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Color calibration for backlit led displays?

Manfr3dManfr3d Registered Users Posts: 2,008 Major grins
edited May 17, 2007 in Digital Darkroom
Just a quick question for you hardware geeks out there:

Will a Pantone Huey be able to calibrate one of those
new backlit led displays? I just wanted to place my order
for the Huey Pro but since I'm also waiting for the new
MacBookPro to come out (which rumors to have such a
display) this could quickly become an issue for me.

Maybe I just have to wait ... :dunno
“To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
― Edward Weston

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    CatOneCatOne Registered Users Posts: 957 Major grins
    edited May 10, 2007
    Manfr3d wrote:
    Just a quick question for you hardware geeks out there:

    Will a Pantone Huey be able to calibrate one of those
    new backlit led displays? I just wanted to place my order
    for the Huey Pro but since I'm also waiting for the new
    MacBookPro to come out (which rumors to have such a
    display) this could quickly become an issue for me.

    Maybe I just have to wait ... ne_nau.gif

    Hehe. Planning based on rumor sites who are making inferences due to Apple's response to Greenpeace's extortion tactics... who knows how long you may be waiting.

    In theory though the calibration should be similar... calibration works by putting up known colors and seeing what the actual output is... so it should work with any display type (assuming the new displays are consistent across the panel, which one would assume they would need to be).
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    Manfr3dManfr3d Registered Users Posts: 2,008 Major grins
    edited May 10, 2007
    CatOne wrote:
    Hehe. Planning based on rumor sites who are making inferences due to Apple's response to Greenpeace's extortion tactics... who knows how long you may be waiting.

    In theory though the calibration should be similar... calibration works by putting up known colors and seeing what the actual output is... so it should work with any display type (assuming the new displays are consistent across the panel, which one would assume they would need to be).
    Okay, I'm waiting for the new mbp upgrade regardless of the display,
    but thought that it could be an issue if I buy a current colorimeter
    and end up with one of those new displays. Thanks!
    “To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
    ― Edward Weston
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    colourboxcolourbox Registered Users Posts: 2,095 Major grins
    edited May 10, 2007
    CatOne wrote:
    Hehe. Planning based on rumor sites who are making inferences due to Apple's response to Greenpeace's extortion tactics... who knows how long you may be waiting.

    This is not in response to Greenpeace. The rumors of Apple switching to LED-backlit displays started long before now. The environmentally friendly lack of mercury is a relatively minor consideration in switching to them. More compelling for marketing reasons is the fact that LED backlighting lasts longer, gives you brighter and more even color, and needs less power, which makes for longer battery life. And for once, that's not just good for marketing...those are characteristics we all want in our photo laptops.

    Some on the Web characterize the LED backlighting thing as an Apple knee-jerk reaction to Greenpeace and that's not only unfair but unrealistic, and probably the reverse of what actually happened. More likely, when Apple was putting a press release together they probably went around the company and asked if anyone had something they could add and the display group probably said "Well, these new displays we got in the pipeline don't have mercury anymore..." and PR probably said "Cool we'll add that in."

    As far as calibration, when display technology changes it's best to wait and see. I had to re-buy my calibrator when I switched from CRTs to LCDs because the old calibrator was simply not built for LCD characteristics. The new monitors are still LCDs, but the new light source may have some spectral "gotchas" that might require an update of hardware. I'm going to wait and see what the color geeks say when they get their hands on the new monitors and try to profile them with their calibrators.
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    wxwaxwxwax Registered Users Posts: 15,471 Major grins
    edited May 10, 2007
    CatOne wrote:
    Apple's response to Greenpeace's extortion tactics.
    lol3.gif
    Sid.
    Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
    http://www.mcneel.com/users/jb/foghorn/ill_shut_up.au
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    Mr. 2H2OMr. 2H2O Registered Users Posts: 427 Major grins
    edited May 10, 2007
    Hey guys, dig deep. You will need to find out Apple's specs for the tolerance on the spec for the color temp of the LEDs. They have to be binned in order to get anything close to each other. Someone has to create a spec detailing how different the color can be between the LEDs.eek7.gif

    Even if they are binned for color, they have to be binned again for current sensitivity and the drivers have to be flexible to drive each LED according to the minute differences in the current characteristics (thats electrical current, not chronological current mwink.gif).

    Those two factors will determine how the screen will respond to color calibration.

    - Mike
    Olympus E-30
    IR Modified Sony F717
    http://2H2OPhoto.smugmug.com
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    CatOneCatOne Registered Users Posts: 957 Major grins
    edited May 10, 2007
    colourbox wrote:
    This is not in response to Greenpeace. The rumors of Apple switching to LED-backlit displays started long before now. The environmentally friendly lack of mercury is a relatively minor consideration in switching to them. More compelling for marketing reasons is the fact that LED backlighting lasts longer, gives you brighter and more even color, and needs less power, which makes for longer battery life. And for once, that's not just good for marketing...those are characteristics we all want in our photo laptops.

    Some on the Web characterize the LED backlighting thing as an Apple knee-jerk reaction to Greenpeace and that's not only unfair but unrealistic, and probably the reverse of what actually happened. More likely, when Apple was putting a press release together they probably went around the company and asked if anyone had something they could add and the display group probably said "Well, these new displays we got in the pipeline don't have mercury anymore..." and PR probably said "Cool we'll add that in."

    As far as calibration, when display technology changes it's best to wait and see. I had to re-buy my calibrator when I switched from CRTs to LCDs because the old calibrator was simply not built for LCD characteristics. The new monitors are still LCDs, but the new light source may have some spectral "gotchas" that might require an update of hardware. I'm going to wait and see what the color geeks say when they get their hands on the new monitors and try to profile them with their calibrators.

    Well... yes and no it was in relation to Greenpeace. No it wasn't *because* of Greenpeace, but futures info was provided as a "for example" because it was a favorable data point for the women-who-rock-hairy-armpits set. Otherwise, rumors are rumors. I mean, how many rumors are there that never come to fruition? I can do a helluva lot better job prognosticating by throwing darts after 6 beers than most of the rumor sites can do. Seems they missed iLife '07 and iWork '07 no? In fact, they missed EVERYTHING about MacWorld 2007 *except* the iPhone which had been rumored for 2.5 years, so there you go.

    The thing with LCD versus CRT calibrators is true... but then again one of the biggest differences is that the CRT calibrators suck on to the screen like a 6th grader with his first french kiss. That damages LCD panels, which are not glass. We'll see how much the LED technologies differ from the LCD technologies... you have a color-calibrated ("white", though temp may vary -- see binning comment above... one of the reasons Apple displays cost more than Dells... consistency) backlight and then you have cells that obscure the light. As long as you can fire 6500K from the back, they should be pretty much identical. I say this conceptually, as I've never seen one of these newfangled products yet.

    And know I'm not attacking you nor am I attacking Apple, I'm just sayin', it wasn't a foregone conclusion these things were coming one way or another until the disclosure in Steve's "open letter" to the peoples' republic of patchoulli.
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    colourboxcolourbox Registered Users Posts: 2,095 Major grins
    edited May 10, 2007
    CatOne wrote:
    And know I'm not attacking you nor am I attacking Apple, I'm just sayin', it wasn't a foregone conclusion these things were coming one way or another until the disclosure in Steve's "open letter" to the peoples' republic of patchoulli.

    Don't worry, I perceived no attack at all. I do believe it was a foregone conclusion the new displays were coming, because the practical/technical/marketing benefits are so strong and the competition is doing it; I think Apple needed to bring those features to its target audience even if Greenpeace hadn't existed.
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    David_S85David_S85 Administrators Posts: 13,210 moderator
    edited May 10, 2007
    CatOne wrote:
    Well... yes and no it was in relation to Greenpeace. No it wasn't *because* of Greenpeace, but futures info was provided as a "for example" because it was a favorable data point for the women-who-rock-hairy-armpits set. ...

    The thing with LCD versus CRT calibrators is true... but then again one of the biggest differences is that the CRT calibrators suck on to the screen like a 6th grader with his first french kiss. ...

    ... I'm just sayin', it wasn't a foregone conclusion these things were coming one way or another until the disclosure in Steve's "open letter" to the peoples' republic of patchoulli.

    This thread is getting fun to read. rolleyes1.gif
    My Smugmug
    "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky
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    cabbeycabbey Registered Users Posts: 1,053 Major grins
    edited May 17, 2007
    CatOne wrote:
    As long as you can fire 6500K from the back, they should be pretty much identical. I say this conceptually, as I've never seen one of these newfangled products yet.

    Never seen an iPod then? They've been LED back lit since day 1, and the video ones clearly paid more attention to the quality of that backlight than the previous generation. My 3G iPod for example quite clearly has 4 LEDs beside the display, whereas a co-worker's newer video iPod is very smoothly illuminated.
    SmugMug Sorcerer - Engineering Team Champion for Commerce, Finance, Security, and Data Support
    http://wall-art.smugmug.com/
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