Idea #5

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

"Where do you want to go today?"

saurora · May 4, 2007

Is this an older shot Nik that you are thinking of re-shooting? I like the idea....I'm not so sure about the moon being quite so huge. There seems to be a lot of competition between the 2 subjects moon vs. fence. It also seems too tight. Just my thoughts, which isn't much I know!

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

Saurora,

saurora wrote:

Is this an older shot Nik that you are thinking of re-shooting?

No, it's from this week..

saurora wrote:

I like the idea....

Thanks!

saurora wrote:

I'm not so sure about the moon being quite so huge. There seems to be a lot of competition between the 2 subjects moon vs. fence. It also seems too tight. Just my thoughts, which isn't much I know!

Duly noted!

Thank you for your feedback! :saurora

Flyinggina · May 4, 2007

Wow, Nik. I love this shot. Just as it is. I like the crop, the huge moon (you do moons really well so I knew it was real), the composition - everything. It is my kind of photo.

It took me a minute, but with the title's guidance I began to think of being imprisoned , staring up at the moon and dreaming of where I would go if I were free. Then it was obvious and - for me - moving. It drew me further into the photo. If there is anything I would change it would be to make the title stronger (though I don't have any suggestions at the moment). But it works as is.

Virginia

BistiArt · May 4, 2007

Powerful Moon

Nikolai wrote:

"Where do you want to go today?"

Nik,

My comment may be somewhat absurb; did you intend for the fence 'post' to obscure where the Apollo crew landed back in the 60's?

As I drove home from the camera club last nite, there was a big moon just clearing our local mountains, aglow with that soft, post full-moon presence. Alas, tired, no camera, and dust spots to be cleaned, I did not get a shot.

Can you please detail how you got the moon that size, yet also got the fence in the pic?

You shot is reminiscent of Moon to King's Rook on BistiArt.smugmug.com with a B&W presence v a color capture.
http://bistiart.smugmug.com/gallery/2219599#115599418

I guess MtKR is more of a "Where did you go yesterday..." Alas, for many of my shots, LPS rules and distance seem to make it so.

VisualXpressions · May 4, 2007

Great shot! wish I had the kind of glass it takes to capture such a clear shot of our closest celestial neighbor... but alas my piece of crap nikor 80-300 F5.6 just doesn't cut it... Any way, does the strong moon shot overwhelm the "silhouette" of the fence? don't know, just something to consider.

Winston

Tessa HD · May 4, 2007

lps#5
i really like the sillouette of the fence and even how it captures a little bit of glow on some of the links. I too, however, wonder if the moon is overpowering.

Tessa

richtersl · May 4, 2007

Nice shot! But like the others said, the moon is a bit overpowering. At first I wondered why you submitted a shot of the moon for LPS #5. It took a few seconds for it to sink in that there was a silhouette of a fence in there.

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

Flyinggina wrote:

Wow, Nik. I love this shot. Just as it is. I like the crop, the huge moon (you do moons really well so I knew it was real), the composition - everything. It is my kind of photo.

It took me a minute, but with the title's guidance I began to think of being imprisoned , staring up at the moon and dreaming of where I would go if I were free. Then it was obvious and - for me - moving. It drew me further into the photo. If there is anything I would change it would be to make the title stronger (though I don't have any suggestions at the moment). But it works as is.

Virginia

Virginia,
Thank you! Glad I was able to deliver the message..
I will work on the details (this is only an early draft) and, likely, on the title, too.

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

Joe,

BistiArt wrote:

Nik,
My comment may be somewhat absurb; did you intend for the fence 'post' to obscure where the Apollo crew landed back in the 60's?

In all honesty, I have no idea where that spot is..

BistiArt wrote:

As I drove home from the camera club last nite, there was a big moon just clearing our local mountains, aglow with that soft, post full-moon presence. Alas, tired, no camera, and dust spots to be cleaned, I did not get a shot.

Well, it happens every month, you'll get a couple more chances...

BistiArt wrote:

Can you please detail how you got the moon that size, yet also got the fence in the pic?

Later, sure, at this moment I don't want to ruin the mood with the gory details :smooch

Thanks for looking!

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

Winston, Tessa, Linda
Thank you guys for looking and commenting!

As to your general concern about having two powerful subjects and moon overpowering the fence.

Well, IMHO, diminishing either one would lower the impact.

A viewer is not supposed to notice the fence at first. The moon is "in your face". It's the primary magnet, it should draw you, make you wishing you could go there now.
Then you'll notice that something's bothering you, prevents you from going there. And at this point you realize there is an obstacle - the darn barbed wire fence. It's kinda ghostly, but once you've noticed it you won't be able get it out of your mind. It's there, even if only in silhouette, and it won't let you go where you want to...

At least that was my intention.
HTH

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

Winston,

VisualXpressions wrote:

Great shot! wish I had the kind of glass it takes to capture such a clear shot of our closest celestial neighbor... but alas my piece of crap nikor 80-300 F5.6 just doesn't cut it...

This was taken with EF 100-400L + TC 1.4x (taped pins for AF to work at least in focus confirmation mode, I focused manually)
It's not as good as 500/600mm prime would be, but it's close and pricewise it's an awesome ROI.

douglas · May 4, 2007

Looks great Nik

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

douglas wrote:

Looks great Nik

Thanks, Douglas!

I've been waiting for yours..

NanaMo · May 4, 2007

.....fun shot and I got the idea you were communicating from both the picture (first) and then when I read your title...

..certainly makes you think!!

Maureen

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

NanaMo wrote:

.....fun shot and I got the idea you were communicating from both the picture (first) and then when I read your title.....certainly makes you think!!

Maureen

Thanks, Maureen!

ChrisJ · May 4, 2007

Nikolai wrote:

A viewer is not supposed to notice the fence at first. The moon is "in your face". It's the primary magnet, it should draw you, make you wishing you could go there now.

Hi Nik, I do like this shot. But I think you mentioned its biggest challenge-related problem for me, the sillhouette is not the focus of the image, the moon is. Just think of your assignments.

Obviously, anything goes with the judges, though! I'd say you should reshoot, but you'd have to wait a moonth!

Nikolai · May 4, 2007

ChrisJ wrote:

Hi Nik, I do like this shot. But I think you mentioned its biggest challenge-related problem for me, the sillhouette is not the focus of the image, the moon is. Just think of your assignments.

Obviously, anything goes with the judges, though! I'd say you should reshoot, but you'd have to wait a moonth!

Thanks!

Yeah, I know, I know...

Well, as I said before - I looks for the non-challenge specific results more than for challenge compliance. I'd rather have an overall better image than a third spot in May semifinals...

Nikolai · May 5, 2007

Submitted version
With numerous slight improvements (or so I hope:-)

Nikolai · May 5, 2007

"Moonlit fence" how-to...

BistiArt wrote:

Can you please detail how you got the moon that size, yet also got the fence in the pic?

Well, I guess it's too late now:-)

First of all, those are two shots. One of the fence, an hour before the sunset, another of the moon, about three hours after the sunset. They happened to be on the same day, just different times.
Also different lenses are used, but that's probably not a biggie.
The moon was shot with 100-400 and 1.4 TC, pins taped, manual focus with focus confirmation.
Both images were brought together to a composite file as different layers.
The fence the was resized to match the moon shot scale.
The fence layer was then "thresholded" to achieve a 100% "silhouette" effect.
The moon layer was mangled with several adjustment layers to achieve the look I wanted it to have.
The toughest issue was the fence. After the threshold it was purely b/w (I mean, "purely black and white", either back, or white, no shades of gray). That was fine for the part that was against the moon, but I wanted to create a somewhat realistic glimpse on the fence surfaces that would have been moonlit if it was a real deal. Well, after a few tries i came to the following:

select the fence
contract the selection by 1 pixel
create a new layer
with the selection still active, fill it with white (thus creating a somewhat thinner inverse copy of the fence shot)
Gaussian blur with 1 pixel radius to achieve smoother edges
move the white layer below the black one
find the center of the moon, mark it with the rulers
with the white fence layer selected, activate the free transform
move the central anchor of the free transform to the "center of the moon"
magnify the image at one of the corners about x5..x10 times (to achieve precise control over the small mouse movements)
while depressing the Alt key contract the selection by 1 pixel, hit Enter to confirm
As the result of this step the white part will "gravitate" towards the moon center, thus creating more or less realistic "moonlit" effect.
adjust opacity of this layer to make it only slightly visible
double-click the layer to bring its Properties dialog
for the lower Blend-If slider: alt-click the white one, bring its lower part completely to the black, then carefully move the upper part to about 10..15% from the black.
The result of this last step is that the white "lit" parts would become less visible if brought against the brightest moon parts, yet become more distinct when opposing the darker ones or totally black sky.

Well, that's about it...
Hope it was worth typing..:-)

richtersl · May 5, 2007

Nikolai wrote:

A viewer is not supposed to notice the fence at first. The moon is "in your face". It's the primary magnet, it should draw you, make you wishing you could go there now.
Then you'll notice that something's bothering you, prevents you from going there. And at this point you realize there is an obstacle - the darn barbed wire fence. It's kinda ghostly, but once you've noticed it you won't be able get it out of your mind. It's there, even if only in silhouette, and it won't let you go where you want to...

At least that was my intention.

If that was your intent, then it works very well.

The moon does look most impressive! I've not had much luck with moon shots yet. It always looks overexposed and when I play around with different layers I still haven't quite gotten the knack of making it look right.

Ya done good, my friend!

BistiArt · May 5, 2007

Sea of Tranquility & 1969's Apollo 11 1st Lunar Landing

Nikolai wrote:

Well, I guess it's too late now:-)

Hope it was worth typing..:-)

Yep, Darth, it really was!

Thanks for the detailed PS procedures.

Apollo 11 was the 1st lunar landing, in 1969. Under manual flight control to avoid a crater, it was piloted by Neil Armstrong onto the Sea of Tranquility [Mare Tranquilitatis]. To add to this fascinating history;

"Thats one small step for man, one giant leap for mankind..."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_11

Tranquilitatis is noted below by the Apollo 11 arrow.

Innovative creation, Nik!

Please keep 'em coming...

Nikolai · May 5, 2007

richtersl wrote:

If that was your intent, then it works very well.

The moon does look most impressive! I've not had much luck with moon shots yet. It always looks overexposed and when I play around with different layers I still haven't quite gotten the knack of making it look right.

Ya done good, my friend!

Thank you!

Shooting the moon is, actually, VERY simple. I mean, to get it up close you obviously need a long glass, and it's better have IS or mounted on a very good tripod. But exposure-wise...

See, there is this "Sunny 16" rule, i.e. "when sunny, shoot ISO 100, 1/100 sec, f/16".
Guess what: full moon is a sunlit object...

But since it's not exactly white, it may be beneficial to open the aperture up a bit and shoot maybe f/11.

From this set you can make further adjustments: increase shutter speed and close the aperture, or vice versa, etc.

Just don't trust your auto mode, since cameras are easily fooled, that is unless you can fill the whole viewfinder with the moon surface or use a spot meter (which works pretty well on 30D)

HTH

Flyinggina · May 5, 2007

For what it is worth, I like the first version you posted showing more of the fence better than the second version. It strikes me as more coherent as a photograph. It conveys the feeling of being fenced in better. The revision seems over processed to me. Just my 2 cents worth. Either way, I still love the photo!

Virginia

Nikolai · May 5, 2007

Flyinggina wrote:

For what it is worth, I like the first version you posted showing more of the fence better than the second version. It strikes me as more coherent as a photograph. It conveys the feeling of being fenced in better. The revision seems over processed to me. Just my 2 cents worth. Either way, I still love the photo!

Virginia

Virginia, thank you for the feedback, really appreciate it!
I decided for this tighter crop since the theme is "silhouette", not the moon. This way I get more of the silhouette (I hope so, at least).
Cheers!

Flyinggina · May 5, 2007

I understand your reasoning, Nik, but to me having more of the fence in the first one and a somewhat less contrasty moon emphasizes the fence better and grabs my interest. I am sympathetic with your desire to make the photo less aout the moon given the way the themes are being interpreted by the judges. I'm just not sure you have succeeded.

Virginia

NanaMo · May 5, 2007

Nikolai wrote:

Thank you!

Shooting the moon is, actually, VERY simple. I mean, to get it up close you obviously need a long glass, and it's better have IS or mounted on a very good tripod. But exposure-wise...

See, there is this "Sunny 16" rule, i.e. "when sunny, shoot ISO 100, 1/100 sec, f/16".
Guess what: full moon is a sunlit object...
But since it's not exactly white, it may be beneficial to open the aperture up a bit and shoot maybe f/11.

From this set you can make further adjustments: increase shutter speed and close the aperture, or vice versa, etc.

Just don't trust your auto mode, since cameras are easily fooled, that is unless you can fill the whole viewfinder with the moon surface or use a spot meter (which works pretty well on 30D)

HTH

Great information! All new to me, thanks...still love the picture....

Maureen

Nikolai · May 5, 2007

Flyinggina wrote:

I understand your reasoning, ....
I'm just not sure you have succeeded.

Virginia

Neither am I, neither am I

I guess we'll see... Or maybe I use some other moon-based idea

Nikolai · May 5, 2007

Maureen,

NanaMo wrote:

Great information! All new to me, thanks...still love the picture....

Maureen

Thanks!

Sometimes those the old timers tricks can be still useful!

BistiArt · May 5, 2007

One Shot Capture of Moon Rise and Sunset w Long Lens

Nikolai wrote:

Thank you!

Shooting the moon is, actually, VERY simple. I mean, to get it up close you obviously need a long glass, and it's better have IS or mounted on a very good tripod. But exposure-wise...

HTH

Hey Nik,

Have you done the moon against a regular foreground object like a Bisti Hoodoo or equivalent?

Its a little more simple to do 2 days before full moon vice the day before when there seems to be little time between moonrise and sunset and the High Dynamic Range grows larger.

In terms of timing and HDR settings using a spot meter have you either
done it?
or
know of a good reference on the web?

TIA

Strikeslip · May 5, 2007

Wow, you're a patient person, Nikolai! :-O

Idea #5

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