Rebel XT or 20D?

drftorres

I need your help here. I would like to buy my first digital SRL camera. I like to shoot at sport events as well as portraits.
My current camera is the Sony T1 (5MP) and takes poor pictures in low light enviroments and it is slow.

What should I buy? I was checking SmugMug and there are a lot of pictures by Nikon D70. I have read the Canon's are better.
Please, help.
Thanks.

Red Bull

The first question to ask is "What's your budget?"

If you can afford the 20D, I'd say go for it. I'm not really a big fan of the XT because it feels cheap and is too small for me, so I went for the 20D.

DanielB

drftorres wrote:

I have read the Canon's are better.

be prepared for some whippin from the Nikonians :whip



as for your question... my advice is wait.


wait for another 2-3 weeks and see what PMA is going to release. then you can decide if you want a 20D, or the replacement.... either way you should wait because the 20D will probably be about 200 dollars cheaper used making a nice condition low count body in the 600-700 range

drftorres

I am looking for a camera of around $1,500 in a package. I am a newbie, I don't want to spend +$2,000 on it. No idea if I can spend $300 on a 20D. I have seen lots of packages on ebay.

nburwell

The 350D (XT) is nice, but it's body it too small for my hands, so I guess my opinion is baised since I own the 20D.

My suggestion though would be that since you're this is going to be your first DSLR to look at the D50 or D70s (even D70) and even the XT, too. Have you held either cameras in your hand? I know at least for me that a camera has to feel comfortable in my hand if I'm going to buy it. Since you mentioned your budget is around $1,500. If you were to go with, say, the D50 or 350D you could probably add some decent glass (or other acessories) to the body and "kit" lens that both cameras come packaged with (unless you purchase the body alone).

Even if you do decide to go with the 20D, you won't be dissappointed!

cmason

Well I for one love the XT, like its weight and size (and no I am not a girl). It is a great entry camera...it has the high end internals (8MP, Digic II), all the Canon lens fit, allowing you to grow, and it is relatively inexpensive.

It allows me to enjoy taking pictures...I can switch to manual for hobby photos, but my wife can switch to auto mode and just take photos at parties. Someday, maybe I will upgrade to something a bit more fancy, but I have time for that. Thankfully, when I do, I can move up and maintain my investements in lens, flash etc. Same can be said for Nikon of course, but at the lower end, I was swayed by the XT over the 70s or 50.

drftorres

All I need is a good camera. I have daughters and I am taking pictures all the time at home and in activities, I usually print them via Walgreens (4x6), sometimes 5x7. Also, as I stated earlier like to take photos in sporting events (mostly racing).
What's the main difference between the two? Price, size, speed? I saw them both at CompUSA. The size is fine with me and they seem to have same things.

erich6

drftorres wrote:

All I need is a good camera. I have daughters and I am taking pictures all the time at home and in activities, I usually print them via Walgreens (4x6), sometimes 5x7. Also, as I stated earlier like to take photos in sporting events (mostly racing).
What's the main difference between the two? Price, size, speed? I saw them both at CompUSA. The size is fine with me and they seem to have same things.

Based on this I'd say go for the XT. You'll save yourself a few hundred dollars which you can use to get a camera bag, extra memory, and a telephoto lens...throw in a bigger flash and a tripod and you're set.

The performance is better on the 20D but the XT is a good camera and will satisfy your needs.

Erich

cmason

drftorres wrote:

All I need is a good camera. I have daughters and I am taking pictures all the time at home and in activities, I usually print them via Walgreens (4x6), sometimes 5x7. Also, as I stated earlier like to take photos in sporting events (mostly racing).
What's the main difference between the two? Price, size, speed? I saw them both at CompUSA. The size is fine with me and they seem to have same things.

The 20D has a bit higher number of frames per second, it also has a step higher in ISO setting, more focus pts in the viewfinder, several more settings in the menus, flash PC port, slightly easier settings selection. The sensor and inards are nearly identical. It is a bit larger than the XT and a touch heavier. So if you are using it for racing, you can take more photos in a burst (more chances of getting a good pic of the car in the frame), which is about the only real difference I would see.

I have used my XT at F1 and Nascar races, and have not found that its burst rate was a shortcoming. I have a very fast CF card, so perhaps that helps...

drftorres

What about Nikon D200?

Red Bull

Nikons are generally more expensive especially with the lenses. With Canon you have a much broader selection of lenses for a cheaper price. There is also more used lenses for Canon on the market.

If you are wanting to shoot sports, CF write speed and frame rate is something you might want to look into. I'm not sure if the Rebel XT has the same write speeds and same size buffer, but I know that the 20D is pretty fast. I've never had to wait for my 20D to write the files. If the XT has the same write speed and buffer size, I'd say save the few extra bucks and get the XT. Then spend the rest on good glass and accessories.

Matthew Saville

Red Bull wrote:

Nikons are generally more expensive especially with the lenses. With Canon you have a much broader selection of lenses for a cheaper price. There is also more used lenses for Canon on the market.

Huh? Nikon and Canon basically have the same lens price ranges all across the line. You can start to see differences of $100+ only when you get up into the $1000+ price range, and even then it goes back and forth depending on which lenses you compare.

In the body department, Nikon beats Canon for price at everything except the 20D, which Nikon has no direct competition for. (If $1000 is your price range for a body, then get the 20D without batting an eye) The D50 however goes for $550 while the 350D (rebel XT) is still stuck up around $700+

And there are truckloads of used lenses on the market for both systems, so that's not a worry.

In the end, for taking photos of family sports and events and gatherings, and printing 4x6's and the occasional 5x7, I would say don't let the higher megapixel sensors of the Canon DSLR's add however many hundred dollars to what you pay since you're not going to need their marginal advantage. Go with a D50, and save your money for a really great lens like a Sigma 70-200 f/2.8. A lens like that, while not as good as the Nikon / Canon "stabilized" counterparts, will be an other-worldly experience compared to a Sony T1. Add to that the capability of safely using ISO 1600, and you're all set to go. If you shop at KEH, which is perfectly safe, you can easily get a fantastic setup (D50, 18-70 DX, 70-200 Sigma) for about $1500.


HOWEVER, for heaven's sake, do NOT buy a camera that you haven't held, shot with, and "gotten to know"... If you can, find somewhere that will let you compare a few different models, and go with the camera that feels best for you. If using one camera doesn't feel intuitive, or seems at least to be hard to learn, then try another. There's also the Olympus E-system, which if you're really hunting a bargain you can't go wrong with a $400 E-300 and a $500 14-54mm f/2.8-3.5 Zukio lens... Or Pentax and Minolta, which both have fantastic, low-priced bodies that accept the Sigma mount giving you access to the extra-value lenses like the 17-70mm f/2.8-4.5 and the 70-200mm f/2.8 that I mentioned which you'll love for sport events...

Good luck and let us know your continued thoughts and decisions,
-Matt-

gus

Buy the 20D. You will love it.

drftorres

Humungus wrote:

Buy the 20D. You will love it.

I will read a little more and make a decision. The 20D is winning!

gus

drftorres wrote:

I will read a little more and make a decision. The 20D is winning!

There is no argument against it in this price range that can hold water.

JimM

Humungus wrote:

Buy the 20D. You will love it.

DoctorIt

Matthew Saville wrote:

HOWEVER, for heaven's sake, do NOT buy a camera that you haven't held, shot with, and "gotten to know"...

I would like to echo this sentiment. I loved my 10D and thought that on paper, I'd love the XT as a nice little upgrade. NO! Way too small for me to shoot comfortably, hated the button layout.

Definitely at least hold and play with the camera you want. It'd be wise of you to go to www.dpreview.com where you can essentially read the owners manual for the controls layout, and you'll be prepared for when you walk into the store. If you read the controls layout once, can remember it, and the actual controls fit your memory of what you read, you know you have a winner that will work naturally with your style (kinda how my D2H is for me now ).

johno

20D. However, do you research beyond the forums.

peace.
johno~

NHBubba

Between the RebelXT and the 20D, I think I personally would pick the 20D any day of the week. If you've got the means, go for the pro-sumer now, rather than the cheaper (build quality) XT.

The 20D is a camera I would have a hard time outgrowing for many years. Any of the lesser models (Rebels or D50) are stop-gaps.

Although waiting a few weeks to see what the PMA show brings certianly wouldn't hurt either.

gtc

apart from the features and size differences which have already been dealt with, its worth remembering that the 20d body is titanium alloy whereas the 350d is plastic.

after cracking my sony mvc-cd500 body around the tripod mounting bung i have sworn off plastic.

this should tip you over the edge!

i have seen some extremely cheap secondhand 20d's,still in warranty, for sale recently,possibly in anticipation of an upgrade.

now would be the time to get one.

gluwater

gtc wrote:

apart from the features and size differences which have already been dealt with, its worth remembering that the 20d body is titanium alloy whereas the 350d is plastic.

after cracking my sony mvc-cd500 body around the tripod mounting bung i have sworn off plastic.

this should tip you over the edge!

i have seen some extremely cheap secondhand 20d's,still in warranty, for sale recently,possibly in anticipation of an upgrade.

now would be the time to get one.

It is not titanium alloy, it is stainless steal coated in Magnesium alloy on top front and rear only. But you are correct, it is a better build and just feels more substantial in your hands.

drftorres

Thanks all!

I ordered the 20D. It should arrive in ~3 days. I ordered also an additional 300mm lens. It is a low budget pro camera. :

CalKidd

I am begining to feel I have an inferior camera now (Rebel XT):uhoh . On the other hand I just took a gander on eBay and found the 20D, close to the end of auction, are going for over $850 used. I think for the hobbiest and some one who is very ignorant to photograhpy (me) I think the 350D is a great choice.

As for the XT being small I thought the same thing, but added the battery grip and it feels great in my hands.

cmason

CalKidd wrote:

I am begining to feel I have an inferior camera now (Rebel XT):uhoh . On the other hand I just took a gander on eBay and found the 20D, close to the end of auction, are going for over $850 used. I think for the hobbiest and some one who is very ignorant to photograhpy (me) I think the 350D is a great choice.

As for the XT being small I thought the same thing, but added the battery grip and it feels great in my hands.

Love my XT, and don't lust after a 20D at all. Plastic? so are football helmets...so what? Yes I suspect metal alloys would likely be tougher, but I am not sure that makes any difference in how I will use this camera.

Look, I am not making a living doing this, it is a hobby. I spent a significant amount of $$ (yes I still consider $1000 considerable) on this camera, and I will be damned if I intend to put it in jeopardy where it could crack, plastic or no. Yes I know accidents happen, but an accident that would crack my XT is not one I would be interested in happening to a 20D either.

Certainly if I were planning on going super rough, into the wilderness or standing out in the rain during a press shoot, I may have choosen a different camera. But I am not. If it rains, I put my camera away. For hiking, I bought a camera backpack, and it stays there till I shoot.

I also recommend this Zing cover, great for keeping scratches off, and offers a marginal bit of cushoning.