What to do?
evoryware
Registered Users Posts: 1,330 Major grins
What would you think and what would you do next if it was you?
http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=483577&postcount=29<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=53769&highlight=police<o:p></o:p>
http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=57725&highlight=police<o:p></o:p>
http://www.digitalgrin.com/showthread.php?t=58542<o:p></o:p>
The following story ties into the topic in the above threads, but I just feels deserves a different thread. This happened to me today.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
At <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:time Hour="7" Minute="0">7:00AM</st1:time> I drive to take my wife to JFK airport from <st1:City><st1:place>Manhattan</st1:place></st1:City> because she has a flight out at <st1:time Hour="8" Minute="45">8:45</st1:time>. Knowing that traffic will be horrible going back to Manhattan at 8 AM in the morning, I decide it would be a good idea to bring my lenses and camera and try and find a good view of the city/airport. Having lived 16 years in <st1:place>Queens</st1:place>, I have a great idea of where to go to get these pictures.
<o:p></o:p>
Knowing that I love taking pictures around the city and loving aviation, this is a perfect opportunity to find a good spot. Also having a shot idea for an assignment, I decide to trek around the vicinity of the airport. After I drop my wife off, I plug a position into his TomTom GPS that would appear to be a waterfront view of the city and possibly catch airplanes landing on their approach. Heading over to the position, I’m not satisfied. It’s a commercial area. So I plug in another location in the TomTom and head off again, but stop at Burger King to get some food on the way. When I get to the location, it’s exactly what I was hoping for but the sun is high and bright. I figure I can come back later with a tripod and get a nice sunset picture of the city and a night time picture. Sitting in my running car, pulled off to the side of the street, eating a crossanwich and drinking orange juice, I snap off a few pictures to get an idea of composition. People are driving by. The DEP is in the area. I’m not hiding my camera and I am sitting in the running car taking pictures. Then a cop car drives by while I’m parked and I have the camera in my lap and I’m taking my last bite of food. The cops drive by and then 2 minutes or so later come back and pull behind me. The officer comes up to the car and asks if I know why they are there. “No”, I say. The officer responds, “You are not allowed to be taking pictures of the airport.”
<o:p></o:p>
“Oh, I’m sorry. I was just enjoying the lovely view of the city and taking a couple pictures”, I say and gesture to the direction of the city. “You know you can’t be taking pictures of the airport from here. Since 9-11 this is a sensitive issue and they don’t want pictures of the airport being taken with a telephoto lens.” I respond, “Okay, no problem. I didn’t realize that would be an issue here. I take pictures all around the city all the time.” The officer asks how many pictures I took of the airport. I point and frame the area I took and tell the cop “a few”. The cop asks for my license, registration, and insurance card. I pull it out and the officers walk back to their car. I take the telephoto lens off the camera and go back to finish my OJ. After a few minutes, the officer comes back and asks if I have any outstanding warrants. I reply, “No.”
<o:p></o:p>
The officer walks back to his car. Comes back about a minute later and there are 4 cops now. I gesture to show the cop the pictures and my generic business card. The officer asks me to get out of the vehicle. I say okay and get out w/ no argument. I’m told to turn around and empty my pockets and put my hands behind my back.
<o:p></o:p>
The first two cops were white. One of the new cops is a black officer. These three officers ask me what I’m taking pictures of, why I’m taking them, what I’m doing in the area, where do I live, what does I do for a living, how long was I in the area, am I a U.S. citizen, etc. I answer all the questions voluntarily and quickly.
<o:p></o:p>
“I dropped my wife off at JFK… I’m taking pictures of this beautiful city as I always do, I used to live in the area and I figured this would be a good spot. I live in <st1:City><st1:place>Manhattan</st1:place></st1:City>,” blah blah blah…. Black officer asks if I have anything in the car that I shouldn’t have. “Just my camera sir, it’s over $3000 worth of equipment in there.”
<o:p></o:p>
Another 4 or 5 squad cars show now and he’s put in the back of a squad car while they search it. Tears rolling down my eyes in the back seat of the squad car, I complain to one of the officers “why are they searching my car? That should be illegal.” There’s about 12-16 officers now searching my car inside and out. Looking at the pictures I took, going through my bowling ball bag, my carton with a 16 x 20 Smugmug print of Blue Angels F-18’s, my glove compartment, my phone, my TomTom. I’m being co-operative and sort of understand the reasoning behind the fear, but not the reaction, and I’m visibly shaken and upset and crying. When the officers ask why I’m crying I say, “I never expected to be handcuffed and in the back of a squad car”, (never having been handcuffed before, well except maybe once or twice by my wife). One of the officers tries to get me to calm down with the guise of wouldn’t you want to know your family is safe, your wife is safe on that plane, etc... I felt it was genuine but not soothing.
<o:p></o:p>
I’m told I’m being detained and bought in for questioning, not arrested, and this is procedure in this day and age after 9-11. Next, the police debate about who will drive his car to the precinct. One jokes, “I’m not driving it so it can blow up on me.” As out of a scene from a movie, of the 12 to 16 officers on the scene, the only black officer drives off w/ the possible car bomb. <o:p></o:p>
I’m taken to the precinct a few blocks away but it seems like a half an hour drive to me, crying, feeling humiliated, with people looking at him in the backseat, and just wanting to go home. Also knowing it’s Friday and I don’t want to somehow end up locked up all weekend for nothing, I want to be as cooperative as possible.
<o:p></o:p>
I give up all my possessions, my belt, my sneakers and I’m put in a holding cell to wait for questioning detectives.
<o:p></o:p>
After 2 hours in the precinct, detectives come to my holding cell to ask me about what’s going on. I explain again, I drove my wife to JFK because she’s going to <st1:City><st1:place>San Diego</st1:place></st1:City> for a conference. I like driving around looking for nice landscape views of the city. I used to live in the area so I figured I’d come look for a nice view. I’m also in a photography school. I didn’t see any signs that said private community or that I couldn’t take pictures, but when he told me I couldn’t I immediately stopped. I was very cordial the whole time.” I tell them my student ID is in my wallet and even give them my website. I’m asked again why I was crying and respond again, “I never expected to be handcuffed and in the back of a squad car”. The detectives visit the website quickly and within minutes I’m free to go with a summons at <st1:time Hour="12" Minute="30">12:30PM</st1:time>. The summons is a $115 ticket for “parking 6 ft from a fire hydrant” at <st1:time Hour="9" Minute="30">9:30AM</st1:time>. And I’m sure my name is on a terrorist watch list. Damon Anthony Khan. I was raised as "light skinned black" but am often confused between "Hispanic" and "Middle Eastern". This could obviously spark some concern. When they asked if I was a U.S. Citizen I assumed they have no idea what I am. The area is a mixed area I was shooting pics in.
<o:p></o:p>
I get in my car and look around. Everything is opened. They looked through my recent destinations on my GPS. Fortunately, my pictures are not deleted.
<o:p></o:p>
I drive back to the scene to make sure there is actually a fire hydrant. There is and lo and behold, there is also a woman pulled over in her van doing the same exact thing with a P & S!!!<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
These are the two I took:<o:p></o:p>
1. Telephoto:<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
2. Wide angle:<o:p></o:p>
The other 3 I deleted because they were underexposed.
http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=483577&postcount=29<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=53769&highlight=police<o:p></o:p>
http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=57725&highlight=police<o:p></o:p>
http://www.digitalgrin.com/showthread.php?t=58542<o:p></o:p>
The following story ties into the topic in the above threads, but I just feels deserves a different thread. This happened to me today.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
At <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:time Hour="7" Minute="0">7:00AM</st1:time> I drive to take my wife to JFK airport from <st1:City><st1:place>Manhattan</st1:place></st1:City> because she has a flight out at <st1:time Hour="8" Minute="45">8:45</st1:time>. Knowing that traffic will be horrible going back to Manhattan at 8 AM in the morning, I decide it would be a good idea to bring my lenses and camera and try and find a good view of the city/airport. Having lived 16 years in <st1:place>Queens</st1:place>, I have a great idea of where to go to get these pictures.
<o:p></o:p>
Knowing that I love taking pictures around the city and loving aviation, this is a perfect opportunity to find a good spot. Also having a shot idea for an assignment, I decide to trek around the vicinity of the airport. After I drop my wife off, I plug a position into his TomTom GPS that would appear to be a waterfront view of the city and possibly catch airplanes landing on their approach. Heading over to the position, I’m not satisfied. It’s a commercial area. So I plug in another location in the TomTom and head off again, but stop at Burger King to get some food on the way. When I get to the location, it’s exactly what I was hoping for but the sun is high and bright. I figure I can come back later with a tripod and get a nice sunset picture of the city and a night time picture. Sitting in my running car, pulled off to the side of the street, eating a crossanwich and drinking orange juice, I snap off a few pictures to get an idea of composition. People are driving by. The DEP is in the area. I’m not hiding my camera and I am sitting in the running car taking pictures. Then a cop car drives by while I’m parked and I have the camera in my lap and I’m taking my last bite of food. The cops drive by and then 2 minutes or so later come back and pull behind me. The officer comes up to the car and asks if I know why they are there. “No”, I say. The officer responds, “You are not allowed to be taking pictures of the airport.”
<o:p></o:p>
“Oh, I’m sorry. I was just enjoying the lovely view of the city and taking a couple pictures”, I say and gesture to the direction of the city. “You know you can’t be taking pictures of the airport from here. Since 9-11 this is a sensitive issue and they don’t want pictures of the airport being taken with a telephoto lens.” I respond, “Okay, no problem. I didn’t realize that would be an issue here. I take pictures all around the city all the time.” The officer asks how many pictures I took of the airport. I point and frame the area I took and tell the cop “a few”. The cop asks for my license, registration, and insurance card. I pull it out and the officers walk back to their car. I take the telephoto lens off the camera and go back to finish my OJ. After a few minutes, the officer comes back and asks if I have any outstanding warrants. I reply, “No.”
<o:p></o:p>
The officer walks back to his car. Comes back about a minute later and there are 4 cops now. I gesture to show the cop the pictures and my generic business card. The officer asks me to get out of the vehicle. I say okay and get out w/ no argument. I’m told to turn around and empty my pockets and put my hands behind my back.
<o:p></o:p>
The first two cops were white. One of the new cops is a black officer. These three officers ask me what I’m taking pictures of, why I’m taking them, what I’m doing in the area, where do I live, what does I do for a living, how long was I in the area, am I a U.S. citizen, etc. I answer all the questions voluntarily and quickly.
<o:p></o:p>
“I dropped my wife off at JFK… I’m taking pictures of this beautiful city as I always do, I used to live in the area and I figured this would be a good spot. I live in <st1:City><st1:place>Manhattan</st1:place></st1:City>,” blah blah blah…. Black officer asks if I have anything in the car that I shouldn’t have. “Just my camera sir, it’s over $3000 worth of equipment in there.”
<o:p></o:p>
Another 4 or 5 squad cars show now and he’s put in the back of a squad car while they search it. Tears rolling down my eyes in the back seat of the squad car, I complain to one of the officers “why are they searching my car? That should be illegal.” There’s about 12-16 officers now searching my car inside and out. Looking at the pictures I took, going through my bowling ball bag, my carton with a 16 x 20 Smugmug print of Blue Angels F-18’s, my glove compartment, my phone, my TomTom. I’m being co-operative and sort of understand the reasoning behind the fear, but not the reaction, and I’m visibly shaken and upset and crying. When the officers ask why I’m crying I say, “I never expected to be handcuffed and in the back of a squad car”, (never having been handcuffed before, well except maybe once or twice by my wife). One of the officers tries to get me to calm down with the guise of wouldn’t you want to know your family is safe, your wife is safe on that plane, etc... I felt it was genuine but not soothing.
<o:p></o:p>
I’m told I’m being detained and bought in for questioning, not arrested, and this is procedure in this day and age after 9-11. Next, the police debate about who will drive his car to the precinct. One jokes, “I’m not driving it so it can blow up on me.” As out of a scene from a movie, of the 12 to 16 officers on the scene, the only black officer drives off w/ the possible car bomb. <o:p></o:p>
I’m taken to the precinct a few blocks away but it seems like a half an hour drive to me, crying, feeling humiliated, with people looking at him in the backseat, and just wanting to go home. Also knowing it’s Friday and I don’t want to somehow end up locked up all weekend for nothing, I want to be as cooperative as possible.
<o:p></o:p>
I give up all my possessions, my belt, my sneakers and I’m put in a holding cell to wait for questioning detectives.
<o:p></o:p>
After 2 hours in the precinct, detectives come to my holding cell to ask me about what’s going on. I explain again, I drove my wife to JFK because she’s going to <st1:City><st1:place>San Diego</st1:place></st1:City> for a conference. I like driving around looking for nice landscape views of the city. I used to live in the area so I figured I’d come look for a nice view. I’m also in a photography school. I didn’t see any signs that said private community or that I couldn’t take pictures, but when he told me I couldn’t I immediately stopped. I was very cordial the whole time.” I tell them my student ID is in my wallet and even give them my website. I’m asked again why I was crying and respond again, “I never expected to be handcuffed and in the back of a squad car”. The detectives visit the website quickly and within minutes I’m free to go with a summons at <st1:time Hour="12" Minute="30">12:30PM</st1:time>. The summons is a $115 ticket for “parking 6 ft from a fire hydrant” at <st1:time Hour="9" Minute="30">9:30AM</st1:time>. And I’m sure my name is on a terrorist watch list. Damon Anthony Khan. I was raised as "light skinned black" but am often confused between "Hispanic" and "Middle Eastern". This could obviously spark some concern. When they asked if I was a U.S. Citizen I assumed they have no idea what I am. The area is a mixed area I was shooting pics in.
<o:p></o:p>
I get in my car and look around. Everything is opened. They looked through my recent destinations on my GPS. Fortunately, my pictures are not deleted.
<o:p></o:p>
I drive back to the scene to make sure there is actually a fire hydrant. There is and lo and behold, there is also a woman pulled over in her van doing the same exact thing with a P & S!!!<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
These are the two I took:<o:p></o:p>
1. Telephoto:<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>2. Wide angle:<o:p></o:p>
The other 3 I deleted because they were underexposed.
Canon 40D : Canon 400D : Canon Elan 7NE : Canon 580EX : 2 x Canon 430EX : Canon 24-70 f2.8L : Canon 70-200mm f/2.8L USM : Canon 28-135mm f/3.5 IS : 18-55mm f/3.5 : 4GB Sandisk Extreme III : 2GB Sandisk Extreme III : 2 x 1GB Sandisk Ultra II : Sekonik L358
dak.smugmug.com
dak.smugmug.com
0
Comments
It sucks this happened but there's really nothing we can do about it, in the day and age we live in having darker pigmentation in your skin is an acceptable cause for suspicion.
Nikon D300
Nikkor 85mm f/1.8D
Tamron 28-75 f/2.8
Nikkor 80-200 AF-D ED f/2.8
2 Alien Bees AB800
Nikon Speedlight SB800
Elinchrome Skyport Triggers
Sorry you went through that.
Dgrin FAQ | Me | Workshops
I can understand the cops questioning you but that's it. The way you were treated just pisses me off. I would contact my local NYC councilperson and file a complaint. I would fight the ticket in court.
I'm beginning to feel that the terrorists have won. I've been told by our "leaders" that they wanted to destroy our way of life and our freedoms. Looks like they have.
All my sympathy to you for what they unnecessarily put you through. I wonder how many folks got robbed while all those cops were searching your car.
BTW, terrorists don't have to take pictures of JFK that would be redundant
http://behret.smugmug.com/ NANPA member
How many photographers does it take to change a light bulb? 50. One to change the bulb, and forty-nine to say, "I could have done that better!"
Yup.
I was trying to avoid the "What you ougtta do" in my reply earlier, but really, if no one does anything about our freedoms being abridged, then no one's doing anything.
Dgrin FAQ | Me | Workshops
Law enforcers tell us that ignorance is not an excuse whenever we supposedly break the law, but what about their ignorance? Because it's either that or some cop stuck in a rut who desparately fantasizes about how he or she is going to be THE ONE to stop the next big terrorist attack by searching some random person's car (illegally!) and finding some sort of earth-shattering evidence.
The fact that they didn't delete your photos is proof-positive that you did absolutely nothing wrong at all. I encourage you to complain in a lucid and well-stated manner about the way you were treated...it is inexcusable and my heart goes out to you for having to go through that.
Gallery of mine...caution, it's under CONSTANT construction! | Photo Journal
In the right light, at the right time, everything is extraordinary. ~Aaron Rose
I'd be loud about this and not stop telling my story until someone listened.
Jesse
** Feel free to edit my photos if you see room for improvement.**
Use what talents you possess: the woods would be very silent if
no birds sang there except those that sang best.
~Henry Van Dyke
Get a lawyer. One of those tv advertising lawyers or another civil rights lawyer. They will tell you what if anything can be done, and get ride of that ticket.
www.zxstudios.com
http://creativedragonstudios.smugmug.com
I also think you ought to contact the New York Times and other newspapers.
The only effective way to fight this kind of police behavour is with public exposure by the folks who purchase their ink in 55 gallon drums. The powers that be at JFK and city hall do not want this widely read about in the local papers or on the local city television networks.
Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
My photos
"The future is an illusion, but a damned handy one." - David Allen