Error: Due to browser incompatibilities, Smugmug should not be framed

AndyEllen

Recently, this error has started to be displayed. Can anyone help?

Andy B

Andy

AndyEllen wrote:

Recently, this error has started to be displayed. Can anyone help?

Andy B

Hi Andy,

We are discouraging our customers from using frames. It's a protective measure, becuase in order for your site security (for example, passworded galleries may never unlock) and transaction security (you can't add items to the shopping cart) to work properly, your visitors need to be directed to your site via CNAME Aliasing not webforwarding with Frames.

More in SmugBlogs

The message, when clicked, unframes your site and you are directed to your site via your nickname.smugmug.com

I can help you get "unframed" if you'd like. Just email me at help@smugmug.com.

BTW what is your SmugMug site name?

bwg

AndyEllen wrote:

Recently, this error has started to be displayed. Can anyone help?

Andy B

Besides the obvious "don't use frames", here's an explanation from the smugmug help page

A form of URL forwarding or redirecting that doesn't change the name of the URL uses Frames, sometimes called URL Frame. URL Frame displays your smugmug page through a window on your registrar's server, which prevents us from reading or writing user cookies. That means we can't remember their gallery preferences, can't keep them logged into password-protected galleries, and your shopping cart won't work.

edit: Andy wins the race again.

AndyEllen

I didn't intentionally add frames
Thanks for the replies. You can find me at www.andyboruta.com. I mailed my css, and I hope we can find out what happens.

I like your competition to see who can answer first! Great for us newbies!

jfriend

It's probably related to your custom domain configuration

AndyEllen wrote:

Thanks for the replies. You can find me at www.andyboruta.com. I mailed my css, and I hope we can find out what happens.

I like your competition to see who can answer first! Great for us newbies!

It is probably because of the way you have configured your custom domain. See the relevant help page. If that doesn't explain it, then a dgrin search on "domain" and "forwarding" will probably find your answer.

richmor

Hello Smugmug Community,
Prohibiting frames is problematic for those of us who are power users and have our domains forwarding to our Smugmug site. Frankly it feels as if there was a Smugmug policy change for the sole purpose screwing those of us who were using domain forwarding and not paying for the professional account. I am surprised by this change from a policy perspective, as it places what should have been a user decision in the hands of the Smugmug administrators.

The reasons given for this change was that it messed up security, might mess up shopping carts, and also caused emails to be sent to Sumgmug's technical support. However, it should be up to the Smugmug user to decide whether he/she wants to deal with the minor problems of a forwarded domain, not the administrators at Smugmug. Yes it messes up a user’s secure galleries, yes it might mess up the shopping cart; however, if the user wants to forward his/her domain then he/she must deal with these issues. As far as emails to support go, Smugmug should instead have a canned response saying that the problems were caused by a forwarded domain, and that unfortunately they cannot support the issue. Again, the decision to use forwarding must remain in the hands of the user.

The reasons stated thus far for this change are far from compelling.

Smugmug has made great strides and begun impressive initiatives to allow users to customize their sites. Therefore, it seems to be a radical shift to suddenly prevent users from using forwarding that almost every single domain management firm supports. Furthermore, the “best solution” as proposed by Smugmug is to use CNAMES. Ironically, even the Digital Grin forums clearly state that not all domain management firms support CNAMES and even if they do it might be very difficult to setup. This policy change seems to run contrary to allowing users to both customize and take control over their website.

I propose two potential solutions. The first is undo this change Smugmug. This returns the choice to the users; if they want to face the minor potentialities for reduced functionality, they may do so. This choice must be their option, not Smugmug’s. The second and least preferable is to allow power and basic accounts to also setup a custom hostname, thus returning the functionality of forwarded domains to the non-pro user.

I look forward to any other perspectives on this important topic.

Richard T. Moore
richmor.smugmug.com

Mike Lane

From what I've seen frames cause more problems on smugmug than they solve. I for one am very glad they implemented this change.

onethumb

richmor wrote:

Hello Smugmug Community,
Prohibiting frames is problematic for those of us who are power users and have our domains forwarding to our Smugmug site. Frankly it feels as if there was a Smugmug policy change for the sole purpose screwing those of us who were using domain forwarding and not paying for the professional account.

That's a pretty low blow. I don't think our history lends itself to this sort of thinking, but maybe I'm wrong? When on earth have we stooped to *any* tactics to get people to upgrade?

We've never used any selling tactics at all, let alone strong-armed tactics like you're suggesting.

richmor wrote:

I am surprised by this change from a policy perspective, as it places what should have been a user decision in the hands of the Smugmug administrators.

The reasons given for this change was that it messed up security, might mess up shopping carts, and also caused emails to be sent to Sumgmug's technical support. However, it should be up to the Smugmug user to decide whether he/she wants to deal with the minor problems of a forwarded domain, not the administrators at Smugmug. Yes it messes up a user’s secure galleries, yes it might mess up the shopping cart; however, if the user wants to forward his/her domain then he/she must deal with these issues. As far as emails to support go, Smugmug should instead have a canned response saying that the problems were caused by a forwarded domain, and that unfortunately they cannot support the issue. Again, the decision to use forwarding must remain in the hands of the user.

The reasons stated thus far for this change are far from compelling.

Smugmug has made great strides and begun impressive initiatives to allow users to customize their sites. Therefore, it seems to be a radical shift to suddenly prevent users from using forwarding that almost every single domain management firm supports. Furthermore, the “best solution” as proposed by Smugmug is to use CNAMES. Ironically, even the Digital Grin forums clearly state that not all domain management firms support CNAMES and even if they do it might be very difficult to setup. This policy change seems to run contrary to allowing users to both customize and take control over their website.

I propose two potential solutions. The first is undo this change Smugmug. This returns the choice to the users; if they want to face the minor potentialities for reduced functionality, they may do so. This choice must be their option, not Smugmug’s. The second and least preferable is to allow power and basic accounts to also setup a custom hostname, thus returning the functionality of forwarded domains to the non-pro user.

I look forward to any other perspectives on this important topic.

The fact is, SmugMug customer service gets *a lot* of support questions from non-customers and customers alike about framing problems. It's very expensive and time-consuming for us to keep answering them, and it takes resources away from important features and service enhancements.

Contrary to your statements, most people DO have major problems with browsing framed sites in their browsers. You don't hear about them - we do.

If anything, this change is aimed at keeping the Standard and Power User account price levels down.

This decision wasn't made lightly, but given the amount of confusion on the part of our customers, we think we made the right choice.

Don

AndrewSternard

Less than a month ago, I forwarded my smugmug account from my own domain name. Things were all going well until I started recieving error messages, essentially telling me I need to pay an extra $50 to have it work properly. I am not happy at all about this, especially since i have never once had a problem with the frames. I own a Mac and a PC and work on my site from both, and I have never once encountered a problem, until now.

I use this site as my graphic design portfolio, and my user domain is posted all over washington to help me obtain contract and partitime work in the area. It has been my understanding that if someone encounters the least bit of trouble opening up my portfolio, my resume is immediately discarded. This bad for business and I am somewhat irritated that I must pay $50 more to fix the problem. It seems to me that in a world where customer service is the only way to survive, forcing smugmug users to upgrade is a bad move.

onethumb

AndrewSternard wrote:

Less than a month ago, I forwarded my smugmug account from my own domain name. Things were all going well until I started recieving error messages, essentially telling me I need to pay an extra $50 to have it work properly. I am not happy at all about this, especially since i have never once had a problem with the frames. I own a Mac and a PC and work on my site from both, and I have never once encountered a problem, until now.

I use this site as my graphic design portfolio, and my user domain is posted all over washington to help me obtain contract and partitime work in the area. It has been my understanding that if someone encounters the least bit of trouble opening up my portfolio, my resume is immediately discarded. This bad for business and I am somewhat irritated that I must pay $50 more to fix the problem. It seems to me that in a world where customer service is the only way to survive, forcing smugmug users to upgrade is a bad move.

We're not forcing you, or anyone else, to upgrade.

Frames cause huge problems for most sites in most browsers. Login passwords, site passwords, and gallery passwords *do not work*. The shopping cart does not work. The list goes on and on.

We cannot allow our customers (and yours!) to have a bad experience by using something broken. Frames don't work.

Using frames to wrap your smugmug site is like pouring lemonade in your car's fuel tank. The manufacturer isn't trying to sell you a new lemonade-powered car when it doesn't work. Neither are we.

Don

jfriend

Two ideas...

AndrewSternard wrote:

Less than a month ago, I forwarded my smugmug account from my own domain name. Things were all going well until I started recieving error messages, essentially telling me I need to pay an extra $50 to have it work properly. I am not happy at all about this, especially since i have never once had a problem with the frames. I own a Mac and a PC and work on my site from both, and I have never once encountered a problem, until now.

I use this site as my graphic design portfolio, and my user domain is posted all over washington to help me obtain contract and partitime work in the area. It has been my understanding that if someone encounters the least bit of trouble opening up my portfolio, my resume is immediately discarded. This bad for business and I am somewhat irritated that I must pay $50 more to fix the problem. It seems to me that in a world where customer service is the only way to survive, forcing smugmug users to upgrade is a bad move.

Here are two ideas:

1) If you don't want to upgrade to do transparent domain support, then you could choose a different approach that isn't quite as elegant, but won't cause any problems for your customers. You could use some form of redirection. For example, when users go to your main domain, you could have them land on a page that would do a redirection to http://andrewsternard.smugmug.com/. They would then have the full smugmug experience with no other difficulties and no dialog prompt.

2) It would probably be possible to write customization JavaScript that would default the popup. I don't know how smugmug would feel about that, but you should at least stay away from the smugmug features that commonly fail with frames (like password protected galleries).

Andy

AndrewSternard wrote:

Less than a month ago, I forwarded my smugmug account from my own domain name. Things were all going well until I started recieving error messages, essentially telling me I need to pay an extra $50 to have it work properly. I am not happy at all about this, especially since i have never once had a problem with the frames. I own a Mac and a PC and work on my site from both, and I have never once encountered a problem, until now.

I use this site as my graphic design portfolio, and my user domain is posted all over washington to help me obtain contract and partitime work in the area. It has been my understanding that if someone encounters the least bit of trouble opening up my portfolio, my resume is immediately discarded. This bad for business and I am somewhat irritated that I must pay $50 more to fix the problem. It seems to me that in a world where customer service is the only way to survive, forcing smugmug users to upgrade is a bad move.

Hi Andrew, thanks for posting. To be clear and sure: we're not forcing anyone to upgrade - in fact - at the moment, the message only comes up, and once clicked - your viewer will get to your site at smugmug - out of the frame - via nickname.smugmug.com - and all will be well, we hope!

Sorry this is causing you heartache - as Onethumb posted, just above, it's to keep our serviceability high - and to ensure that site visitors don't have any problems with the site whatsoever, for example a passworded gallery not working, for example. We're real clear about why frames are bad, in our help sections:

http://www.smugmug.com/help/professional-accounts

and we don't mention on our site any support of forwarded domains for power accounts.

I hope this helps.

flyingdutchie

OneThumb,
I agree with the reasons you did this, but i don't like the message-pop up with the error-message.

Just move the site out of the frame to the top-window without the message. The 'moving outside of the frame' is going to happen anyway, so why bother with the message? The message may be useful for the smugmugger owning the site, but not for the viewer/customer of the site.

BTW: The message does not appear once. When you move forward through a site, yes, no problem. Next time you go to the same site, no problem. But as soon as you hit the 'Back button'... the pesky message keeps popping up(!) and don't let you go 'back'.

jfriend

I agree

flyingdutchie wrote:

OneThumb,
I agree with the reasons you did this, but i don't like the message-pop up with the error-message.

Just move the site out of the frame to the top-window without the message. The 'moving outside of the frame' is going to happen anyway, so why bother with the message? The message may be useful for the smugmugger owning the site, but not for the viewer/customer of the site.

BTW: The message does not appear once. When you move forward through a site, yes, no problem. Next time you go to the same site, no problem. But as soon as you hit the 'Back button'... the pesky message keeps popping up(!) and don't let you go 'back'.

I agree with flyingdutchie on this one. It's OK, to make the logged in site owner see the pop-up, but you should just silently move the site outside the frame without the pop-up for regular viewers since that's what you are going to do anyway and it doesn't do any good to annoy the viewers with the pop-up - it's not like they can do anything about fixing it.

AndyEllen

Cooler heads must prevail!
Wow, when I started this, I didn't think it would cause such a ruckus. Smugmug help is going the extra distance to help me (and I trust them).

I'm more concerned that the site operates properly (with and passwords, shopping cart working properly. If Smugmug is willing to help me set up a more complex CNAME structure, what's the hassle?

I'll keep you posted on how well things work out. So far, Smugmug is still a winning company.

Andy B

Andy

AndyEllen wrote:

Wow, when I started this, I didn't think it would cause such a ruckus. Smugmug help is going the extra distance to help me (and I trust them).

I'm more concerned that the site operates properly (with and passwords, shopping cart working properly. If Smugmug is willing to help me set up a more complex CNAME structure, what's the hassle?

I'll keep you posted on how well things work out. So far, Smugmug is still a winning company.

Andy B

Andy, your site is already fixed - did it with yahoo about a half hour ago Check it out, verify, ok?

EDIT: BTW, I made screen grabs while I was setting up your CNAME for you, they're here if you would like to see them.

All the best,

itchyfeet

Custom Host Name
I am a very happy Smugmug user! The popup that effects pages that are framed has affected my web page (www.elliotsjourney.com - http://itchyfeet.smugmug.com) and subsequently I have changed my domain to a FORWARDING one now (so I do not get this error message anymore).

However, I would like to use a custom hostname (so I don´t need to forward people), but do not need all the functions of the Professional account.

Therefore, is it possible to pay an amount LESS than $50 to upgrade to a (quasi) Professional account, as I ONLY want a custom hostname? I do NOT need any other facilities of the Professional account, and I feel that paying an extra $50 simply to have a custom hostname is too much.:): Or, could they be an account in between Power and Professional (price wise and functionality wise) that includes custom hostnames?

Thanks!
MERRY CHRISTMAS / HAPPY CHANUKAH / HAPPY NEW YEAR

Elliot

AndyEllen

SUCCESS!!! This was so easy!
My site now works as it should! Check it out at www.andyboruta.com. Smugmug service was excellent!

Thanks Andy...you should be proud of the service you give your customers.

Andy B

DavidTO

AndyEllen wrote:

My site now works as it should! Check it out at www.andyboruta.com. Smugmug service was excellent!

Thanks Andy...you should be proud of the service you give your customers.

Andy B

Congrats! Nice site.

Can I offer one tiny suggestion? Up in your header...your name...the kerning could be much improved. You see how much space there is around the "O"? The "B" and the "R" look like they're staying away from something stinky. All of "ANDY" is a bit loose. I think the "UTA" start to get there, but they may be a bit tight.

Here's a link to kerning on the Wikipedia. Also, I really recommend The Non-Designer's Design Book, which I have read, and the sister book, which I have not read The Non-Designer's Web Book.

It may seem like a small thing, but I really think it will help the impact of your site...it's the first thing I noticed, anyway. Your header, that is. Your header is the first thing I noticed when entering your site. Then I noticed the kerning...

onethumb

How To Remove The Framed Message

onethumb wrote:

We're not forcing you, or anyone else, to upgrade.

Frames cause huge problems for most sites in most browsers. Login passwords, site passwords, and gallery passwords *do not work*. The shopping cart does not work. The list goes on and on.

We cannot allow our customers (and yours!) to have a bad experience by using something broken. Frames don't work.

Using frames to wrap your smugmug site is like pouring lemonade in your car's fuel tank. The manufacturer isn't trying to sell you a new lemonade-powered car when it doesn't work. Neither are we.

Don

Ok, we've decided to let YOU decide if you want gasoline or lemonade.

If you're 100% sure you DO NOT want the shopping cart, gallery passwords, site passwords, login passwords, or anything else requiring sessions and cookies to work, we have a workaround.

Go to your customization and enter this in your javascript section:

framesWarning=false;

That'll cause us to not break you out of your frames.

Hope that helps!

Don

jfriend

How about only showing the warning to the site owner?

onethumb wrote:

Ok, we've decided to let YOU decide if you want gasoline or lemonade.

If you're 100% sure you DO NOT want the shopping cart, gallery passwords, site passwords, login passwords, or anything else requiring sessions and cookies to work, we have a workaround.

Go to your customization and enter this in your javascript section:

framesWarning=false;

That'll cause us to not break you out of your frames.

Hope that helps!

Don

Don, I think that's a useful step.

I also think you should only show the warning when it's the logged-in site owner. I think you are doing the right thing in removing the frames if the variable above is not set because too many things will break and calls will hit your support line.

But, I think showing the warning to a casual visitor is only making things look unprofessional and not helping anything. The casual visitor can't do anything about fixing the problem and it just makes the site look broken. Why not just take the frames away and skip the warning when it's not the site owner?

Andy

jfriend wrote:

Don, I think that's a useful step.

I also think you should only show the warning when it's the logged-in site owner. I think you are doing the right thing in removing the frames if the variable above is not set because too many things will break and calls will hit your support line.

But, I think showing the warning to a casual visitor is only making things look unprofessional and not helping anything. The casual visitor can't do anything about fixing the problem and it just makes the site look broken. Why not just take the frames away and skip the warning when it's not the site owner?

John - framed sites now auto-redirect to nickname.smugmug.com with no error message, to anyone, site owner, or visitor.

jfriend

Good move

Andy wrote:

John - framed sites now auto-redirect to nickname.smugmug.com with no error message, to anyone, site owner, or visitor.

Oh. I didn't see where that change was mentioned. That's a good move.

AndyEllen

Thanks for the feedback!
I'll check out the references!

Evans

Having problem with 2nd gallery pages
I have put in the frames warning script and get smugmug to initially open properly in an inline frame. However when I click on gallery page 2 (or any of the other pages) smugmug pops out of the frame and takes over the whole screen. Is there any way to keep it in the frame when clicking on additional pages?

AnneMcBean

Evans wrote:

I have put in the frames warning script and get smugmug to initially open properly in an inline frame. However when I click on gallery page 2 (or any of the other pages) smugmug pops out of the frame and takes over the whole screen. Is there any way to keep it in the frame when clicking on additional pages?

Do you have a link?

-Anne

Evans

www.bethandevans.com/photos

I deleted the page I have but just put this sample together to show you the problem. It loads fine, but when you click on another gallery page smugmug takes over the whole screen.

AnneMcBean

Evans wrote:

www.bethandevans.com/photos

I deleted the page I have but just put this sample together to show you the problem. It loads fine, but when you click on another gallery page smugmug takes over the whole screen.

Thanks for the link.

Right you are! I'm not sure what to tell you other than "I'm sorry it' s not working for you" and "SmugMug is better not framed" . Maybe someone else has some suggestions?

-Anne

dogwood

AnneMcBean wrote:

Thanks for the link.

Right you are! I'm not sure what to tell you other than "I'm sorry it' s not working for you" and "SmugMug is better not framed" . Maybe someone else has some suggestions?

-Anne

It's a conspiracy to get us to upgrade our accounts? Wait, I already have a pro account...

sg111

open SmugMug pages inside frame
framesWarning=false; does not seem to work now after some recent changes (from some weeks. It did work previously. I cannot avoid frames due to the structure of my site and I would be very grateful if this js of opening my SMugMug pages inside the frames is supported again. Thanks and please help.

Andy

sg111 wrote:

framesWarning=false; does not seem to work now after some recent changes (from some weeks. It did work previously. I cannot avoid frames due to the structure of my site and I would be very grateful if this js of opening my SMugMug pages inside the frames is supported again. Thanks and please help.

It'll work again after our next release, which should be we hope by tomorrow.

Stay up on Release Notes, here:
http://blogs.smugmug.com/release-notes/