I grabbed a copy of the above image. I'm looking at a 100% crop of the upper-left corner. There is some bark seperating from the trunk of the tree. Looking at this, even with the camera/lens on a tripod, it is clear you have camera shake/vibration. That's not the only place you can see it, it's just the easiest place to see it.
I used to have a very nice copy of this lens. The ONLY way I was ever able to get good, clear, crisp images was to mount on a very stable tripod, use mirror lock-up, a shutter release cable, and a 2 - 10 second delay between mirror pop-up and exposure. This technique tended to ensure that camera and lens were both quite at the moment of exposure.
That makes it sound like this lens is impossible to handhold.
Well...I checked the return policy with B&H yesterday and sure enough I was on the last and final day. So I got a Return # and sent it out about an hour ago.
I don't like to take chances, especially with something like this. I am constantly looking at the clarity of other pictures taken with this lens on dgrin and my lens does not come even close.
So...my Canon 100-400 is on it's way.
Unfortunately, I didn't have enough time to really test the Bigma, so I was never able to get a definite answer. Also, I think that because it was Sigma, I was looking for a problem since day one and never really gave it a chance! But, what good does it do if i can't trust my own lens!
Thank you all for your help!
Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein :bash
Camera/lens movement is why Canon's IS is so revolutionary for long telephoto lens usage. Nikon calls it VR, and Sigma calls it OS. Don't leave home without it, if you plan on shooting long lenses handheld.
Spend a few days with bird photographers shooting 500+mm long lenses and you will see the extremes they go to to shoot from a stable platform. They do not shoot handheld, except, in rare circumstances, birds in flight. Even those are better if shot from a tripod mounted head. Look at Harry's birds shots in his forum - he did not shoot those from the hip, but a first rate heavy tripod.
On my own behalf, I own several Canon teles with IS, and my spouse shoots with a Sigma 120-300 f2.8 without IS.
The Sigma is sharp and the zoom is very useful, but the lens requires a GREAT deal more care in technique than my Canon lenses with IS. More care means cable release, large heavy tripod, mirror lock up, yada yada yada. Without this care,the images from this lens will look slighly soft. But it is not the optics, it is camera movement and poor technique.
Lenses longer than 400mm are their own special world that requires significantly more care in shooting technique. Errors that you can get away with a 200mm, won't work at 500mm+.
Camera/lens movement is why Canon's IS is so revolutionary for long telephoto lens usage. Nikon calls it VR, and Sigma calls it OS. Don't leave home without it, if you plan on shooting long lenses handheld.
Spend a few days with bird photographers shooting 500+mm long lenses and you will see the extremes they go to to shoot from a stable platform. They do not shoot handheld, except, in rare circumstances, birds in flight. Even those are better if shot from a tripod mounted head. Look at Harry's birds shots in his forum - he did not shoot those from the hip, but a first rate heavy tripod.
On my own behalf, I own several Canon teles with IS, and my spouse shoots with a Sigma 120-300 f2.8 without IS.
The Sigma is sharp and the zoom is very useful, but the lens requires a GREAT deal more care in technique than my Canon lenses with IS. More care means cable release, large heavy tripod, mirror lock up, yada yada yada. Without this care,the images from this lens will look slighly soft. But it is not the optics, it is camera movement and poor technique.
Lenses longer than 400mm are their own special world that requires significantly more care in shooting technique. Errors that you can get away with a 200mm, won't work at 500mm+.
Or in other words, what Scott said!!
Thanks!
When I was debating between IS or no IS I figured that I would be shooting moving objects most of the time so to me, it didn't make any sense to pay extra for the IS. Now I realize, it's not the moving object that's the problem, It's ME!:D
A moving object is just that. But when you have camera shake, the entire image is OOF! Another lesson learned at my young age!
So, all of the sideline shots I've done for sports have been with the 55-200. any recommendations for sports with the longer lenses? When I shot paintball with the 50-500, I used a monopod and had pretty good results...most of the time.
Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein :bash
Steve has posted a great number of very sharp shots with the Bigma. But, it does require careful shooting technique. That MAY be easier when shooting birds than an exciting round of paintball.
The Canon 100-400 IS L is a fair choice - not as sharp at 400mm as a good prime, but used carefully and properly can create stunning images. Raise the ISO to 400 or even 800 to make up for the slow speed of the aperture, and keep the shutter speed 1/800th or faster unless you are panning for blur, where 1/100th or 1/200th may be just the ticket. Try to shoot it about one or two stops smaller aperture than its maximum when zoomed all the way out. - f8 or f11, not wide open.
Shooting a prime lens, of course, will be noticeably sharper, but without the convenience of the zoom. Canon 400 f5.6 is sharp, but lacks IS. The 400 f4 DO IS is very sharp, and light, but substantilally more expensive than the slower lens. But small, light, and easy to handle. The longer Canon IS lenses are neither small, light, or esy to handle.
Steve has posted a great number of very sharp shots with the Bigma. But, it does require careful shooting technique. That MAY be easier when shooting birds than an exciting round of paintball.
The Canon 100-400 IS L is a fair choice - not as sharp at 400mm as a good prime, but used carefully and properly can create stunning images. Raise the ISO to 400 or even 800 to make up for the slow speed of the aperture, and keep the shutter speed 1/800th or faster unless you are panning for blur, where 1/100th or 1/200th may be just the ticket. Try to shoot it about one or two stops smaller aperture than its maximum when zoomed all the way out. - f8 or f11, not wide open.
Shooting a prime lens, of course, will be noticeably sharper, but without the convenience of the zoom. Canon 400 f5.6 is sharp, but lacks IS. The 400 f4 DO IS is very sharp, and light, but substantilally more expensive than the slower lens. But small, light, and easy to handle. The longer Canon IS lenses are neither small, light, or esy to handle.
Because of the speed of primes, is this what's normally used in sports? How else would you do it with a zoom? I was considering the 70-200/2.8 but I figured most of the time I would use it with a TC and I would be at the same speed as the 100-400.
Thanks again!
Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein :bash
TT,
Sorry to read that the Bigma didn't work out for you :-( Oh well, the only important thing is that you are satisfied. I think the 100-400 will put a smile back on your face
As PF points out, IS is helpful. But the point he makes (and that I have been harping on) about it taking time, a learning curve if you will, to get decent results handholding this beast.
I thought it was just me, but I have read so many other posts about these same issues, I am sure all new Bigma users go through it. What really convinced me is that the best shooter I know, who shall remain nameless but his initials are AW has used my Bigma before. Granted he's not a super tele shooter, but he had major issues handholding this lens. As I did for the first 1000 shots or so So it wasn't just me and it wasn't just you.
The 100-400 is no lightweight, but it seems to be easier to handhold than the Bigma and you've always got IS to rely on for those slower speed shots
TT,
Sorry to read that the Bigma didn't work out for you :-( Oh well, the only important thing is that you are satisfied. I think the 100-400 will put a smile back on your face
As PF points out, IS is helpful. But the point he makes (and that I have been harping on) about it taking time, a learning curve if you will, to get decent results handholding this beast.
I thought it was just me, but I have read so many other posts about these same issues, I am sure all new Bigma users go through it. What really convinced me is that the best shooter I know, who shall remain nameless but his initials are AW has used my Bigma before. Granted he's not a super tele shooter, but he had major issues handholding this lens. As I did for the first 1000 shots or so So it wasn't just me and it wasn't just you.
The 100-400 is no lightweight, but it seems to be easier to handhold than the Bigma and you've always got IS to rely on for those slower speed shots
Good luck,
Steve
Thank you Steve!
- Kevin
Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein :bash
As Steve said, sorry the Bigma didn't work for you - I find it to be a really classy piece of equipment. Even though you've given up on it, you may want to check out my Pilanesberg gallery, where I *really* used the Bigma for everything (I'm still working on the gallery).
As Steve said, sorry the Bigma didn't work for you - I find it to be a really classy piece of equipment. Even though you've given up on it, you may want to check out my Pilanesberg gallery, where I *really* used the Bigma for everything (I'm still working on the gallery).
Wow. I wanna go THERE! Thanks for the samples. I wish I had more time to test the Bigma.
Thanks again - Kevin
Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein :bash
The 100-400 has a circular friction ring around the barrel of the lens, that can be adjusted to prevent unintended extension. But it is not very handy or user friendly. I find it either too tight or too loose half the time.
I strongly prefer a smaller switch/detent for this function similar to the one on the Tamron 28-75 f2.8 Di.
I keep hoping Canon will update the 100-400. It is one of their older L Zoom telephotos and deserves to be updated. But it is still a very handy lens for all its shortcomings.
My biggest frustration with it is that is tends to pump air and dust into the mirror box with frequent use of its trombone zoom, which everyone seems to dislike. But other than the Sigma 80-400, there is no other substitute for its versatility.
The 100-400 has a circular friction ring around the barrel of the lens, that can be adjusted to prevent unintended extension. But it is not very handy or user friendly. I find it either too tight or too loose half the time.
I strongly prefer a smaller switch/detent for this function similar to the one on the Tamron 28-75 f2.8 Di.
I keep hoping Canon will update the 100-400. It is one of their older L Zoom telephotos and deserves to be updated. But it is still a very handy lens for all its shortcomings.
My biggest frustration with it is that is tends to pump air and dust into the mirror box with frequent use of its trombone zoom, which everyone seems to dislike. But other than the Sigma 80-400, there is no other substitute for its versatility.
Thanks! As mentioned before, I had the Bigma and loved the lock feature. I forgot all about the thread that called this lens the "Dust Pumper".
Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein :bash
Got the 100-400!
Just got the 100-400 a couple of hours ago. I've been waiting for UPS ALL DAY and they didn't show up until 7:00pm!!! They were supposed to show up in the morning as usual, then I was going to shoot all day. They really messed up my plans!
So far I'm pretty impressed. It's much lighter and smaller. It's amazing how much of a difference 1lbs makes! Also seems to focus quicker.
But, as everyone mentioned, the tension ring is pretty stupid - I can see it getting very annoying. It's somehow connected to the focusing ring so if you want to adjust the tension, you have to hold the focusing ring then move the tension ring, otherwise they'll both move and the tension won't adjust at all.
So, first thing tomorrow I'm going to the Tule Elk Reserve to shoot me some elk! I've lived here three years and never knew it was there till a month ago!
Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein :bash
My take on what I see here. This is a long lens I have the Sigma 170-500. Here is what I think I see. The lens was most likely above 400 at the time of the tree shot. The shutterspeed was fast enought to stop the brighter object in the forground clean. However here is where it gets strange the tree in this case is further away. Thus the camera vibration did not freeze that area as well. Add to that the DOF not being there and you get the odd looking clumpy background. I have seen it on my work once or twice in just the right conditions. If you had just a little more light and a slightly faster shutter the clumps would be gone. of course then the apeture and DOF issue could be less if there was a bit more light.
I like the shots they are well done, other than the light issue.
Comments
That makes it sound like this lens is impossible to handhold.
Well...I checked the return policy with B&H yesterday and sure enough I was on the last and final day. So I got a Return # and sent it out about an hour ago.
I don't like to take chances, especially with something like this. I am constantly looking at the clarity of other pictures taken with this lens on dgrin and my lens does not come even close.
So...my Canon 100-400 is on it's way.
Unfortunately, I didn't have enough time to really test the Bigma, so I was never able to get a definite answer. Also, I think that because it was Sigma, I was looking for a problem since day one and never really gave it a chance! But, what good does it do if i can't trust my own lens!
Thank you all for your help!
- Kevin
Spend a few days with bird photographers shooting 500+mm long lenses and you will see the extremes they go to to shoot from a stable platform. They do not shoot handheld, except, in rare circumstances, birds in flight. Even those are better if shot from a tripod mounted head. Look at Harry's birds shots in his forum - he did not shoot those from the hip, but a first rate heavy tripod.
On my own behalf, I own several Canon teles with IS, and my spouse shoots with a Sigma 120-300 f2.8 without IS.
The Sigma is sharp and the zoom is very useful, but the lens requires a GREAT deal more care in technique than my Canon lenses with IS. More care means cable release, large heavy tripod, mirror lock up, yada yada yada. Without this care,the images from this lens will look slighly soft. But it is not the optics, it is camera movement and poor technique.
Lenses longer than 400mm are their own special world that requires significantly more care in shooting technique. Errors that you can get away with a 200mm, won't work at 500mm+.
Or in other words, what Scott said!!
Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
Thanks!
When I was debating between IS or no IS I figured that I would be shooting moving objects most of the time so to me, it didn't make any sense to pay extra for the IS. Now I realize, it's not the moving object that's the problem, It's ME!:D
A moving object is just that. But when you have camera shake, the entire image is OOF! Another lesson learned at my young age!
So, all of the sideline shots I've done for sports have been with the 55-200. any recommendations for sports with the longer lenses? When I shot paintball with the 50-500, I used a monopod and had pretty good results...most of the time.
- Kevin
The Canon 100-400 IS L is a fair choice - not as sharp at 400mm as a good prime, but used carefully and properly can create stunning images. Raise the ISO to 400 or even 800 to make up for the slow speed of the aperture, and keep the shutter speed 1/800th or faster unless you are panning for blur, where 1/100th or 1/200th may be just the ticket. Try to shoot it about one or two stops smaller aperture than its maximum when zoomed all the way out. - f8 or f11, not wide open.
Shooting a prime lens, of course, will be noticeably sharper, but without the convenience of the zoom. Canon 400 f5.6 is sharp, but lacks IS. The 400 f4 DO IS is very sharp, and light, but substantilally more expensive than the slower lens. But small, light, and easy to handle. The longer Canon IS lenses are neither small, light, or esy to handle.
Sigma makes an 80-400 zoom that is optical stabilized as well -- http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=389504&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation
Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
Thank you for the tips and info!
Because of the speed of primes, is this what's normally used in sports? How else would you do it with a zoom? I was considering the 70-200/2.8 but I figured most of the time I would use it with a TC and I would be at the same speed as the 100-400.
Thanks again!
- Kevin
Sorry to read that the Bigma didn't work out for you :-( Oh well, the only important thing is that you are satisfied. I think the 100-400 will put a smile back on your face
As PF points out, IS is helpful. But the point he makes (and that I have been harping on) about it taking time, a learning curve if you will, to get decent results handholding this beast.
I thought it was just me, but I have read so many other posts about these same issues, I am sure all new Bigma users go through it. What really convinced me is that the best shooter I know, who shall remain nameless but his initials are AW
The 100-400 is no lightweight, but it seems to be easier to handhold than the Bigma and you've always got IS to rely on for those slower speed shots
Good luck,
Steve
Thank you Steve!
- Kevin
- Kevin
Bugs
Spiders
Flowers
Wow. I wanna go THERE! Thanks for the samples. I wish I had more time to test the Bigma.
Thanks again - Kevin
- Kevin
Out of curiosity...
Does the 100-400 have a lock to keep it at 100 during transport?
- Kevin
The 100-400 has a circular friction ring around the barrel of the lens, that can be adjusted to prevent unintended extension. But it is not very handy or user friendly. I find it either too tight or too loose half the time.
I strongly prefer a smaller switch/detent for this function similar to the one on the Tamron 28-75 f2.8 Di.
I keep hoping Canon will update the 100-400. It is one of their older L Zoom telephotos and deserves to be updated. But it is still a very handy lens for all its shortcomings.
My biggest frustration with it is that is tends to pump air and dust into the mirror box with frequent use of its trombone zoom, which everyone seems to dislike. But other than the Sigma 80-400, there is no other substitute for its versatility.
Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
Thanks! As mentioned before, I had the Bigma and loved the lock feature. I forgot all about the thread that called this lens the "Dust Pumper".
- Kevin
Just got the 100-400 a couple of hours ago. I've been waiting for UPS ALL DAY and they didn't show up until 7:00pm!!!
So far I'm pretty impressed. It's much lighter and smaller. It's amazing how much of a difference 1lbs makes! Also seems to focus quicker.
But, as everyone mentioned, the tension ring is pretty stupid - I can see it getting very annoying. It's somehow connected to the focusing ring so if you want to adjust the tension, you have to hold the focusing ring then move the tension ring, otherwise they'll both move and the tension won't adjust at all.
So, first thing tomorrow I'm going to the Tule Elk Reserve to shoot me some elk!
- Kevin
may have been wind
Longitude: 145° 08'East
Canon 20d,EFS-60mm Macro,Canon 85mm/1.8. Pentax Spotmatic SP,Pentax Super Takumars 50/1.4 &135/3.5,Pentax Super-Multi-Coated Takumars 200/4 ,300/4,400/5.6,Sigma 600/8.
I like the shots they are well done, other than the light issue.
Bogan Tripod. Gaint Yukon 25' Bike,
Like it or not we most often get what we deserve in the end.