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Help with Studio Lighting

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    pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,698 moderator
    edited June 22, 2010
    You need to set a custom white balance with a white card in the position of your subject lit exactly like your subject will be lit. This should correct your color balance.

    if you room is only 4 feet wide, consider a single white shoot through umbrella - they are used just outside your frame. Or a single off camera speed light with a Fong diffuser.

    You will HAVE to set a custom white balance in this closet with the blue walls!
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
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    rhommelrhommel Registered Users Posts: 306 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2010
    IMO, if you are shooting RAW, you don't need to set your white balance. it would be much easier to change WB in a larger monitor, calibrated or not
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    Don KondraDon Kondra Registered Users Posts: 630 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2010
    Maddie1small.jpg

    I used the eyedrop tool in Element 7 to set the skin tone and lighting adjustment on the shadows.

    The point being some minor adjustments can help IF you get close with the capture :)

    And this last image is much better.

    One hint, have Maddie change into a white shirt, THAT is going to be the next challenge, he, he...

    Cheers, Don
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    Don KondraDon Kondra Registered Users Posts: 630 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2010
    One other thought.

    For a school portrait you may want to turn down the main a little and turn up the fill but not so far you lose the shadows.

    You might want to add a simple reflector for a hair light. Even a piece of 2' x 2' white foamcore will help.

    Along with highlights pay attention to the shadows on the nose.

    Cheers, Don
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    liflanderliflander Registered Users Posts: 339 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2010
    Re: Help with Studio Lighting
    My 2cents:
    For the reshoot, do a test with an assistant, preferably with plenty of time before the real shoot.

    Keep it as simple (automatic) as possible. I would try one light into or through an umbrella, higher but fairly close to camera. 1/125 shutter, f8, iso100. ETTL should work fine for flash exposure. If exposure is bad, use manual flash power, try full power, check result, adjust.

    4 foot room is crazy! I would push to move location.

    Good luck!

    LiflanderPhotography.com
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    SamSam Registered Users Posts: 7,419 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2010
    Gota run...................but here is a quick color balance.

    Sam
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    liflanderliflander Registered Users Posts: 339 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2010
    Re: Help with Studio Lighting
    ...and yes, like others said, auto white balance, correct for skin tones on computer, and shoot RAW!

    I recently was able to save several RAW shots that looked almost black before correction.

    LiflanderPhotography.com
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    Art ScottArt Scott Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2010
    to start with girl in 1st photo is waaaay too close to the wall....subject should almost always be a min of 4ft....(my own rule here).........
    also Was the incident dome over the light receptacle on the meter?
    did you fire the flash to get meter reading??
    Was camera ISO and flash meter set to same ISO?

    For most modern flash meters to work you must fire the flash while the meter is in metering mode....and it must be in flash meter mode.....not in a reflective
    metering mode and the white incident dome must cover the light entrance receptacle............

    Good starting point with any camera + studio flash is lowest iso (100 or 200) F8 and 1/60th shutter........subject to flash distance approx 10ft
    This 99% od the time get you a good exposure......pronounced shadows on wall....move subject farther from wall.......
    Also for the softest light......get your light source as CLOSE to the subject as possible.......the closer the lights the softer the light will be on
    the subject and turn the power down............also I try to keep all my light sources the same....so if one if shoot thru both should be and vice versa.....another of my own rules........it is along the lines of keep it stoopid simple.................especially for these types of shoots........................
    "Genuine Fractals was, is and will always be the best solution for enlarging digital photos." ....Vincent Versace ... ... COPYRIGHT YOUR WORK ONLINE ... ... My Website

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    bhambham Registered Users Posts: 1,303 Major grins
    edited June 22, 2010
    This was shot with a main light and a fill light. Same settings as the previous picture...

    Attachment not found.

    That's looking good for a test shot.
    "A photo is like a hamburger. You can get one from McDonalds for $1, one from Chili's for $5, or one from Ruth's Chris for $15. You usually get what you pay for, but don't expect a Ruth's Chris burger at a McDonalds price, if you want that, go cook it yourself." - me
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    GrovesStudioGrovesStudio Registered Users Posts: 28 Big grins
    edited June 23, 2010
    I haven't worked much with RAW, that's probably how I ended up where I did. I am familiar with fixing under exposed images but not OVER exposed. In any case. After working for HOURS and reading for HOURS I am still VERY nervous that this shoot tomorrow will go bad (for some reason) I felt like they all looked like smurfs. Casue of the blue wall and white tops. I am nixing the light meter. I will adjust and re adjust with an assistant. I know for sure I will pull them 3-4 ft from the wall. Also try to get in early enough to work with my lights so I can get it set up right. I am even having my assistant bring a white button down (just to be sure)....

    Hopefully they will al work out. I am unsure how to set a custom white balance on my camera. I have never done it before. Any tips would be great!

    I REALLY appreciate all of your help, your inputs, advice, critique. Studio lighting is new to me and I normally do outdoors for friends, family and mostly motorcycles for my husband. Thank you everyone... so much! ::):
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    GrovesStudioGrovesStudio Registered Users Posts: 28 Big grins
    edited June 23, 2010
    Here is an example of the motorcycle shots....

    Pp-080209-int-0690small.jpg

    Keep in mind, this guy was probably doing around 40-50 MPH
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    GrovesStudioGrovesStudio Registered Users Posts: 28 Big grins
    edited June 23, 2010
    Thinking of it, I wish I had more of the background in focus.. hard to do at 40 MPH... any hints?
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    pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,698 moderator
    edited June 23, 2010
    I am unsure how to set a custom white balance on my camera. I have never done it before. Any tips would be great!

    I REALLY appreciate all of your help, your inputs, advice, critique. Studio lighting is new to me and I normally do outdoors for friends, family and mostly motorcycles for my husband. Thank you everyone... so much! ::):


    Setting a custom white balance in on page 68 in your manual for the 40D.... ( I can't seem to quickly find an active link for a manual in English for a 40D on the web anymore )

    Shoot a jpg of a plain white object in AWB in the room with the blue wall with the light you are going to shoot with - a t shirt, a towel, a piece of plain white cardboard will do - Shoot in Manual mode such that the histogram tends toward the right side of your histogram but not all the way. If you have an 18% grey card that is even a better choice to use.

    Once you have a frame of this white or grey target that fills the frame, go to your menu in your camera to Custom WB. Select the frame you shot by turning the dial on the back of your 40D to select the image, and then OK on the dialogue screen. Now go to the White Balance button on the top right to your 40D, an turn it to Custom white balance and you are done.

    You can see a video of setting a custom white balance on a 40D here - http://www.ehow.com/video_2371536_canon-eos-40d-custom-white.html


    Once you have the grey/white frame, it takes longer to describe how to do it, than it does to do it, literally. It will save you hours in Photoshop too!!

    I know folks told you to shoot RAW and just adjust in PS, but did you see how their image's color balance was all over the map after they did precisely that?

    For this blue room, you will want a custom white balance. Once you do that, your colors SHOULD be perfect.

    I wrote a bit about custom white balance tools here - http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=90438

    If your white balance and exposure are correct within 1/3 of a stop, you should be able to shoot a jpg of a 16 step grey scale and capture the full range with the middle tone precisely in the middle of your histogram.


    You will not get your background in focus when you are panning a motorcycle going by. A smaller aperture will give you greater depth of field though, even when panning.
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
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    Art ScottArt Scott Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
    edited June 23, 2010
    Personally I would not nix the flash meter.......maybe it was just
    too much for you to try and grasp when you did not have time to
    learn your equipment prior to your shoot........for some reason
    light meters were easy for me to use right from the start.......
    but I also started with a simple box flash meter (Wein 500
    and they are still made and sold).....they are simplest but
    still they are dang near indestructible and give damn accurate
    readings.........especially with 2 flashes and trying to balance them.....
    but I am old school in many ways....I have carried a flash meter with me
    everyday since I bought my first one over 30 yrs ago............the one
    I now have is a Sekonic L558 that is capable of averaging several meter
    readings for difficult situations......it is both a reflective meter as well as
    an incident flash meter + a 1 degree spot meter....Flash meters are
    indispensable to get exposures set accurately and Fast so that you can
    keep clients happy......clients get nervous when we the Pro photogs ( i use that term loosely
    to mean any person that is doing a photo job for a client, whether paid or not)......I know
    when I did some metering in Lexington Ky the building Manager looked surprised to see me
    using a meter and asked why....I explained that with the fog and bright spots and dark
    I wanted and idea of where to set my exposure to start my shooting at......it was an average
    exposure of 6 meter readings.........I could have stood there and shot and chimped and shot
    and chimped but i opted to use the meter.......after the first shot he want ed to see the photo
    and was pleased that it looked good to him......but the fog killed what I was aiming for....so
    the pic was a failure.......

    I trust my meter so much that chimping does not happen with me.......
    My flash meters have saved my butt more than once......especially if for no
    reason a flash unit desides that it is not going to put out properly........I
    used to set my flashes and just step off the distance from flash to subject,
    prior to subjects arrival and then start shooting.....then one day I got a
    bad feeling prior to a shoot and sure enuff i had my flashes set to full
    power and neither was putting out even half power......the meter saved my
    tail...........as i said i have always carried it.......

    If you are using the meter correctly and if the meter is working properly the
    getting a proper exposure is a one shot deal...maybe 2 at the most..........

    That is why I still use one...............but you do as you feel is best for you.......


    For me time is money and so is my image to my client................
    I will pull out the meter and play with it just to make an impression on a client,
    especially if they are old enough to know what a flash meter is.............it is that
    impression that brings clients back for another round of your ability to produce
    a work of art for them.
    "Genuine Fractals was, is and will always be the best solution for enlarging digital photos." ....Vincent Versace ... ... COPYRIGHT YOUR WORK ONLINE ... ... My Website

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    pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,698 moderator
    edited June 24, 2010
    While one can shoot without a flash meter by paying close attention to your histogram, getting professional level jogs requires very accurate exposure control which is what the Sekonic L358 will do for you if used correctly. Art is right about a flash meter. It will save you time too.

    I do not find my L-358 to be real intuitive to use either, but you should plan for a shutter speed between 1/125th and 1/200th. For studio strobes I routinely plan on 1/160th, this will minimize the influence of ambient light as well.
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
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    Don KondraDon Kondra Registered Users Posts: 630 Major grins
    edited June 24, 2010
    For product I set up my camera, in manual mode set speed at 1/200, f 8, iso 100.

    With strobes off and room lights on take a shot. You should have a black frame.

    Set the meter (L358) to 1/200, iso 100, wireless flash mode, lumisphere out.

    Turn on the strobes and adjust the power, since I've worked without a meter for a while I usually get pretty close.

    Take a reading.

    Adjust the strobes power until the meter reading matches your target f number, in this case f 8.

    For a 2/1 ratio there is a one stop difference in the power of the lights.

    You can meter each light separately to get the ratio between the main light and fill light, I just eyeball the strobes sliders....

    For portraiture I'm sure someone will step in and refine my process :)

    Cheers, Don
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    D'BuggsD'Buggs Registered Users Posts: 958 Major grins
    edited June 28, 2010
    You REALLY NEEEEEED to get the meter figured out.
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    GrovesStudioGrovesStudio Registered Users Posts: 28 Big grins
    edited June 28, 2010
    D'Buggs wrote: »
    You REALLY NEEEEEED to get the meter figured out.

    I agree BUT I took it back since I was only renting it. It will be my next purchase once I pay off my lights!
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    D'BuggsD'Buggs Registered Users Posts: 958 Major grins
    edited June 29, 2010
    I agree BUT I took it back since I was only renting it. It will be my next purchase once I pay off my lights!


    You should've purchased the meter 1st, IMHO.... Set-up will be 'tough' now but not totally unbearable. It'll go a lot easier if you can get the images up on a monitor when factoring in the fill light (just easier to see what's going on).

    If not then work the HG as suggested, shooting in RAW with a test subject beforehand. Flag off the walls right and left of the posing area with black. The blue cast should pretty much be a moot point then. Pull the subject AS FAR AS FEASIBLE from the back wall. Set your shutter speed somewhere between 125th and 200, go for an aperture of 5.6 or so (more if you got camera support) then start test firing with various light outputs until you get an exposure thats GOOD and on the right of the histogram. Then repeat for the other light (with the main turned off) until you see what you deem 'good' for the fill light (forget the HG on this as it will be visual 'flavour'). Then test with BOTH lights AND check the HG again, just to be certain that you're not blowing highlights away with the combonation.

    - flag off walls
    - work up each light on its own, then test both
    - work the histogram; do NOT trust the LCD
    - Be certain you're shooting RAW
    - shoot a gray card and set WB in ACR
    - Take a laptop and either tether or upload your test images
    - Save and BUY that light meter, learn how it works... It'll be like a gift from the gods when ya do!


    That's how I'd go..... Good luck.
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    GrovesStudioGrovesStudio Registered Users Posts: 28 Big grins
    edited June 29, 2010
    I believe it still needs some fine tuning but they LOVE the pictures! I got a huge order yesterday! Thank you guys for all of your help!
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    Don KondraDon Kondra Registered Users Posts: 630 Major grins
    edited June 29, 2010
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    D'BuggsD'Buggs Registered Users Posts: 958 Major grins
    edited July 1, 2010
    Don Kondra wrote: »
    We need to "see" the evidence :)

    Cheers, Don

    Yeah,,,,, BRING IT!!!!
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    GrovesStudioGrovesStudio Registered Users Posts: 28 Big grins
    edited July 16, 2010
    TEST.jpg


    So... critique.. I can take it.. promise~!
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    Don KondraDon Kondra Registered Users Posts: 630 Major grins
    edited July 16, 2010
    Okay mwink.gif

    Pretty darn good with a couple of provisions..

    The focus is not on the eyes, if you look closely you will see the V on her top is sharp.

    The background is a little dark, I did a quick edit on highlights and some sharpening to show the difference.

    TEST.jpg

    Cheers, Don
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    GrovesStudioGrovesStudio Registered Users Posts: 28 Big grins
    edited July 16, 2010
    Don- I see the difference! Thanks for pointing it out!
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