PC Laptop for photo editing?

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

[FONT=Geneva, Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Just the way things are I need to use a laptop for photo editing. I've pretty much decided on the Lenovo Thinkpad R60 with the 15" 1400x1050 monitor (still debating maybe the Compal HEL80 from powernotebooks.com with the 1680x1050 15.4" monitor - better graphics card for the same money, but it's not a Thinkpad). Does anybody have any experience with using Thinkpads for photo editing? How are their screens? I wonder if the LUT is editable (i.e. if my Eye One Display 2 can profile the monitor)? Or is it worth the extra $300 (which would be a big stretch for me) to get the flexview IPS screen in a Thinkpad T60?
Also, graphics cards don't matter at all for photo editing right? I'd get the best one offered from the Lenovo (128mb ATI X1400), but it's a long shot from the one in the Compal (256mb GeForce 7600) - will it matter?
Thanks,
Richard [/FONT]

tsk1979 · October 30, 2006

marlinspike wrote:

[FONT=Geneva, Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Just the way things are I need to use a laptop for photo editing. I've pretty much decided on the Lenovo Thinkpad R60 with the 15" 1400x1050 monitor (still debating maybe the Compal HEL80 from powernotebooks.com with the 1680x1050 15.4" monitor - better graphics card for the same money, but it's not a Thinkpad). Does anybody have any experience with using Thinkpads for photo editing? How are their screens? I wonder if the LUT is editable (i.e. if my Eye One Display 2 can profile the monitor)? Or is it worth the extra $300 (which would be a big stretch for me) to get the flexview IPS screen in a Thinkpad T60?
Also, graphics cards don't matter at all for photo editing right? I'd get the best one offered from the Lenovo (128mb ATI X1400), but it's a long shot from the one in the Compal (256mb GeForce 7600) - will it matter?
Thanks,
Richard [/FONT]

Graphics card wont matter.
But make sure you get
1. 1600x1200 resolution atleast, or 1280x1024 if thats too expensive
2. Plenty of RAM(I recommend 1GB). If you want to work with multiple images RAW etc., in photoshop it will help
3. Dual core is a good idea.
4. atleast 100GB of HDD is you plan to keep a lot of pics
5. I use a Dell inspiron, as it gave the best bang for the buck. you can opt for one with high res lcd and dual core with 1GB ram for under 800$.

AntoineD · October 30, 2006

make sure to check the screen is good enough for you to edit photos. I had some bad issue editing on a laptop, especially when it comes about colors.

I understand you're looking for a pc, but it might be a nice idea to check the apple macbook or better : the macbooks pro.

Now they're intel powered, you can install win xp on it if you really need it.

Why I'm saying id they really take great care of there screen, especially on the macbook PRO. Some photographers of my friends did chooses so for "travel editing" and they seem very pleased with their screens

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

I really dislike mac, it's just part of who I am, so there is no way I'm going that route (I also in general don't like Dell unless I can get a killer deal).

The way I'm specing them out is T7200 2ghz core 2 due 4mb cache cpu, 1 gig of pc5300 ram, and either a 7200rpm or 5400rpm hard drive (depending on the model I go with - a Thinkpad T with 7200 gets too expensive, but the R or Compal get attainable with the 7200).

But the kicker is exactly what Antoine said: the screen. The compal is 1680x1050 and the Thinkpads are 1400x1050 (with the Thinkpad T having an IPS TFT screen). Anybody have any experience with these? I don't have the option of trying any of them before I buy them.

AntoineD · October 30, 2006

marlinspike wrote:

I really dislike mac, it's just part of who I am, so there is no way I'm going that route (…)
But the kicker is exactly what Antoine said: the screen

Sure, I work the same about pc

But you got me: I was making a point about the screen.

marklarry28 · October 30, 2006

if you can get a laptop with a 7200rpm HD, go for it. The performance is a lot of better comparing with a 5400rpm.

I am using a IBM T42. I just loved, but I have my desktop as well.

ChrisJ · October 30, 2006

I've been using an IBM T41p for 2.5 years now. Pentium M-1.7 GHz, 1 Gig RAM and 128 MB Video Card.

Performance-wise, it still does a fine job with photo editing using PS CS2. Color-wise, I was unable to use the Pantone Huey on it successfully, and I've never been quite happy with the colors. YMMV.

My suggestion would be to get the best video card that you can afford (since they're difficult/impossible to upgrade in laptops), and the most RAM you can afford. You can always upgrade the H.D. later if you think you need to.

I love my IBM, one of the best laptops I've ever used.

AntoineD · October 30, 2006

marklarry28 wrote:

if you can get a laptop with a 7200rpm HD, go for it. The performance is a lot of better comparing with a 5400rpm.

Indeed.

Especially with Photoshop.

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

How do you guys find your non flexview screens? The guy at the Thinkpad number seemed to think I'd be fine with the non-flexview 15" 1400x1050 screen of an R60. Thoughts?

I'm a bit worried about that non-adjustability. Have you run the LUT tester Chris?
[SIZE=-1]http://www.xrite.com/support_doc.aspx?Line=16&SupportID=2933

Also, is a 7200 rpm ATA drive better or a 5400rpm SATA? I can swing a R60 with 7200rpm (ATA) 15" 1400x1050 1 gig ram T7200 core duo 2 4mb cache 2ghz cpu for $1569 or a T60 with the same cpu, same ram, but a 1400x1050 15" flexview screen and a 5400rpm SATA hard drive (same video card in both - x1400 128mb) for $1809...what do I do?

I'm really hoping for someone with an R60 and someone with a T60 both with the x1400 video card to try the LUT tester.

I wish somewhere on the website there was a list of T60 vs R60 differences.

Hmmm...they're both SATA 150, so it's a faster HD R60 or a flexview screen T60...hmmm....I'm going to have to call the Lenovo people to see if the 60gb 7200rpm drive available for the R60 is also available for the T60.
[/SIZE]

ChrisJ · October 30, 2006

Other than colors, I'm happy with my screen. I don't think FlexView existed when I bought this, so I guess I might not know what I'm missing!

I just tried the LUT tester and it does NOT work. My guess is that this is video card/driver dependent, and this is an old card at this point: ATI Mobility FIRE GL T2.

Personally, I would choose a 5400 SATA drive over a 7200 PATA drive. Once you've bought your laptop, the drive interface is not upgradeable... the hard disk is. But, the 7200 PATA drive will be faster in the short term (and it really can make a noticeable difference).

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

Ok it looks like the T60 vs R60 the T60 gets you better build quality/materials, better battery life, with the options I would get a better screen (the question being how much better and is the R60 screen good enough), slightly (0.6 lb) lighter. However, the T60 doesn't have S-video out (the spec sheet says use USB...how does that work?) and it would be 5400rpm vs 7200rpm (though, wouldn't 5400rpm SATA 150 be faster than my current 7200rpm ATA100? - plus I could always upgrade later).

I wish the darn thinkpad forums would approve my username already so I can ask someone there to run the LUT tester.

ChrisJ · October 30, 2006

You could be rigth about the H.D. Probalby depends on the specific hardware. FYI, here's a nice comparison of laptop HDs:

http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/09/13/25_inch_hdd_charts/

cmason · October 30, 2006

Ok some info from my view of using both T41 and R60 models. I used the R60 only briefly, btw. The 'T' series are definitely the business, roadwarrior class of machine. They are built like tanks, have tons of features needed for constant movement, in and out of bags, on planes, etc. So they have harddrive safety, magnesium cages, etc. I use a T41 daily and during my so far 100,000 miles of air travel so far this year.

I tried the R60 (or was it a R50?) anyway, this was not in the same class as the T models. The keyboard, fittings, monitor bezel, etc were not as tough or as durable. It 'worked' the same, but was not built the same. I guess I would say it is like the difference between a Canon higher end lens, and an "L" lens: better materials and tougher build for the 'L", but not necessarily dramatically better results.

So, if you need the roadwarrior features of the T, go for it. If not, save a buck and spend the extra on things that will make a difference: memory, monitor, etc.

They used to make an 'A' series, that was a desktop replacement laptop. It was bigger, and heavier, but had more performance. The 'R' has always been the 'value' line, though now with Lenovo, all Thinkpads are 'premium".

You may want to look at the 'Z" series, which are the widescreen multimedia models.

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

OK CMason, your comment, plus these two reviews that looked at the screens http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=2961&review=ThinkPad+R60
http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=2767
sold me.

I don't travel nearly as much as you do, but I do travel with my laptop (probably about 6 round trip flights per year) and I also do a lot of non-airplane travel with my laptop. But more importantly while the R60's screen has some light leakage in that review, it appears the T60's flexview has absolutely no light leakage whatsoever. Since it looks like 5400rpm SATA150 is about the same as 7200rpm ATA100, I can live with that for now, and I'll upgrade at some point in the future (it's $50 cheaper to upgrade immediately on my own than to buy from Lenovo anyways). Plus...the BATTERY LIFE...mmmm many hours of use on the 9-cell...no longer will I require my power cord when I need to use my laptop for more than 2 hours (which is any time I need to use my laptop).

Now I just need to find someone with a flexview T60 and X1400 vid card and have them run the LUT tester.

I looked at the Z, but quite frankly I don't like widescreens (plus I've read they are less than stellar on the Z) and I really don't want a glossy screen.

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

ChrisJ wrote:

Other than colors, I'm happy with my screen. I don't think FlexView existed when I bought this, so I guess I might not know what I'm missing!

I just tried the LUT tester and it does NOT work. My guess is that this is video card/driver dependent, and this is an old card at this point: ATI Mobility FIRE GL T2.

If it matters to you, try the guys over at forum.thinkpads.com. Since you have the FireGL branded cards, you get the professional drivers which might lock this out (it appears that LUT adjustability is driver controlled), and the guys there seem to have ways to run Radeon drivers on FireGL branded cards. It's unlikely that this will work, but it's possible.

cmason · October 30, 2006

I really don't know what LUT is or what it is for. But, if it helps, my T41 has an ATI card (not the x1400), and I can change the color management settings by putting any .icc profile I wish.

Now, I find that the LCD isnt that great for photoshop, but at home, I connect it to my monitor there for real photo work, and change the color profiles to match that for the monitor at home.

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

cmason wrote:

I really don't know what LUT is or what it is for. But, if it helps, my T41 has an ATI card (not the x1400), and I can change the color management settings by putting any .icc profile I wish.

Now, I find that the LCD isnt that great for photoshop, but at home, I connect it to my monitor there for real photo work, and change the color profiles to match that for the monitor at home.

LUT is look up table, it's complicated (translation: I don't know anything about it other than its abbreviation), but if the LUT isn't adjustable the monitor cannot be profiled. The trick is, this is all card and driver dependant, so I want to find someone with exactly what I will get.

Andy · October 30, 2006

The best.

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

Andy wrote:

The best.

That's enough out of you, you hippie. Go put on your Birkenstocks and walk over to some tree to hug. Mac guys, guess what - they're using Intel chips now...MAC LOST!

rofl

AntoineD · October 30, 2006

Andy wrote:

The best.

Here is some help, at last

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

To be honest, now that Macs can run windows I really hate them because of personal pride. I've hated Mac OS for this long (well...even before there was MacOS, I've hated them since using IIe's in grade school), I'm not going to start liking Macs now just becuase they admit defeat to windows.

Also, do your precious macs have spill resistant keyboards with drain holes, internal roll cages, shock mounted hard drives, and a fingerprint reader?

And someone just posted on another forum that they'll run the LUT tester when they get home tonight...sweet.

AntoineD · October 30, 2006

marlinspike wrote:

To be honest, now that Macs can run windows I really hate them because of personal pride.

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

Ordered

10 days till shipping.

DavidTO · October 30, 2006

marlinspike wrote:

To be honest, now that Macs can run windows I really hate them because of personal pride. I've hated Mac OS for this long (well...even before there was MacOS, I've hated them since using IIe's in grade school), I'm not going to start liking Macs now just becuase they admit defeat to windows.

That's funny. Apple didn't lose anything. Motorola and IBM lost out, and Apple made a switch. Apple actually started with the 68000 processors because that's what Wozniak could get his hands on when he built the Apple I. The very first computer, BTW, to have a keyboard and a display. Everything before that was switches and lights.

Anyway, enjoy your hate/hate relationship with Apple.

Oh, and your rollbars and keyboard drains.

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

DavidTO wrote:

Oh, and your rollbars and keyboard drains.

Oh, I will. I'll also enjoy the money I still have.

DavidTO · October 30, 2006

marlinspike wrote:

Oh, I will. I'll also enjoy the money I still have.

How much you paying, what are you getting?

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

DavidTO wrote:

How much you paying, what are you getting?

T60 20077JU (15" 1400x1050 flexview monitor, 2.16ghz core 2 duo 4mb cache, 120 gig 5400rpm SATA - I can upgrade later if I need to, radeon X1400 128mb, CD-RW/DVD which is fine with me since I have an external DVD burner, 1 gig ram). How much am I paying? I can't tell you, but it's several hundred cheaper than the cheapest mac that Andy linked to. Yes, I know that has the x1600, but I like my computers to come with Windows, and like I said, several hundred dollars - plus again I don't like widescreens)

And for the record, I do own an iPod...so I'm not totally hatefully.

wxwax · October 30, 2006

marlinspike wrote:

plus again I don't like widescreens)

Now, this doesn't make a great deal of sense.

If you're using the lappie for editing photos, a wider screen gives you somewhere to put your tool palettes, so they're not sitting right on top of your photo.

DavidTO · October 30, 2006

marlinspike wrote:

T60 20077JU (15" 1400x1050 flexview monitor, 2.16ghz core 2 duo 4mb cache, 120 gig 5400rpm SATA - I can upgrade later if I need to, radeon X1400 128mb, CD-RW/DVD which is fine with me since I have an external DVD burner, 1 gig ram). How much am I paying? I can't tell you, but it's several hundred cheaper than the cheapest mac that Andy linked to. Yes, I know that has the x1600, but I like my computers to come with Windows, and like I said, several hundred dollars - plus again I don't like widescreens)

And for the record, I do own an iPod...so I'm not totally hatefully.

Congratulations!

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

wxwax wrote:

Now, this doesn't make a great deal of sense.

If you're using the lappie for editing photos, a wider screen gives you somewhere to put your tool palettes, so they're not sitting right on top of your photo.

Well, I do travel with my laptop, and 15" is bad enough, 15" widescreen from what I've seen is pretty bulky. Also, they're wider but shorter.

marlinspike · October 30, 2006

Thanks David.

Would I have paid tax with a mac? Well, either way, it's still a couple hundred cheaper.

Here it is btw
http://www-131.ibm.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=-840&productId=4611686018425339862&storeId=10000001&langId=-1&categoryId=2049168&dualCurrId=1000073&sourceid0=ZDNETdatafeed00000000&cid=US1C02124&ca=affiliate&me=A&met=exbaAFwww.befree.&re=www.befree.com
Then remember what I said about how it's price relates to the cheapest of the macs Andy linked to. I think at that price even mac boys gotta shout baby got...a good price.

PC Laptop for photo editing?

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