Shooting BB with Canon 85 f1.8
This may need to be moved to the camera or techniques forum, but I'm posting it here because I am wanting input especially from people who shoot sports with this lens............
I've been shooting a lot of basketball lately. As most know, HS gym's aren't really known for abundant/good lighting. When possible I prefer to shoot with my Canon 70-200 f/2.8L IS lens.
But, you have to be prepared to go it without any flash/strobe help.
I purchased the Canon 85mm f/1.8 lens for basketball. I shot half a game with it then switched to the 70-200. Upon working the images it became evident that the 85mm pics were soft.
So, I did some lens testing at home. Basically, shot a magazine cover with plenty of shutter speed to eliminate any shake. Starting at f/1.8 and working my way up through f/5.6.
To my surprise, this copy did not get sharp until f/3.5. I took the lens back to my local pro camera shop and tried another copy... Exactly the same - not sharp until f/3.5.
Obviously this was unacceptable. My 70-200 is razor sharp at f/2.8, so f/3.5 on the 85mm makes it a useless lens for me.
I called another local pro and asked about his 85mm. He said his was sharp, but he would do some testing also. He called me back and informed me that his didn't get sharp until f/3.2. Hmmm....
Three different copies of this lens and all were like this.
I traded it for a Canon 50mm f/1.4 and did the same testing.
At f/1.4 it's a bit soft --- At f/1.6 it's very acceptable --- At f/1.8 it's razor sharp!
I would like to obtain an 85mm f/1.8 in the future, but have concerns that this lens build just won't get sharp until you hit f/3.5.
Anybody out there tested there 85mm and found it to be sharp at anything faster than f/3.5?
I'd appreciate feedback so that I can have a broader base of information.
I've been shooting a lot of basketball lately. As most know, HS gym's aren't really known for abundant/good lighting. When possible I prefer to shoot with my Canon 70-200 f/2.8L IS lens.
But, you have to be prepared to go it without any flash/strobe help.
I purchased the Canon 85mm f/1.8 lens for basketball. I shot half a game with it then switched to the 70-200. Upon working the images it became evident that the 85mm pics were soft.
So, I did some lens testing at home. Basically, shot a magazine cover with plenty of shutter speed to eliminate any shake. Starting at f/1.8 and working my way up through f/5.6.
To my surprise, this copy did not get sharp until f/3.5. I took the lens back to my local pro camera shop and tried another copy... Exactly the same - not sharp until f/3.5.
Obviously this was unacceptable. My 70-200 is razor sharp at f/2.8, so f/3.5 on the 85mm makes it a useless lens for me.
I called another local pro and asked about his 85mm. He said his was sharp, but he would do some testing also. He called me back and informed me that his didn't get sharp until f/3.2. Hmmm....
Three different copies of this lens and all were like this.
I traded it for a Canon 50mm f/1.4 and did the same testing.
At f/1.4 it's a bit soft --- At f/1.6 it's very acceptable --- At f/1.8 it's razor sharp!
I would like to obtain an 85mm f/1.8 in the future, but have concerns that this lens build just won't get sharp until you hit f/3.5.
Anybody out there tested there 85mm and found it to be sharp at anything faster than f/3.5?
I'd appreciate feedback so that I can have a broader base of information.
Randy
0
Comments
My copy works just fine and is sharp at 2.0.
Of course, there are two caveats:
1. DOF is shallow so your technique needs to be more precise
2. The 85 is only good for about 20 feet of coverage. After that you will get soft results - but no different than trying to shoot your 70-200 at 40 yards (i.e. longer than the lens was designed to accurately focus at).
I posted a gallery of basketball shots a week or so back taken with this lens. You should be able to find it.
Randy,
I went through two, returned one for front focus and the second is sharp at 1.8. Here is a shot handheld at f1.8. Not as sharp on the left but it is handheld so with the thin DOF that would account for that, not being perfectly perpendicular to the chart. The second is a 100% crop of that shot. There is no sharpening applied to these, right out of the camera.
I just don't care that much for the lens for basketball. From where I shoot it just doesn't fit my focal length. I use the 70-200/2.8 for around 95% of my basketball shooting.
Yes I know it is for low light gyms but that is where the lens suffers in my opinion. It is more inaccurate in focus and tends to hunt a bit, likely due to lack of a good contrast subject in the lower light. I was not satisfied with its performance on my 20D, it is much better on the Mark IIN. I have used the lens more for T&I work than action work.
Hope that gives you some information.
Canon Gear
Thanks a lot! That gives me some hope that there are copies out there that are sharp below f/3.5. It's just strange that of the 3 copies I have first hand knowledge of, none of them get sharp till f/3.5.
I shot a JV & varsity HS basketball game tonight (just got in). Varsity with the 50mm f/1.4. I'm anxious to process them and get a feel for what that lens can/will do.
Again, thank you very much for your time and effort
John,
I've seen your work and respect it, but I must say I am completely uncertain about your insistence that lenses can't/won't focus very far. My experience is completely different than that.
You just stated above about the 70-200. I've shot a little over 80k pictures this year, and most have been with that lens. I regularly shoot past 40 yards, and at erratically moving targets. I only have an OOF rate of about 1 in 300 pictures, when checked via Canon EX Browser that shows where the focus point was when the exposure was taken if I am in quandary about a focus issue. (sometimes I miss the mark, but that's not the lens fault) --- Disclaimer: I'm talking about rodeos, football, etc... NOT basketball. I'm still getting used to this gig.
If you could explain in detail, or point me to someplace that does explain what you are claiming, I would certainly appreciate it. I'm all for learning as much about my gear's capabilities as possible. But, as stated above, with as many exposures as I take, I'm confident I would have seen a focus issue at distance if there was one with my gear.
Thanks again for your time and effort.
Randy -- I will be trying out the lens for hoop starting in January -- will let you know how mine fares. I really hate the thought that with a major player like Canon, results can be variable from unit to unit (as with the Mk III).
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KED,
I really suggest you do some testing with that lens. A magazine or anything flat with type will work, albeit that test chart is nice.
I just worked my BB pics from last night that I shot with the Canon 50mm f/1.4
I'm out of the want for a good 85mm.
Very impressive results with the 50mm f/1.4
I'll post some pics in another thread later.
One other question - are you shooting from the baseline and, if so, do you even have range out to the foul line with the 50?
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This is the site with the chart I posted.
http://www.focustestchart.com/chart.html
Another site with a good chart.
http://regex.info/blog/photo-tech/focus-chart/
Randy glad to hear your test with the 50/1.4 went well.
Canon Gear
KED,
The reason for the 45 degree angle is to check for front/back focus issues. To check for general focus, just shoot something flat that has type on it.
If your shooting from wide open, then stopping down the range, shoot with the camera on a tripod. Don't worry about the lighting, as long as there is enough to see good and for your camera to focus good.
Yes, I'm shooting under the basket.
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Geez Andy,
I hope you didn't look at any of my basketball pictures before you sent that link
Thanks though...
Dan,
You snuck that post in on me 3 minutes before I responded to KED, you fast typer you
Andy has written about his 85mm f1.8 here - http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=18532&highlight=Andy+85mm+f1.8
He has written another thread about it also, but I can't seem to find it right now.
Suffice it to say, he likes it real well. I have always thought the Canon 85 f1.8 was sharp by f2.2 or so also. I am sorry to hear about your experience.
The 135 f2 is sharp as a razor if that is an alternative, but it may be too long.
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Thanks Pathfinder,
I'm always interested in knowing about what gear will, and won't do.
But, don't go through any more trouble looking up info on this. I've found the 50mm f/1.4 to do a good job on basketball. That was my immediate need. I'm very happy with my 70-200 f/2.8L IS, but I needed an insurance lens in the events that I can't light.
Thanks again,