Salon Shots

System

Did my first shoot of "hair models" last week. Tougher than you'd expect to make the hair the most important part of the image. Anyway, I'll past some of the images I'm trying to dial in here for constructive critiques and general harassment as I get them to the point of jpg'ness.

Up-do

Ted Szukalski

I'll try to be constructive but I have to admit I see a lot more negatives than positives in this image:
1. her eyes seem to be blured a bit - perhaps that is just the size of the image
2. the lines on her neckline reallly bother me - too much twist. I know it is natural but it is not very glamorous.
3. I can clearly see the lipstic line well below her actual bottom lip. She has beautiful lip line and there was no need to try to enlarge it. I guess that was just her make up.
4. her brows are green - not sure where this tone is coming from but you can also see it in the shade of the hair on the skin of her forehead.
5. the top looks flat black.

THE HAIR IS PERFECT!

System

That's what I needed Ted. I have no idea what I'm doing here, totally uncharted waters for me. One thing I should point out is that the only thing that really matters in the images is that the hair looks the way the stylist wants it to. The poses and lighting were focused on getting the best angles on the hair with little regard to the models face. I'm just trying to make the best of what I was able to shoot. I did burn the heck out of the shirt and the final image will be a tighter crop removing as much as possible from the bottom of the photo.

I'll go back and play with the color balance to see what's causing the green tint you pointed out. They eyes are not razor sharp but the image size is making them look far worse than they actually are. These images will most likely only be viewed even smaller as website images so it's not a huge issue.

wxwax

I find it very instructive to look at high-end shoe ads, clothes ads, hair products ads, to figure out how the photographer is directing my attention where he wants it. It's often very subtle.

In your image, I certainly look at the hair. But the bright face, large eyes and large, glossy red lips are bigger draws.

photogmomma

Okay, first of all, I am NOT a fashion photographer - as you well know.... So take what I say with a grain of salt.

The color is definitely off... Not sure what it is...

One thing that struck me is that i'm drawn a bit to her eyes. If you are trying to make the hair stand out more, you could either have a model with ugly eyes OR you could have her direct her eyes elsewhere. You know, as if she's not trying to engage the viewer. That may have the hair be even more of the focus.

The hair does look awesome.

I, too, am bothered by the neck lines.

Overall, I think it's quite good for a first shot. But know you'll come up with better shots!

System

Is the color getting better or worse? I've been staring at it so long I can't tell.

DavidTO

The area around the eyes seems yellow, is my biggest color complaint. There must be a yellow cast overall? I haven't checked.

With your watermark right there it's hard to tell, but her expression looks kind of unpleasant. Get the watermark off of her face and it might help, but it's not a sexy malevolent look, just kind of hateful, like she's asking me what the f I'm looking at. Sometimes that can be kind of tough, sexy, but in this case it's just not attractive.

The lighting seems flat, and doesn't really draw attention to the hair, although if your lighting did draw attention to the hair that would probably seem odd, but there must be some way to light this more dramatically and less flatly.

All this from a guy that knows nothing about fashion photography except that most of what passes for attractive in the fashion mags is ugly to me. So take with the appropriate amount of salt.

Art Scott

my only suggestion is for you to go to a styling salon and "STEAL" a copy of HAIR DO's or some other hair publication they have lying around....Orrrrr go order a copy of a speciality hair mag...the ones they have clients look at for ideas on how the client wants to look.

off to dinner......
Now where is that needle ..... and botle of insulin.....ahhhhhh there it tis....

System

I think I need to step away from the monitor for a bit. I'm starting to want to delete the whole shoot and do it again, which is always an option.

DavidTO

truth wrote:

I think I need to step away from the monitor for a bit. I'm starting to want to delete the whole shoot and do it again, which is always an option.

No, don't do that. This is informative for all. We get to learn by your mistakes.

wxwax

truth wrote:

I think I need to step away from the monitor for a bit.

I do that all the time. I find I easily lose my sense of what looks good and what doesn't.

DavidTO

wxwax wrote:

I do that all the time. I find I easily lose my sense of what looks good and what doesn't.

System

DavidTO wrote:

No, don't do that. This is informative for all. We get to learn by your mistakes.

If you're learning from my mistakes you're bound to end up the next Einstein. I'm a mistake machine. I wasn't going to delete the thread, just the images from this shoot sitting in Lightroom taunting me.

slapshot

DavidTO wrote:

The area around the eyes seems yellow, is my biggest color complaint. There must be a yellow cast overall? I haven't checked.

With your watermark right there it's hard to tell, but her expression looks kind of unpleasant. Get the watermark off of her face and it might help, but it's not a sexy malevolent look, just kind of hateful, like she's asking me what the f I'm looking at. Sometimes that can be kind of tough, sexy, but in this case it's just not attractive.

The lighting seems flat, and doesn't really draw attention to the hair, although if your lighting did draw attention to the hair that would probably seem odd, but there must be some way to light this more dramatically and less flatly.

All this from a guy that knows nothing about fashion photography except that most of what passes for attractive in the fashion mags is ugly to me. So take with the appropriate amount of salt.

Ditto what DavidTO says. Forget about what the hair looks like. The model has a very unpleasant look on her face. You have also toned down the colors on her face, which was the right idea, but now there is an unnatural cast.

Personally, I find the dark shirt to be distracting as well. My thought would be to go high key all the way, as is your lighting, but to include the clothing and make up as well.

Take this for what it's worth, I'm not a pro.

Art Scott

truth wrote:

I think I need to step away from the monitor for a bit. I'm starting to want to delete the whole shoot and do it again, which is always an option.

No don't do that

As several of the major pros I have read have said.....Never use the delete button....save every image as it may become a great work of art some day just in a different digital medium....(not as a portrait but maye as a line drawing, posterization or solarazation or some other form of surrealism or abstractness...).......

I read the critiques......so ...from what I see the only real prob is the neck twist.....clone it out..simple....first enlarge photo to actual pixels..let it take over the screen..set your clone brush (stamp) to accurate (the little cross hair target thing, instead of a brush...I personally had those damn brushes)...then set size to no bigger than a #9...it is small but not tiny start at the bottom of neck area and work upwards....
as for the lips ....it looks as if here is enuff room to clone them also with a really tiny brush, say a #5 or maybe a #3......... and that should make about 1000% difference.....also in hair shoots try to get both sides and the back (when shootingthe back side, you may need to be shooting slightly down to getthe effect of the hair style as it goes down the back side of the head.....another angle is to shoot so that you get the back and one side at the same time......all these shoting suggestions of course depends on the hair style........






just remember to do some home work before you take on a new and exciting shoot....even after thousands of weddings and portraits I still spend a lot of time looking at others work to get creative inspiration......or to see waht I need to do if I am not doing something I am familair with.......

System

Art, thanks. I have over 300 images from the shoot and this was just the first I took into PS from LR. Having never processed images like this I wnated to get some feedback here before I got too far into the stack of images.

Art Scott

truth wrote:

Art, thanks. I have over 300 images from the shoot and this was just the first I took into PS from LR. Having never processed images like this I wnated to get some feedback here before I got too far into the stack of images.

I have done exactly what you did here....I worked for a hairstylist that was trying to bring the California look to Wichita and in the Mid-80's that wasn't happenin' too quickly.....and they would schedule shoots and I would convrge on their salon with lights and umbrellas and extension cords.....

I had to several re-shoots because of simple mistakes of having necks twisted a tad far.....no way to clone it out of film:D......and waaaaaay to much make up on the models....

Hope my suggestions were helpful.....GOOD LUCK!

System

Art, they were and I do appreciate it. With both my finance and future brother in law owning salon's I have a feeling there will be a few more of these shoots before I die. The good thing is they are getting what they pay for right now!

I'm not a plastic surgeon but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn Express once:



or



I'm spent. I need a PS assistant.

bsvirginian

I think you did a pretty good job. Are you able to re-shoot it or something similar? she is in a perfect 2/3 view. I find the eyes need to be centered a bit. Yes, the neck is overextended. Just bring her shoulders around some. Or just tighten the shot. I don't think color is that much a problem. I wouldn't doubt that you could soften the whole image. High Key is working good. I can't tell by the eyes but what lighting were you using. As far as flat is concerned it is not uncommon to photograph women in flat light. Just some thoughts, BS. :ivar

System

Jack

wxwax

truth wrote:

I'm spent. I need a PS assistant.

DavidTO

truth wrote:

Jack

Dude needs a haircut.

wxwax

As I said, I'd look at how others do what you're trying to do.

Look at these:
http://www.babak.ca/backstage/contessa.html
The models are beautiful but bland, the hair is where the color and the action is, hence where the eye goes. Well, except for the tattoo models of course, but there the hair is a continuation of their body patterns.

Similar work here.
http://www.babak.ca/backstage/naha.html

Click on Book 100, to see how he shot L'Oreal hair.
http://www.babak.ca/

I keep seeing a lot of featureless, almost plastic faces, with bright hair that pops.

System

wxwax wrote:

As I said, I'd look at how others do what you're trying to do.

Look at these:
http://www.babak.ca/backstage/contessa.html
The models are beautiful but bland, the hair is where the color and the action is, hence where the eye goes. Well, except for the tattoo models of course, but there the hair is a continuation of their body patterns.

Similar work here.
http://www.babak.ca/backstage/naha.html

Click on Book 100, to see how he shot L'Oreal hair.
http://www.babak.ca/

I keep seeing a lot of featureless, almost plastic faces, with bright hair that pops.

This was not a new shot...just processing what I have, but thanks,

wxwax

truth wrote:

Did my first shoot of "hair models" last week.

Implies more shoots.

You're welcome.

System

wxwax wrote:

Implies more shoots.

You're welcome.

Indeed.