shooting macro with nikon

the supervillain

alright everyone here we go!
i love macro photography. i am going to get a macro lens very soon.

i want to get the nikon 105mm vr. i initially wanted the sigma 150mm. i changed my mind, because i wasnt sure i was going to be able to set up a tripod all the time for my shots. so the VR may come in handy.

then recently, i have been thinking about greater than 1:1 magnification!
then i was reading about bellows, and extension tubes and reversing rings and etc etc etc

okay, so i am a bit overwhelmed at this point.
i have heard that extension tubes are a nogo with the 105mm VR. dont remember why. bellows are pretty expensive, so thats out of the question.

basically what i am asking is how easy would it be to get greater than 1:1 with the nikon lens i want? what would i need? would it work?

and anyone have any other suggestions for me! i am open to all
hope this post makes sense, i am tired and ready for bed!

thanks!!!!

catspaw

Check out a similar thread with lots of great lens suggestions for you to research:

http://dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=124696

the supervillain

thank you, suppose i should have done a little sleuthing first :S

Lord Vetinari

Just to add some more info. AFAIK the VR is not useful when close to 1:1 or above.
With a macro lens around 100mm you will get 2:1 with a full set of Kenko ext tubes or using a reversed 50mm lens on the front around 3:1.

I always think a macro lens around 100mm is fairly ideal - so Tamron 90, sigma 105 Tokina 100 are all excellent optically.
Brian V.

the supervillain

great, i am going to look into those lenses you mentioned..
i have heard nothing but good things about the 200mm nikon macro f/4!

it may be a bit expensive though

next question is greater than 1:1 magnification! whats the best way to do this?

extension tubes?

Cygnus Studios

I love the tubes. Best money you can spend for macro work. When coupled with a 90 through 105mm you can go from roughly 8 inches to 1cm.

the supervillain

Cygnus Studios wrote:

I love the tubes. Best money you can spend for macro work. When coupled with a 90 through 105mm you can go from roughly 8 inches to 1cm.

alright, 8 inches to 1 cm, thats your closest focusing distance?

so, i know there are some lenses that are not compatible with extension tubes. how do i know if i can use them with whatever lens i decide to choose??

sorry for all the questions, but i want to get this right the first time

Lord Vetinari

the supervillain wrote:

alright, 8 inches to 1 cm, thats your closest focusing distance?

so, i know there are some lenses that are not compatible with extension tubes. how do i know if i can use them with whatever lens i decide to choose??

sorry for all the questions, but i want to get this right the first time

Haven't heard of tube incompatibility, (as long as they are the correct set for your camra fitting). Any of the suggested lenses will work with a set of kenko ext tubes AFAIK.
BTW think Cygnus was talking about frame width captured on the sensor when you have tubes fitted not focus distance. My Sigma 105 goes down from around 4.5" in front of the lens MFD with no tubes to about 3" with all 65mm of tubes.
Brian V.

the supervillain

Lord Vetinari wrote:

Haven't heard of tube incompatibility, (as long as they are the correct set for your camra fitting). Any of the suggested lenses will work with a set of kenko ext tubes AFAIK.
BTW think Cygnus was talking about frame width captured on the sensor when you have tubes fitted not focus distance. My Sigma 105 goes down from around 4.5" in front of the lens MFD with no tubes to about 3" with all 65mm of tubes.
Brian V.

okay, i get the frame width thing, thats good to know!
so i am looking at different options for lenses now, i think i want to be in the 100mm to 150mm range. i like the sigma 150mm, its got pretty good reviews, i have seen some sample images, and they look very sharp! what i need to go larger than 1:1 with that lens?

there is so much info on the web, my head hurts

thanks again everyone for all your help!

catspaw

the supervillain wrote:

what i need to go larger than 1:1 with that lens?

there is so much info on the web, my head hurts

thanks again everyone for all your help!

Extension tubes are your friend for getting larger magnifications. Kenko makes a good set that doesn't cost too much ($140 I think).

the supervillain

catspaw wrote:

Extension tubes are your friend for getting larger magnifications. Kenko makes a good set that doesn't cost too much ($140 I think).

okay! i think i figured it out!

i am going to stick with the 105mm VR nikon (i looked at the other ones, but the majority of them extend when focusing, that could be an issue!).

once i get that, for nay higher than 1:1 work i want to do, i will use a reversed 50mm f1.8 on the front!

now, i may be getting greedy, but i can combine extension tubes with this combo to get even greater magnification??

also, with reversing a lens, the shorter the focal length, the more magnification you get?? i thought i read that somewhere, but am not sure

keep the answers coming

anonymouscuban

Great thread Supervillain! I'm in the same boat as you are and have had a lot of my questions answered without have to create a thread.

I do have one question though and I hope you don't mind if I ask it here...

I have a Sigma 30mm f/1.4. Does this lens work reversed?

I thought I read somewhere that some lenses do not work reversed. Not sure it that is true and if it is the case with the Sigma 30mm.

Thanks.

Lord Vetinari

the supervillain wrote:

okay! i think i figured it out!

i am going to stick with the 105mm VR nikon (i looked at the other ones, but the majority of them extend when focusing, that could be an issue!).

once i get that, for nay higher than 1:1 work i want to do, i will use a reversed 50mm f1.8 on the front!

now, i may be getting greedy, but i can combine extension tubes with this combo to get even greater magnification??

also, with reversing a lens, the shorter the focal length, the more magnification you get?? i thought i read that somewhere, but am not sure

keep the answers coming

Lens extension is not a big issue for me- I tend to preset the magnification I want on the lens and focus by moving the camera

Yes you can combine a set of extension tubes and a reversed lens - you'll get about 4:1 magnificatio with both.

With a reversed lens yes the shoter focal length the reversed lens is the more magnification you will get but it comes at the expense of focus distance. With too short a reversed lens you can end up with the focus point being inside the front elemement of the reversed lens

Brian v.

Lord Vetinari

anonymouscuban wrote:

Great thread Supervillain! I'm in the same boat as you are and have had a lot of my questions answered without have to create a thread.

I do have one question though and I hope you don't mind if I ask it here...

I have a Sigma 30mm f/1.4. Does this lens work reversed?

I thought I read somewhere that some lenses do not work reversed. Not sure it that is true and if it is the case with the Sigma 30mm.

Thanks.

Suspect it will work but you will have insanely small focus distance in front of the lens. Just tried my sigma 105 with the kit lens set around 30mm reversed on the front- focus distance about 1" in front of the reversed lens
Brian V.

Cygnus Studios

Okay, I just did some test shots and measurements using a Sigma 28-90mm macro lens and the full set (12mm,20mm,36mm) of Kenko macro tubes I went to work. With the lens set at 90mm / 12mm I could focus at 11 1/4 inches away. Set at 34mm with the stacked set I can focus at 1/2 inch away before losing the light.

The shots were first done with the lens set at 90mm.

With 12mm Kenko Tube:



This next shot is done with the lens set at 28mm.



With the 20mm Kenko Tube: 90mm



With the 36mm Kenko Tube: 90mm



Stacked Kenko set.

Set at 90mm 6 1/4 inches away

Set at 34mm 1/2 inch away

the supervillain

awesome test, its really helpful to see the effects of the extension tubes!

i am flip flopping between the sigma 105 and the nikon 105 VR....then i was reading about the tamron 90mm, which i dismissed at first based on looks alone :S, it looked a little cheap to me. but have heard nothing but good things about it!

and always in the back of my mind, i want the sigma 150mm....

so, basically i want some help/opinions on the above! i will be using this for bugs and flowers and water drops etc... i plan on getting a good tripod at some point this year, but i would be using it mostly handheld for now!

Cygnus Studios

My current lineup of macros are:

Sigma 28-90mm macro
Sigma 50mm macro
Sigma 70-300mm macro

Nikkor 60mm macro
Nikkor 105mm macro

My two favorites are the 28-90 and the 105. Some are better for different applications than others.

the supervillain

Cygnus Studios wrote:

My current lineup of macros are:

Sigma 28-90mm macro
Sigma 50mm macro
Sigma 70-300mm macro

Nikkor 60mm macro
Nikkor 105mm macro

My two favorites are the 28-90 and the 105. Some are better for different applications than others.

do you have the 105mm VR?? or the older one?
any experience with the sigma 105??

Cygnus Studios

No VR. Most of my work is done on tripods, so never had the need.

the supervillain

Cygnus Studios wrote:

No VR. Most of my work is done on tripods, so never had the need.

i gotcha, i am debating that myself, do i really need the VR, is it worth the extra ~$400 or so.

arg

i dont know how many low light, no flash, handheld macros i will be doing

there is no easy choice is there??

**edit**right now, i can get the sigma 150mm for the same price as the nikon 105mm VR ($989 CDN)...thats still a lot for an extra 3 inches or so of focusing distance..the sigma 105 is $659, and the tamron is $629!

Cygnus Studios

I have heard lots of good things about the Tammy. I would certainly give it a lot of consideration.

the supervillain

Cygnus Studios wrote:

I have heard lots of good things about the Tammy. I would certainly give it a lot of consideration.

yah thats what a lot of people are saying!

i think i will go to the shop and try them all on my camera and see what feels the best

the supervillain

hey, if i reverse a 50mm on the end of the nikon 105 VR, i will get some vignetting right, seeing as the filter thread size is different??

Lord Vetinari

the supervillain wrote:

hey, if i reverse a 50mm on the end of the nikon 105 VR, i will get some vignetting right, seeing as the filter thread size is different??

Don't think So - I used to reverse a pentax 50mm (52mm filter) onto my sigma 105 (58mm filter) and no problem with vignetting.
Brian V.

the supervillain

good to know!! i have never used a setup like that, just an assumption!

i got a reversing ring today to play around with until i get my true macro lens! very fun! takes a little getting used to though, i am going to have a field day when the weather is a bit better!


the only bug i could find was a dead mosquito hehe

hey lord v, in your setup, before you got the mpe65. did you have extension tubes as well with the 105mm and reversed lens?

anonymouscuban

Hey Villain,

Been following this thread as I am in the same boat as you. The reversing ring that you just got... is it body to lens? If so, can you post a shot taken with it?

Maxxamillian

New to macro
Sprang for the Nikkor 105 VR. Love the lens. New to this segment of photography...a few things from what I've seen so far.

1. Amazing portraiture lens!
2. Use with a teleconverter (17e II) I get insanely close to the subject--DOF is really shallow.
3. AF does alot of hunting....won't be using this in Macro but if you use it otherwise it will cause some frustration. The focus ring was a very wide splay of travel.
4. Lens does not telescope. I LOVE Nikon's CLS and plan on adding an R1 kit with maybe a third sb200 flash. Didn't want to have to worry about a moving lens with the lighting.

Good luck. What an amazing little (big) world...

the supervillain

anonymouscuban wrote:

Hey Villain,

Been following this thread as I am in the same boat as you. The reversing ring that you just got... is it body to lens? If so, can you post a shot taken with it?

hi, the reversing ring is a thin metal ring, with a 'f mount' connection on one end, then a 52mm filter thread on the other, so you can attach the f mount part to the body, then thread your lens on like a filter to the other side!!

i just woke up, but i will post some pics in a couple of hours

thanks for following, hope this thread is helping you out!

*50th post! woot!*

eminart

Don't overlook the Tokina 100mm. It's a very nice "pro-build" type lens. I'm fairly new to photography, but I bought this lens and I love it. Plus, it costs a LOT less than the 105mm. I think I paid around $400 new from B&H. Next on the agenda is a set of extension tubes, but I may get a reversing ring first since they're only about $8 and I have an old manual focus 24mm nikkor just begging for a use.

the supervillain

here are some sample pics i have taken with the br-2a reversing ring

(pay no mind to composition, subject matter, or exposure, no PP, resized in lightroom)


my watch


a dead mosquito


a dusty old nick knack


some bling


my dog bailey's hairy nose

so what i have found so far, is that focusing with this thing takes a bit of getting used to! you put it, set the lens at infinity, and move the camera back and forth to focus. DOF is very very thin!

i would not suggest this as a alternative to a genuine macro lens, but it will tide me over until mine when the weather gets nicer, i will go hunting for some bugs and see how that works out! stay tuned

anonymouscuban

Very cool! So is that a 50mm you reversed?

I was so close to getting my Sigma 105mm, but the guy on Craigslist decided to sell it to someone else before I could get off work to go pick it up. And so the hunt continues!!!

I can't wait!!