That will come in handy as you learn. I was shooting horse jumping with my 2.8. I ended up pacing off where I was shooting to the closest jump. Found out some of what I thought were focus problems were depth of field problems. Keep practicing, nothing can replace it.
There are a number of issues here. The aperture is your biggest. Your old 70-300 shot at f5.6. The reason you got the faster glass would be to use it's abilities. I'd never shoot that lens over f4 for sports. I'd start at f2.8 though. Some have expressed concerns about depth of field issues. These can be controlled with proper focus settings in the menus. If you set a1 (AF-C priority selection) to focus, the shutter will only release when you have focus lock. I'd probably use 21 points and set a4 (focus tracking with lock on) to short. It's important to understand what these settings do and why you might use them rather than simply following some formula as if there is a magic key to getting the right shot. Every situation requires different settings. Read your manual 100 times and then again. If it still looks like a foreign language, buy one that claims to be easier to understand.
The image appears to have too little contrast and looks washed out. Shooting without a lens shade will do this, but so will shooting into the sun. I suspect one or both of these issues exists here. You can correct this a bit in post with the curves tool. Pull the left hand side of the curve down, darkening the darks.
The photographer sitting on his butt in the dirt will always get the better shot. You're definitely standing here. One thing you're likely looking for is relative sharpness in your image. You want the background out of focus and the subject in focus. The best way to accomplish this is to get them farther away from each other. If you sit on the ground, you'll find that the grass is no longer behind the subject, but the stands or trees on the other side of the field are. There is a big difference in distance there, making it easy to throw the background out of focus. Look closely at the images you like and try to figure out how it was captured. You'll learn a lot about perspective and what you like if you think about it every time you view a photo.
Lastly, the most obvious issue has been discussed. Frame your subject tighter when you shoot it. Depth of field (region of sharp focus) decreases as focal length increases (the mm gets bigger) and distance to your subject decreases. In sports, you're almost always looking to work with the smallest depth of field possible. That's one of the things that makes it challenging and rewarding.
Hi donek, thanks for the input. Yes I was shooting with out the lens cover, it was overcast and I assumed it would block some light from getting in. So I left it off. and yes I know that I was killing myself with not shooting at 2.8 and not letting light in.. But at the time I wasnt thinking about that.. I am now.
changing the focus settings in the camera menu was something I was looking for as well. I never hear anyone talk about them and was curious if I even should worry about them at all. I will read up on them, thanks.
thanks everyone for your input. so so so much to learn.......
If you set a1 (AF-C priority selection) to focus, the shutter will only release when you have focus lock. I'd probably use 21 points and set a4 (focus tracking with lock on) to short.
This is a D300, not a D700. I'd have AF-C on release priority. So, you miss a shot or two with less than perfect focus. You delete them. But, occasionally you will get one that's "sharp enough" (to your point on relative sharpness). If the sun's bright, then 21 point works okay. Otherwise, 9 is about all the D300 can deal with on fast moving sports.
The image appears to have too little contrast and looks washed out. Shooting without a lens shade will do this, but so will shooting into the sun. I suspect one or both of these issues exists here. You can correct this a bit in post with the curves tool. Pull the left hand side of the curve down, darkening the darks.
Not so much with the lens being used (at least on the hood part). But why not leave on the hood anyway. It provides protection and definitely doesn't hurt. There was no bright sun to shoot into. Though there is a LARGE field of relatively bright sky taking up a majority of the frame in number 1. That creates a similar effect on the foreground objects. I think the lack of contrast here (and it's not bad--I noticed your stuff tends to be fairly high contrast, so you obviously like a little more contrast--so do I) is because of the overcast day (relatively flat lighting) perhaps aggravated by the relatively bright sky taking up so much of the frame and/or a problem from post processing. Howitzer, use the lens hood/shade, but not because it's going to magically transform your photographs. Be sure you are using a calibrated monitor for post and making the contrast reasonable. Try "Auto Tone" in Lightroom as a STARTING point. You'll also find this issue may take care of itself when you start getting tight crops in shots. Donek's advice on getting low is spot on. Get low. Do not stand up. Kneel at least. Sit if possible.
Hi donek, thanks for the input. Yes I was shooting with out the lens cover, it was overcast and I assumed it would block some light from getting in. So I left it off. and yes I know that I was killing myself with not shooting at 2.8 and not letting light in.. But at the time I wasnt thinking about that.. I am now.
changing the focus settings in the camera menu was something I was looking for as well. I never hear anyone talk about them and was curious if I even should worry about them at all. I will read up on them, thanks.
thanks everyone for your input. so so so much to learn.......
Try taking identical pictures with and without the lens shade in varying types of light. You'll notice a difference in the look, contrast, and color saturation of the image. You'll quickly be convinced that it is a good thing to keep on the lens regardless of the lighting situation. I use one all the time.
Try taking identical pictures with and without the lens shade in varying types of light. You'll notice a difference in the look, contrast, and color saturation of the image. You'll quickly be convinced that it is a good thing to keep on the lens regardless of the lighting situation. I use one all the time.
just a UV one, put that on all my lenses for protection. Should I consider a polarizer or something else?
Sorry, I meant that as a question to donek because I think the only way you will see a difference on every single shot "regardless of the lighting situation" with a lens hood is if you have such a filter in place and it's causing issues.
No, you don't need any other filters for the sports you are shooting. Use the lens hood though (for your lens' protection, if for nothing else).
AF-C priority should be on Focus, not release.
Don't need filters.
If you have a hood use it, it is not going to hurt you in any way.
Having said that....I never use one.
Here are my d300 focus settings for sports:
Focus
focus area 21
tracking lock on short
AF point selection 11
Set your front dial on continuous and your back dial on dynamic area auto focus.
Set your frame rate on Ch for your highest rate.
Set the lens to VR on and A 2.8
Set your ISO to 400 ( 200 in straight bright sun) you can stretch it to 640 if you aren't getting enough shutter speed, once you get to 800 it will be getting pretty noisy.
Focus on your subject press the shutter halfway down to lock on and track, when they are hitting the spot you want to focus fire. I typically time it for just one perfect shot, you can also fire a burst through the action and hope you get just the right shot.
For action I typically shoot in Manual mode to maintain consistent exposures, (especially if one team is in white the other in black).
Set your F-stop to 2.8 then just adjust your shutter speed by firing a few test shots. Once set you should not have to mess with it, if sun is popping in and out you can adjust exposure with the shutter speed wheel or go back to A.
Don't agree. I'd use the focus/release combo setting that the D300 has. If it can lock in a decent time, great. Otherwise, fire and keep trying to lock a focus because of AF-C being set on the front of the camera.
Here are my d300 focus settings for sports:
Focus
focus area 21
tracking lock on short
AF point selection 11
Set your front dial on continuous and your back dial on dynamic area auto focus.
Set your frame rate on Ch for your highest rate.
Set the lens to VR on and A 2.8
Set your ISO to 400 ( 200 in straight bright sun) you can stretch it to 640 if you aren't getting enough shutter speed, once you get to 800 it will be getting pretty noisy.
Mostly good settings. VR for sports is: 1. Not needed, and 2. Might actually cause the moving object to be more blurry. VR is about YOUR MOVING THE CAMERA, not the subject moving.
If you're getting noise at 800 in the D300, then maybe your exposure is to dark (goes to your manual
exposure suggestion). But 200 (maybe 400) is great in sun. For the cloudy day originally show, probably 400 or 800.
If the sun is in and out, then AP makes better sense. Again, I shoot sports manual most of the time, but in WA State outdoors in the daytime, AP often makes more sense. Four reasons. Sun in and out. Players faces in shadow and out of shadow. Late afternoon start with quickly changing light in the fall and early spring (we have shorter days here). Fastest shutter speed. I'll even use the ISO adjust with AP sometimes with a high minimum shutter speed set, starting ISO of 200, and reasonable max ISO to allow lowest ISO and fastest shutter speed in changing light when manual just isn't very practical.
Well we disagree, try it both ways, see which works better for you..
Since sharpness/focus is the issue you started out with, it makes no sense to me that you would want to shoot without good focus.
For subjects where you have time to lock on focus the VR will help get sharp shots.
If you are shooting quick snap and grabs then the VR should be turned off.
Well we disagree, try it both ways, see which works better for you..
Since sharpness/focus is the issue you started out with, it makes no sense to me that you would want to shoot without good focus.
And you will often get "good focus" when shooting short bursts with the focus/release compromise setting. May not be the first frame in a four or five shot burst with AF-C, but at some point you are likely to get "good focus", or more precisely "good enough focus", to get a reasonably sharp image. May not be tack tack sharp (or it certainly may be), but that's not always needed in sports. Nice to have, yes. Essential, not always.
For subjects where you have time to lock on focus the VR will help get sharp shots.
If you are shooting quick snap and grabs then the VR should be turned off.
Only if your panning (to deal with any unintended vertical motion) at a slower shutter speed or if you have bad shaky hands. VR also slows down focus lock acquisition, so why would you use it and degrade your focus acquisition speed when your shutter speed is high enough to cancel any slight camera movement anyway.
well apparently soccer season for the next few weeks is over here..... So I drove around to a few schools till I found a game of anything going on. Found some girls warming up for a lacrosse game.
I used all the settings you guys (or gals) gave me, AP, VR off, read alot about all my camera settings and menu options..
so here is the out come, what do you guys think? I tried to do as little processing as possible, I cropped out just what was needed, like orange goal posts....
1. AP 2.8, ISO 250, Shutter 1/800
2. 2.8 1/800 ISO 250
3. same as other 2.
all in all I would say you guys really do know what your talking about..
I think they turned out pretty good, well they are better than before, lets start with that...
well apparently soccer season for the next few weeks is over here..... So I drove around to a few schools till I found a game of anything going on. Found some girls warming up for a lacrosse game.
I used all the settings you guys (or gals) gave me, AP, VR off, read alot about all my camera settings and menu options..
so here is the out come, what do you guys think? I tried to do as little processing as possible, I cropped out just what was needed, like orange goal posts....
1. AP 2.8, ISO 250, Shutter 1/800
2. 2.8 1/800 ISO 250
3. same as other 2.
all in all I would say you guys really do know what your talking about..
I think they turned out pretty good, well they are better than before, lets start with that...
Nice shots! These appear pretty sharp to me. I'm going to take the same advice using my 70-200 2.8 when football season comes back around in a few months...
Travis M. Chance
twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass site ∙ facebook
hahahahahaha yeah that does sound wrong.... I am way to tired from moving furniture all weekend to have carpet installed today... but that hilarious...
well apparently soccer season for the next few weeks is over here..... So I drove around to a few schools till I found a game of anything going on. Found some girls warming up for a lacrosse game.
I used all the settings you guys (or gals) gave me, AP, VR off, read alot about all my camera settings and menu options..
so here is the out come, what do you guys think? I tried to do as little processing as possible, I cropped out just what was needed, like orange goal posts....
all in all I would say you guys really do know what your talking about..
I think they turned out pretty good, well they are better than before, lets start with that...
Much better sharpness and exposure. Now, sit down. Seriously, looks like you're still standing on the sidelines instead of kneeling or sitting. The 2.8's helping clear out the background, but try sitting or kneeling and see if you don't like that better too. But BIG IMPROVEMENT! Congratulations.
Comments
Good Luck!
HTH -
- Wil
Equipment: a whole bunch of black cylinders full of polished glass that cost way to much that I just had to have...
That will come in handy as you learn. I was shooting horse jumping with my 2.8. I ended up pacing off where I was shooting to the closest jump. Found out some of what I thought were focus problems were depth of field problems. Keep practicing, nothing can replace it.
The image appears to have too little contrast and looks washed out. Shooting without a lens shade will do this, but so will shooting into the sun. I suspect one or both of these issues exists here. You can correct this a bit in post with the curves tool. Pull the left hand side of the curve down, darkening the darks.
The photographer sitting on his butt in the dirt will always get the better shot. You're definitely standing here. One thing you're likely looking for is relative sharpness in your image. You want the background out of focus and the subject in focus. The best way to accomplish this is to get them farther away from each other. If you sit on the ground, you'll find that the grass is no longer behind the subject, but the stands or trees on the other side of the field are. There is a big difference in distance there, making it easy to throw the background out of focus. Look closely at the images you like and try to figure out how it was captured. You'll learn a lot about perspective and what you like if you think about it every time you view a photo.
Lastly, the most obvious issue has been discussed. Frame your subject tighter when you shoot it. Depth of field (region of sharp focus) decreases as focal length increases (the mm gets bigger) and distance to your subject decreases. In sports, you're almost always looking to work with the smallest depth of field possible. That's one of the things that makes it challenging and rewarding.
www.seanmartinphoto.com
__________________________________________________
it's not the size of the lens that matters... It's how you focus it.
aaaaa.... who am I kidding!
whoever dies with the biggest coolest piece of glass, wins!
changing the focus settings in the camera menu was something I was looking for as well. I never hear anyone talk about them and was curious if I even should worry about them at all. I will read up on them, thanks.
thanks everyone for your input. so so so much to learn.......
Equipment: a whole bunch of black cylinders full of polished glass that cost way to much that I just had to have...
This is a D300, not a D700. I'd have AF-C on release priority. So, you miss a shot or two with less than perfect focus. You delete them. But, occasionally you will get one that's "sharp enough" (to your point on relative sharpness). If the sun's bright, then 21 point works okay. Otherwise, 9 is about all the D300 can deal with on fast moving sports.
Not so much with the lens being used (at least on the hood part). But why not leave on the hood anyway. It provides protection and definitely doesn't hurt. There was no bright sun to shoot into. Though there is a LARGE field of relatively bright sky taking up a majority of the frame in number 1. That creates a similar effect on the foreground objects. I think the lack of contrast here (and it's not bad--I noticed your stuff tends to be fairly high contrast, so you obviously like a little more contrast--so do I) is because of the overcast day (relatively flat lighting) perhaps aggravated by the relatively bright sky taking up so much of the frame and/or a problem from post processing. Howitzer, use the lens hood/shade, but not because it's going to magically transform your photographs. Be sure you are using a calibrated monitor for post and making the contrast reasonable. Try "Auto Tone" in Lightroom as a STARTING point. You'll also find this issue may take care of itself when you start getting tight crops in shots. Donek's advice on getting low is spot on. Get low. Do not stand up. Kneel at least. Sit if possible.
Try taking identical pictures with and without the lens shade in varying types of light. You'll notice a difference in the look, contrast, and color saturation of the image. You'll quickly be convinced that it is a good thing to keep on the lens regardless of the lighting situation. I use one all the time.
www.seanmartinphoto.com
__________________________________________________
it's not the size of the lens that matters... It's how you focus it.
aaaaa.... who am I kidding!
whoever dies with the biggest coolest piece of glass, wins!
Do you have a filter in front of the lens glass?
Equipment: a whole bunch of black cylinders full of polished glass that cost way to much that I just had to have...
Sorry, I meant that as a question to donek because I think the only way you will see a difference on every single shot "regardless of the lighting situation" with a lens hood is if you have such a filter in place and it's causing issues.
No, you don't need any other filters for the sports you are shooting. Use the lens hood though (for your lens' protection, if for nothing else).
Don't need filters.
If you have a hood use it, it is not going to hurt you in any way.
Having said that....I never use one.
Here are my d300 focus settings for sports:
Focus
focus area 21
tracking lock on short
AF point selection 11
Set your front dial on continuous and your back dial on dynamic area auto focus.
Set your frame rate on Ch for your highest rate.
Set the lens to VR on and A 2.8
Set your ISO to 400 ( 200 in straight bright sun) you can stretch it to 640 if you aren't getting enough shutter speed, once you get to 800 it will be getting pretty noisy.
Focus on your subject press the shutter halfway down to lock on and track, when they are hitting the spot you want to focus fire. I typically time it for just one perfect shot, you can also fire a burst through the action and hope you get just the right shot.
For action I typically shoot in Manual mode to maintain consistent exposures, (especially if one team is in white the other in black).
Set your F-stop to 2.8 then just adjust your shutter speed by firing a few test shots. Once set you should not have to mess with it, if sun is popping in and out you can adjust exposure with the shutter speed wheel or go back to A.
Go shoot and show us some examples.
Have fun!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21695902@N06/
http://500px.com/Shockey
alloutdoor.smugmug.com
http://aoboudoirboise.smugmug.com/
Don't agree. I'd use the focus/release combo setting that the D300 has. If it can lock in a decent time, great. Otherwise, fire and keep trying to lock a focus because of AF-C being set on the front of the camera.
Mostly good settings. VR for sports is: 1. Not needed, and 2. Might actually cause the moving object to be more blurry. VR is about YOUR MOVING THE CAMERA, not the subject moving.
If you're getting noise at 800 in the D300, then maybe your exposure is to dark (goes to your manual
exposure suggestion). But 200 (maybe 400) is great in sun. For the cloudy day originally show, probably 400 or 800.
If the sun is in and out, then AP makes better sense. Again, I shoot sports manual most of the time, but in WA State outdoors in the daytime, AP often makes more sense. Four reasons. Sun in and out. Players faces in shadow and out of shadow. Late afternoon start with quickly changing light in the fall and early spring (we have shorter days here). Fastest shutter speed. I'll even use the ISO adjust with AP sometimes with a high minimum shutter speed set, starting ISO of 200, and reasonable max ISO to allow lowest ISO and fastest shutter speed in changing light when manual just isn't very practical.
Since sharpness/focus is the issue you started out with, it makes no sense to me that you would want to shoot without good focus.
For subjects where you have time to lock on focus the VR will help get sharp shots.
If you are shooting quick snap and grabs then the VR should be turned off.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21695902@N06/
http://500px.com/Shockey
alloutdoor.smugmug.com
http://aoboudoirboise.smugmug.com/
Great response!
twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
site ∙ facebook
And you will often get "good focus" when shooting short bursts with the focus/release compromise setting. May not be the first frame in a four or five shot burst with AF-C, but at some point you are likely to get "good focus", or more precisely "good enough focus", to get a reasonably sharp image. May not be tack tack sharp (or it certainly may be), but that's not always needed in sports. Nice to have, yes. Essential, not always.
Only if your panning (to deal with any unintended vertical motion) at a slower shutter speed or if you have bad shaky hands. VR also slows down focus lock acquisition, so why would you use it and degrade your focus acquisition speed when your shutter speed is high enough to cancel any slight camera movement anyway.
See http://www.nikon.com/about/technology/core/software/vr_e/index.htm and http://imaging.nikon.com/products/imaging/technology/scene/16/index.htm
I used all the settings you guys (or gals) gave me, AP, VR off, read alot about all my camera settings and menu options..
so here is the out come, what do you guys think? I tried to do as little processing as possible, I cropped out just what was needed, like orange goal posts....
1. AP 2.8, ISO 250, Shutter 1/800
2. 2.8 1/800 ISO 250
3. same as other 2.
all in all I would say you guys really do know what your talking about..
I think they turned out pretty good, well they are better than before, lets start with that...
Equipment: a whole bunch of black cylinders full of polished glass that cost way to much that I just had to have...
Nice shots! These appear pretty sharp to me. I'm going to take the same advice using my 70-200 2.8 when football season comes back around in a few months...
twin Mark IV's & a bunch of "L" glass
site ∙ facebook
This sound like the into to a penthouse letter. :giggle You better be careful.
Your shots look much better. I've been reading all the helpful suggestions trying to pick up some tips for the upcoming lacrosse season.
Equipment: a whole bunch of black cylinders full of polished glass that cost way to much that I just had to have...
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21695902@N06/
http://500px.com/Shockey
alloutdoor.smugmug.com
http://aoboudoirboise.smugmug.com/
Much better sharpness and exposure. Now, sit down.
but thank you all for the very helpful advice. I really do appreciate the time you took to give it.
Equipment: a whole bunch of black cylinders full of polished glass that cost way to much that I just had to have...
I read the posts and hope to gain some knowledge too, so thanks everyone...
Good luck Howitzer!
That might explain it. I'm accustomed to the 5'6" perspective.