LPS14 Worth pursuing? (Zamboni)

PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
edited October 14, 2007 in The Dgrin Challenges
I will try to reshoot this to see if I can get something that is better. I was fighting the extreamly low light level in the rink (only about a 1/4 of the lights were on).

#1- Ice Maker

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#2 - World's Best Job

205974797-L.jpg

I'm trying to embrace the grain here but not sure it's really working for me. Please let me know what you think...Thanks!

paul

Comments

  • HoofClixHoofClix Registered Users Posts: 1,156 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    I like the direction and story told by the first one, in color. The second tells the story of the lone Zambonier more than that of the ice..

    Nice!
    Mark
    www.HoofClix.com / Personal Facebook / Facebook Page
    and I do believe its true.. that there are roads left in both of our shoes..
  • richterslrichtersl Registered Users Posts: 3,322 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    HoofClix wrote:
    I like the direction and story told by the first one, in color. The second tells the story of the lone Zambonier more than that of the ice..

    Nice!

    15524779-Ti.gif
    Linda

    http://lrichters.smugmug.com
  • TravisTravis Registered Users Posts: 1,472 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    Arggghhhh, Paul what are you doing? I was at the ice rink yesterday doing some scouting for a photo to shoot later this week! rolleyes1.gif#1 is my fave out of the 2. I like the composition. It is hard for me to comment on colors, etc because I'm on my work pc and the monitor is horrible.
    Travis Owney Photography
    My Images | My Lessons Learned and Other Adventures
  • LlywellynLlywellyn Registered Users, Retired Mod Posts: 3,186 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    Man...I prefer #2 for composition and treatment, but I have to agree its focus is more on the man than the smoothness of the ice. So you can ignore my preference. rolleyes1.gif

    For the first, the softness of it detracts from the image for me. If the bottom of the zamboni could be sharper, it might appeal to me more. The color actually isn't doing much for me, even on my calibrated monitor. Can't pinpoint why yet, but it may have something to do with the zamboni itself being so dark that it's almost negative space and makes the ice and yellow edge look washed out in comparison. ne_nau.gif
  • PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    Travis wrote:
    Arggghhhh, Paul what are you doing? I was at the ice rink yesterday doing some scouting for a photo to shoot later this week! rolleyes1.gif#1 is my fave out of the 2. I like the composition. It is hard for me to comment on colors, etc because I'm on my work pc and the monitor is horrible.

    Travis (and others) I know you were kind of kidding, but please don't avoid Zamboni shots just because I happened to post one here for comment. In fact I would welcome other (probably better) interpretations from other folks. Hey, maybe we could have a Zamboni Shootout...at any rate, don't feel like you'll be stepping on my toes if you decide to pursue the elusive Zamboni. I may not use it anyway (unless I can't get a better shot) as I've got a half dozen other ideas percolating (but not much free time to develop them).


    Thanks for your feed back everyone.
    paul
  • TravisTravis Registered Users Posts: 1,472 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    PaulThomasMcKee wrote:
    Travis (and others) I know you were kind of kidding, but please don't avoid Zamboni shots just because I happened to post one here for comment.

    :D Don't worry, if I could come up with a good one, I would post it. Laughing.gif

    Now that I can see yours on a different monitor, it looks like there is a lot of color noise in #1 (especially in the blue of the zamboni). It is still my favorite composition. Is it possible to reshoot it? I'm guessing that it was a fairly low light situation and required either a high ISO or liberal use of exposure compensation in PP.
    Travis Owney Photography
    My Images | My Lessons Learned and Other Adventures
  • PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    Travis wrote:
    Is it possible to reshoot it? I'm guessing that it was a fairly low light situation and required either a high ISO or liberal use of exposure compensation in PP.

    I went back again today and it is just too dark (wish they'd turn on some more lights!) with my current lens f3.5-5.6 and D200 to get a good shot of the Zamboni as it is moving - I have to shoot at ISO 1000-1600 or higher and I just can't seem to get a good clear image. I haven't completely given up on it, but I may move on to my next idea...

    paul
  • sherstonesherstone Registered Users, Retired Mod Posts: 2,356 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    possibly a stupid question... Do Zambonis actually make ice or just smooth it out?

    I agree with the others #1 is strongest on theme - I dont think noise is something that you need to worry about in this competition as long as it doesnt detract from the image and in this case I don't think it does.
    Sean
  • PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    sherstone wrote:
    possibly a stupid question... Do Zambonis actually make ice or just smooth it out?

    I agree with the others #1 is strongest on theme - I dont think noise is something that you need to worry about in this competition as long as it doesnt detract from the image and in this case I don't think it does.

    Sean,

    I'm not an expert, but the way it seems that a Zamboni smooths out the ice is by shaving a thin layer off the top and then laying down an nice even layer of water over the top that freezes to make a brand new top layer of ice.

    Is the plural of Zamboni Zambonis or Zambonii?

    Thanks for weighing in on the noise issue. I'm not overly distraught by the noise on this particular shot. But I do worry that others (perhaps a judge) will see it as a detractor due to poor technical quality. I don't know much about how reduce it in PP - When folks speak of the blue channel etc. my eyes glaze over.

    Here's the EXIF for the first picture. It was taken hand-held at f5.6, ISO1250 & 1/20th second. There were a lot of other pictures from that shoot that were just way blurry.

    Thanks
    paul
  • sherstonesherstone Registered Users, Retired Mod Posts: 2,356 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    PaulThomasMcKee wrote:
    Sean,

    I'm not an expert, but the way it seems that a Zamboni smooths out the ice is by shaving a thin layer off the top and then laying down an nice even layer of water over the top that freezes to make a brand new top layer of ice.

    Is the plural of Zamboni Zambonis or Zambonii?
    paul

    Well... since the question was in my head I decided to do the research
    and you are indeed correct - I just love this giant encyclopedia called the internet mwink.gif

    http://www.zamboni.com/images2/How%20it%20works%20copy2.gif
    Sean
  • HoofClixHoofClix Registered Users Posts: 1,156 Major grins
    edited October 9, 2007
    sherstone wrote:
    possibly a stupid question... Do Zambonis actually make ice or just smooth it out?

    Not Stupid! A philosophical question, if not more specifically, existential....

    Both! The Zamboni takes what was once both craggy and frozen, then melts it, then magically makes it all of a sudden both frozen and smooth.......
    Mark
    www.HoofClix.com / Personal Facebook / Facebook Page
    and I do believe its true.. that there are roads left in both of our shoes..
  • richterslrichtersl Registered Users Posts: 3,322 Major grins
    edited October 10, 2007
    PaulThomasMcKee wrote:
    Sean,

    I'm not an expert, but the way it seems that a Zamboni smooths out the ice is by shaving a thin layer off the top and then laying down an nice even layer of water over the top that freezes to make a brand new top layer of ice.

    Is the plural of Zamboni Zambonis or Zambonii?

    Thanks for weighing in on the noise issue. I'm not overly distraught by the noise on this particular shot. But I do worry that others (perhaps a judge) will see it as a detractor due to poor technical quality. I don't know much about how reduce it in PP - When folks speak of the blue channel etc. my eyes glaze over.

    Here's the EXIF for the first picture. It was taken hand-held at f5.6, ISO1250 & 1/20th second. There were a lot of other pictures from that shoot that were just way blurry.

    Thanks
    paul

    You can try this to shoot at a higher ISO with the instructions below. It doesn't work all the time but it may get you over the hurdle. You need to shoot RAW in order for this to work.

    1. Set the camera to manual mode and the ISO setting to 400 or 800 (if the latter is not too noise-ridden on your camera).

    2. Open the aperture up. Your shutter speed is going to be slow, I know!

    3. Now start playing with your shutter speed until you see that the photo is only about 1-2 stops underexposed. If that gets you a shutter speed of 1/25 or 1/30 or more it should yield a decent hand-held shot in low light.

    4. Recoup underexposed details with your RAW editor.

    It doesn't work under all conditions, though. I've had success with this at a friend's wedding ceremony where flashes were not allowed.
    Linda

    http://lrichters.smugmug.com
  • PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
    edited October 10, 2007
    richtersl wrote:
    You can try this to shoot at a higher ISO with the instructions below. It doesn't work all the time but it may get you over the hurdle. You need to shoot RAW in order for this to work.

    1. Set the camera to manual mode and the ISO setting to 400 or 800 (if the latter is not too noise-ridden on your camera).

    2. Open the aperture up. Your shutter speed is going to be slow, I know!

    3. Now start playing with your shutter speed until you see that the photo is only about 1-2 stops underexposed. If that gets you a shutter speed of 1/25 or 1/30 or more it should yield a decent hand-held shot in low light.

    4. Recoup underexposed details with your RAW editor.

    It doesn't work under all conditions, though. I've had success with this at a friend's wedding ceremony where flashes were not allowed.

    Thanks Linda! That sounds like it might help! I'll give it a try this afternoon and report back.

    The folks at the ice rink are going to wonder "who's the crazy guy that shows up every day to take pictures of the Zamboni?" There's a group of serious figure skaters that practice at the rink at the time that I have been showing up, and both days one of them asked if I was from the local paper - I think hoping for some publicity.

    paul
  • TravisTravis Registered Users Posts: 1,472 Major grins
    edited October 10, 2007
    PaulThomasMcKee wrote:
    The folks at the ice rink are going to wonder "who's the crazy guy that shows up every day to take pictures of the Zamboni?" There's a group of serious figure skaters that practice at the rink at the time that I have been showing up, and both days one of them asked if I was from the local paper - I think hoping for some publicity.

    paul

    Funny, when I showed up to the rink, they looked at me like "who's the creepy guy with the camera?" Thats when I decided that I was better of coming back at a later time. rolleyes1.gifroflrolleyes1.gif
    Travis Owney Photography
    My Images | My Lessons Learned and Other Adventures
  • indiegirlindiegirl Registered Users Posts: 930 Major grins
    edited October 13, 2007
    How'd it go, Paul?
    main | recent work |
  • PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
    edited October 13, 2007
    indiegirl wrote:
    How'd it go, Paul?

    It went well...I think. I went to a Silvertips game and was able to get right down at the level of the ice to take a few pictures. The lighting was quite a bit better and I rented a 70-200mm f2.8 which also helped out enormously. I'm hoping to have something to post here for you folks to help me out with later tonight. My wife and I are off to a Tango class right now...

    Later,

    paul
  • PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
    edited October 14, 2007
    Zamboni - Part Deux
    I thought I was going to be able to get back to the rink earlier in the week but meetings got in the way and it had to wait 'til Friday. I think it worked out for the best as it gave me time to rent a faster lens and the game night lights were on in the rink.

    I like the Zamboni and ice for this theme because it encompasses three forms of the word "Smooth" - noun, verb and adjective.

    Below are a few of my favorites from the Friday night shoot. I like #1 Best because of the composition and colors and #2 because of the additional context and wider view of the ice. What do you guys think? (no opportunity to reshoot)

    1.
    207477657-M.jpg

    2.
    207476874-M.jpg

    3.
    207839578-M.jpg

    4.
    207470961-M.jpg
  • richterslrichtersl Registered Users Posts: 3,322 Major grins
    edited October 14, 2007
    Nice series! thumb.gif

    Of all of them #2 and #3 are my favorites. The reflections in the ice are very pleasing to look at and give the photos a nice sense of balance. The definitely say "smooth" to me. #1's colors are really pretty and so is the composition, but to me the combination seems to upstage the smooth ice. ne_nau.gif
    Linda

    http://lrichters.smugmug.com
  • richterslrichtersl Registered Users Posts: 3,322 Major grins
    edited October 14, 2007
    PaulThomasMcKee wrote:
    ... I rented a 70-200mm f2.8 which also helped out enormously...

    You rented a lens for these eek7.gif ? Holy cow!!! rolleyes1.gif
    Linda

    http://lrichters.smugmug.com
  • sherstonesherstone Registered Users, Retired Mod Posts: 2,356 Major grins
    edited October 14, 2007
    I tend to agree with you Paul - #1 is just grand when it comes to color and comp, Linda does have a point but I see the rink board and people doing the same thing in #2, even though they do add context I cannot get over how much the blue and yellow along with the smooth ice logo all work so well together in #1.
    Sean
  • PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
    edited October 14, 2007
    richtersl wrote:
    You rented a lens for these eek7.gif ? Holy cow!!! rolleyes1.gif

    I did. But it's only 25 bucks (from Glazer's in Seattle) and I get to keep it from 3pm Friday 'til 10am Monday for that price. I didn't rent it just for the Zamboni shot. I used it yesterday morning to shoot my nephew's soccer game and then later in the afternoon, Miles (my son), used it to shoot a rugby game that one of his college mates was playing in.

    I have been wanting to see what kind of a difference a pro-quality fast lens would make. For the most part I'm quite content with my 18-200 VR. But when the light is low, the faster apeture pays off in spades.

    As I look at these this morning, I think I might agree that #2 is the better shot for the theme. Thanks for your response.

    paul
  • PaulThomasMcKeePaulThomasMcKee Registered Users Posts: 429 Major grins
    edited October 14, 2007
    sherstone wrote:
    I tend to agree with you Paul - #1 is just grand when it comes to color and comp, Linda does have a point but I see the rink board and people doing the same thing in #2, even though they do add context I cannot get over how much the blue and yellow along with the smooth ice logo all work so well together in #1.

    Thanks Sean, my abstract tendancy pulls me more toward #1 too. And I do think there is enough context in it so that nobody will be guessing at what it is. I'll let it settle for a while today and pick one this afternoon.

    paul
  • HoofClixHoofClix Registered Users Posts: 1,156 Major grins
    edited October 14, 2007
    PaulThomasMcKee wrote:
    I'll let it settle for a while today and pick one this afternoon.

    paul

    Then... enter at 11:59:59 right on your schedule!rolleyes1.gif
    Mark
    www.HoofClix.com / Personal Facebook / Facebook Page
    and I do believe its true.. that there are roads left in both of our shoes..
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