Basketball Action

timberrattle

timberrattle

I'm pretty much a novice and I'm looking for advice, opinions, suggestions. What did I do right, what can I do to improve, what can I do to get a better outcome.

The camera was a Canon 7D and the lens I used was a Canon Macro Ef 100mm 2.8 L IS. Specs for the above picture was 1/320 and aperture 2.8 with ISO 1000. Shot vertical with Zone focus.

Thanks for any help!

Ferguson

Indoor basketball is hard, so as a novice that's not a bad shot. It's hard to comment in general based on one shot.

Some generic thoughts:

- For photojournalist work, I believe you need it cropped straight - no tilt.

- For action sports get in there tight, put the viewer into the action. You did that fairly well (though it could be a lot tighter crop), but it's not much of an action shot -- there's no conflict, just one running and one watching. Interesting basketball shows conflict OR it shows athleticism; so a great dunk, a great leap, or someone fighting through a sea of arms for a shot. I remember someone (but not who) who said the best basketball shots are when the player looks like they are in football.

- White balance is hard indoors, it's often necessary to hand adjust. Those doesn't look too bad, bit is a bit pink.

- Sharp is king. I hear people all the time saying "but I like a bit of blur, it shows there's action". Sorry, look at the sports magazines, see how often a basketball player is blurred. 1/320th is too slow for basketball. I suspect your focus was good, but the right player face is soft and I suspect it's motion not focus. I don't speak Canon, but most gym's require being in the 2000+ or even 3200+ ISO on a 2.8 lens to get decent shots, and your F2.8 is definitely the minimum fast lens.

- Get low. Or get high. Basketball is much more interesting as an image if it's not from where people normally see it. Shots from eye level standing up, or sitting low in the stands is ordinary. Sit on the floor, shoot up, make the players look tall -- adds a lot. Or get way up and shoot down on them; you'll find the same quality shot has more impact to the viewer.

And shoot a lot ... practice is the primary requirement.

timberrattle

Ferguson: Exactly what I wanted. I will definitely try what you suggested. I really like the idea of shooting from up high or down on the floor. And the more action/conflict the better.

And thanks for the suggestions on the specs. I'll give them a try!

Much appreciated!

perroneford

That 7D is going to be AWFULLY noisy at ISO 3200. Sometimes you just have to do the best you can. Fixing the tilt, framing well, getting conflict, sitting low (or very high), are all things well under your control. The amount of light available is not. So focus on fixing the fixable things first, then worry about your ISO. But I'd be trying to get shutter speeds at least in the 1/500 range.

timberrattle

perroneford wrote: »

That 7D is going to be AWFULLY noisy at ISO 3200. Sometimes you just have to do the best you can. Fixing the tilt, framing well, getting conflict, sitting low (or very high), are all things well under your control. The amount of light available is not. So focus on fixing the fixable things first, then worry about your ISO. But I'd be trying to get shutter speeds at least in the 1/500 range.

Let me see if I understand this right. You would go with 1/500 and 2.8 and set the ISO to automatic and let the camera determine the ISO for the best exposure? And if it's noisy its noisy, not much else I can do to prevent that?

Thanks perroneford!

perroneford

Close.

I would set my shutter speed to 1/500, aperture to F2.8, and then set my ISO *manually* to get the exposure I need. You are in an indoor gym. The light is not changing, there is no need to use automatic anything.

timberrattle wrote: »

Let me see if I understand this right. You would go with 1/500 and 2.8 and set the ISO to automatic and let the camera determine the ISO for the best exposure? And if it's noisy its noisy, not much else I can do to prevent that?

Thanks perroneford!

timberrattle

perroneford wrote: »

Close.

I would set my shutter speed to 1/500, aperture to F2.8, and then set my ISO *manually* to get the exposure I need. You are in an indoor gym. The light is not changing, there is no need to use automatic anything.

Got it! Thanks, I'll give it a try Monday night.

photodad1

I would recommend shooting RAW. I tend to shoot a lot of vertical shots when shooting basketball and keep the white balance at auto and adjust in post production. I also crop at a 8x10 ratio. Also, tell a story with your photos. Take photos of the pre game, the excitement of the fans/students, the emotions of coaches and players.

lifeinfocus

Shoot raw as suggested and take a shot of a grey card or use a white balance filter to start. If you use something like Lightroom for post processing you can adjust white balance with the grey card shot.

And my favorite thing to remember for sports photos is try to get FACT - Face, Action, Contact and Toy (ball, stick, etc.) in one shot - three out of four is good.

timberrattle

Thanks for all the suggestions! I will definitely give them a try and see what kind of results I get.

johng

If you've got a white/grey card to shoot then save yourself some time - set a custom WB in your camera. Most gyms will have enough overlap of the light fields to give an average color temperature even though the lights cycle. I've shot in a dozen different gyms over the years and only 1 of them had lights spaced so far apart you didn't get a good average temperature.

Shoot manual - get the exposure and WB correct IN CAMERA and you save yourself a ton of time after the fact. Just make sure when you take your shot of the grey/white card you use a slower shutter speed - about 1/60 - you'll get a better "average" temperature reading that way. With this method you'll see some slight hue adjustments from shot to shot but not anything great. It's just as accurate as using the 'grey card" shot to set WB in raw processing. The only way you're going to get more reliable WB is to adjust each individual shot differently in RAW conversion and without a reference point that can be extremely difficult.

timberrattle

johng wrote: »

If you've got a white/grey card to shoot then save yourself some time - set a custom WB in your camera. Most gyms will have enough overlap of the light fields to give an average color temperature even though the lights cycle. I've shot in a dozen different gyms over the years and only 1 of them had lights spaced so far apart you didn't get a good average temperature.

Shoot manual - get the exposure and WB correct IN CAMERA and you save yourself a ton of time after the fact. Just make sure when you take your shot of the grey/white card you use a slower shutter speed - about 1/60 - you'll get a better "average" temperature reading that way. With this method you'll see some slight hue adjustments from shot to shot but not anything great. It's just as accurate as using the 'grey card" shot to set WB in raw processing. The only way you're going to get more reliable WB is to adjust each individual shot differently in RAW conversion and without a reference point that can be extremely difficult.

Ok, I've got to be honest. I know almost nothing concerning WB and taking a shot of a grey/white card, temperature readings, etc. The only thing that I've been doing is going to the Menu, going to White balance and selecting White fluorescent light or Tungsten light. That seems to improve my results.

Would there be an article or someplace where I can read all about the things you mentioned concerning white balance? Sure do appreciate the help!

perroneford

timberrattle wrote: »

Ok, I've got to be honest. I know almost nothing concerning WB and taking a shot of a grey/white card, temperature readings, etc. The only thing that I've been doing is going to the Menu, going to White balance and selecting White fluorescent light or Tungsten light. That seems to improve my results.

Would there be an article or someplace where I can read all about the things you mentioned concerning white balance? Sure do appreciate the help!

Mucho EASY. http://youtu.be/JFYBVV4cqOo

Done in 1 minute.

JimKarczewski

Custom WB won't do you jack if the lights cycle in a gym. Every sport has "that" school that doesn't have properly wired lights where anything above 1/Electricity Hz (60 in N. America, 50 most everywhere else) will cause half a frame to be one color and the other to be something completely different. Olders schools typically a major issue, newer schools (but not always) are done properly. While a custom WB can help, if the lighting isn't wired properly on a 3 phase system, you're starting off with a huge disadvantage. Be it basketball, football, gymastics, swimming, etc.

perroneford

JimKarczewski wrote: »

Custom WB won't do you jack if the lights cycle in a gym. Every sport has "that" school that doesn't have properly wired lights where anything above 1/Electricity Hz (60 in N. America, 50 most everywhere else) will cause half a frame to be one color and the other to be something completely different. Olders schools typically a major issue, newer schools (but not always) are done properly. While a custom WB can help, if the lighting isn't wired properly on a 3 phase system, you're starting off with a huge disadvantage. Be it basketball, football, gymastics, swimming, etc.

True. However, the issue is not just incorrect wiring. Many older lights do this even when they are wired correctly. And then you have gyms where lights have been replaced over time with newer versions, and the color of the lights don't match.

Sometimes you just do the best you can. I have all three scenarios on the campus I work at so it is what it is.

-P

timberrattle

perroneford wrote: »

Mucho EASY. http://youtu.be/JFYBVV4cqOo

Done in 1 minute.

Thank You! I will check it out.

JimKarczewski

perroneford wrote: »

True. However, the issue is not just incorrect wiring. Many older lights do this even when they are wired correctly. And then you have gyms where lights have been replaced over time with newer versions, and the color of the lights don't match.

Sometimes you just do the best you can. I have all three scenarios on the campus I work at so it is what it is.

-P

Which is why I strobe a lot of sports... Can't deal with half these screwed up lighting cases. Camera set to 5900K, with a WB Shift dialed in to I think 3G/3B and I'm done with it. Then again, I only know rules for strobes in IN/IL (Actually had to correct an AD the other day because once my strobes went off at a basketball game the PA Anouncer said, "No Flash Photography" Which is contradictory to IHSAA rules.)

johng

the problem isn't cycling lights the problem is gaps between lights. If lights are close enough together the light fields overlap and you get a pretty average temperature - but if you look at the shots you'll see different color casts on walls where you don't have overlapping fields. Again, I've shot in at least a dozen different gyms and only 1 had lights spaced so far apart each shot had a different color cast. Such gyms exist, but in my experience they are the remote exception.