Most Memorable Rejection

DavidTO · January 14, 2006

The American Photo magazine that just arrived on my doorstep has an article about professional photographers most memorable rejections. It's a good read.

One photographer (Paul Fusco) remarked about rejection:

You can't make people like your pictures, and you can't make people use your pictures. You just have to believe in yourself and demand excellence. You must be able to look at your work and see if it's really good--you can't fool yourself. When you look at your photographs, does it honestly feel like you felt when you took the picture? If it doesn't, it stinks, and that's because you didn't catch life at 1/1,000 of a second. It's out there, you just didn't catch it, and you'll have to work at it.

Notice he doesn't ask if your picture looks like it looked, but if it feels like you felt.

Discuss.

wxwax · January 14, 2006

Oooh, I hate people telling me what to do.

Nevertheless, I shall discuss. But only because I choose to. Just so we're clear on this.

I think what he's talking about is a level of sophistication beyond most of us. I think when he takes a photograph, he sees or feels something quite different. He already has a sense of the final image, even as he's actuating the shutter.

It's a place where I'd like to be, or at least visit more often than I do. The only time I feel like him is when I'm revisiting a location to take the same shot again, trying to address a shortcoming in a previous version of the shot. by then I've seen what the image looks like thru the camera, and have a somewhat better idea of how I'd like it to look.

DavidTO · January 14, 2006

Sid,

I would never dream of telling you what to do. Well, I might dream of it, but I wouldn't have the guts to actually do it!

What he's talking about in the feeling part is something that I really want to develop. It's part thinking/part feeling. The occasions that I've had a glimmer of a feeling I wanted to convey (and wasn't fumbling with the exposure and camera controls) have been the most rewarding for me.

I also need to develop that other part...the critical eye, to know when my shots stink.

Luckily, I've faced little rejection in my work, since I never put it in a position of being rejected! (aside from the couple of challenges I entered!).

Shay Stephens · January 14, 2006

Rejection is good.
Why do people like photos and pay money for them? It's because they make you feel something. If you are not moved by a photo, it isn't worth the paper it is printed on.

So, when you cast your critical eye on your own work, it should move you. If it doesn't, then you are going to have a hard time selling it. I find this to be the case in my line of work. And there are two kinds of customers, those who are moved emotionally by photos, and those that are not. Can you guess which one looks for the cheapest price?

If one can produce work that stirs emotion, then there is a great chance to be successful. If ones work doesn't even move oneself, a new line of work may be on the horizon.

Now, as to the rejections. I think rejection is essential. When a photographer is starting out they are like a lump of clay. Not quite knowing in what direction to go. Rejection helps to mold the photographer, helps to define the strengths and weaknesses. If you listen to those rejections, and they must come from potential clients, then you can benefit. If you ignore the rejections as coming from the great unwashed masses who just don't get it, well, a life as a starving artist may be in the making hehehe.

When I first started out, I was going to do product photography, and maybe portrait. The rejections I faced helped me to see that new directions were needed. I finally found my niche in wedding photography, a field I swore I would never get into in the beginning. But the truths behind the rejections were valid. It turns out I am only so so in my product photography. When I look at the photos they don't move me, sure some look cool, but I don't get excited about doing a product shoot. But when I look at a recent wedding gallery, I can be moved to tears. I find myself thinking of things I can do for upcoming shoots. I see wedding photography ideas when I watch TV and movies. I am emotionally involved in it.

If you do work that moves you in one way or another, that is a direction you are strong in. Persue it. If a line of work leaves you a little cold or worse, then leave it, it will burn you out and you will never make good money at it.

wxwax · January 14, 2006

Yes, I agree completely.

We succeed best at things to which we bring passion.

Fred Maurer · January 14, 2006

wxwax wrote:

We succeed best at things to which we bring passion.

Your words are inspiring and very true!

DavidTO · January 15, 2006

Shay Stephens wrote:

I think rejection is essential.

That's actually what this whole issue of American Photo is about. Great issue. Pam Anderson on the cover, you can't miss it!

Andy · January 15, 2006

American Photo has really stepped it up a notch, IMO. It's always been good, but lately, they've gotten *really* good. Hard to believe same guys publish PopPhoto, eh?

ian408 · January 15, 2006

Shay,

Do you think the emotion you feel has more to do with your participation in
the event? In otherwords, because you were involved and know your clients,
do you feel a stronger connection to the images?

Ian

ginger_55 · January 15, 2006

I am moved to tears and great admiration and feeling from my own photography which either does, or does not (then it isn't shown often) surpass what I saw with my naked eye.

Obviously, I must have a problem. Confusion reins (sp), when I am soooo moved by this or that, and someone says, there is some grain in....... (must not distract from what I am seeing)

I know this sounds egotistical, but honestly, I used to print out my photograpy, in the seventies, go to bed looking at it, wake up in the morning to decide if it was OK. Now, I think I am better, what I did then usually does not have legs. What I do now, only some might have legs, but I am often amazed that I was there, and I saw THAT.

Etc. Just too impressed with myself to live!

By the by, I don't go to galleries and stuff, I am also greatly moved by other's art and want/expect to own everything I like. The frustration is tremendous!

Oh, I have always said to photograph what you love, but I also add "hate".
I usually photograph what I love, but it seems to me "hate" would work, too.

I just don't hate much.

ginger (gotta get ready for church and baptism photography, not particularly moving at all, but it is what I do for the church. Keeps them happy.)

Bye

Shay Stephens · January 16, 2006

ian408 wrote:

Do you think the emotion you feel has more to do with your participation in the event? In otherwords, because you were involved and know your clients, do you feel a stronger connection to the images?

Definitely a factor yes. But I also hear from people who view sample slideshows that have similar reactions without ever knowing the people in the video. So I think what is going on is two fold.

One the one hand, I get to know the people, and during the wedding I pickup on and photograph the emotional aspects because there is that connection there.

And on the other hand, people being empathetic *and* personally moved by photography, when they (and myself) view the photos for the first time, they are lead to the emotional climax and experience similar emotions as to what is portrayed in the photos.

Those who are not moved by photography don't tend to respond in this fashion. And they rarely are the type to hire me as well. So my marketing is aimed toward finding and attracting the type of customers I can satisfy instead of trying to get anyone and everyone to hire me.

Flyinggina · January 17, 2006

Hi Shay!

Thank you so much for your comments, which I found very inspirational. Your description of how you feel about your wedding photography really spoke to me - it moved me! It is clear why your clients appreciate you. I am fortunate, I think, in that I know what moves me in my own and others' photography, which can be, of course, very different from what I simply like or find pleasing, or appreciate from a technical point of view. Unfortunately, while I am lucky to have some people who are very supportive of my "art", I have yet to find my niche. I think I may be doomed to be a permanent member of the clan of starving artists.

Time will tell. Meanwhile, thank you for giving me a mental boost and a reminder that it is important to stick with what one loves. And to have the courage to go for it.

Virginia

ginger_55 · January 17, 2006

hi, Gina, you have a gift in knowing what pleases others, I think.

Just wanted to say that I don't take rejection well at all which some of you may have surmised.

My worst rejections have not been in photography, but they have been monumental. Once in love, and my complete failure at being able to work in my field of cytotechnology. Rejection by people when I was too young, much to young to even guess that my hearing might be off.

Well, I just don't take to rejection well and try to avoid it. But I do take to certain kinds of "advice" well, I love to learn, as long as my brain is not in pain.

I cannot sell my photography, I just can't do it. And some of it, I think could be sold, but the rejection ..................... I just can't do it. I have a friend, if she lived here, she would work with me, and we would "sell" my stuff together.

I cannot take on commissions. I even promised to try to get something to someone for considerable money, about a yr and a half ago. I just couldn't do it.

Shay, you say you enjoy watching the joy of the newly weds, I am afraid of the disappointment.

So, where I love my stuff, I carefully stay away from most things that could involve rejection.

The most I have ever put myself out was here, the challenges. The pain I have been through, as I have avoided that. I did enter club contests, but I had it made, I had a baby boy, and I could photograph him very well. There were no rejections there.

I was an over achiever when I went back to school. I over studied for any test......................

I mean, I really, really do not take rejection well at all. And dGrin has been a trial by fire for me. I like this place enough to risk "myself" (and my photography is a part of me), but it has been a learning process and difficult for me to stick with at times. If I could have figured out some other way to live, I would have been gone by now. Having persevered, I do feel more comfortable now. I can say that right now, but a big rejection of any sort here, I will still be here, but I take awhile to be comfortable. Chances are, I then push myself to not get the same criticism again, sometimes to my own detriment as I lose myself trying to please others.

ginger

I could always write papers in school, so I stopped writing papers, so they could not be criticised. I then majored in biology, thought I would never have to write another paper. Was I ever mad when I had to write one to graduate!

livinginoz · January 17, 2006

i think the one thing that affects creative people the most and is the hardest to get around is a feeling of personal rejection, rather than just the rejection of the photo/artwork. when i used to go on job interviews with my portfolio, spreading everything out felt so personal, as if putting myself on the table for judgement. i think people who think with the other side of the brain don't always understand this.

i have gotten over it somewhat, if i like my stuff, then i am happy with it. someone else's opinion may be valid from their point of view, but if i change things just to make others like them, it's not really being true to my own art....

jmho

Shay Stephens · January 17, 2006

I'm going to bloviate a little.

ginger_55 wrote:

Just wanted to say that I don't take rejection well at all which some of you may have surmised.

Can a boxer become a boxer without taking a punch? Ginger, you have to get over your fear of rejection. In the beginning, it is hard and painful because one tends to take it personally, but you keep at it, and eventually you see the patterns of rejection and true significance of rejection, you discover the path you really are good at because you keep trying.

I wanted to be an inventor soooo bad growing up. That morphed into a compuer guy, which I did, but it wasn't really my thing, wasn't my strong point. I have had so many jobs, I kept testing, kept trying, kept getting rejected.

Photography has been a strong interest since being a kid, I tried that out. Now photography is a big field, so I tried various aspects of it. I thought product photography would be it. But there was a lot of rejection. I kept trying. The rejection pattern led me to what I do now.

I still get rejection, a potential client just doesn't like what I do, what I offer, or how I look. But that is ok, they have to make their own decisions and I am happier landing a customer who does like what I do, what I offer, and how I look

I have come to realize it's not personal. I may feel some disapointment not landing a particular job, but I know there is far more potential coming than there was in the rejection just experienced. So the significance of the rejection can be accurately weighed, and it is not that big a deal.

Think of rejection as the seeds in a watermellon. Find one, and spit it out to get to the sweet sweet rest of the melon. In other words, put the rejection behind you once you are done with whatever it can teach you and move on. Don't dwell on the rejection. It's just a seed to spit out and not bother with anymore. Rejection is not a personal attack on your existence, it's just a person saying yes or no for their own desires and needs.

So don't avoid rejection. It will stunt your growth, make you weak, and in the end destroy you. Seek out rejection, discover your boundries, find your path!

Shay Stephens · January 17, 2006

Fly high!

Flyinggina wrote:

Meanwhile, thank you for giving me a mental boost and a reminder that it is important to stick with what one loves. And to have the courage to go for it.

DavidTO · January 17, 2006

Well said, Shay. The not taking things personally has been a huge and valuable lesson for me in my life. In fact, I've found that if you take things personally, you're guaranteeing a lack of growth in that area.

wxwax · January 18, 2006

DavidTO wrote:

Well said, Shay. The not taking things personally has been a huge and valuable lesson for me in my life. In fact, I've found that if you take things personally, you're guaranteeing a lack of growth in that area.

Reminds me of the dgrinner who said he doesn't see the need to post his best shots to the Whipping Post, because he already knows they're perfect. You can't grow that way.

Most Memorable Rejection

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