I haven't spoken to David Pogue, the tech journalist who works for the New York Times, in years, but last I did he didn't seem to think the way photos look online was a big deal. His feeling was that most consumers don't care about how the galleries look, just whether it's easy and free.
- arranging photos in galleries - too hard and takes too long (mainly for large galleries).
- deleting photos, either one at a time or bulk - takes too long even to delete 1 photo.
- updating or adding keywords - takes forever sometimes. "saving keywords" on the screen for like 30 seconds or more. Just seems like that should be a fairly simple thing to do and not take so long.
So I guess for me it comes down to the convenience issues. Just little nickel and dime petty stuff that over time aggravates the poo out of you. I've been reworking my galleries the last few days and teh arranging photos, deleting photos and keyword issues are the things that I keep coming back to as minor points of aggravation.
I have spent the better part of today moving and rearranging my site and - well - it has take me the better part of the day - nuff said
No offense to you who have used the system for awhile and are willing to speak up, but you tend to be more advanced. I was trying to get inside the head of less advanced people who won't talk to us because they get stuck and we make them feel dumb (even though we're the dummies if we're confusing them).
ask me anything- call me anytime - I am definitelya dummie - everything confuses me and it takes an age to get my head around, only to find Ive forgotten it next time I come to it ( usuallyu a month or two later)
I just noticed this thread, and have to agree that there is room for improvement in Smugmug's gallery maintenance toolkit.
It would be nice if there were bulk options for adding GPS to a selected group of pics, for example. I don't use GPS because data entry is too tedious.
It is also tedious to make a pic appear in more than one gallery. You have to make a copy, then move it, and you have to do this one pic at a time. Then, if you decide to edit the pic, you have to replace each and every copy one at a time.
The biggest single issue I have is that there is no comprehensive WYSIWYG tool to arrange an entire gallery. The arrange photos displays do not give you any feedback on what the gallery will look like if there are x number of rows of thumbs in the gallery, so you actually need to keep count of the position. Meh. The in-gallery drag and drop is buggy--pics sometimes mysteriously move to a different page--and there is no way (that I know of) to drag a pic to a different page in the gallery.
The first point should be trivial to fix--I notice that there is finally a bulk delete option , and this shouldn't be any harder.
The second, well, that depends on the design of the database, I suppose. Since this issue has been discussed for a long time, I'm guessing that there must be dragons there. Nevertheless, I'm sure that something could be done to make this easier.
The last point will require the most thought and effort, given the ever-increasing variation in what a gallery can look like. On the other hand, it is probably the most important thing Smugmug could do to improve my experience as a user.
[*]It is also tedious to make a pic appear in more than one gallery. You have to make a copy, then move it, and you have to do this one pic at a time. Then, if you decide to edit the pic, you have to replace each and every copy one at a time.
exactly the point I made a while back when I suggested a button for 'copy to' i.e. makes a copy to a specified destination gallery
(getting a second plug in here:D )
[it'd be nice to be able to select more than one pic by shift/command clicking too]
[*]The biggest single issue I have is that there is no comprehensive WYSIWYG tool to arrange an entire gallery.
Couldn't agree more - it takes forever if you decide just to make one change to all galleries .. and no Smugbrowser is not the answer, it takes us outside the(familar) environment, is not intuitive either and just adds another cog to the wheel
.. and no Smugbrowser is not the answer, it takes us outside the(familar) environment, is not intuitive either and just adds another cog to the wheel
I agree Smugbrowser as it is currently is not the answer. However I believe that a desktop resident program IS one potential answer, and upgrades to Smugbrowser could be that.
I see the program as being an "offline" version of your site, getting the benefits of that offline status: speed and the ability to do "what if's" with your site design without actually committing the changes until you are ready. When everything is perfect you hit the "Sync" button and upload the changes in one shot.
I agree Smugbrowser as it is currently is not the answer. However I believe that a desktop resident program IS one potential answer, and upgrades to Smugbrowser could be that.
I see the program as being an "offline" version of your site, getting the benefits of that offline status: speed and the ability to do "what if's" with your site design without actually committing the changes until you are ready. When everything is perfect you hit the "Sync" button and upload the changes in one shot.
Just dreaming here...but it would be sweet!
recipe for disaster AFAIC, one extra step of 'virtualness' too many
I have the same problem with Adobe LightRoom, it gets confusing differentaiting what is actually on the harddrive and what is a 'virtual copy'
I would much prefer something that actually directly affects the galleries in real time
Interesting...I've recently started using flickr as well and compared to SM it's VERY intuitive. The Organizr is great and much easier to use than the SM tools, plus mapping seems to be nicer on flickr (no darn 150 limit, + the ability to bring up a map and see the photos in that area, which SM struggles with).
Having said that SM is definitely my primary site, Flickr is for photo sharing/amateurs (and is a little too 'cute' for my liking), SM is for professional display of images.
I would much prefer something that actually directly affects the galleries in real time
Not that I have any inside info, but I'm sure that's what they are working on. Which is why I keep bringing up the desktop version idea; I think having both options available would be great -
I love SmugMug but I also find the organization really complicated and non-intuitive.
For example, the way bulk-settings is implemented is to me very confusing. I would like an own settings page where I can edit, add, compare and delete my different quick-settings. To my knowledge the only way to change and edit them now is when using them for a real album. I'd much rather have an own page in the Control Panel where quick-settings can be edited.
While it's on my mind...speaking of bogging down, one thing SmugMug needs is a spreadsheet view of the settings in every gallery in an account. As the settings multiply, it becomes harder to view and change them in bulk, especially for older galleries.
For example, SmugMug added the "Hello World!" setting. Great setting, and one I'm like to apply to all my old galleries. But wait, I have to go through each gallery one by one, check the settings, and apply new ones. I wish I could list every gallery in a big table, look down the column for "Hello World!", and see in an instant exactly which galleries have that feature on or off. Or tick every box in every gallery right down the column in less than one second.
I have the same problem at the moment, I want to set "ext. links" to NO on all my albums without chaning any other settings for them. If I just do a bulk quick settings I guess all the settings will be the same for all albums.
One sugggestion on how to solve this (if the spreadsheet idea is too complicated) is to make it possible to create quick-settings with options set as "not defined". As in if I apply a certain quick-settings onto an album it will only change the options explicitly changed in the quick-settings and leave the rest unchanged. In my example I'd just create a quick-setting called "No ext. links" with that option set to NO and all others as "not defined" and then run that quick-setting on all albums.
And one last (minor) thing: Is it possible to remove the pre-configured categories? I don't need 20 categories that I'll never use in the list. If there isn't any way to remove them, maybe there could be an option in the control panel to hide all pre-configured categories.
I hid a little Easter egg on the site for users taking the free trial, with an offer: if they let me call them and ask how it's going with their trial, I give them a $25 Amazon gift certificate. So far I've made about 30 calls.
No offense to you who have used the system for awhile and are willing to speak up, but you tend to be more advanced. I was trying to get inside the head of less advanced people who won't talk to us because they get stuck and we make them feel dumb (even though we're the dummies if we're confusing them).
Anyway, what's coming through loud and clear they love the quality of the display, the way photos fill the screen, themes, the variety of uploaders, etc., but we're foiling them by hiding the photo tools and control panel, and not being clear about which does what.
So I'm afraid we're guilty as charged for this review.
It has our complete attention, however, and we're working on it. But it's a big job and we have things to finish that we're working on now, so we're not going to be able to rush out a quick fix.
I'm on the free trial, amd I want the easter egg! :wow
I'll add my $.02 to the "review" portion of the thread, just for the heck of it. There are a few little tweaks here and there that can be done to make everything just a little better...what's more important is that the smugmug folks have consistently and constantly worked to improve everything based on customer suggestions and needs. Quite awhile ago I decided to go with a SM competitor because I thought their basic layout looked better and worked faster than SM. When I signed up (in 2006) they promised the ability to customize sites. They're still saying that is "coming soon".
Contrast that to smugmug that will quickly offer add-ons, hacks, mods, and flat out upgrades to the system on a constant basis - and then offer a forum like this one that often has answers to questions around the clock.
Anybody comparing the different services needs to go beyond the initial glitter and discover the real possibilities and value in the various products.
I'm on the free trial, amd I want the easter egg! :wow
Hahaha, it was fun while it lasted! I actually got more requests for calls than I could make and it didn't take long to get to the thing that everyone said on every call: make organizing more intuitive!
I did love making the calls and loved the feedback, but now we have to be fixing.
Comments
I have spent the better part of today moving and rearranging my site and - well - it has take me the better part of the day - nuff said
...pics..
ask me anything- call me anytime - I am definitelya dummie - everything confuses me and it takes an age to get my head around, only to find Ive forgotten it next time I come to it ( usuallyu a month or two later)
...pics..
- It would be nice if there were bulk options for adding GPS to a selected group of pics, for example. I don't use GPS because data entry is too tedious.
- It is also tedious to make a pic appear in more than one gallery. You have to make a copy, then move it, and you have to do this one pic at a time. Then, if you decide to edit the pic, you have to replace each and every copy one at a time.
- The biggest single issue I have is that there is no comprehensive WYSIWYG tool to arrange an entire gallery. The arrange photos displays do not give you any feedback on what the gallery will look like if there are x number of rows of thumbs in the gallery, so you actually need to keep count of the position. Meh. The in-gallery drag and drop is buggy--pics sometimes mysteriously move to a different page--and there is no way (that I know of) to drag a pic to a different page in the gallery.
The first point should be trivial to fix--I notice that there is finally a bulk delete optionThe second, well, that depends on the design of the database, I suppose. Since this issue has been discussed for a long time, I'm guessing that there must be dragons there. Nevertheless, I'm sure that something could be done to make this easier.
The last point will require the most thought and effort, given the ever-increasing variation in what a gallery can look like. On the other hand, it is probably the most important thing Smugmug could do to improve my experience as a user.
Regards,
exactly the point I made a while back when I suggested a button for 'copy to' i.e. makes a copy to a specified destination gallery
(getting a second plug in here:D )
[it'd be nice to be able to select more than one pic by shift/command clicking too]
Couldn't agree more - it takes forever if you decide just to make one change to all galleries .. and no Smugbrowser is not the answer, it takes us outside the(familar) environment, is not intuitive either and just adds another cog to the wheel
...pics..
I see the program as being an "offline" version of your site, getting the benefits of that offline status: speed and the ability to do "what if's" with your site design without actually committing the changes until you are ready. When everything is perfect you hit the "Sync" button and upload the changes in one shot.
Just dreaming here...but it would be sweet!
recipe for disaster AFAIC, one extra step of 'virtualness' too many
I have the same problem with Adobe LightRoom, it gets confusing differentaiting what is actually on the harddrive and what is a 'virtual copy'
I would much prefer something that actually directly affects the galleries in real time
...pics..
Having said that SM is definitely my primary site, Flickr is for photo sharing/amateurs (and is a little too 'cute' for my liking), SM is for professional display of images.
For example, the way bulk-settings is implemented is to me very confusing. I would like an own settings page where I can edit, add, compare and delete my different quick-settings. To my knowledge the only way to change and edit them now is when using them for a real album. I'd much rather have an own page in the Control Panel where quick-settings can be edited.
Also, this suggestion was really good:
I have the same problem at the moment, I want to set "ext. links" to NO on all my albums without chaning any other settings for them. If I just do a bulk quick settings I guess all the settings will be the same for all albums.
One sugggestion on how to solve this (if the spreadsheet idea is too complicated) is to make it possible to create quick-settings with options set as "not defined". As in if I apply a certain quick-settings onto an album it will only change the options explicitly changed in the quick-settings and leave the rest unchanged. In my example I'd just create a quick-setting called "No ext. links" with that option set to NO and all others as "not defined" and then run that quick-setting on all albums.
And one last (minor) thing: Is it possible to remove the pre-configured categories? I don't need 20 categories that I'll never use in the list. If there isn't any way to remove them, maybe there could be an option in the control panel to hide all pre-configured categories.
Mee too! But IO assume that's because I use Macs
...pics..
--- Denise
Musings & ramblings at https://denisegoldberg.blogspot.com
Thanks, I tried SmugBrowser about a year ago but guess I should try it again.
Still, I don't think you should have to rely on a 3rd party application to organize your albums and their settings.
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
I tried it too and hate top say it bit didn't like it (sorry :cry )
hey you're not supposed to be back yet!;-)
...pics..
I'm on the free trial, amd I want the easter egg! :wow
Contrast that to smugmug that will quickly offer add-ons, hacks, mods, and flat out upgrades to the system on a constant basis - and then offer a forum like this one that often has answers to questions around the clock.
Anybody comparing the different services needs to go beyond the initial glitter and discover the real possibilities and value in the various products.
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showpost.php?p=4799600&postcount=227
do you guys know tis thread.. linked post a bit anti...:cry
...pics..
I did love making the calls and loved the feedback, but now we have to be fixing.
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter