Facebook Question

Sam

OK for all you social media folks, I would like to know how many people have a business Facebook account.

Of those does it bring in any clients? Also how much time is involved in maintaining the darn thing updating, adding photos or whatever.

While I do participate on a few photo forums I have never understood the social media, like, friend, unfriend thing. Always seems like kid thing.

That said many business friend have been encouraging me to create a business Facebook account.

So what have your business experiences been?

Sam

Cygnus Studios

We've had a business page since Facebook starting allowing it. I'm with you on the personal thing, friending, unfriending, checking in, seems to be a bit "young" for me, so I've never used a personal page. Back when we started using a business page, you didn't have to have a personal account.

There are some annoying changes facebook made recently the affect your business page, like showing what others like. So you'll end up promoting other photographers in a round about way. They claim it is a bug and it doesn't seem to affect everyone, but it's something to factor into your decision.

Anyway, while we don't use any social media to the extent we should, we still license 15 to 18 images per year just through the facebook page and that has been consistent since we started. We have picked up a client here an there but they were smaller one off projects. We don't do weddings or portraits or things like that so we tend to focus on having other business pages like us more than individuals. Currently we have something like 200 individuals who "like" the page and more than 1800 other pages that follow us. That fits us much better.

Our social media focus has been to showcase minor projects we've been working on or new equipment we're using, the occasional workshop that we host, that sort of thing.

If we were using social media properly (and my staff and I have discussed it at length many times) I would hire a part time person to just focus on that aspect of it. 15 to 20 hours per week to show off the best and newest images. Show off the latest tear sheets. Follow the other businesses that offer similar products to what we are shooting, so that we may influence their future decision on their photography needs.

Some companies (Williams and Sonoma did it just a while back) actually use social media to look for new product photographers to handle their in house studios. So depending on what your photography focus is, following other businesses can lead to more work.

In the old days it was much harder to get your book in front of the commercial directors/buyers/editors, now you can post on their page and whatever twenty year old who is in charge of their social media can actually get you in the door quite easily.

If you're focus is weddings or portraits, it seems to be a must have tool for reaching new clients. My staff has been following some of these new senior portrait startups that have really taken off just using facebook and instagram. They're using this as an excuse to get me to hire a social media person.

My recommendation if you want to do it right, hire some young person part time. These early 20 year olds are so in tune with it and they tend to work cheap

Sam

Cygnus Studios wrote: »

We've had a business page since Facebook starting

Thanks Steve!

Really, really, nice, I am envious, product images!

Sam

AlliOOP

We removed our business FB and never started a personal one. Our focus isn't on gaining clients and jobs. Our focus -- very eclectic special projects -- is very different and social media upkeep (FB) added to an already busy schedule with no return on our bottom line. We no longer FB.

Cygnus Studios

Sam wrote: »

Thanks Steve!

Really, really, nice, I am envious, product images!

Sam

Products has always been a larger part of our studio business, but last year we really began to narrow our focus and the effect has been tremendous. We used to do a ton of clothing, electronics, food and lots of little point of sale type stuff, but that was so time consuming and so stressful.

Last year we dramatically scaled back operations to basically doing 2 types of products and we've never been happier or busier. Product work is considerably more expensive than some other types of photography, but the work is really steady. Every so often I get this idea in my head to stop doing catalog work and do nothing but hero shots, but that's the bread and butter of commercial work.

Unlike working with models, products are never late, never flake, never complain, never have a death in the family, and no matter how well known they may be, never act like a diva.

Sam

Cygnus Studios wrote: »

Products has always been a larger part of our studio business, but last year we really began to narrow our focus and the effect has been tremendous. We used to do a ton of clothing, electronics, food and lots of little point of sale type stuff, but that was so time consuming and so stressful.

Last year we dramatically scaled back operations to basically doing 2 types of products and we've never been happier or busier. Product work is considerably more expensive than some other types of photography, but the work is really steady. Every so often I get this idea in my head to stop doing catalog work and do nothing but hero shots, but that's the bread and butter of commercial work.

Unlike working with models, products are never late, never flake, never complain, never have a death in the family, and no matter how well known they may be, never act like a diva.

Right now I'm picking some catalog / web work (on white). While not exciting I have learned a bunch about how to get an efficient workflow going for volume type shoots.

Last one was on location shooting tethered. The client was very picky about the image which was fine. I got direction. We need to move this / that, can you shot at a higher / lower angle, etc. Client approved each image and on we went.

Please note the client was very reasonable, just particular.

I know one thing, I would be very careful about quoting a volume per item price if I don't have control over the shoot or have a very clear understanding of what the client wants, quantity, etc.

The only issue with the last onsite volume shoot was the product wasn't ready or pulled so I ended up waiting more than I or the client would have liked. The good news is the client recognized the fault, and both knew and stated low per hour production was not my fault.

Prior to this job I took a risk and quoted a potential client a really low per item price based on setting up an efficient production line. I would have got slaughtered.

Bottom line your work goes beyond simple high volume white background catalog web images.

Let me know if you need someone to hold a light some day.

Sam

Cygnus Studios

For catalog shoots, rarely do we have the client on site. They do slow the down the process quite a bit, even the easy going ones. Questions come up. A new thought pops into their head. Sometimes they just want to sit around and b.s. especially on drink shoots.

If it's a new client and they are worried about quality, most often we'll ask for a few pieces and test shoot for them, then move on once they approve the layout and final image. Most understand this process when you're talking about shooting four or five hundred pieces. Nobody wants the shoot to go long.

On an ad shot, the client is tied to your hip the entire time, even when the mood boards were finalized long before you arrived on set.

There is so much product work here in the bay area, especially if you want to do wine and beer. Between the brewers and makers themselves and the tasting room/stores, you can easily fill 50 to 60 hours a week. These micro breweries are popping up all over the area, especially the south bay and just below Santa Cruz. The extra cool part, usually you get some samples to enjoy on top of being paid.

I'll keep you mind when we get in the extra large runs. We usually pull in some part time help a few times per year, especially on the mass jewelry shoots.

AlliOOP

What do you hope to gain out of using social media, Sam? Clients? Personal networking? Connections? New full time job opportunities?

For every minute you are on social media, that is one minute you are not shooting, or printing, or "business-ing" or whatever is absolutely necessary towards your photography business.

For every dollar you are paying someone to upkeep a social media site for you is one more dollar of business overhead and one less dollar profit.

But...

If social media has a clearly defined goal, is structured towards that goal, and plays a definitive role in the business structure, it can be an invaluable part of the business.

While we don't social media our business, we personally know a person whose sole advertisement and client connection is FaceBook. All the wedding shoots come from FB, all the deliverables are via FB and the references are FB likes/timelines.

It can be worth it... IF...

OffTopic

If I was a wedding or portrait photographer I would absolutely be on Facebook, without hesitation. For other types of photography, it depends. I think the key to social media marketing is to understand who your target market is and where they hang out, and then how to get your work in front of them. Are the clients you want to reach on Facebook?

When I gave in and started a business Facebook page I decided to target only a well-defined niche of my business. The upside for me was that many of my personal friends are involved in the industry and it has a strong fan base, and since I knew they were all on Facebook I realized that I needed to be there too. I'm embarrassed to admit how little effort I put it into it, I am terrible at finding time to update my social media accounts and I haven't even tried to actively get followers, but even that little bit of effort has paid off tremendously for me with big name brand clients and 5 figure deals, in addition to smaller projects and print sales. I hate trying to find time for social media (even though I try to justify it as "marketing"), but truth be told, if I were smart I would put more emphasis into my Facebook marketing - for that niche only. But who I am kidding, I can't even find time to update my own website and blog, let alone my social media accounts.

My G+ account is for networking and socializing with other photographers, I never set out to use it for marketing. It has brought a bit of business and a lot of fantastic contacts, although it's main purpose is that it's good for SEO purposes and search visibility. I don't get any business from Twitter (and never expected to) so I have that account set on autopilot.


These days the big corporate brands are all on Instagram and that's where we really need to be if that is our target client, but again with the time...doing up a separate square crop, thinking up 50 million hashtags, how on earth do people find time for this stuff?

Sam

OffTopic wrote: »

If I was a wedding or portrait photographer I would absolutely be on Facebook, without hesitation. For other types of photography, it depends. I think the key to social media marketing is to understand who your target market is and where they hang out, and then how to get your work in front of them. Are the clients you want to reach on Facebook?

When I gave in and started a business Facebook page I decided to target only a well-defined niche of my business. The upside for me was that many of my personal friends are involved in the industry and it has a strong fan base, and since I knew they were all on Facebook I realized that I needed to be there too. I'm embarrassed to admit how little effort I put it into it, I am terrible at finding time to update my social media accounts and I haven't even tried to actively get followers, but even that little bit of effort has paid off tremendously for me with big name brand clients and 5 figure deals, in addition to smaller projects and print sales. I hate trying to find time for social media (even though I try to justify it as "marketing"), but truth be told, if I were smart I would put more emphasis into my Facebook marketing - for that niche only. But who I am kidding, I can't even find time to update my own website and blog, let alone my social media accounts.

My G+ account is for networking and socializing with other photographers, I never set out to use it for marketing. It has brought a bit of business and a lot of fantastic contacts, although it's main purpose is that it's good for SEO purposes and search visibility. I don't get any business from Twitter (and never expected to) so I have that account set on autopilot.


These days the big corporate brands are all on Instagram and that's where we really need to be if that is our target client, but again with the time...doing up a separate square crop, thinking up 50 million hashtags, how on earth do people find time for this stuff?

Thanks for taking the time to post!!! Much appreciated.

Good stuff on your website and you sure do like them big tired vehicles.

Sam

OffTopic

Thanks Sam! Haha, it's kind of funny how that all came to be with those big tired vehicles...I was originally going in a completely different direction and never set out to shoot off roading professionally, in fact I actually rejected it as a way to make money (at least enough to make it worthwhile) many years ago before the industry really took off. I originally got my Jeep for landscape photography purposes and used to blog about my trips. One day out of the blue I was contacted by a major tire manufacturer who liked what they saw on my blog and asked if I would be interested in working with them. One thing led to another, and four years later I'm still working with them (and many others) and now I practically live and breathe off roading. I count my blessings every day because there is an incredible number of people in SoCal who shoot that stuff for free or dirt cheap just because they're there anyway, and I remind myself of that every time I'm feeling hot, tired, dirty and cranky.