plz help - prom shoot

Frog Lady

to all the dgrin portrait guru's...

My son's school just called; their photographer for prom just cancelled for their prom this Friday night! And, since I've been shooting some of their HS games and a couple of other odds and ends, they asked me to cover. This is a small charter school w/ a graduating class of approx. 30 students.

I let them know up front that I don't have experience in portrait photography. But that being said, I would appreciate any advice you all can give me. What would be appropriate f-stops for couples, small groups? Poses? How to position hands/arms?

I have a 40D and a 20D, no external flash; lenses include 50 f/1.4 and the 70-200 f/2.8. The dance will be held at a local mansion. The student who contacted me suggested her dad (who is the "technical director" for the dance) may be able to help set up appropriate lighting. But I would like to be able to give him some direction.

Being a mansion that rents itself out, I'm assuming there will be reasonable backgrounds... but any hints on what to look for/avoid in backgrounds would be appriciated. I will try to get out there tomorrow or Weds and check it out.

I'll try to check out some of Jeffreaux's (and others) (pre)prom posts as well, but don't have huge amounts of time as the real job calls...

TIA,

Colleen

Seneca

Do you have umbrella lighting. If so I tend to put mine at low power and my camera settings at F7 at 1/60 (AWB). I just did an 8th grade prom...I can post a couple of images for you if you'd like. Your prom is easy...I had 240 kids.

Frog Lady

Seneca wrote:

Do you have umbrella lighting. If so I tend to put mine at low power and my camera settings at F7 at 1/60 (AWB). I just did an 8th grade prom...I can post a couple of images for you if you'd like. Your prom is easy...I had 240 kids.

I have no lighting connected to the camera out side of the built in flash. I might be able to get some stand lights. If so, what would you (any one) recommend? If the ceiling is white/light colored, I know I should probably direct lighting up to avoid harsh shadows, but should I still have some type of reflector? (white poster board?)

I would appreciate your posting some sample images. tx!

C.

jeffreaux2

Frog Lady wrote:

I have no lighting connected to the camera out side of the built in flash. I might be able to get some stand lights. If so, what would you (any one) recommend? If the ceiling is white/light colored, I know I should probably direct lighting up to avoid harsh shadows, but should I still have some type of reflector? (white poster board?)

I would appreciate your posting some sample images. tx!

C.

Will it still be daylight outside at picture time? Have you made a visit to the venue to see what might be possible?

My recommendation would be to make a visit in advance with the guy who offered to help with lighting. Bring your gear and his....set it up somewhere and take some test shots. Establish a solid white balance, and figure out where you will be as far as exposures. There should be a plethora of settings suitable for a backdrop whether indoors or out.

A visit in advance will allieviate your anxiety, and also tell you whether you will need any additional lighting gear. I do this whenever possible....insisting to be present at the rehearsals for the handfull of weddings I have shot. It is worth the time!!

EDIT: The 50mm will be your best bet...especially indoors. If you set it up in a particular spot, use a tripod. This wilkl keep the camera stationary and you can put a small piece of masking tape on the floor where you want the couples to stand. This will keep all of the photos framing consistant.

Hope this is helpfull?

From my daughter's recent Proms.

Single 580EX mounted on camera...with a diffuser...bounced off high ceiling.

Same set up but a tighter crop. Be sure to leave room for cropping to a 5x7 or wallet sized photo. 8x10's aren't normally part of a prom package.

Outdoors with a touch of fill flash.

Seneca

Ok don't fret...this is a going to be an easy gig for you...and if I lived near you...I would help you out and you would see how easy this is. I'm going to give you a link use this link and study the poses of the teenagers. I love this site and have rented a muslin from them several times. I did a high school prom last year of 500 kids and renting their muslin paid for itself. Although not cheap to rent, it still paid for itself over and over again.

http://www.dozensofmuslins.com/portfolio.php?topic=party&results=all&pageNum_muslinCategory=0&unit=3D49

Seneca

Agree with Jeff shoot loosely to allow for cropping. Those are great poses.

Frog Lady

jeffreaux2 wrote:

Will it still be daylight outside at picture time? Have you made a visit to the venue to see what might be possible?

My recommendation would be to make a visit in advance with the guy who offered to help with lighting. Bring your gear and his....set it up somewhere and take some test shots. Establish a solid white balance, and figure out where you will be as far as exposures. There should be a plethora of settings suitable for a backdrop whether indoors or out.

I had already planned to try to visit ahead of time. Checking out website for Edwards Mansion, it looks like most of the venue will be out of doors, but possibly under patio cover. Sun set is about 7:40, so I may be fighting changing lighting conditions depending on where I get to set up. I will see if the tech director gets to set up his gear before Friday and if so, I will try to get out and see what the conditions are and check for exposure, but I'm not sure what their hours are on non-event days.

jeffreaux2 wrote:

EDIT: The 50mm will be your best bet...especially indoors. If you set it up in a particular spot, use a tripod. This wilkl keep the camera stationary and you can put a small piece of masking tape on the floor where you want the couples to stand. This will keep all of the photos framing consistant.

Good idea. Do you know if most couples prefer the full body shots (to show off their fancy duds) or close ups, like your 2nd example? If I try to do both, would it be easier (in your opinions) to have the couples move between two sets of x's on the floor or move the tripod between two locations?

jeffreaux2 wrote:

Hope this is helpfull?

Yes it was and thanks for the example shots w/ poses Now what would be the most appropriate aperature for couples/small groups? Is f/4 too wide?

thanks again Jeff and Seneca for your replies!

C.

urbanaries

Regardless of what lighting gear your friend has....I strongly suggest investing in a flash unit for your camera....even if you use it mounted directly on camera, you're going to have a lot better luck salvaging the day if something goes wrong with his lights. It seems like you need a plan B, if plan A is to trigger someone's equipment you have never used before. Just my 0.02.....

Best of luck and make sure you post your results here! maybe some test run shots from your go-see?

I would say full body shots are a must-have for formal wear, fwiw. Jeff's outdoor example is a great reason!

jeffreaux2

Yup....Lynne's right (doh)


Full length would best suit the attire.

joshhuntnm

Good news about the 40d is you can crank up the ISO pretty good without a lot of grain.

evoryware

I would do like Jeff said with the tripod, but that second cam I would couple w/ the 70-200 and do head & shoulders and maybe 3/4. Couples and separates. It's 30 students.

I hope you find out the exact lighting situation ahead of time, but I would even consider continuous lights on light stands if I didn't have flash experience. Off the top of my head I can think of the Westcott pb500 series.

Scott_Quier

evoryware wrote:

I would do like Jeff said with the tripod, but that second cam I would couple w/ the 70-200 and do head & shoulders and maybe 3/4. Couples and separates. It's 30 students.

I hope you find out the exact lighting situation ahead of time, but I would even consider continuous lights on light stands if I didn't have flash experience. Off the top of my head I can think of the Westcott pb500 series.

I've heard one can do well with a set of hot-lights from Home Depot as well. (assuming, of course, that you have access to 120v60Hz power) Set your WB, shoot RAW if you don't already, and have a good time. Just make sure you make allowances for the various hazards associated with hot-lights.

Speaking of hazards - have you looked into your exposure to liability. Who is carrying the insurance on this gig? You really need to CYA!

Frog Lady

Scott_Quier wrote:

I've heard one can do well with a set of hot-lights from Home Depot as well. (assuming, of course, that you have access to 120v60Hz power) Set your WB, shoot RAW if you don't already, and have a good time. Just make sure you make allowances for the various hazards associated with hot-lights.

Speaking of hazards - have you looked into your exposure to liability. Who is carrying the insurance on this gig? You really need to CYA!

thanks guys for the advice. I'll check into the hot-lights - but I just searched Home Depot's site and no hits came up. What type of lights are you talking about?

I will check into the liability issue.

C.

jeffreaux2

Frog Lady wrote:

thanks guys for the advice. I'll check into the hot-lights - but I just searched Home Depot's site and no hits came up. What type of lights are you talking about?

I will check into the liability issue.

C.

I believe Scott is talking about something like this...

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=246907-52757-WL500SP-L&lpage=none

Scott_Quier

jeffreaux2 wrote:

I believe Scott is talking about something like this...

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=246907-52757-WL500SP-L&lpage=none

Yep - something like that. Though, if you can get the sort that are elevated ona a light stand, that works even better

Scott_Quier

Frog Lady wrote:

I will check into the liability issue.
C.

Do so. If someone's little darling trips over his feet within 10' of your location, you might be in for a fight. Liability coverage (either the school covers you or you get some of your own) especially if you are getting paid for the gig, is a must if you don't want to risk loosing the house, the three caddies, and the hummer!

joshhuntnm

jeffreaux2 wrote:

I believe Scott is talking about something like this...

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=246907-52757-WL500SP-L&lpage=none

i have used those lights for video. They are very hot and tungston-y. Don't miss what Scott said about shooting in RAW and setting the white balance.

If there is not a good place to bounce them, you mgiht get a display board from office max and bounce the off that. Don't get it too close--they are hot

http://www.officemax.com/omax/catalog/sku.jsp?skuId=11042542&searchString=display&category_Id=null

System

Is there any chance of you renting some lighting from a local camera store? I'm in a large-ish city and there's at least three or four places. I'd be able to rent a couple heads with umbrellas for around $80 for a day. That SHOULD give you enough light for some portraits if there's any ambient lighting at all.

Be sure to pick your backdrop carefully: nothing reflective or stark white. Also be sure to shoot a few test frames to make sure there's no unexpected shadows etc.

And like the commercial goes: never let them see you sweat! if you're uncomfortable then they'll be uncomfortable.

Frog Lady

MagicKiwi wrote:

Is there any chance of you renting some lighting from a local camera store? I'm in a large-ish city and there's at least three or four places. I'd be able to rent a couple heads with umbrellas for around $80 for a day. That SHOULD give you enough light for some portraits if there's any ambient lighting at all.

Be sure to pick your backdrop carefully: nothing reflective or stark white. Also be sure to shoot a few test frames to make sure there's no unexpected shadows etc.

Good advice, thank you. Unfortunately, I'm probably about an hour away from any decent camera stores and won't have the time this week to check them out. I love last minute gigs

C.

foxwizard

Try Worklights
If this has been suggested, I apologize. But first time I set up a home studio, I got some clamp on worklights from the hardware store, and put photo flood bulbs in them; get a couple neutral pieces of gel from the photo store, or rent a softbox or umbrella and stands.

I've also shot such events with only an external flash mounted on the hot shoe, bounced off the cieling. If you want to save money, you may be able to pick up a used older Vivitar flash. I use a 272; you can get them for less than $50).

You can also do ok with your on-camera flash if the room is well-lit. Take somebody with you and experiment ahead of time.