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Help! Motorcycle Race/Flash Questions....
Lets just wait 'till the last minute....
This friday(5/12) I'll be at Phoenix Int. Raceway for the GT LIVE (Car drifting & m/cycle stunting) event...
My main purpose is to shoot the U.S.Motorcycle Stunt Racing event,
it will be held in the parking lot area (not on the track) both during the afternoon and concluding at nite (9-10:30pm)
I've shot stunting before so I have a good idea of what to anticipate:wink ,
however my experience was 95% during bright mid-day sun.
Its the nite stuff / ext Flash use I need guideance with....:dunno :scratch
my gear: canon 20D(mine), canon 70-200 2.8L IS (borrowed),canon 75-300 4-5.6 usm lll (mine)
and FIRST TIME EVER - EXT. FLASH: canon 580EX (rental):uhoh
Any suggestions / tips would be greatly appreciated!!
(re: flash settings, iso, would like to shoot as wide open as poss.again I've never used an ext flash so I'm going in blind!)
(I called the promoters re: the lighting and best info i could get was "the regular parking lot lights and 'should' have additional rented lighting for this area")
based on prior exp. my distance from subjects will be varying, probobly between 15-60 feet range- and moving 10-50 mph
thanks in advance,
rich
http://rich56k.smugmug.com
(also, any tips on daytime fill flash use?)
This friday(5/12) I'll be at Phoenix Int. Raceway for the GT LIVE (Car drifting & m/cycle stunting) event...
My main purpose is to shoot the U.S.Motorcycle Stunt Racing event,
it will be held in the parking lot area (not on the track) both during the afternoon and concluding at nite (9-10:30pm)
I've shot stunting before so I have a good idea of what to anticipate:wink ,
however my experience was 95% during bright mid-day sun.
Its the nite stuff / ext Flash use I need guideance with....:dunno :scratch
my gear: canon 20D(mine), canon 70-200 2.8L IS (borrowed),canon 75-300 4-5.6 usm lll (mine)
and FIRST TIME EVER - EXT. FLASH: canon 580EX (rental):uhoh
Any suggestions / tips would be greatly appreciated!!
(re: flash settings, iso, would like to shoot as wide open as poss.again I've never used an ext flash so I'm going in blind!)
(I called the promoters re: the lighting and best info i could get was "the regular parking lot lights and 'should' have additional rented lighting for this area")
based on prior exp. my distance from subjects will be varying, probobly between 15-60 feet range- and moving 10-50 mph
thanks in advance,
rich
http://rich56k.smugmug.com
(also, any tips on daytime fill flash use?)
http://HooliganUnderground.com
Member: ASMP; EP; NPPA; CPS
Member: ASMP; EP; NPPA; CPS
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I was right where you are a few weeks back. I did my first night motocross race. The lights were less than favorable. In fact it was pretty bad. I used the 20D and my 550EX flash. I tried several ways, and had pretty good success with setting the camera on manual, at 1/250 @ F8, and leaving the flash on E-TTL (a tip I found in the flash manual), using ISO 400. The shot below was taken at these settings.
I also tried varying the settings, by changing the f-stop to F4, and F2.8...really made little to no difference in the final image. Neither did bumping the ISO up to 800. Your lighting may be better, I don't know how it couldn't be...this place was scary dark, so if you have a chance do some test shots, and check the image...god bless digital! A good smooth pan may be needed, and you may not be able to do a burst of images...but try.
If you shoot in the day time and want to use fill (edit:for sports) , it's pretty easy too. Either choose your shutter speed (1/250 or higher) or your aperature and set your flash to highspeed sync, it should do the rest. Works for me.
Good luck:D
And if you don't have a battery pack for the flash, take lots of batteries!
The biggest issue I had was that auto-focus performance tanks in dim light, and I was using a 20D and a 70-200/2.8. Your 75-300/5.6 will be nearly impossible to auto-focus with. So I resorted to manually pre-focusing and shooting only bikes when they were at that spot.
If you stick to shutter speeds that are 1/250 or slower then you can stay off high-speed sync mode on the flash. Do not use high-speed synch mode if you do not need it. I would suggest trying a shutter of 1/250, an aperture of f/4, and set an ISO so that you are from 1 to 3 stops underexposed, let the flash fill in the rest.
Notice that as you change your manual exposure you will either require more or less flash, and you will either darken or brighten your background. For example, a longer shutter will require less flash power and make the backgrounds brighter. A smaller aperture will require more flash and make darker backgrounds. Higher ISO will require less flash power, etc. You get the idea.
A former sports shooter
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Thanks to each of you for your expertise and tips!
Will be using your info to guide my shooting and to experiment,
I feel much less anxiety with this endeavor as a result of your
prompt and informative replies...will be picking up the flash after work tonite and have a chance to get familier(?) with it ...may pop back a couple more 'q's' but either way I've got some good points to go with!
"I can see said the blind man!"
Will post some pics when I get back
Jeff, can only hope to get some results like your example- looks great!
Bill, also serves to explain many of your tips!
Thanks Again,
rich
And thanks also to Dgrin for being here!
http://rich56k.smugmug.com
Member: ASMP; EP; NPPA; CPS
Anytime. And Bill is right about the focus thing...it gets hard if the light gets too low, and you are starting out with a disadvantage with the 75-300. Try to get under some lights! Hoepfully they have more than the track I went to did. You'll have to show us how it went.
I'd be looking at the existing lighting and the added rental lights to work with the ambient lighting.
Stick with the 70-200 2.8 and if possible maybe borrow a x1.4 for a 280mm. Leave the 75-300 at home unless you've got a spare body. Crops from the 200mm will, I think, give you better results than the 300.
As for flash I tend to go full power in pitch black but just a touch ie a 1/4 maybe 1/2 power if background light is available and suitable. And then dump the flash asap.
(28-70 f2.8) 70mm f4 1/60 ISO 100 flash was set low but not recorded. The shot before this one is an overbright mess with an overpowered flash as I adjusted. This is the third attempt to adjust so lost two pics in setup. Probably went full power, half and ended at 1/4. Does it show any flash
For your 200 look at setting 1/200 or 1/250 or less(your choice 1/100?) and see what it looks like. f2.8 or f8 doesn't matter. I pop on a 200mm and shoot at 1/200 or 1/250 at 1.8 at dawn to maybe f16 by mid morning. But no flash asap.
ie. (200mm f1.8) 200mm f2.5 1/250 ISO100
So I'm trying to say shoot to the ambient light at 1/200ish f2.8 or whatever (take readings and test shots) then add a dash of flash say 1/4 or 1/2 and look at the results. If it does not seem to be working (say bikes too far for flash to matter(now try full power flash)) dump the flash and shoot 1/250 or 1/100 or 1/500 at f whatever and see how that looks. Have a mess about and enjoy the show. It may be lit quite well....
Hope that ramble makes sense,
Bod.
Jerry Lodriguss - Sports Photographer
Reporters sans frontières
Just got in 3AM- got up, am downloading / backing up 2800 pics total - had to peek-
so far looks like theres keepers for sure(a good bunch con. first time and all..) (the lighting SUCKED!-:cry -rentals all around - had to pick the rare occasion where bikes weren't directly between-you'll see what I mean)
Took pretty much all advice offered and :
-didnt bother with the 75-300 at all
-did many test shots for setup
-stuck with 70-200 2.8L
-biggest/most helpful point prob: the manual focus/pick a spot/wait for them
without that would have wasted $$/ time
Will post some ASAP,
Thanks Again To All of You
Jeff
rich
http://rich56k.smugmug.com
Member: ASMP; EP; NPPA; CPS
Glad to hear it went well
My races got rained out today:cry, what a bummer.
Sorry to hear about the rain..however,the season is just starting!
(was 105 in Phoenix!)
Well this is my attempt at both posting pics and night shots w/ext flash....
my settings were: (20D- parameter 1) Manual, f4.0, 1/250, flash@ETTL, 70-200L 2.8 IS,(IS off),ISO 3200, manual focus as they came to me (for the most part anyhow...)(first tried 400, 800 seemed too dark-set at 3200 then forgot to try back to other ISO as got caught up in the excitement) FOR POST -I do iPhoto slideshow @ 1 second int, rate @ star / no star to weed down total 1100 shots total to 220 'keepers' mostly day shots)mild sharp in iPhoto, then run thru PS "vivid color*" action /save @ j10 then straight into s/mug gallery)
Met most of the riders a lot of fans passed out about 200 cards,
Had a great time, then flew to Sacramento 7am Sat for NMRA M/C Drag Racing (drove back to Burbank Sun AM - had over 2800 shots to go thru - then back to work Mon AM (darn!)
However... seems i should have been able to shoot at less than 3200?!
Need feedback / tips to improve as June 3 it's back to Phoenix for AZ. Stuntfest (woo whoo) which doesnt start til the sun goes down :uhoh
Thanks again for the tips! I'm pleased for a first time now need to get fine tuned....(let it rip, I need to hear it!!only one way to improve is with constructive crit!!)
rich
PS: * Bill, Thanks for the link to Noel Carboni site-re PS actions pre-made! (from back in March!!)
http://home.att.net/~ncarboni/DigiPhoto.html
http://rich56k.smugmug.com
Member: ASMP; EP; NPPA; CPS
PS.....it's still raining!:cry You would think I lived in Seattle.
Jeff,
Again thanks for your help!
Will look into the flash extender,
sounds like it might be just what i need,
you sure you're not in Seattle?
rich
http://rich56k.smugmug.com
Member: ASMP; EP; NPPA; CPS
I'm begining to think it's Seattle....9 straight days with rain.:bs