... ...I also do most of my shooting with a "middle zoom", and my first major purchase, outside of the body itself, was for a Sigma 18-50mm, f2.8 EX series lens. I am still very happy with that choice.
At the time, my only true alternatives (of those I cared to consider) were the Canon 17-40mm, f4L and the Canon 16-35mm, f2.8L....
Since then, the Canon 17-55mm, f2.8 IS has appeared. This is a very desirable lens for my uses and is on my radar
Thanks for all those links.
I really wish there was asome comparision done between the Sigma/Tamron short-zooms and the Canon/Nikon versions.
Although photozone did not give it great marks the pics on the dcresource link on your post tell a slightly different story. The Sigma 30/1.4 is not too bad there comparing quite favourably against the Canon 35/1.4L. Is this due to sample variation?
Good luck with your choice. What's gonna happen is that the Nikon users will tell you to buy a Nikon and the Canon users will tell you to buy a Canon.
wow - harryb's clairvoyant!
well, let's go on that commonality there - BUY A CANON!
LOVE MINE! I have a friend with a rebel, love it. they are relatively cheap now, and you could get a really good deal on them. the people who have them - LOVE THEM. look at their record - - wonderful - great photos, easy to use etc. buy the right 'glass' and your set to go. don't go with harryb's idea about the D70 - my sister has one...it's nice and pretty nice to handle, low light and high ISO is deplorable however. I've been MUCH more impressed with my 30D...but then again I don't use her camera on a normal basis - she might like it better than my 30D. canon is known for their high ISO and noise reduction. okay - well, I'm sorry to cut this paragraph short, but I gotta go NOW. look at my signature - those are my lenses - LOVE THEM. and the camera is wonderful too. if you're interested in a car, infinitis are the best.
okay - also, I had a panasonic Lumix DMC-LZ2 it was 5mp and has OIS, it was great, loved it, just couldn't keep it, had to move on. keep in mind what kind of memory cards they take - if you get a sony - you're limited to ONLY sony memory sticks. keep that in mind! and sony memory sticks are more expensive. especially look for the iamge stabalization - that's a must now in small cameras. okay - really gotta go - bye!
My Equipment: Canon EOS 5D w/ battery grip Backup Canon EOS 30D | Canon 28 f/1.8 | Canon 24 f/1.4L Canon 50mm f/1.4 | Sigma 50mm f/2.8 EX DI Macro | Canon 70-200 F/2.8 L | Canon 580 EX II Flash and Canon 550 EX Flash Apple MacBook Pro with dual 24" monitors
Domke F-802 bag and a Shootsac by Jessica Claire
Infiniti QX4
wow...don't go with harryb's idea about the D70 - my sister has one...it's nice and pretty nice to handle, low light and high ISO is deplorable however. I've been MUCH more impressed with my 30D...
1. it is not the camera but the whole system that i am really confused about. The 30D costs about more than a D70 and less than a D200. I assume Nikon's new D-SLR will be a more direct competitor of the 30D. Also I am comparing a body+2 zooms+fast-prime+flash combo.
For me the Canon's (30D) advantage is that it can use my 420EX flash (I use this with a Canon G2 now) and Nikon's advantage is that I am familiar with the N80 controls and hence would be familiar with any Nikon SLR.
I still have NOT decided if I should retain my 28-105/3.5-4.5 and 70-300ED/4-5.6 Nikon lenses (if I choose a Nikon D-SLR). My guess is that with faster lenses in my bag (when I buy the D-SLR) I mgiht never use these except on the 1-2 occasions where weight might become an issue.
BTW how old does one have to be to learn photography? I have a 4 year old son and could see more use in retaining my Nikon lenses (selling only the N80 body, MB16 battery pack and SB50Dx flash) so that he could learn with these lighter lenses (we can share 1 D-SLR body). Or does it make more sense at this stage just to get him a light P&S camera (the Ricoh R4 is on my list).
2. Yes I too have heard that Canon handles low light/High ISO related noise better. Wont software like Noise Ninja help reduce these differences?
3. I dont see a wide lens in your signature. 50mm is about 80mm on a D-SLR. Did I miss something?
1. it is not the camera but the whole system that i am really confused about. The 30D costs about more than a D70 and less than a D200. I assume Nikon's new D-SLR will be a more direct competitor of the 30D. Also I am comparing a body+2 zooms+fast-prime+flash combo.
For me the Canon's (30D) advantage is that it can use my 420EX flash (I use this with a Canon G2 now) and Nikon's advantage is that I am familiar with the N80 controls and hence would be familiar with any Nikon SLR.
I still have NOT decided if I should retain my 28-105/3.5-4.5 and 70-300ED/4-5.6 Nikon lenses (if I choose a Nikon D-SLR). My guess is that with faster lenses in my bag (when I buy the D-SLR) I mgiht never use these except on the 1-2 occasions where weight might become an issue.
BTW how old does one have to be to learn photography? I have a 4 year old son and could see more use in retaining my Nikon lenses (selling only the N80 body, MB16 battery pack and SB50Dx flash) so that he could learn with these lighter lenses (we can share 1 D-SLR body). Or does it make more sense at this stage just to get him a light P&S camera (the Ricoh R4 is on my list).
2. Yes I too have heard that Canon handles low light/High ISO related noise better. Wont software like Noise Ninja help reduce these differences?
3. I dont see a wide lens in your signature. 50mm is about 80mm on a D-SLR. Did I miss something?
If I may offer my 2 cents.
Don't get too much into the Internet research. Just go play with systems and pick up the one you like and buy lens that you need and use most frequently. For the rare occasion, you can always rent special lenses. I own Canon gear and often play with Nikons from friends. Maybe because I am not a PRO, to me IQ wise they are really the SAME if shoot with equivalent quality lens. 6MP vs 8MP 8MP vs. 10MP you really cannot tell the difference if the image size is not above 8x11. Samething with Pro lens vs. Prosumer, Canon/Nikon vs. third party lens. You can read those review and get confused with all the finesse, in reality you and majority viewers of your art work will hardly notice any difference if most of your shots end up with 4x6 or 5x7 size prints.
So pick up a system and get lenses for what you want to shoot NOW and start shooting.
... Just go play with systems and pick up the one you like and buy lens that you need and use most frequently. For the rare occasion, you can always rent special lenses....to me IQ wise they are really the SAME if shoot with equivalent quality lens. 6MP vs 8MP 8MP vs. 10MP you really cannot tell the difference if the image size is not above 8x11.....
Sorry.
I wish I could play with Canons and Nikons but I live in India and few shops have these available to play with. I visited a couple of shops and they said they only import against order becuase they did not want to invest in the high duties and taxes etc..
The internet is my main (if not my only resource) to help me decide which camera, cellphone, and even which laptop to buy.
Besides India is Canon country. You dont find many Nikon users here.
My prints will usually be 6x8 with the odd 8x11. The advantage of going digital is that I can make fewer prints and invest more in these few prints instead of having a whole roll of 4x6.
and yes 6MP+ is fine (for a 6x8) as what I notice is that having the right lens and adequate light and also a good colour printer (with good quality paper) is more important than the pixel count. In most cases Canon=Nikon. I am just trying to decide which is right for me (given that I have a Canon 420EX flash but am more used to Nikon's "dual dial" system and also have slower and lighter Nikon zoom lenses).
This "debate" is more internal yet I am pleased that the gurus here have offered some valid arguments that I had earlier overlooked.
The only issues I now am grappling with are
1. should I get a Sigma/Tamron 18-50/2.8 lens or spend $700 more on a Nikon/Canon version?
lesser issues....
2. I could about $300 on the flash if I buy a Canon body but sacrifice the "dual dial" system. This will only be answered after the new Nikon D-SLR is released and it's price is known.
3. Are the smaller Nikon lenses I have anyuse once I get faster/better glass? Again if the new Nikon D-SLR is convincingly better or/and cheaper than the 30D this might be mute.
1. should I get a Sigma/Tamron 18-50/2.8 lens or spend $700 more on a Nikon/Canon version?
Ask yourself this question...is the extra sharpness, autofocus speed, and all around quality of the canon/nikon lens worth the extra $700? If it is, then get the nikon/canon lens...if it isn't and you think you can touch up the downfalls of the sigma/tamron lenses in post production then save yourself some money.
bored? check out my photo site...and if you have the time, leave a comment or rate some pictures while you're there.
Canon 20D | Canon 17-40mm f/4L USM | Tamron 28-75 f2.8 XR Di LD IF | Canon 50mm f/1.8 II | Canon 70-200mm f/2.8L USM
Ask yourself this question...is the extra sharpness, autofocus speed, and all around quality of the canon/nikon lens worth the extra $700? If it is, then get the nikon/canon lens...if it isn't and you think you can touch up the downfalls of the sigma/tamron lenses in post production then save yourself some money.
Excellent points. I think if you look at the pictures from the different lenses you will have a had time telling which lens took which picture.
Harry http://behret.smugmug.com/NANPA member How many photographers does it take to change a light bulb? 50. One to change the bulb, and forty-nine to say, "I could have done that better!"
well, let's go on that commonality there - BUY A CANON!
LOVE MINE! I have a friend with a rebel, love it. they are relatively cheap now, and you could get a really good deal on them. the people who have them - LOVE THEM. look at their record - - wonderful - great photos, easy to use etc. buy the right 'glass' and your set to go. don't go with harryb's idea about the D70 - my sister has one...it's nice and pretty nice to handle, low light and high ISO is deplorable however. I've been MUCH more impressed with my 30D...but then again I don't use her camera on a normal basis - she might like it better than my 30D. canon is known for their high ISO and noise reduction. okay - well, I'm sorry to cut this paragraph short, but I gotta go NOW. look at my signature - those are my lenses - LOVE THEM. and the camera is wonderful too. if you're interested in a car, infinitis are the best.
okay - also, I had a panasonic Lumix DMC-LZ2 it was 5mp and has OIS, it was great, loved it, just couldn't keep it, had to move on. keep in mind what kind of memory cards they take - if you get a sony - you're limited to ONLY sony memory sticks. keep that in mind! and sony memory sticks are more expensive. especially look for the iamge stabalization - that's a must now in small cameras. okay - really gotta go - bye!
- RE
If you want a definition of fanboy then take a look at the above. The basic symptom of fanboyism is the belief that what they like is best for everyone else.
Ignore the brand zealots. Look at your options and go with what feels best in your hands and fits your shooting style.
Harry http://behret.smugmug.com/NANPA member How many photographers does it take to change a light bulb? 50. One to change the bulb, and forty-nine to say, "I could have done that better!"
Excellent points. I think if you look at the pictures from the different lenses you will have a had time telling which lens took which picture.
After comments such as these the Sigma/Tamron lenses look more inviting! :-) Between these two however which is considered better. I find I am sensitive to noise and CA most. My photoshop skills wont let me correct much so I would like a lens that works best out of the box.
remmeber the 18-50/2.8 range is what I will use most. also the real reason I am looking at zooms is to (a) not miss a good photo op (b) not have to change lenses and expose the CCD anymore than I should. I much prefer the quality of a prime even the $99 Nikon 50/1.8 is good with my N80.
as far as fanboys go, I live in India. Canon Country. Bought a Nikon. :-)
Comments
Thanks for all those links.
I really wish there was asome comparision done between the Sigma/Tamron short-zooms and the Canon/Nikon versions.
Although photozone did not give it great marks the pics on the dcresource link on your post tell a slightly different story. The Sigma 30/1.4 is not too bad there comparing quite favourably against the Canon 35/1.4L. Is this due to sample variation?
wow - harryb's clairvoyant!
well, let's go on that commonality there - BUY A CANON!
LOVE MINE! I have a friend with a rebel, love it. they are relatively cheap now, and you could get a really good deal on them. the people who have them - LOVE THEM. look at their record - - wonderful - great photos, easy to use etc. buy the right 'glass' and your set to go. don't go with harryb's idea about the D70 - my sister has one...it's nice and pretty nice to handle, low light and high ISO is deplorable however. I've been MUCH more impressed with my 30D...but then again I don't use her camera on a normal basis - she might like it better than my 30D. canon is known for their high ISO and noise reduction. okay - well, I'm sorry to cut this paragraph short, but I gotta go NOW. look at my signature - those are my lenses - LOVE THEM. and the camera is wonderful too. if you're interested in a car, infinitis are the best.
okay - also, I had a panasonic Lumix DMC-LZ2 it was 5mp and has OIS, it was great, loved it, just couldn't keep it, had to move on. keep in mind what kind of memory cards they take - if you get a sony - you're limited to ONLY sony memory sticks. keep that in mind! and sony memory sticks are more expensive. especially look for the iamge stabalization - that's a must now in small cameras. okay - really gotta go - bye!
- RE
www.rossfrazier.com/blog
My Equipment:
Canon EOS 5D w/ battery grip
Backup Canon EOS 30D | Canon 28 f/1.8 | Canon 24 f/1.4L Canon 50mm f/1.4 | Sigma 50mm f/2.8 EX DI Macro | Canon 70-200 F/2.8 L | Canon 580 EX II Flash and Canon 550 EX Flash
Apple MacBook Pro with dual 24" monitors
Domke F-802 bag and a Shootsac by Jessica Claire
Infiniti QX4
1. it is not the camera but the whole system that i am really confused about. The 30D costs about more than a D70 and less than a D200. I assume Nikon's new D-SLR will be a more direct competitor of the 30D. Also I am comparing a body+2 zooms+fast-prime+flash combo.
For me the Canon's (30D) advantage is that it can use my 420EX flash (I use this with a Canon G2 now) and Nikon's advantage is that I am familiar with the N80 controls and hence would be familiar with any Nikon SLR.
I still have NOT decided if I should retain my 28-105/3.5-4.5 and 70-300ED/4-5.6 Nikon lenses (if I choose a Nikon D-SLR). My guess is that with faster lenses in my bag (when I buy the D-SLR) I mgiht never use these except on the 1-2 occasions where weight might become an issue.
BTW how old does one have to be to learn photography? I have a 4 year old son and could see more use in retaining my Nikon lenses (selling only the N80 body, MB16 battery pack and SB50Dx flash) so that he could learn with these lighter lenses (we can share 1 D-SLR body). Or does it make more sense at this stage just to get him a light P&S camera (the Ricoh R4 is on my list).
2. Yes I too have heard that Canon handles low light/High ISO related noise better. Wont software like Noise Ninja help reduce these differences?
3. I dont see a wide lens in your signature. 50mm is about 80mm on a D-SLR. Did I miss something?
If I may offer my 2 cents.
Don't get too much into the Internet research. Just go play with systems and pick up the one you like and buy lens that you need and use most frequently. For the rare occasion, you can always rent special lenses. I own Canon gear and often play with Nikons from friends. Maybe because I am not a PRO, to me IQ wise they are really the SAME if shoot with equivalent quality lens. 6MP vs 8MP 8MP vs. 10MP you really cannot tell the difference if the image size is not above 8x11. Samething with Pro lens vs. Prosumer, Canon/Nikon vs. third party lens. You can read those review and get confused with all the finesse, in reality you and majority viewers of your art work will hardly notice any difference if most of your shots end up with 4x6 or 5x7 size prints.
So pick up a system and get lenses for what you want to shoot NOW and start shooting.
Sorry.
I wish I could play with Canons and Nikons but I live in India and few shops have these available to play with. I visited a couple of shops and they said they only import against order becuase they did not want to invest in the high duties and taxes etc..
The internet is my main (if not my only resource) to help me decide which camera, cellphone, and even which laptop to buy.
Besides India is Canon country. You dont find many Nikon users here.
My prints will usually be 6x8 with the odd 8x11. The advantage of going digital is that I can make fewer prints and invest more in these few prints instead of having a whole roll of 4x6.
and yes 6MP+ is fine (for a 6x8) as what I notice is that having the right lens and adequate light and also a good colour printer (with good quality paper) is more important than the pixel count. In most cases Canon=Nikon. I am just trying to decide which is right for me (given that I have a Canon 420EX flash but am more used to Nikon's "dual dial" system and also have slower and lighter Nikon zoom lenses).
This "debate" is more internal yet I am pleased that the gurus here have offered some valid arguments that I had earlier overlooked.
The only issues I now am grappling with are
1. should I get a Sigma/Tamron 18-50/2.8 lens or spend $700 more on a Nikon/Canon version?
lesser issues....
2. I could about $300 on the flash if I buy a Canon body but sacrifice the "dual dial" system. This will only be answered after the new Nikon D-SLR is released and it's price is known.
3. Are the smaller Nikon lenses I have anyuse once I get faster/better glass? Again if the new Nikon D-SLR is convincingly better or/and cheaper than the 30D this might be mute.
Ask yourself this question...is the extra sharpness, autofocus speed, and all around quality of the canon/nikon lens worth the extra $700? If it is, then get the nikon/canon lens...if it isn't and you think you can touch up the downfalls of the sigma/tamron lenses in post production then save yourself some money.
Excellent points. I think if you look at the pictures from the different lenses you will have a had time telling which lens took which picture.
http://behret.smugmug.com/ NANPA member
How many photographers does it take to change a light bulb? 50. One to change the bulb, and forty-nine to say, "I could have done that better!"
If you want a definition of fanboy then take a look at the above. The basic symptom of fanboyism is the belief that what they like is best for everyone else.
Ignore the brand zealots. Look at your options and go with what feels best in your hands and fits your shooting style.
http://behret.smugmug.com/ NANPA member
How many photographers does it take to change a light bulb? 50. One to change the bulb, and forty-nine to say, "I could have done that better!"
After comments such as these the Sigma/Tamron lenses look more inviting! :-) Between these two however which is considered better. I find I am sensitive to noise and CA most. My photoshop skills wont let me correct much so I would like a lens that works best out of the box.
remmeber the 18-50/2.8 range is what I will use most. also the real reason I am looking at zooms is to (a) not miss a good photo op (b) not have to change lenses and expose the CCD anymore than I should. I much prefer the quality of a prime even the $99 Nikon 50/1.8 is good with my N80.
as far as fanboys go, I live in India. Canon Country. Bought a Nikon. :-)