instance, her clothes go straight down making her look straight figured. If they are wearing loose clothing and I am paying attention, I get the subject to pull the slack into the front. Since their hands are folded anyway, they can use one hand to hold the slack. Also arching the back and sticking the booty out by having them cross their legs enhances their shape. They feel very weird doing that but I show them before and afters and they actually get more confidence in themselves during the shoot.
  • HackboneHackbone Registered Users Posts: 4,027 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2013
    Very nice and great color. Really like the 2nd one. Always keep some hair clips handy to gather excess clothing behind.
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2013
    Haha John - I'll take full credit for the 'straight figure" - her sweater billowed out behind her, so I liquified down; guess I need to follow the actual curve of her body better, because she certainly has 'em (in the good way)!!
  • jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2013
    I feel your pain re: women who hate photos of themselves. Women like to imagine themselves as 17 or 25, and it ain't happening ever again, sorry lady.

    1 is great. Nice work. Sorta wish the teeth were in focus, but whatever, it still works. Just delete the feeding gnat on her forehead.

    2 she will reject because it makes her look somewhat fat even though she isn't.

    3, Jesus H. Christ, she needs minor surgery to remove that hideous mole. Come on people, we have technology. And, all piercings other than ear and bellybutton always suck. Suck suck suck suck suck. Fugly.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2013
    Actually, she mentioned the mole, and that she doesn't really like that side of her face because of it. I took some from that side anyway just in case there turned out to be something she liked (4 is actually one of my favorites from the session; ymmv). I also pointed out I could remove it in post if she wanted: "Yeah, I know. But then I just wouldn't look like me". I think there's a far more complicated relationship with birthmarks etc than just "good" or "bad". Btw, I would NEVER remove something like that in post without client permission - no way!!!
  • jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2013
    Yeah, there is a fine line between a blemish and an identity-linked birthmark. When I said surgery I meant it literally, not Photoshop. Maybe I am a shallow bastard but I wouldn't be able to get past it. Hopefully this set will finally give her the motivation to follow through and fix it.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2013
    Yeah, to me it makes her more interesting - I don't really see it as something to "get past", any more than the colour of somebody's eyes or shape of their nose. Beauty comes in many different flavours (and I think this young woman is drop-dead gorgeous fwiw) ne_nau.gif
  • jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2013
    divamum wrote: »
    Yeah, to me it makes her more interesting - I don't really see it as something to "get past", any more than the colour of somebody's eyes or shape of their nose. Beauty comes in many different flavours (and I think this young woman is drop-dead gorgeous fwiw) ne_nau.gif

    Well... that's because you're not a dude. mwink.gif

    It's the first thing I see in that picture. Moley moley mole! I wouldn't make such comments normally but I would think an aspiring actress would want to get that taken care of.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
  • jonh68jonh68 Registered Users Posts: 2,711 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2013
    Yeah, there is a fine line between a blemish and an identity-linked birthmark. When I said surgery I meant it literally, not Photoshop. Maybe I am a shallow bastard but I wouldn't be able to get past it. Hopefully this set will finally give her the motivation to follow through and fix it.

    I think that's a little harsh.
  • jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2013
    Honesty is sometimes harsh. If I were a director auditioning her for a show or movie I'd be like "Mole. NEXT!" Now if she was flirting with me in a social setting (and if I were single), I could get over it if there were a lot of other offsetting qualities.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2013
    Didn't seem to get in the way of the careers of Cindy Crawford, Angelina Jolie and Goldie Hawn.... :D
  • StueveShotsStueveShots Registered Users Posts: 544 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2013
    Jack, I, too, think you are being harsh, particularly given that this is a photography forum and not a discourse on a woman's beauty. Your comments are, indeed, shallow. They also have nothing whatsoever to do with Diva's photographs.

    For the record, I am a director--in my case, of theatre (not all actresses are striving to work on film). It would depend on the part I was looking to fill, of course, but her mole would NOT automatically rule her out at all. She is a striking young lady with a strong charisma on camera--at least in these still pictures. I'd want to see her move and speak before I'd make a judgement.

    Similarly, she does not look "fat" in #2.

    Such stupid side issues aside....Diva, I love these photographs. On my monitor, the first does look a little blown-out...but I'm not at my normal work station. I love the way you've emphasized her eyes--those dark brown eyes with her blonde hair are one of the reasons I would absolutely think about having her audition for me. (On that note, if she does like #3--and I do--I would probably spend a little time lightening her roots for her in post-processing.)
  • StueveShotsStueveShots Registered Users Posts: 544 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2013
    One more thought...you know which picture might get her through my audition's door? #2. She looks fierce in that photograph...like she could knock someone back just with a glance. Exactly the kind of power I want on stage. :)
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2013
    Stueve, you have MADE MY DAY, because everything you're getting from these shots is *exactly* what I was going for. Including the "fierce" in #2!!! I am SO SO happy that my intentions are coming across to the kind of person whose desk these shots might cross - this is the best encouragement I could have!!! She's too young and inexperienced to know her type yet (that's usually the case with the kids at the college), so I try to give them each possibilities that they can use/explore. She's got the glamour/sexy thing going on (despite what Jack thinks lol), she's quite a giggly and sweet kind of girl, but I could feel that there was a gritty look she could deliver too, and wanted to catch that. I'm THRILLED that it has come across to you. Thank you!! thumb.gif
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,948 moderator
    edited December 3, 2013
    What a cool thing to give the students thumb.gif
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • MitchellMitchell Registered Users Posts: 3,503 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    Nice set. #1 is my favorite followed very closely by #2. I think #1 could be a little stronger if her lips and teeth were in focus and not just the eyes. Sometimes we get so fixated on the eyes that we downplay the importance of some other striking facial features.
  • jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    Intended use is part of any discussion of photography. These photos are a credit to Diva's excellent technique, but sorry, the size and location of the mole make it a total distraction and not at all a "beauty mark" like Cindy Crawford's, etc. I wouldn't even mention any of this but the stated use of the photos is advertisement for a sexy young actress. The mole is not helping that cause. At least not for film or hdtv. Stage, sure, no biggie. But my eye goes right to it in #3. I think it will close some doors for her. 4 does a good job of minimizing the mole but also revealing that it is there so there won't be a huge surprise when a director meets her in person.

    Anyway, another great job on the photos, Diva.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
  • puzzledpaulpuzzledpaul Registered Users Posts: 1,621 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    Busyness of bgs in 2 and 3 (esp 3) caught my eye, together with rather too? whites of eyes in 4.

    pp
  • StueveShotsStueveShots Registered Users Posts: 544 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    OK, Jack...let's speak about intended use. Do you have any experience in the performing arts? I can see that you take wonderful portraits, but you seem to have a serious misunderstanding of the role of headshots.

    Headshots (at least for actors--I'm not speaking here of models) are not "advertisement" in the traditional sense--and they certainly don't need to project an actress as "sexy" just because she's young.

    Headshots are used by directors to winnow down a large number of actors for particular parts, and the decision the director (or casting director) makes upon looking at the shots is based upon the nature of the role he or she is trying to fill. A great headshot photographer for performing artists will provide her client with a number of photographs that project various aspects of the actor's personality--hence the reason I loved #2. That mole might rule this actress out for a very narrow number of roles (maybe some leads, maybe some ingenue parts--and, as an aside, ingenue parts are often very boring to perform)...but every show you see on TV today could make use of someone like her in a large number of roles. Based on appearance alone, that girl could be a successful working actress--she's rocking a unique, gritty, urban look--and if she's got the personality Diva describes, she's in great shape! (Can she sing, Diva?)

    Are there directors out there who would respond as you do? Sure. Would most of them? No, thank goodness.

    If this beautiful young lady decides herself to someday remove that mole because she wants to open herself up for more parts, that's up to her. But you forcing your perspective of what is attractive upon her is, frankly, offensive. I appreciate that in your last response you have softened your position somewhat...but let me remind you what you first wrote: "Jesus H. Christ, she needs minor surgery to remove that hideous mole. Come on people, we have technology. And, all piercings other than ear and bellybutton always suck. Suck suck suck suck suck. Fugly." I don't think that was a comment on intended use (you make no mention of the photograph)--that was an attack on the young lady's appearance. I hope that you are not truly that rude in real life.
  • jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    I stand by all my comments in this thread. Sorry I didn't make them nicer, but I was just caught way off guard by #3. The mole is going to limit her choice of roles, and that is that. Which is a pity because otherwise she is pretty (and thus she doesn't need the alternative piercings either). I am not forcing my opinion on her, I would expect that no photographer would ever direct their clients to read critiques of their photos. You seem like a nice person. But "nice" is not always honest or helpful.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    I think this is a valid exchange, so don't worry about it not being specifically about this set of shots (although I of course appreciate the kind feedback). As all here know, I thump the tub about how headshots differ from portraits and strictly promotional images, intended use, and potential impact, so please, carry on - entirely appropriate and of interest.

    Thanks again, Stueve, for "getting" what's going on here. Obviously as somebody in the industry we have similar views on this.

    Jack, you're right - acting is a "lookist" profession and, as Stueve also mentions, there are indeed casting directors/directors out there that go exclusively on appearance and/or type and might be that aggressively looks-focused. Particularly in the US, typecasting has become extremely widespread. Why? It's EASIER. You don't have to do much except push the actor's start-button and let things happen. Working with somebody to CREATE a character - instead of only using what the actor already has on offer - is much, much harder work. (For what it's worth, a lot of those directors also have the reputation among actors as shallow a**holes. Just saying............ rolleyes1.gif)

    HOWEVER - and thankfully - we're starting to see more of the industry (partiucularly TV) thinking outside the "pretty" box; it's been a long time coming, but there are glimmers of more substance starting to appear. Is physical appearance a part of the package? Absolutely. But for the best of the best, it's only ONE part of the package. Many, many other things are involved in deciding whether or not a person might be right for a role. Hollywood may still be all about "perfect" matinee idol looks, but (thank goodness) American TV is starting to take the more British approach (actors who look like real people instead of soapstar looks, eg Breaking Bad), and the theater has always been a little kinder and more open-minded in that regard anyway.

    IMO this is a very American thing; one of the things I notice most about British TV is the huge range of appearances that not only turn up, but are very well-known and respected performers (both onstage and on screen). Nicola Walker, Olivia Coleman, Laura Carmichael are quite ordinary looking women, in some cases with prominent "unattractive" features, but they are nothing short of superstars because they bring their characters so vividly to life. There are male actors of note as well who I suspect might not even have had a look-in in the states because their looks didn't conform to square-jawed type (eg Martin Freeman).
  • jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    (tangent alert)

    There are plenty of normal, average, or even homely actors in the US, they just don't get leading roles, or if they do they don't get swarmed by paparazzi. But they do get some very important roles. My wife is actually acquaintances with Siobhan Fallon, so we always notice when she pops up in movies and tv shows. She gets a ton of work because she is good. If you've never noticed her, that would speak to the culture here. She was the bus driver in Forrest Gump, and she was in Men In Black, and she has had recurring roles on SNL and Seinfeld, just to name a few.

    But I think what's worse is the trend that seemed to be started by King of Queens, where a below-average schlub guy lands a supermodel.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    Ah, but the actresses I referenced often play leads, and even sometimes romantic leads at that. They're not considered character actresses as such; Mis Fallon's imdb biography specifically describes her as such, so I assume she considers herself one :)
  • Bryce WilsonBryce Wilson Registered Users Posts: 1,586 Major grins
    edited December 3, 2013
    I think these images are dandy! They show off her personality (various) quite well. She should be thrilled.

    I do think her right eye and mouth should be sharper in number one.

    As far as the mole, at first glance, I thought it was a piercing and didn't think much of it, well except that old codgers like me don't like facial piercings. Didn't know it was a mole until it was mentioned.
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 6, 2013
    Thanks, Bryce! I don't like piercings either, but at this age/stage they're almost inevitable and (in this context, ie the college shoot) I tend not to challenge them. Hopefully the fashion will pass again at some point!
  • jmphotocraftjmphotocraft Registered Users Posts: 2,987 Major grins
    edited December 6, 2013
    divamum wrote: »
    Thanks, Bryce! I don't like piercings either, but at this age/stage they're almost inevitable and (in this context, ie the college shoot) I tend not to challenge them. Hopefully the fashion will pass again at some point!

    I think it will. My kids (11 and 8) think it's dumb.
    -Jack

    An "accurate" reproduction of a scene and a good photograph are often two different things.
  • lifeinfocuslifeinfocus Registered Users Posts: 1,461 Major grins
    edited December 7, 2013
    3 and 4 My Favs
    I like 3 and 4.

    3 - attitude captured.

    4 - I see the beauty in her.

    1 is not focus and 2 just doesn't appeal to me.

    Phil (just trying to keep it simple).
    http://www.PhilsImaging.com
    "You don't take a photograph, you make it." ~Ansel Adams
    Phil
  • divamumdivamum Registered Users Posts: 9,021 Major grins
    edited December 7, 2013
    It always interests me how shallow depth of field affects different folks. As long as the leading (or important) eye is in focus, I don't mind - draws me right in. But I know some people hate it if the entire face/head isn't sharp. thumb.gif
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