Perplexed

jayegirl

Does anyone know why the display quality can vary so much between programs? To explain, when I view pictures using the standard windows photo brower or ACDSee, the pictures are clear. When I open the same photo in Lightroom, it comparison it is dull and looks like it has a low opacity white foggy layer on top. The same picture looks even worse in Elements 4.o. It seems if I view first in Lightroom, I edit the photos based on what I see in that program and then when I use ACDSee to browse through the pictures, the original doesn't look as bad as I thought and I over-edit. I aplogize if none of this makes any sense.

arodney

jayegirl wrote:

Does anyone know why the display quality can vary so much between programs? To explain, when I view pictures using the standard windows photo brower or ACDSee, the pictures are clear. When I open the same photo in Lightroom, it comparison it is dull and looks like it has a low opacity white foggy layer on top.

LR and Photoshop are color managed, the previews ARE correct if you've calibrated and profiled the display. The other applications are not, the previews are different (and incorrect). Only ICC aware applications with a good display profile preview the RGB numbers of color managed documents correctly.

jayegirl

Thank you.

claudermilk

I'm starting to wonder if we need to sticky a "common issues" kind of thread answering this and other similar questions? I think this is the third time in a week nearly the exact same question has been asked.

jayegirl

claudermilk wrote:

I'm starting to wonder if we need to sticky a "common issues" kind of thread answering this and other similar questions? I think this is the third time in a week nearly the exact same question has been asked.

Would you be kind enough to give me the location of those exact same questions so I can read the answers? I looked before I posted and again after this message. Perhaps I am not using the correct search terms.

claudermilk

Hrmmm...I must have blended several fora together in memory, search isn't turning up what I could have sworn I'd read. I know I've seen that question several times lately. In any case, I wasn't picking on the question--it's a perfectly valid one for someone new to color management & the answer is simply that which Andrew gave. I still think a simple color-management primer sticky would be a good idea.

dmmattix

claudermilk wrote:

Hrmmm...I must have blended several fora together in memory, search isn't turning up what I could have sworn I'd read. I know I've seen that question several times lately. In any case, I wasn't picking on the question--it's a perfectly valid one for someone new to color management & the answer is simply that which Andrew gave. I still think a simple color-management primer sticky would be a good idea.

I know what you mean. In fact I said the same thing to myself when Jaye's post appeared.

I found one on this forum but it might be hidden by the title "Does any here understand Vista Color Management" or something very close to that.

http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=84745

I suspect "Color Management" would get many hits on this forum. In fact I just did it and got:

http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=86265&highlight=Color+Management
http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=80945&highlight=Color+Management

There are others but they deal with the other aspect of color management (the printer).

There is a lot of information here. Quite a bit of opinion but still a lot of information also. Many of Andrew's posts have links in them that point to a lot of Adobe white papers on this subject.

Happy hunting.

jayegirl

Thanks,
claudermilk: I didn't think you were picking on the question. Think outloud anytime.

dmmattix: you are correct, I am new to color management. Never worried about it before. I bought the Huey by Pantone. Other than that, haven't done a thing towards color management.

Thanks for the links, I just found it odd that a picture could look so good in one application and so different in another. So much to learn.

arodney: I am sure that I haven't calibrated and profiled the display, at least not intentionally!

claudermilk

Now that you have spent the money on a calibrator, use it! That's the foundation of controlling your output. I would also suggest ignoring the Windows Fax viewer, it's not up to the job at hand--stick to ICC aware viewers like Breezebrowser, Irfanview, Faststone, etc.

pathfinder

claudermilk wrote:

I'm starting to wonder if we need to sticky a "common issues" kind of thread answering this and other similar questions? I think this is the third time in a week nearly the exact same question has been asked.

Chris, as you said, there have been numerous discussions of the issue of non-color aware browsers here on dgrin and smugmug, as well as other websites. Uncertainty about color management is a problem that has plagued digital photographers since the new century.

There are countless books emphasizing the need to calibrate our monitors with a hardware device. But the fact is that most web users do not do this, nor are they even aware of what not using a hardware device is doing to the images they see on screen.

As each new user of ICC aware software discovers, things do not look the same in ICC aware software, like Safari or Photoshop. Photoshop users have had this experience, since PS 5 or 6.

New users always seem to want to believe that ICC aware software is 'wrong' and their Internet Explorer or Foxfire is 'correct'. Calibrated monitors frequently look warmer, yellower or pinker, and less saturated than non-calibrated monitors, and initially may not seem preferable to new users. Most of the new monitors these days come with deeper saturation and contrast than after calibration. Proper calibration allows better visibility of shadow details, but is not immediately as "impressive"

The issues include appreciating what calibrating a monitor actually does - it makes our monitor match a proper paper print more closely - it does not make all of our monitors all over the web look exactly the same.

Another issue is how Operating Systems manage color (if they do at all), and whether the images are derived from photos or artists graphics or drawings, and whether the images have ICC color space tags associated with them.

This is a complicated set of issues, and I am not sure a simple sticky with a few posts will handle this issue, because of all the various factors that need to be understood carefully. Think how many times Andrew Rodney and others have gone over this here.

I will make an FAQ sticky with a set of links to these various discussions.

Be aware though, that frequently, folks do not read the stickies before asking their questions.

claudermilk

BTDT, it is a bit shocking when you first calibrate. The trick is to trust in the hardware & soon that is what looks normal.

I understand that most people don't check the stickies or search before asking, but then we can point them to it rather than make Andrew & others write their essays again. Makes leading the horse to the water much easier.