Yessir, especially after my car troubles.. Just thinking out loud.. Having - even incomplete set of - realtively high quality lighting equipment - and a consumer camera.. It immediately becomes "the weakest link".. It feels like adding Andy's 30" cinema display to a 25Mhz 386 with 1Mb of RAM a "huge" 40Mb hard drive, you know what I'm saying.. Something (camera) is way out of line here..
Yes, I know what you mean. However, I used the 717 and the 828 with studio lighting for a long time, and a single light for location work. The 828 does well especially with good lighting. So don't think you have to change cameras just because you have new lighting.
I moved to SLR for performance reasons, and if I had to choose right now between lighting or a new camera, I would choose lighting. It will provide more bang for the buck than will an SLR at this point.
Even after you get the lighting and new camera, there will be plenty of new things that will then tempt you as being essential now. It is a never ending vicious cycle hehehe
Yessir, especially after my car troubles.. Just thinking out loud.. Having - even incomplete set of - realtively high quality lighting equipment - and a consumer camera.. It immediately becomes "the weakest link".. It feels like adding Andy's 30" cinema display to a 25Mhz 386 with 1Mb of RAM a "huge" 40Mb hard drive, you know what I'm saying.. Something (camera) is way out of line here..
Creator of Dgrin's "Last Photographer Standing" contest
"Failure is feedback. And feedback is the breakfast of champions." - fortune cookie
Yes, I know what you mean. However, I used the 717 and the 828 with studio lighting for a long time, and a single light for location work. The 828 does well especially with good lighting. So don't think you have to change cameras just because you have new lighting.
I moved to SLR for performance reasons, and if I had to choose right now between lighting or a new camera, I would choose lighting. It will provide more bang for the buck than will an SLR at this point.
Even after you get the lighting and new camera, there will be plenty of new things that will then tempt you as being essential now. It is a never ending vicious cycle hehehe
I guess I'll use my old good black-bodied doggie for a while, eh:-)
This way wifie would not scream *too* loud:-)
Thanks again!
Question about brollybox...
For the brolly box at Alien Bees I see that it says:
"Acting like a softbox, it’s designed like an umbrella, fitting through your reflector as an umbrella would, then tightening around the faceplate to eliminate light spill"
From what I understand it tightens around the AB to prevent spill. How does that work for a flash (i.e. Sunpak) How does it tighten around a non-AB flash unit?
A brolly box is basically a "poor mans" softbox. It is like an umbrella with a diffusion cover in front. Must faster to setup & transport than a softbox.
This site is very organized and can give you an idea about what everyone is talking about. Their prices aren't too bad. www.alienbees.com
For the brolly box at Alien Bees I see that it says:
"Acting like a softbox, it’s designed like an umbrella, fitting through your reflector as an umbrella would, then tightening around the faceplate to eliminate light spill"
From what I understand it tightens around the AB to prevent spill. How does that work for a flash (i.e. Sunpak) How does it tighten around a non-AB flash unit?
Thanks,
Lee
Softboxes come in several sizes. One might be 6'x6' or as small as something
that pops over the flash.
Kind of... What I was looking for was how the actually brollybox from Alien Bees would "tighten" around a non-Alien bee light? For example a Sunpack, 550EX, SB-800...
It has a draw string around loose fabric. So you basically just tighten the drawstring and the fabric closes around the reflector or flash that you are using. They are made for Alien Bees, so depending on the light you are using, you may need to devise a mounting method that will work.
Kind of... What I was looking for was how the actually brollybox from Alien Bees would "tighten" around a non-Alien bee light? For example a Sunpack, 550EX, SB-800...
Thanks,
Lee
Creator of Dgrin's "Last Photographer Standing" contest
"Failure is feedback. And feedback is the breakfast of champions." - fortune cookie
My thanks as well...
Nik this thread caught my eye and I also want to say thanks to Shay and everyone else for the great insight. Eventually I want to have some lighting myself, and you guys have really helped answer some of my questions about it too.
It has a draw string around loose fabric. So you basically just tighten the drawstring and the fabric closes around the reflector or flash that you are using. They are made for Alien Bees, so depending on the light you are using, you may need to devise a mounting method that will work.
These were all done with a 2 light AB setup.
I recomend gettting umberellas there very easy to set up. If your looking for portable (do not get the AB soft or octo box it takes way to much time to setup, (I know I have them)just use some shoot through umberellas or a brolly box (cheap and good)
Here is a good starting kit. If you ask me!
An AB 400 and AB 800 two umberellas or a brolly box a sekonic L358 and if your doing location work where you will not have power then the vagabon system. And if you have any money left over a reflector would help also.
Of corse you also have to get stands for these also.
There is a really good link on lighting set up at Freadmiranda.com go to lighting froums and look at (show me your studio) I would give you the link but the site is down for maintance.
This is my 2 cents worth
Here is what i recommend.
*2 AlienBees B400 Flash Units
2 CB1 Single Light Carrying Bags
2 LS3050 10-foot General Purpose Light Stands
1 U48TWB 48-inch Translucent White “Shoot-Thru” Umbrella
1 U48SW 48-inch Silver/White Reversible Bounce Umbrella
Also comes with 2 sync cables
(you can change or modify this to meet your needs) but price is $599.00 as is.
* The vagabond system is $350 or $499 depends on what you need of if you need something to light outdoors or in a place where you wont be able to plug into a power outlit.
* The sekonic L 358 is a great light meter and will last you for many years to come and (yes you NEED one of these this is a must) Price $250 at B&H
* The photoflex lightstand umbrella carry case is $69.00 at B&H
* And the phototek background system is great if you need poratably it's very sturdy and a good price. $ 145.00 at B&H
Oh one more think Nik.
One more thing Nik if you would like to discuss some of this over the phone I would be more than happy to help you out.
I'm in the military and stationed in Germany at the moment so It would be better for me to call you I can call you with a special phone plan but it would cost you a fortune to call me. As long as its not a long conversation Id be more than happy to give you a ring if you would like.
Just let me know.
<SNIP>
I have the latest B&H catalog and I still have some time to order them before the gig (end of May).
However, the options are too many, so I'd appreciate some specific advices.
What shall I get?
Thank you!
OK here is my route:
I love Alien Bee and their big brother/sister brand White Lightning, but I am cheap, so splurging for everything right up front was 'painfull' to just think about.
Here is the route I went, with the emphasis that I have NO affiliation with any ofthese companies.
Flash, 2 White Lightning Ultra 1200 of EBAY $280 each, similar to a B800 but much more light.
A two set umbrella (one shoot through, one reflector brolly) $49.95 (look for FotoDiox on ebay)
One heavy duty Dynatran AS-806 lightstand of ebay 101" $12.67 (ex shipping) (look for AMVONA on Ebay)
One heavy duty Dynatran AS-9110 lightstand 166" $15.- (ex shipping) (AMVONA again)
Except the Monolights everything is brand new.
Later I found a wireless controll (dedicated White Lightning) Wireless remote control/flash sync again used on ebay for about half the original price.
White Lightning has been great as they still have all the manuals online, and parts available.
Currently I am looking for a backdrop support, but have been using 3/4" pvc schedule 40 pipe and lean it against any available wall, and a set of clamps (6 for $2.00 from harbor freight).
As I said I am cheap, but the above setup works fantastic, save for some modifiers and a dedicated backdrop/seperationlight (currently using my SB800 setup in SU4 optical slave mode) I also have two old Metz CT45 with Adorama optical slaves, and a reflector kit from fotodiox again. Fotodiox also has a great softbox and even an octodome softbox for much much less than can be found anywhere else.
In short, I am an ebayer. If this was my true and and only profession, I might consider new, but would go with the same stuff.
XO,
You can't depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus. Mark Twain
I found a couple of online lighting instruction sites. They are put together by manufacturers, who want to sell their product, but take a look at the techniques they are using and you can substitute other manufacturers items.
I found another good reference site, Profoto. The Light Shaping Tools page has links to the same scene lit with different light modifiers on a single head, giving a good idea of the different qualities of light they provide.
...
Next, you need a way to trigger the lights. This can be as simple as using a long sync cord from camera to light. However, location work is murder with sync cords. Try to avoid this like the plague. The next option is optical triggering. While this does work, it is not always reliable enough on location in varying lighting situations and other peoples flash going off triggering your lights. The most reliable method is to trigger the lights with radio signals. There are more and more manufacturers now coming out with radio units of various prices ranges, triggering distances, and triggering features. So do some homework here to find the right one for you.
Thanks Shay and Nik for this great and informative thread!
Thought I'd offer a bit of comic relief that supports Shay's observation about sync cords. This morning I was experimenting with light tent and strobes in my garage/studio and trying out my unused Sekonic light meter. I "saved" a few bucks in my setup by using sync cords, figuring "why bother" for working in the studio.
I had the light meter hanging from my neck and was leaning into the tent to take a reading, when the phone rang. I took a quick couple of steps before the slack in the light meter lanyard snagged the sync cord and pulled my camera and tripod over. Things toppled just slowly enough so that I could catch the camera before it hit the floor.
After my breathing got back to normal and before posting this...
...I ordered a Pocket-Wizard kit from B&H!
Thanks Again,
- Frank
.... .- ...- . .- -. .. -.-. . -.. .- -.--
"Whether you're rich or you're poor, it's nice to have Money!" - Alfred E. Newman
Comments
"Failure is feedback. And feedback is the breakfast of champions." - fortune cookie
Yessir, especially after my car troubles.. Just thinking out loud.. Having - even incomplete set of - realtively high quality lighting equipment - and a consumer camera.. It immediately becomes "the weakest link".. It feels like adding Andy's 30" cinema display to a 25Mhz 386 with 1Mb of RAM a "huge" 40Mb hard drive, you know what I'm saying.. Something (camera) is way out of line here..
I moved to SLR for performance reasons, and if I had to choose right now between lighting or a new camera, I would choose lighting. It will provide more bang for the buck than will an SLR at this point.
Even after you get the lighting and new camera, there will be plenty of new things that will then tempt you as being essential now. It is a never ending vicious cycle hehehe
"Failure is feedback. And feedback is the breakfast of champions." - fortune cookie
I guess I'll use my old good black-bodied doggie for a while, eh:-)
This way wifie would not scream *too* loud:-)
Thanks again!
For the brolly box at Alien Bees I see that it says:
"Acting like a softbox, it’s designed like an umbrella, fitting through your reflector as an umbrella would, then tightening around the faceplate to eliminate light spill"
From what I understand it tightens around the AB to prevent spill. How does that work for a flash (i.e. Sunpak) How does it tighten around a non-AB flash unit?
Thanks,
Lee
that pops over the flash.
Here's one for a small flash head.
Does this answer your question?
Ian
Thanks,
Lee
"Failure is feedback. And feedback is the breakfast of champions." - fortune cookie
Nik this thread caught my eye and I also want to say thanks to Shay and everyone else for the great insight. Eventually I want to have some lighting myself, and you guys have really helped answer some of my questions about it too.
My smugmug stuff
Lee
I recomend gettting umberellas there very easy to set up. If your looking for portable (do not get the AB soft or octo box it takes way to much time to setup, (I know I have them)just use some shoot through umberellas or a brolly box (cheap and good)
Here is a good starting kit. If you ask me!
An AB 400 and AB 800 two umberellas or a brolly box a sekonic L358 and if your doing location work where you will not have power then the vagabon system. And if you have any money left over a reflector would help also.
Of corse you also have to get stands for these also.
There is a really good link on lighting set up at Freadmiranda.com go to lighting froums and look at (show me your studio) I would give you the link but the site is down for maintance.
It's the sudden stops!
http://reecephoto.smugmug.com
http://www.danasoft.com/sig/JeffReece.jepg
src="http//www.danasoft.com/sig/JeffReece.jpg">
Here is what i recommend.
*2 AlienBees B400 Flash Units
2 CB1 Single Light Carrying Bags
2 LS3050 10-foot General Purpose Light Stands
1 U48TWB 48-inch Translucent White “Shoot-Thru” Umbrella
1 U48SW 48-inch Silver/White Reversible Bounce Umbrella
Also comes with 2 sync cables
(you can change or modify this to meet your needs) but price is $599.00 as is.
* The vagabond system is $350 or $499 depends on what you need of if you need something to light outdoors or in a place where you wont be able to plug into a power outlit.
* The sekonic L 358 is a great light meter and will last you for many years to come and (yes you NEED one of these this is a must) Price $250 at B&H
* The photoflex lightstand umbrella carry case is $69.00 at B&H
* And the phototek background system is great if you need poratably it's very sturdy and a good price. $ 145.00 at B&H
It's the sudden stops!
http://reecephoto.smugmug.com
http://www.danasoft.com/sig/JeffReece.jepg
src="http//www.danasoft.com/sig/JeffReece.jpg">
One more thing Nik if you would like to discuss some of this over the phone I would be more than happy to help you out.
I'm in the military and stationed in Germany at the moment so It would be better for me to call you I can call you with a special phone plan but it would cost you a fortune to call me. As long as its not a long conversation Id be more than happy to give you a ring if you would like.
Just let me know.
It's the sudden stops!
http://reecephoto.smugmug.com
http://www.danasoft.com/sig/JeffReece.jepg
src="http//www.danasoft.com/sig/JeffReece.jpg">
I love Alien Bee and their big brother/sister brand White Lightning, but I am cheap, so splurging for everything right up front was 'painfull' to just think about.
Here is the route I went, with the emphasis that I have NO affiliation with any ofthese companies.
Flash, 2 White Lightning Ultra 1200 of EBAY $280 each, similar to a B800 but much more light.
A two set umbrella (one shoot through, one reflector brolly) $49.95 (look for FotoDiox on ebay)
One heavy duty Dynatran AS-806 lightstand of ebay 101" $12.67 (ex shipping) (look for AMVONA on Ebay)
One heavy duty Dynatran AS-9110 lightstand 166" $15.- (ex shipping) (AMVONA again)
Except the Monolights everything is brand new.
Later I found a wireless controll (dedicated White Lightning) Wireless remote control/flash sync again used on ebay for about half the original price.
White Lightning has been great as they still have all the manuals online, and parts available.
Currently I am looking for a backdrop support, but have been using 3/4" pvc schedule 40 pipe and lean it against any available wall, and a set of clamps (6 for $2.00 from harbor freight).
As I said I am cheap, but the above setup works fantastic, save for some modifiers and a dedicated backdrop/seperationlight (currently using my SB800 setup in SU4 optical slave mode) I also have two old Metz CT45 with Adorama optical slaves, and a reflector kit from fotodiox again. Fotodiox also has a great softbox and even an octodome softbox for much much less than can be found anywhere else.
In short, I am an ebayer. If this was my true and and only profession, I might consider new, but would go with the same stuff.
XO,
Mark Twain
Some times I get lucky and when that happens I show the results here: http://www.xo-studios.com
http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=12471
See for yourself what a one-ligth setup and one sony camera can do together..:-)
I found another good reference site, Profoto. The Light Shaping Tools page has links to the same scene lit with different light modifiers on a single head, giving a good idea of the different qualities of light they provide.
Thought I'd offer a bit of comic relief that supports Shay's observation about sync cords. This morning I was experimenting with light tent and strobes in my garage/studio and trying out my unused Sekonic light meter. I "saved" a few bucks in my setup by using sync cords, figuring "why bother" for working in the studio.
I had the light meter hanging from my neck and was leaning into the tent to take a reading, when the phone rang. I took a quick couple of steps before the slack in the light meter lanyard snagged the sync cord and pulled my camera and tripod over. Things toppled just slowly enough so that I could catch the camera before it hit the floor.
After my breathing got back to normal and before posting this...
...I ordered a Pocket-Wizard kit from B&H!
Thanks Again,
- Frank