2 known colors, how do i calibrate?

i_worship_the_Kingi_worship_the_King Registered Users Posts: 548 Major grins
edited October 4, 2007 in Digital Darkroom
I took a print of an image and linked up what the computer says is the CMYK color and what the printed CMYK appeared as on the paper.

What the computer says: 100/0/60/0
What that looks like printed: 44/20/48/62

Anyone know how to make the monitor match the print? (Photoshop CS)

Thank you so much... I just hope this all makes sense to someone...
I make it policy to never let ignorance stand in the way of my opinion. ~Justiceiro

"Your decisions on whether to buy, when to buy and what to buy should depend on careful consideration of your needs primarily, with a little of your wants thrown in for enjoyment, After all photography is a hobby, even for pros."
~Herbert Keppler

Comments

  • SloYerRollSloYerRoll Registered Users Posts: 2,788 Major grins
    edited October 2, 2007
    i_worship_the_King wrote:
    I took a print of an image and linked up what the computer says is the CMYK color and what the printed CMYK appeared as on the paper.

    What the computer says: 100/0/60/0
    What that looks like printed: 44/20/48/62

    Anyone know how to make the monitor match the print? (Photoshop CS)

    Thank you so much... I just hope this all makes sense to someone...
    Sounds like your print profile and color space aren't gellin. Adobe CS2 defaults to US web coated (SWOP) v2 which is an inherrant problem to begin with since none of the papers you print on an inkjet are coated papers. (Coated paper gives more pop and also adds a very complicated addition to an already confusing problem.

    Do a forum search for color management. You'll get more than you know what to do w/.

    On a side note. Why are you printing CMYK and not just sticking w/ an RGB profile?
  • i_worship_the_Kingi_worship_the_King Registered Users Posts: 548 Major grins
    edited October 2, 2007
    The best priced printer prints in CMYK. I don't ask questions, I just convert to CMYK & email to the editor...
    I make it policy to never let ignorance stand in the way of my opinion. ~Justiceiro

    "Your decisions on whether to buy, when to buy and what to buy should depend on careful consideration of your needs primarily, with a little of your wants thrown in for enjoyment, After all photography is a hobby, even for pros."
    ~Herbert Keppler
  • SloYerRollSloYerRoll Registered Users Posts: 2,788 Major grins
    edited October 3, 2007
    It's a free country so feel free to disregard this advise. But I was in large format digital (and other) printing for many years and have allot of expercience in this field.

    This may sound abrasive, but please know that's not my intention.

    You NEVER want to just send a digital file to a printer. Unless you both creator and printer have a managed color space and/or are able to repeatedly produce acceptable results.

    You should really be sending your digital images to the 'editor' on a CD w/ a sample print for them to color match to. So what they do is print a small version of the job, compare colors in a light box then adjust accordingly. Any reputable printer will find this to be a standard workflow and won't bat an eye if you do this.

    If adjustments need to be made on your side. They should clearly tell you their expectations. Not just print the job and ship it.

    Your editor may have an expensive printer. But the gear is only as good as the operator.

    -Jon
  • i_worship_the_Kingi_worship_the_King Registered Users Posts: 548 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2007
    ^Now that's some valuable information! I'll definitely be looking into shipping them some test prints. I contacted their editor to find out what color profiles they're using so I can at least set that up, but I never even thought of test prints.

    I guess the real problem with that is that we don't have a nice color printer that can put out some great prints for them to color check.

    Since the printer is printing on newsprint should I also print on a standard paper, or should I send them on photo paper?

    Thanks again for all the help!
    I make it policy to never let ignorance stand in the way of my opinion. ~Justiceiro

    "Your decisions on whether to buy, when to buy and what to buy should depend on careful consideration of your needs primarily, with a little of your wants thrown in for enjoyment, After all photography is a hobby, even for pros."
    ~Herbert Keppler
  • SloYerRollSloYerRoll Registered Users Posts: 2,788 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2007
    i_worship_the_King wrote:
    ^I guess the real problem with that is that we don't have a nice color printer that can put out some great prints for them to color check.
    It doesn't matter if you have a nice color printer or not. Sounds like these printers aren't breaking out the spectrometers every time they get a sample print. All you need to do is have the colors output on your print look acceptable to you. Then they will need to color match that.
    If they start talking about color density. Tell them to stop because you only used a desktop printer and there's not acurate color density coming fromyour machine. (don't sweat what this is unless they ask, then come back and ask me)
    i_worship_the_King wrote:
    ^Since the printer is printing on newsprint should I also print on a standard paper, or should I send them on photo paper?
    I'll say standard paper, even though I feel it doesn't matter. It's all relative. May as well simulate the print environment as much as possible eh?

    One big thing you are going to want to do is look at your colors in the best possible light environment. If your inside you home office and looking at a print w/ a desk lamp of some crappy bulb that's about to burn out. The color may look great to you. BUt when someone looks at it in daylight or in a light box. It will look worlds apart. You may want to include in your print a blurb about how you color proofed this print in natural daylight or under flourescent bulbs (whatever the case) that way they have a fighting chance of matching what your talking about.

    Hope this proved useful.

    -Jon
  • arodneyarodney Registered Users Posts: 2,005 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2007
    i_worship_the_King wrote:
    I took a print of an image and linked up what the computer says is the CMYK color and what the printed CMYK appeared as on the paper.

    What the computer says: 100/0/60/0
    What that looks like printed: 44/20/48/62

    I'm not totally sure I understand your question.

    If you have a CMYK value that produces a certain color appearance on screen, its totally normal, in fact necessary to produce a different set of values going out to a printer to match that color. One device is an RGB emissive display, the other a reflective print using some kind of substraight (paper) and ink or dye, or toner. Color management's job is to make the correct and new CMYK or RGB values to produce a color appearance you expect on any or all devices.

    What printer are you using, do you have an output profile for this device that describes its color space (how it produces color)? Is your display calibrated and profiled? Without both, you have no hope in getting these two very dissimilar devices to match color appearance.
    Andrew Rodney
    Author "Color Management for Photographers"
    http://www.digitaldog.net/
  • i_worship_the_Kingi_worship_the_King Registered Users Posts: 548 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2007
    I have my display calibrated and profiled, and I'm waiting on the info back from the printer...

    What I did was put that color into photoshop (a big greenish square) then took that same square that was printed in the last issue and compared the two. When I found a color that was extremely close to what I saw on the page I wrote down the CMYK values.

    SO, what my computer says is 100/0/60/0 when printed looks like 44/20/48/62. I want the two to look the same - don't care how or why, just want it fixed. or close. I can deal with close...
    I make it policy to never let ignorance stand in the way of my opinion. ~Justiceiro

    "Your decisions on whether to buy, when to buy and what to buy should depend on careful consideration of your needs primarily, with a little of your wants thrown in for enjoyment, After all photography is a hobby, even for pros."
    ~Herbert Keppler
  • arodneyarodney Registered Users Posts: 2,005 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2007
    i_worship_the_King wrote:
    I have my display calibrated and profiled, and I'm waiting on the info back from the printer...

    What I did was put that color into photoshop (a big greenish square) then took that same square that was printed in the last issue and compared the two. When I found a color that was extremely close to what I saw on the page I wrote down the CMYK values.

    SO, what my computer says is 100/0/60/0 when printed looks like 44/20/48/62. I want the two to look the same - don't care how or why, just want it fixed. or close. I can deal with close...

    Without a printer profile that defines the print conditions, forget it.
    Andrew Rodney
    Author "Color Management for Photographers"
    http://www.digitaldog.net/
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