D40x overexposing by A LOT!!

Rhuarc

So my mom is using a D40x that my grandfather was using as a backup body. It has an 18-128 on it. She recently took the camera on a cruise. She is only shooting in Automatic everything, as she doesn't really know too much about the ins and outs of it. She said some of the scenery pictures she was taking were looking really bright on the viewfinder. When she got back and uploaded them to the computer she had me take a look at them. Things look bad! There are pictures that are overexposed to the point that things are almost pure white in some of them. I've tried to check the settings in EXIF and thigns don't seems to be bad enough to overexpose that much. Now comes the kicker, my Mom said that before they left for the cruise the camera got knocked off of a counter onto a carpet floor. She said she picked it up and tried taking pictures with it and it seemed to be ok so she didn't worry about it. On the trip she said there were times when the camera didn't want to take any pictures, and she had to turn the camera off and back on in order to get it to take.

My question is, has anyone ever experienced this problem? Could a camera overexposing some but not all pictures by something like 5 stops be explained by a fall? I was searching for precedence and the only thing I could find was this: (1) Don?t drop or bang the camera (a) use Yellowstone dropped camera ex where it was overexposing by 5 stops at Digital Nature Photography. It seems that in writing this book he is talking about not bumping the camera and he is going to use an exampole where a camera was overexposing by 5 stops after it was dropped or knocked.

I'm really hopeing someone here can offer some advice! I'm uploading all teh shots to a smugmug gallery right now so once they are up I will post the link here. I'm wondering if peopl can take a look at them and let me know if the exposure settings seem ok. I looked and the settings don't seem like they would overexpose s regular landscape by that much.

Thank you everyone!

Edit: Here is one example I have available right now. The EXIF should be available on it as well.

jonh68

Without having the camera and taking pictures with it, I would say the problem is having it "automatic mode". If she was focusing on a person and the baclkground was very bright, the camera will expose for the darker areas and blow out the background. Automatic mode is made for quick shots, but not very good for exposing for background in situations like this. They tend to expose for the darker areas and this is what happens.

It could be the fault of the camera, but I doubt it. You need to get the camera in the more programmable modes to really tell. It seems to me the camera was just doing what it was supposed to do in that mode.

Rhuarc

Normally I would agree with you, but take a look at the photo I just attached. Nothing in the forground, just a generic cityscape. Is the Auto mode really so dumb as to overexpose that bad when there is nothing in the foreground? I mean on the shots that over exposed there is NOTHING correctly exposed!

jonh68

It shouldn't be that bad. Was it in automatic mode for sure? I have taken badly exposed pictures like that thinking it was in one mode, but find out I was in a different one set for low light etc.

Seymore

Usually there a pin-hole reset on Nikon digi-cams that only needs the end of an open paper-clip to reset. You may want to check the manual and see where this is on the D40x and what they have to say about the process. Sometimes you also have to remove the battery.

If this don't fix it, warranty is in order...

Oh, and check this with another lens, if you can. Could be sticky aperture blades not letting the lens stop down.

Keep us posted...

ps: drop me an email if I can help. Just a quick phone call a few miles south...

Rhuarc

Hmm, thanks for the suggestions Seymore, I'll hav eto check this stuff out. I'll def look into resetting everything back to factory defaults. As far as if it was shot in full Auto or not I don't know, I am assuming so. Have you taken a look at the EXIF on that shot? Does the EXIF show what happened for it to be so blown out, or does the EXIF look ok and the shot is blown out anyway? Also, could the apeture blades stick sometimes, but not all the time? The camera seemed to work more often on indoor shots, but not on outdoor shots. I suppose that could be because in Auto the camera was trying to stop down outside, and was showing in the EXIF that it was stopped down, but the apeture blades werren't actually stopped down. Then the same apeture inside resulted in an ok image.

I think we might eb getting somewhere! Any other ideas?

Edit: Oh, and you said to check it with another lens, I guess sticky aperture would be something that would be a lens problem, not a problem with the body wouldn't it?

Seymore

Rhuarc wrote:

Hmm, thanks for the suggestions Seymore, I'll hav eto check this stuff out. I'll def look into resetting everything back to factory defaults. As far as if it was shot in full Auto or not I don't know, I am assuming so. Have you taken a look at the EXIF on that shot? Does the EXIF show what happened for it to be so blown out, or does the EXIF look ok and the shot is blown out anyway?

Thinking about it, I doubt if it's the cam. What lens was being used? Kit lens? Nikon? 3rd party lens? BTW, the EXIF looks ok, and this is what prompts me to think it's the lens. (read down)

Rhuarc wrote:

Also, could the apeture blades stick sometimes, but not all the time? The camera seemed to work more often on indoor shots, but not on outdoor shots. I suppose that could be because in Auto the camera was trying to stop down outside, and was showing in the EXIF that it was stopped down, but the apeture blades werren't actually stopped down. Then the same apeture inside resulted in an ok image.

Well, when you're indoors, the aperture is usually wide open anyhow. If you understand how Nikon lenses work... When focusing, ect, the aperture is wide open. Right before the shutter opens, and while the mirror is going up, the lens stops down. If the aperture blades are sticky, it will not stop down where the aperture should be and the shot over exposes.

Rhuarc wrote:

I think we might eb getting somewhere! Any other ideas?
Yep... Seriously, get another lens and do more outside shots.

Rhuarc wrote:

Edit: Oh, and you said to check it with another lens, I guess sticky aperture would be something that would be a lens problem, not a problem with the body wouldn't it?

Exactly. This will rule out lens or body as the problem.

Rhuarc

Seymore wrote:

Thinking about it, I doubt if it's the cam. What lens was being used? Kit lens? Nikon? 3rd party lens? BTW, the EXIF looks ok, and this is what prompts me to think it's the lens. (read down)



Well, when you're indoors, the aperture is usually wide open anyhow. If you understand how Nikon lenses work... When focusing, ect, the aperture is wide open. Right before the shutter opens, and while the mirror is going up, the lens stops down. If the aperture blades are sticky, it will not stop down where the aperture should be and the shot over exposes.

Rhuarc wrote:

I think we might eb getting somewhere! Any other ideas?
Yep... Seriously, get another lens and do more outside shots.



Exactly. This will rule out lens or body as the problem.

THe lens being used was a 18-135 I believe. So if it is a case of a sticky apeture blade then the camera would still report the correct settings that it thought it used, it is just the lens wasn't obeying the commands to stop down. As far as the camera and the EXIF are concerned though it did stop down, which is why the EXIF looks ok. I will have my mom try out a different lens outside, and then try out this lens again outside and compare. If it is just a sticky apeture blade is that something that would normally be covered under warranty and we should just contact Nikon about?

Thanks for the help!

ziggy53

The EXIF for the above shot:

Make - NIKON CORPORATION
Model - NIKON D40X
XResolution - 133.75
YResolution - 133.75
ResolutionUnit - Inch
Software - Adobe Photoshop Elements 5.0
DateTime - 2007:11:04 21:12:51
YCbCrPositioning - Co-Sited
ExifOffset - 218
ExposureTime - 1/200 seconds
FNumber - 10.00
ExposureProgram - Not defined
ISOSpeedRatings - 200
ExifVersion - 0221
DateTimeOriginal - 2007:05:24 03:55:36
DateTimeDigitized - 2007:05:24 03:55:36
ComponentsConfiguration - YCbCr
CompressedBitsPerPixel - 4 (bits/pixel)
ExposureBiasValue - 0.00
MaxApertureValue - F 4.76
MeteringMode - Multi-segment
LightSource - Auto
Flash - Flash not fired, compulsory flash mode
FocalLength - 50.00 mm
SubsecTimeDigitized - 40
FlashPixVersion - 0100
ColorSpace - sRGB
ExifImageWidth - 800
ExifImageHeight - 535
InteroperabilityOffset - 3442
SensingMethod - One-chip color area sensor
FileSource - Other
SceneType - Other
CustomRendered - Normal process
ExposureMode - Auto
White Balance - Auto
DigitalZoomRatio - 1 x
FocalLengthIn35mmFilm - 75 mm
SceneCaptureType - Landscape
GainControl - None
Contrast - Normal
Saturation - Normal
Sharpness - Hard
SubjectDistanceRange - Unknown

Maker Note (Vendor): -
Data version - 0210 (808595760)
ISO Setting - 200
Color Mode - COLOR
Image Quality - FINE
White Balance - AUTO
Image Sharpening - AUTO
Focus Mode - AF-A
Flash Setting -
Flash Mode -
White Balance Adjustment - 0
White Balance RB - 668
Exposure Adjustment - 68608
Thumbnail IFD offset - 2694
Flash Compensation - 67072
ISO 2 - 200
Tone Compensation - AUTO
Lens type - AF-D G
Lens - 748
Flash Used - Not fired
AF Focus Position - 33554433
Bracketing - 0
Color Mode - MODE3a
Light Type - NATURAL
Hue Adjustment - 0
Noise Reduction - OFF
Total pictures - 106
Optimization -

Thumbnail: -
Compression - 6 (JPG)
XResolution - 72
YResolution - 72
ResolutionUnit - Inch
JpegIFOffset - 3582
JpegIFByteCount - 4781

ziggy53

You won't know whether it is the camera or the lens until you start eliminating through substitution. Do what Seymore suggested and try a different lens on that camera first, but also get another body to try the lens on, just so you can verify the results. It could be (potentially) both camera and lens.

Rhuarc

Well, I just talked to my mom and I had her check the pictures and do a few tests. Here are a few things I found out:

1) Out of the pictures she took, the only properly exposed ones are below f7.1, anything over that gets progressivley more overexposed as the fstop goes higher. We verified that every properly, or close to properly exposed pictures was either indoors, or other lower light situations, and that all the overexposed were in fairly high light situations.

2) I had her do a few test shots in Av mode starting at wide open, and stopping down one click each shot. She said as she went the shutter stayed open longer and longer, and that the higher the fstop number the brighter the picture got. By f8 and f9 the shot was so bright she couldn't make anything out.

3) I am going to have her get my grandpa's other camera and lenses. He has a D200 and several lenses. This way we can test other lenses on the D40x to verify the body is ok, and we will test the "faulty" lens on the D200 to verify thatit still works incorrectly.

Assuming after testing we verify that it seems to be a problem with only that lens overexposing as it stops down should we then contact Nikon? I know the lens is still under warranty. When I contact them would I just explain the situation and tell them what I have found when taking pictures and my suspisions of the apeture being stuck?

I just want to thank everyone for their help! Makes me so glad to be a part of somewhere like DGrin!

Seymore

Once you've determined the problem, contact Nikon (Tel: +1-800-NIKON-UX
(+1-800-645-6689)), explain the problem, the trouble shooting you went thru and see if they have any other suggestions. If they say "yep, that's sounds like it", ship the problem back to them for repair.

Now, if you only bought the problem item a few months ago... and locally, you could also take it back there for a replacement and let them deal with the warranty. Just make sure you still have all the boxes, packing material, paperworks, ect...

BTW, I would also suggest using the lens (18-135) on the D200 and see if the shots over expose stopped down on that bod also. This will just confirm the lens, if it is actually the culprit.


Keep us posted with the test results...

Rhuarc

Seymore wrote:

Once you've determined the problem, contact Nikon (Tel: +1-800-NIKON-UX
(+1-800-645-6689)), explain the problem, the trouble shooting you went thru and see if they have any other suggestions. If they say "yep, that's sounds like it", ship the problem back to them for repair.

Now, if you only bought the problem item a few months ago... and locally, you could also take it back there for a replacement and let them deal with the warranty. Just make sure you still have all the boxes, packing material, paperworks, ect...

BTW, I would also suggest using the lens (18-135) on the D200 and see if the shots over expose stopped down on that bod also. This will just confirm the lens, if it is actually the culprit.


Keep us posted with the test results...

Thanks for the help Seymore. I plan on testing this lens on the D200, as well as testing other lenses on this body. That way I can verify 100% that the camera is ok and that it is just a problem with that single lens.

Seymore

Rhuarc wrote:

Thanks for the help Seymore. I plan on testing this lens on the D200, as well as testing other lenses on this body. That way I can verify 100% that the camera is ok and that it is just a problem with that single lens.