Soccer Tournament revisited

Ann McRae · May 22, 2006

Hi
I was brainstorming this idea in the Vegas airport with Bob Bell, Nancy Wilkins, cwphotos and dragon300zx. I've been asked back to shoot an U10 (U6, U8, U10) tournament in about a month. Two days on site shooting. Last year I agreed to do this on spec, with about 2 days to prepare (and that resulted in my home brew business cards). I then posted edited photos on smugmug, and the tournament host posted the links to the galleries. Overal I sold under $1000 in prints for what amounted to a full weeks work.

I loved shooting this tournament because the kids are really full of joy - too young to be ugly competetive. Of course, at this age the smile on the face is more important than the ball in the frame.

Some of my favorites:

http://canadian-ann.smugmug.com/gallery/956279

So what we came up with yesterday was:
Make sure there is lots of pre event advertising and communication of how to be reached.
Sell cds of print ready photos rather than worry about photo fulfilment, possibly with a preorder component.
Maybe include portraits, special personalized cd covers.

I had considered getting set up for on site printing but that requires on site editing.

I'd like to keep the number of assistants down (to keep costs down) but know I cannot do it alone like I did last year. I am contemplating having a second shooter come with.

Any other thoughts? I'd like to see if I could double the income (minimum) from last year. I have enough time to plan a few strategies.

Thanks

ann

THE TOUCH · May 22, 2006

Ann McRae wrote:

ann

Ann - Can I ask what you charged for prints last year? I'm working on doing the same type of thing for Paintball but I'm still tossing on the prices.

Thanks!

Catto · May 23, 2006

Ann McRae wrote:

Sell cds of print ready photos rather than worry about photo fulfilment, possibly with a preorder component.

Hi Ann; just to play devil's advocate here, what's to prevent someone from each team buying one CD, and printing the whole team's images from your print-ready files?

That wouldn't really help with your plan to double income - and that's why I don't sell print-ready files (or files at all, as I reckon any file you sell will be used for printing, good or bad). Sure, fulfillment is a hassle - but it ensures you're involved in quality control at the print stage.

Plus, you're offering professional lab prints (not un-colour-managed home inkjet versions), which is an opportunity to sell them as premium quality prints, at a premium price. I think offering the self-print option will undercut that, and leave you with less overall income.

You also have an opportunity to label the prints with your copyright info, so if in a few years they're faded or damaged, the individual parents (or children) know where to find you to get the file re-printed. Which of course they'd be able to do themselves if you sell them a disc, which again limits income potential...

Just one take on it. We all have to do what makes us happy.
R!

JimM · May 23, 2006

Did you break up the galleries for each game/team? Seems the easier it is for people to find pictures of their child, the more they will buy. I still need to learn how to enable sorting by player number.

Ann McRae · May 23, 2006

THE TOUCH wrote:

Ann - Can I ask what you charged for prints last year? I'm working on doing the same type of thing for Paintball but I'm still tossing on the prices.

Thanks!

Hey

Well, I basically said 75% margin - so for a 4 x 6 that costs 25 cents to print I charged $2, a 5 x 7 was $10 and an 8 x 12 was $20 (if I remember correctly.) Some difficulty - trust - people order but do not pick up, people buy 4 x 6s and then reproduce them, etc.

But really, what do I want with a whole whack of photos of other peoples kids - so if I could presell to generate several $ that would be great - hence the reason for considering the cd idea.

ann

Ann McRae · May 23, 2006

Catto wrote:

Hi Ann; just to play devil's advocate here, what's to prevent someone from each team buying one CD, and printing the whole team's images from your print-ready files?

Actually - I was thinking if they preordered I'd concentrate on their kid - I would let them pick a selection, but not offer the whole team on one disk.

Sure, fulfillment is a hassle - but it ensures you're involved in quality control at the print stage.

True.

Plus, you're offering professional lab prints (not un-colour-managed home inkjet versions), which is an opportunity to sell them as premium quality prints, at a premium price.

Also true.

Great feedback, appreciate all the food for thought I can get.

ann

Ann McRae · May 23, 2006

JimM wrote:

Did you break up the galleries for each game/team? Seems the easier it is for people to find pictures of their child, the more they will buy. I still need to learn how to enable sorting by player number.

Yes, to the best of my ability - the organizer could not provide me with an actual schedule so I made best guesses..... it did help to have many galleries with time/age group identifiers on them.

ann

THE TOUCH · May 23, 2006

Ann McRae wrote:

Hey

Well, I basically said 75% margin - so for a 4 x 6 that costs 25 cents to print I charged $2, a 5 x 7 was $10 and an 8 x 12 was $20 (if I remember correctly.) Some difficulty - trust - people order but do not pick up, people buy 4 x 6s and then reproduce them, etc.

But really, what do I want with a whole whack of photos of other peoples kids - so if I could presell to generate several $ that would be great - hence the reason for considering the cd idea.

ann

Thanks Ann!

I noticed the same thing with 4x6's. Really stinks. Next shoot I'm going to remove the smaller prints and start at 5x7.

mercphoto · May 24, 2006

Ann McRae wrote:

Well, I basically said 75% margin - so for a 4 x 6 that costs 25 cents to print I charged $2, a 5 x 7 was $10 and an 8 x 12 was $20 (if I remember correctly.) Some difficulty - trust - people order but do not pick up, people buy 4 x 6s and then reproduce them, etc.

If your sales are like mine, you sell about 70% 4x6's. Its why I charge three times what you do for 4x6's. I would consider raising the price on those by quite a bit. Would help with the bottom line.

JimM · May 24, 2006

mercphoto wrote:

If your sales are like mine, you sell about 70% 4x6's. Its why I charge three times what you do for 4x6's. I would consider raising the price on those by quite a bit. Would help with the bottom line.

I agree!!!

Ann McRae · May 27, 2006

I've agreed to do this - its next weekend. Increase the 4 x 6 price....what else?

ann

kammerman · May 27, 2006

Hi Ann,

I just happened across this thread.

I agree with the others, the prices for your 4x6 prints are way too low.

Price for what the market will bear, not based on a markup.

For example, an 8x10 mounted photo, including artwork, from a portrait session is $195. 5x7s are $135. I know others who charge way more.

For a sport event, your 4x6s should be at least $6 or $7. Do packages as well.

Lisa

Ann McRae · June 16, 2006

Rain, rain and more rain....
Still being postponed - boy it is wet here!!! Hoping that this will happen on Sunday, and at least then it won't conflict with the Oilers game. I pointed out it does conflict with Brasil world cup soccer....

In any case, I raised prices and am plenty organized...now just need for it to happen.

ann

Ann McRae · June 23, 2006

It seems like I've got millions of photos to post to smugmug from this. In addition (and as a result) I've done 4 U4/6 team and individual photos at $10 per kid (and boy do I love the 135 f2 now!!!!) and another teams game photos for making a collage for them at $25 a head.

So if I could do that weekly, I could in fact quit my day job!!!!!

And I have been asked to do family portraits again. After discussions with the gang at the airport, I am inclined to say yes to that as well!

I'll let you all know the tally when it is done.

Ann

cwphotos · June 29, 2006

Congrats Ann !!! Im glad it all turned out well. Keep us in the loop.

THE TOUCH · June 29, 2006

Hi Ann

Question for you...did the $10 include prints or was that just a sitting fee? Did you print on location or send them to your smugmug site?

Thanks! Congratulations!

Ann McRae wrote:

It seems like I've got millions of photos to post to smugmug from this. In addition (and as a result) I've done 4 U4/6 team and individual photos at $10 per kid (and boy do I love the 135 f2 now!!!!) and another teams game photos for making a collage for them at $25 a head.

So if I could do that weekly, I could in fact quit my day job!!!!!

And I have been asked to do family portraits again. After discussions with the gang at the airport, I am inclined to say yes to that as well!

I'll let you all know the tally when it is done.

Ann

Ann McRae · June 29, 2006

cwphotos wrote:

Congrats Ann !!! Im glad it all turned out well. Keep us in the loop.

Thanks Dean. Sales from the tournament are S-L-O-W...

Only about $200 so far.

Check them out - they are public but passworded - password is spark.

Ann

cwphotos · June 29, 2006

roger that. Looking now. Its a slow afternoon at work. :uhoh

Ann McRae · June 29, 2006

THE TOUCH wrote:

Hi Ann

Question for you...did the $10 include prints or was that just a sitting fee? Did you print on location or send them to your smugmug site?

Thanks! Congratulations!

Hi Kevin
Well the $10 T & I includes the prints, but it is what the rate is here. I sent them to the local lab for printing, and had the team manager pick them up after that. For $10 you get a 4 x 6 individual (my cost is $0.19) a 5 x 7 team (my cost is $0.49) and a mat (my cost is $0.99). So there is $8 left to cover time and expenses. The key is to shoot properly so there is no editing to be done.

I'll post them eventually - there are some awesome photos from the group, and the clients are thrilled.

ann

cwphotos · June 29, 2006

They look great Ann. I didnt check out all of them (there are like a gazillion) but the 5-6 galleries I looked through were awesome. Great angles and shots for not being post processed.....goes a long way to show the skill

.

I hope those sales pick up. But hey $200 so far is better than a sharp stick in the eye.

THE TOUCH · June 29, 2006

Ann McRae wrote:

Hi Kevin
Well the $10 T & I includes the prints, but it is what the rate is here. I sent them to the local lab for printing, and had the team manager pick them up after that. For $10 you get a 4 x 6 individual (my cost is $0.19) a 5 x 7 team (my cost is $0.49) and a mat (my cost is $0.99). So there is $8 left to cover time and expenses. The key is to shoot properly so there is no editing to be done.

I'll post them eventually - there are some awesome photos from the group, and the clients are thrilled.

ann

Sounds like a great package! That would be a lot of editing!!!

Thanks for the info - Kevin

Ann McRae · June 29, 2006

Kevin - have a look here:
http://canadian-ann.smugmug.com/gallery/1615406

Password is spark

Dean - the action shots aren't strictly unedited - horizons straightened, cropped and black point set for sure. It was a variable cloudy day - really hard to shoot and keep settings correct. I think I will go all RAW next year - since I have the Epson P2000 I could shoot to my hearts content. I love the editing ease RAW provides.

ann

THE TOUCH · June 30, 2006

Ann - great job! I was laughing the whole time! I love your poses and environment - very natural, fun, and "kid" like!

Ann McRae wrote:

Kevin - have a look here:
http://canadian-ann.smugmug.com/gallery/1615406

Password is spark

Dean - the action shots aren't strictly unedited - horizons straightened, cropped and black point set for sure. It was a variable cloudy day - really hard to shoot and keep settings correct. I think I will go all RAW next year - since I have the Epson P2000 I could shoot to my hearts content. I love the editing ease RAW provides.

ann

Ann McRae · July 3, 2006

So far (three weeks post tournament, two weeks after all the posting done) and there have been $63 in sales via smugmug and $175 purchased directly from me. Really not as lucrative as it should be.

Then there has been the 4 sets of team photos for a total of $320, and two further projects of shooting a game full of action shots for a team (17 x $25).

This thread
http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=37180
has some interesting discussion in it regarding this kind of business model. Love Ziggy's line about popcorn.

Soccer Tournament revisited

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