Blur challange, are we missing something?

tsk1979

For a moement it seemed too easy.
What is blur, or rather how to get it
1. Long shutter open time will give you great blur(We already have had a long exposure challenge before)
2. DOF blur.

But the subject is blur. In DOF blur its the background which is blurred(well in most cases) but not the subject. So will such a thing work?
As for motion blur, I think star trails should work. Why? Because its the main subject which is blurred. Same for traffic trails. But too perfect a shot would mean no "blur"

The only pic I have seen which actually is made for the subject is probably the in car pic of scenery rushing by. So what are your thoughts!?

athos

this challenge seems to be about motion blur. DOF blur does not count IMO.

motion blur can be done plenty of ways.

with slow shutter speeds and moving subjects.

moving the zoom ring during a slow shutter speed.

panning with an object.

shooting from a moving position.

i presume the best shots will be good because the blur makes the shot, defines it, rather than just being an unnecessary component.

there was a good thread in Other Cool Shots with lots of examples of Motion Blur.

athos

oh you can also do motion blur with 2nd curtain flash - something i just learned about from reading a thread on dpreview on nightclub photography, and practiced like twice. fun stuff too.

Annabella

Are we missing something?

Apparently yes, some are missing something...like a sense of creativity.

Motion blur was given as only one example. DOF blurs can produce magnificent works of art. Photography is a form of art, isn't it?

Sure you could have a hundred pitcures of cars speeding by, that would be real interesting...right.

Don't box in the challenge with strict narrow interpretations.

athos

Annabella wrote:

Are we missing something?

Apparently yes, some are missing something...like a sense of creativity.

Motion blur was given as only one example. DOF blurs can produce magnificent works of art. Photography is a form of art, isn't it?

Sure you could have a hundred pitcures of cars speeding by, that would be real interesting...right.

Don't box in the challenge with strict narrow interpretations.

i think the only one being narrow here is you, implying that motion blur would result in hundreds of the same type pictures. very ironic and amusing considering you decided to come here and insult a lack of creativity.

i was under the impression it was for motion blur, but if i am wrong i apologize to the OP. but i did say it was IMO (in my opinion).

i find it amazingly rude you come and insult people of not being creative and not seeing photography as an 'art', right.

here are some of my non-creative thinking only inside the box motion blurs from the last couple of months since getting an slr. and only one with a car in it, which happens to be my least favorite.


blur by moving the zoom ring with a 1/5 second exposure.



blur by panning and picking colorful ights as a background




warp tunnel, from a tour bus




blur by slow shutter speed,handheld using IS for the first time like this:

Walkin on by








blur with 2nd curtain flash.

Annabella

athos wrote:

i think the only one being narrow here is you, implying that motion blur would result in hundreds of the same type pictures. very ironic and amusing considering you decided to come here and insult a lack of creativity.

i was under the impression it was for motion blur, but if i am wrong i apologize to the OP. but i did say it was IMO (in my opinion).

Those are great motion photos!

But you take offense where it wasn't intended. The original post was saying DOF did not count as Blur chanllenge worthy.

"The only pic I have seen which actually is made for the subject is probably the in car pic of scenery rushing by. So what are your thoughts!?"..by tsk

My opinon is that the original poster should think out of the box, and that people should post thier interpitations, and that motion is not the only blur worthy subject. How can my saying expand your options on blur be considered narrow minded?

athos

the original poster stated there were two ways to make blur

"1. Long shutter open time will give you great blur(We already have had a long exposure challenge before)
2. DOF blur."

i was the one that stated my opinion was the challenge was about motion blur.

anyways, no need to argue. i still think your post was insulting on some level as well as condescending in tone. but no need to turn this into a negative thread. i go off sometimes as well and have to contain myself

sayntbrigid

Hey, I like that use the zoom on long exposure idea.....i will practice that. Thats what I like about the challenges...gives me great new ideas from other peeps to try.........I try all kinds of things.......and post the one I like best.....and that has been known to change several times as I learn more ideas from all of you clap

athos

yup, that is the best part about forum interaction.

i read about that in a photo book or on a forum. i was in china on a school trip and that felt like the right place to try it. first time was the charm because the few times since hasnt had the same effect.

people keep thinkin that is a subway station but it really is a book market in beijing

smhs.images

Great examples of blur!

wxwax

Athos, sweet!

tsk1979

Annabella wrote:

Those are great motion photos!

But you take offense where it wasn't intended. The original post was saying DOF did not count as Blur chanllenge worthy.

"The only pic I have seen which actually is made for the subject is probably the in car pic of scenery rushing by. So what are your thoughts!?"..by tsk

My opinon is that the original poster should think out of the box, and that people should post thier interpitations, and that motion is not the only blur worthy subject. How can my saying expand your options on blur be considered narrow minded?

I think I was misunderstood.
What I implied was that since the subject is "BLUR", DOF maybe goes out because in DOF its the background which is blurred not the subject.
A photo challenge works on the "Subject"
For example lets take the word fire
Now I can click the pic of a lake with a campfire towards the side of the frame. How I execute it may or may not make the fire a central subject.

In both cases, i.e. with fire being in the sidelights or fire being the main subject the pic can be great, both technically and aesthetically. But in the case of the pic without fire being the main subject, ideally it should lose to less pretty pics because it does not treat the subject of the challenge as the main title.

So coming back, DOF can give you amazing creative shots. Wonderful technically and aesthetically perfect pictures, but all that is useless unless the blur is part of the subject, not something which enhances the subject

my 2 cents

Head in the Clouds

I think maybe we are all being judge and jury before the final 10 have been picked?

Its all about interpretation (and yes, I was guilty of thinking that DOF blur would not count), but that is what is wonderful about us all being individuals - we will all interpret 'blur' in a different fashion, and I don't think anyone should be put off from experimenting with their cameras in any way they feel fits the theme.

Enter what you think fits. The judges will pick the top ten and then we will pick the winner. Pretty simple. If the masses don't think that something fits the theme because it is a DOF blur or a panning blur or a 'twist the zoom' kind of blur, then it won't win .... but the main thing is that everyone gets out and uses their camera and gets that creative side of the brain going.

Anyway - hasn't there been a 'motion blur' challenge held recently? or was that just a suggestion? .... If it was just a suggestion then it might indicate that whomever picks the challenge themes wanted to see more than just 'motion blur' ....

Just my 2 cents. - (this is turning into quite a lucrative thread!)

Great examples of blur by the way! Very inspirational!

vangogh

athos wrote:

yup, that is the best part about forum interaction.

i read about that in a photo book or on a forum. i was in china on a school trip and that felt like the right place to try it. first time was the charm because the few times since hasnt had the same effect.

people keep thinkin that is a subway station but it really is a book market in beijing

I like the idea too. Any tips on the best way to produce it. Also was interested to hear a bout the 2nd curtain effect. I would love to know more about this. Have you got any threads/links that I could look at?

Thanks

vangogh

Head in the Clouds wrote:

I think maybe we are all being judge and jury before the final 10 have been picked?

Its all about interpretation (and yes, I was guilty of thinking that DOF blur would not count), but that is what is wonderful about us all being individuals - we will all interpret 'blur' in a different fashion, and I don't think anyone should be put off from experimenting with their cameras in any way they feel fits the theme.

Enter what you think fits. The judges will pick the top ten and then we will pick the winner. Pretty simple. If the masses don't think that something fits the theme because it is a DOF blur or a panning blur or a 'twist the zoom' kind of blur, then it won't win .... but the main thing is that everyone gets out and uses their camera and gets that creative side of the brain going.

Anyway - hasn't there been a 'motion blur' challenge held recently? or was that just a suggestion? .... If it was just a suggestion then it might indicate that whomever picks the challenge themes wanted to see more than just 'motion blur' ....

Just my 2 cents. - (this is turning into quite a lucrative thread!)

Great examples of blur by the way! Very inspirational!

Not since December at least, as that's when I joined Dgrin & started taking part in the challenges & I don't recall any blur challenges.

Oh & just to add to the debate, I also took blur to mean "motion blur" of some kind rather than DOF as blur. The motion to my mind as the 'subject" of the photo. Just my ha"pennith & IMO....... lol

Angelo

wxwax wrote:

Athos, sweet!

You must tell us more about this technique.

ps: to the thread: Who ever said DOF = background? That is the most common interpretation but it is just as easy to use effective DOF to focus on a distant subject with lots of foreground "bokeh"

athos

vangogh wrote:

I like the idea too. Any tips on the best way to produce it. Also was interested to hear a bout the 2nd curtain effect. I would love to know more about this. Have you got any threads/links that I could look at?

Thanks

i didnt bookmark the threads on it.

as far as the zooming goes i think the best way to do it is to zoom out from the focused subject. the thing you focus on will be the most in focus in the shot, some people say especially if it is in the middle.

however, i am sure it cant hurt to try going forward with the zoom rignt just to see what happens. that is the beauty of digital, you can just try it all and not worry about film costs.

having IS may be a good thing, as using the shutter speeds that are useful to create blur can cause severe handshake blur, and you do want something to be in focus - though maybe not all the time. that shot of the market i took was 1/15second i think. no IS, with a sigma 10-20EX. i was in Tv mode.

2nd curtain flash allows you to drag light over the shutter from the scene before trying to capture your subject. a shutter has two curtain movements, the first one opens the shutter and allows the light to fall on the sensor. usually the flash fires at this point in time. the 2nd curtain is right when the shutter is about to close. the canon 30d has a CF that lets you use the onboard flash as 2nd curtain, or command any external to do so. also good external flashes have a button for this directly on them, so you can switch from 1st curtain to 2nd curtain very easily and quickly, and not have to dive into menus to do so each time.

so if you use the flash during the 2nd curtain the sensor is going to absorb all the ambient light until the flash lights up and nails the subject at the last moment before the shot is done. also, any camera movement will cause the ambient light to streak in whatever pattern you move the camera. for example if you had a field of headlights and a person in front, you could move the camera in a circle, create these circular lights floating in a sea of blackness, and then the person in front will be caught with the 2nd curtain flash.

this is great for night club photography as it can capture very abstract light streaks while having a subject very clear. you get the mood of the club, plus a portrait.

when doing this, IMO it is best to have a good external flash and have the camera in Av or Tv or M mode, where it performs more as a fill flash. the camera meters for the ambient setting and then uses the flash to fill - so you can use EC and FEC to dial in how powerful you want the flash to be. in auto modes or P mode, the camera uses the flash as the main source of light, so you will end up with little or no blur. i could be wrong on that, but all the great examples of 2nd curtain flash i have seen the users recommended these modes. i havent tried it in P yet, ive only used it a few nights.

it is very easy to get too much light blur/painting effects, dialing in FEC and adjusting the shutter speed is most important, as well as how much you move the camera during the exposure. i have seen great shots with 2second exposures, as well as 1/6 seconds.



here is a thread on that:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=15010969

fun stuff

wxwax

Angelo wrote:

You must tell us more about this technique.

ps: to the thread: Who ever said DOF = background? That is the most common interpretation but it is just as easy to use effective DOF to focus on a distant subject with lots of foreground "bokeh"

retro

Great shot wxwax :
I think blur can be interpreted in many different ways...two shots where the blur is all done in pp from a couple of months ago..there are so many different ways to do it, frankly i thought lamina was a lot harder

Angelo

wxwax wrote:

BINGO!

trossnagel

sayntbrigid wrote:

Hey, I like that use the zoom on long exposure idea.....i will practice that. Thats what I like about the challenges...gives me great new ideas from other peeps to try.........I try all kinds of things.......and post the one I like best.....and that has been known to change several times as I learn more ideas from all of you clap

Sayntbrigid - saw your location on your avatar - Niagra Falls!?!?! Geez - wish I was there for this contest!!!!

sayntbrigid

trossnagel wrote:

Sayntbrigid - saw your location on your avatar - Niagra Falls!?!?! Geez - wish I was there for this contest!!!!

c'mon over, bring your bike, we can follow the road less traveled

.....seriously thought, If I can get up there and get a good blur shot.....I'll enter it just for you clap