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Monitor Profile Settings in CS2 - calibrated or sRGB

ZmomZmom Registered Users Posts: 45 Big grins
edited January 26, 2008 in Finishing School
I want to improve people photo prints (the photography, too, but that's another issue...). I'm trying to follow a simple color managed workflow with simple post processing in CS2. The skin tones in the prints are too red and often a bit green.

I've read the help on getting the red out, pleasing skin tones, monitor calibration, and sRBG vs Adobe 98 working spaces. I capture RAW, have ACR set to sRGB, and have the workspace set to sRGB. I'm running CS2 on XP SP2.

I used an xRITE which can profile LCD displays to create a profile for the monitor. Using the Color app under control panel, I set the default monitor profile to that icc profile. (Can't do a hardware calibration of this LCD display.) I can open CS2 and see under color settings that the monitor is set to this profile.

Here's the problem. When I view a smugmug calibration print image opened in CS2 side by side with the same image hosted in Firefox, there is a definite, though minor color difference. The CS2 image looks too green.

I went back to the Color app, changed the monitor profile back to sRGB, closed and re-opened CS2 and looked at the images side by side again. Now they look the same to me. That funny greenish cast I saw in the image hosted in CS2 is gone.

Some of my questions are (1) did I generate a bad profile? (2) should I just be using the sRGB so CS2 images look like the web (I think this answer is no), (3) am I doing this correctly and, assuming the profile is good, this is how I should view and correct images, and (4) what else could be going on?

I have downloaded the updated ezprints profile and use it to softproof images.

Thanks for your help to a novice!
Zmom

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    arodneyarodney Registered Users Posts: 2,005 Major grins
    edited January 22, 2008
    All changing the display profile to sRGB does is lie to all ICC aware applications. Now instead of having a group of applications that correctly preview the numbers and a few (like your browser that doesn't), now none do. That's not a step in the right direction! Get an ICC aware browser, now it and Photoshop, Lightroom etc will preview the numbers the same and correctly.

    The CS2 image may look too green because IT IS. Fix the numbers. ICC aware applications are showing you the numbers correctly. Firefox isn't.
    Andrew Rodney
    Author "Color Management for Photographers"
    http://www.digitaldog.net/
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    ZmomZmom Registered Users Posts: 45 Big grins
    edited January 22, 2008
    arodney wrote:
    The CS2 image may look too green because IT IS. Fix the numbers. ICC aware applications are showing you the numbers correctly. Firefox isn't.
    So I'm glad to know that I was correct in setting the monitor to the "profiled" profile. If the image in question had been my photo it would have been easier to believe it was greenish - image in question is the 750 px smugmug calibration image.

    I tried the same experiment on another LCD monitor/computer, set up similarly. There was still a bit of difference between the Firefox hosted image and the CS2 image (with monitor set to the profiled profile) - just not as much difference as on the other monitor/computer. Good thing there was some consistency in that experiment. And I got another pair of eyes to take a look at the experiments. Still wondering whether I created the profiles ok.

    Another question I had - the smugmug calibration print didn't have an embedded profile. Wasn't sure whether to assign it sRGB or "don't color manage" in CS2. Assumed that since I know it is an sRGB that I should assign it that space. Opened the image twice, once assigned sRBG and once without color manage - and got the same color RBG numbers from a spot. How does this make sense - since the working space is sRGB?

    Thanks.
    Zmom
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    arodneyarodney Registered Users Posts: 2,005 Major grins
    edited January 22, 2008
    Zmom wrote:
    Another question I had - the smugmug calibration print didn't have an embedded profile.

    Said with tough love: these guys don't get color management!

    Untagged documents are RGB (or CMYK) mystery meat. They probably expect you to assign sRGB but none the less, anyone who supplies untagged documents should be slapped on the wrist with a wooden ruler. Bad dogs!
    Assumed that since I know it is an sRGB that I should assign it that space. Opened the image twice, once assigned sRBG and once without color manage - and got the same color RBG numbers from a spot. How does this make sense - since the working space is sRGB?

    Assigning a profile doesn't change the numbers (convert to profile does). Assign just defines the scale (color space) of the numbers to produce a correct preview. I suspect the image looked "better" when you assign sRGB (assuming the data IS sRGB, we don't know).

    If you assign ProPhoto RGB, ColorMatch RGB etc, you 'll see the numbers do not change a lick but the color appearance sure does.
    Andrew Rodney
    Author "Color Management for Photographers"
    http://www.digitaldog.net/
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    ZmomZmom Registered Users Posts: 45 Big grins
    edited January 23, 2008
    arodney wrote:

    Assigning a profile doesn't change the numbers (convert to profile does). Assign just defines the scale (color space) of the numbers to produce a correct preview. I suspect the image looked "better" when you assign sRGB (assuming the data IS sRGB, we don't know).

    If you assign ProPhoto RGB, ColorMatch RGB etc, you 'll see the numbers do not change a lick but the color appearance sure does.

    Ah - that explains it!

    Thanks for the information. I'll keep plugging away.
    Zmom
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    BaldyBaldy Registered Users, Super Moderators Posts: 2,853 moderator
    edited January 26, 2008
    arodney wrote:
    Said with tough love: these guys don't get color management!

    Untagged documents are RGB (or CMYK) mystery meat. They probably expect you to assign sRGB but none the less, anyone who supplies untagged documents should be slapped on the wrist with a wooden ruler. Bad dogs!
    Hahaha, thanks for the tough love, Rodney. iloveyou.gif I can return the favor and point out that Rodney's galleries are in Flash and therefore not color managed. :D

    Zmom, we attach ICC profiles on the fly when we sense your browser is ICC-aware. That way we don't slow down your consumer device or Internet Explorer with unused bytes. Go here with Safari and your wish for calibration images with profiles will be granted.
    My Smug Mug
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    arodneyarodney Registered Users Posts: 2,005 Major grins
    edited January 26, 2008
    Baldy wrote:
    Hahaha, thanks for the tough love, Rodney. <img src="https://us.v-cdn.net/6029383/emoji/iloveyou.gif&quot; border="0" alt="" > I can return the favor and point out that Rodney's galleries are in Flash and therefore not color managed. :D

    Well at least the one's I referenced <g>

    But yes, you did alert me to an issue about Flash I didn't have on my radar. Fortunately, for the time being, its super easy to ask Lightroom to build HTML templates instead.
    Andrew Rodney
    Author "Color Management for Photographers"
    http://www.digitaldog.net/
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    AndyAndy Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
    edited January 26, 2008
    Zmom wrote:
    Another question I had - the smugmug calibration print didn't have an embedded profile.

    It does indeed have a profile. http://cmac.smugmug.com/gallery/122238/1/5637776/Original
    Andy

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