Here Goes Buckle up!!

Different Drummer · January 11, 2004

Ok folks,
So I want to buy my first digital camera. Do mostly outside stuff, wildlife, landscape, mountains, etc. Have always had a need for a reasonable telephoto, when using my old SLR. Rarely do I do inside group or individual photos. However, it does occur occasionally. Compact size is not a priority.
I am considering purchasing the Minolta Dimage Z1. I would appreciate any input that the veterans/experts reading this might offer. Also, what accessories and/or memory cards should I purchase in addition to the camera?
Thank you,
DD

hutchman · January 11, 2004

I don't know anything about the Z1. Here are a couple of websites that I use for info on digital cameras and stuff.

www.dpreview.com

www.dcresource.com

I hope this helps.

One piece of advice - Buy the camera that suits you , whatever it is, then take lots of pictures. Don't just take one picture, take several from different angles and exposures. No film to process. These pictures are cheap!

Hutch

wxwax · January 11, 2004

Good to have you onboard, drummer.

I'll let those old guys with gray hair

weigh-in as they see fit... here's what occurs to me:

One more review site: Steve's Digicams

You'll want a tripod... that 10x zoom sounds sweet, but it will be next to impossible to get a clean shot when you're zoomed-out, unless you have a stable platform. And I wouldn't suggest using the digital zoom... it helps degrade the image. Better to crop the picture later.

Get enough memory to meet your needs for a day's shoot or a road trip (assuming you don't have some kind of portable hard drive.) A 256 or 512 SD card should be ample.

I agree with Hutchman... the the beauty of digital is that I can keep taking the shot until I think I have it right... no cost for all those extra clicks!

If you like wide angle, that wide convertor accessory might be pretty cool to have. And I'd be tempted to upgrade to an external flash, even if you're only using as fill on outdoor shots.

It sounds like it's good with batteries, but unless you like buying fistfuls of batts, I'd say get at least one more set and make them rechargeable.

Sounds like a nice camera, differentdrummer.

wxwax · January 11, 2004

Oh, one last thing, but very important: try to get that camera in your hands before you buy. See if a local store has it, especially if you plan to buy on line. Get a feel for it, see if the controls make sense to you.

I was torn between a Canon and a Nikon on my last purchase, and as soon as I held them it was clear which I found more natural to operate.

hutchman · January 11, 2004

wxwax wrote:

I'll let those old guys with gray hair weigh-in as they see fit... here's what occurs to me:

And what's wrong with gray hair????????

Different Drummer · January 11, 2004

Thanks
Wxwax and Hutchman,
Thank you.
Even with my old ( Not Gray ) SLR I would always take several shots. Cost me more money but my philosophy has always been , "This moment will never occur again in time". So I am on board in that respect.
Patch and Dizave turnrd me onto dpreview.com so I have read that. Trouble is I am not sure I understand everything I read there. Duh?
I will make sure that I get an extra set of rechargable Batteries. I think this camera fits my style well.
Guess I would need a card reader. Also want to make sure that I get cards that are appropriate for the video mode. Is there a difference or something that I need to be aware of in this respect?
Thanks again. Maybe someone that has used it or knowledge of it will chime in.
DD

hutchman · January 11, 2004

Drummer,

The one issue with my DSC-f707 that is very limiting and frustrating is shutter lag. When this camera came out, it had the least amount of lag of the available prosumer cameras. I believe it was rated at .18 of a second with the camera 1/2 cocked. That is too slow for any kind of action shots. If you plan on taking any action type shots, my advice is to step up to one of the new SLRs.

Just a thought.

Hutch

patch29 · January 11, 2004

It might be worth waiting a month to see what new cameras are launched at PMA in February. New models may come out that better serve you or there could be a drop in some prices.

Different Drummer · January 11, 2004

Maybe sometimes

hutchman wrote:

Drummer,

The one issue with my DSC-f707 that is very limiting and frustrating is shutter lag. When this camera came out, it had the least amount of lag of the available prosumer cameras. I believe it was rated at .18 of a second with the camera 1/2 cocked. That is too slow for any kind of action shots. If you plan on taking any action type shots, my advice is to step up to one of the new SLRs.

Just a thought.

Hutch

Probably would would do sequenced action shots very infrequently. Cannot find anything in the specs that show " Shutter delay" or lag. I do see that one of its 5 subject program modes is one for sports action.
I am assuming that it would be capable of a single action type shot where fast shutter speed is needed but only for one shot. I think what you are refering to is the ability to rapidly sequence action shots. Am I correct in that assumpionn?
Like I said in the beginning, " Fasten your seatbelts" and be gentle.
Thank you all,
DD

patch29 · January 11, 2004

Not sure about the shutter lag but here are the specs on the fps and buffer.

1.5 fps up to 6 images

wxwax · January 12, 2004

The review on differentdrummer's camera makes a point of saying that it has shutter lag on a par with the digital SLR's. Quick, in other words. That's a nice feature.

Drummer, I agree about the technical nature of dpreview's... um, reviews. That's why I secretly dip into Steve's Digicams... low brow but informative, right down my alley.

Much easier to understand. You might like it.

You use the same memory for stills as for video -- just pack a lot of memory, 'cause video eats it up. Also, don't expect really good video from a still camera. Maybe I'm a snob, but I think video cameras get video and still cameras get stills.

I really like the Minolta you're looking at. It has a ton of features, incredible optical zoom, hot shoe for flash, quick trigger response. All good. I'd still want to hold it and play with it to make sure I liked it, though.

wxwax · January 12, 2004

Oh, and differentdrumer, card readers are definitely the way to go.

Really easy to use, just leave it hooked up to the computer, slide the memory card into it when you're ready to download. No need to fuss with wiring the camera.

Different Drummer · January 12, 2004

Ok?

patch29 wrote:

Not sure about the shutter lag but here are the specs on the fps and buffer.

1.5 fps up to 6 images

Soooo is this good or bad?

Different Drummer · January 12, 2004

wxwax wrote:

The review on differentdrummer's camera makes a point of saying that it has shutter lag on a par with the digital SLR's. Quick, in other words. That's a nice feature.

Drummer, I agree about the technical nature of dpreview's... um, reviews. That's why I secretly dip into Steve's Digicams... low brow but informative, right down my alley. Much easier to understand. You might like it.

You use the same memory for stills as for video -- just pack a lot of memory, 'cause video eats it up. Also, don't expect really good video from a still camera. Maybe I'm a snob, but I think video cameras get video and still cameras get stills.

I really like the Minolta you're looking at. It has a ton of features, incredible optical zoom, hot shoe for flash, quick trigger response. All good. I'd still want to hold it and play with it to make sure I liked it, though.

Thanks, I will be checking out Steves Digicams.
I have had a chance to lay my hands on it. I like the way it fits my hand and the placement of controls. Also like the Screen in the middle just below the view finder. Ergonomically it seems to please me.
I did read that the video on this camera was exceptional by the way.
Found it on line for about $270.00. Seems quite inexpensive for what it gives you. Thats about $160.00 cheaper than the local stores. ie, Best Buy etc. Never bought on line before and the first time makes me a little nervous. Especially frome some place in Brooklyn. Apologies to all those from Brooklyn.
You guys have been a great help so far.
DD

patch29 · January 12, 2004

Differentdrummer wrote:

Soooo is this good or bad?

It is ok. Not too fast, but for the money about average.

patch29 · January 12, 2004

Differentdrummer wrote:

Thanks, I will be checking out Steves Digicams.
I have had a chance to lay my hands on it. I like the way it fits my hand and the placement of controls. Also like the Screen in the middle just below the view finder. Ergonomically it seems to please me.
I did read that the video on this camera was exceptional by the way.
Found it on line for about $270.00. Seems quite inexpensive for what it gives you. Thats about $160.00 cheaper than the local stores. ie, Best Buy etc. Never bought on line before and the first time makes me a little nervous. Especially frome some place in Brooklyn. Apologies to all those from Brooklyn.
You guys have been a great help so far.
DD

I checked with B+H and they sell it for $329.00. There have good prices and get the product out without any BS (the item comes with everything in the box, they actually have it in stock, etc). I have used them many times and I will use them in the future.

wxwax · January 12, 2004

Differentdrummer wrote:

Found it on line for about $270.00. Seems quite inexpensive for what it gives you. Thats about $160.00 cheaper than the local stores. ie, Best Buy etc. Never bought on line before and the first time makes me a little nervous. Especially frome some place in Brooklyn. Apologies to all those from Brooklyn.
You guys have been a great help so far.
DD

Warning!! Be verrry careful about dealing with those Brooklyn outfits. As in, I wouldn't.

Some of their tricks: sell you the camera without the accessories that come as part of the standard package, then get you to pay extra for the accessories; sell you a 'grey market' camera, an import that is not covered by the manufacturer's warranty; really put the squeeze on you to buy extra accessories and ultimately refuse to sell the camera unless you buy some; appear to be agreeable but when it comes time to check out you'll find mysterious additions to your bill that bring the total price into line with other retailers; not have the camera in stock and make you wait weeks, after already charging your credit card.

I would strongly suggest that you avoid these guys and pay more for a more reliable seller. You can always use those online ratings services to see the feedback on the seller you're considering.

Different Drummer · January 13, 2004

Ever heard of these?
Well guys,
I decided that the Dimage z1 is gonna be the one. Time to crap or vacate the commode.
Anyone ever here of these guys? From price grabber.com Remember guys, I am losing my virginity in this deal. Or maybe you recognize, " Go slow, it's my first time".
6th Ave. electronics
Springfield NJ

Electric Sam
Kenner LA ( Patches neck of the woods)
If no one can recommend these I will bite the bullet for the tax and go the H&B route.

wxwax · January 13, 2004

Good price, that's for sure. cnet gives them a perfect rating.

Link

The camera is supposed to come with the following accessories as part of the standard package:

• 16MB Secure Digital (SD) Memory Card
• 4x AA Alkaline Batteries
• USB Cable (USB-500)
• AV Cable (AVC-200)
• Neck Strap (NS-DG5000)
• Lens Cap (LF-242)
• Accessory Shoe Cap (SC-1000)
• Software CD-ROM (DiMAGE Viewer, ArcSoft VideoImpression)
• User's Guide
• 1-Year Limited Warranty

Make sure that's what you're getting. If they jerk you around on any of this, or try to charge you more, then don't do business with them. They may also try to squeeze you to buy the 2-year warranty. And be watchful about their shipping charges. Don't agree to anything until you have the final cost absolutely firm and clear, and are satisfied that it's what you were expecting.

Why am I so suspicious? Their price is about $100 less than that of established dealers. That's 25%. That's a lot. So tread carefully.

wxwax · January 13, 2004

BTW, just curious, did you get the e-mail lower price from B&H? If so, what was it?

Different Drummer · January 13, 2004

B&H

wxwax wrote:

BTW, just curious, did you get the e-mail lower price from B&H? If so, what was it?

Have not called B&H yet. I really do prefer to speak to someone in person, so to speak. Patch noted that B&H e-mail lower price was $329.00 Because they are in NY( As am I ) there would be 7.25% tax on that I would imagine.
Wich place were you refering to that got the good rating?
I will make sure that whever I buy I get everything on the list.
Also, I now understand about "Grey Products", thanks to the information in the thread about where it is safe to buy. Between here and there I have learned a lot.
Off to check out the review site that you hyperlinked for me.
DD

Different Drummer · January 13, 2004

Oops!!!

wxwax wrote:

BTW, just curious, did you get the e-mail lower price from B&H? If so, what was it?

Just read the rating. Now I know you were talking about 6th Ave. in NJ
Their cost, 313.64 includes shipping of 9.60 and no tax for my zip code.
I will call them tomorrow ( As well as H&B ) and play the 20 questions game with them. I have the list copied that you posted for supplied Accy's.
This has been a tremendous help.
DD

Different Drummer · January 14, 2004

Wxwax to the rescue
Wxwax,
Read your PM's and followed the link. Wouldn't it be nice if we lived in a world where we did not have to approach everyone we come in contact with or did business with, clenching our anal sphinctors.
All I can say is thanks again.
I couldn't even find where Inoax was located. That was going to be my first question to them on the phone.
So, I am going to call 6th Ave. in NJ. At least they are rated and it is quite good at that. However, if I do not feel comfortable when talking to them, and all my questions are not answered to my satisfaction, it's off to H&B
DD

patch29 · January 14, 2004

Differentdrummer wrote:

However, if I do not feel comfortable when talking to them, and all my questions are not answered to my satisfaction, it's off to H&B
DD

Make sure it is B&H, never heard of H&B they might be in Brooklyn.

Different Drummer · January 14, 2004

Ooops!

patch29 wrote:

Make sure it is B&H, never heard of H&B they might be in Brooklyn.

Thanks patch,
My dyslexia kicking in. Now you know why I needed Rabias help with my Avatar.
It must be frustrating for all you techno folks having to have the likes of me around. I guess that we all have our place in life though.
Thanks to all for letting me play at your place once in a while.
Best Regards,
DD :ah:

patch29 · January 14, 2004

Differentdrummer wrote:

Thanks patch,
My dyslexia kicking in. Now you know why I needed Rabias help with my Avatar.
It must be frustrating for all you techno folks having to have the likes of me around. I guess that we all have our place in life though.
Thanks to all for letting me play at your place once in a while.
Best Regards,
DD :ah:

Not a problem at all. Let us know when you get your new camera.

Different Drummer · January 14, 2004

Huh?

patch29 wrote:

Not a problem at all. Let us know when you get your new camera.

If I do that you will want me to post Pics. Have not any idea on how to do that. I can see that I will be studying hard. ( Oh, the thought of those all nighters in college ) Think it will be that bad?
Best get myself to work.
Ta Ta Todalooooo!
DD

patch29 · January 14, 2004

Differentdrummer wrote:

If I do that you will want me to post Pics. Have not any idea on how to do that. I can see that I will be studying hard. ( Oh, the thought of those all nighters in college ) Think it will be that bad?
Best get myself to work.
Ta Ta Todalooooo!
DD

All you need is a computer and smugmug account. :baldy: :glug:

Different Drummer · January 15, 2004

Ooops!
Well,
I just typed a nice informative piece on my experience buying from 6th Ave electronics. Somehow lost it while previewing. I type slow and must return to work. So, look for it later tonight.
DD

wxwax · January 15, 2004

Differentdrummer wrote:

Well,
I just typed a nice informative piece on my experience buying from 6th Ave electronics. Somehow lost it while previewing. I type slow and must return to work. So, look for it later tonight.
DD

That's a drag. Look forward to it. I hope it wnet smoothly.

Different Drummer · January 15, 2004

Here's the Poop!!
So,
I talked to a very nice young man (sounded young, anyway) named Joe. Ext. 509. I explained to him that this was a first time process for me and that I had been forewarned and that I had been warned about being careful about buying item s on the internet. I had many questions and some of them I asked more than just once. Joe remained polite and quite patient during the whole process of ordering. Joe reassured me:
1. The item I wanted was in stock.
2. It was not a gray market item.
3. Cost would be exactly what I saw at their website. In fact, it cost less because shipping to my zip code was less.
4. Full manufacturer's warranty in effect.
5. All the accessories (and I listed all of them) came with the camera for the quoted price.

In addition, Joe told me that I would receive e-mail conifrmation of purchasing the item with price quoted. He gave me an invoice number to refer to if needed. I would receive e-mail confirmation from UPS that the item was shipped with tracking number. The item will be shipped fully insured and would require a signature upon delivery. Therefore, item will not be left sitting on my doorstep unattended, if I'm not home. I was told item should ship tomorrow and arrive Tuesday at the latest. Because things seemed to be going well, I decided to ask about some accessories. Joe told me that although they were extremely competitive on their cameras, their accessory pricing was not as low. I decided to wait and received no pressure from him to buy anything else.
So far this experience has been positive, I will report more when the camera and credit card bill arrive. Thanks to everyone for their help.
DD

Here Goes Buckle up!!

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