Photos Look Blurry in CS5

Dogdots

Why is it that my photos look blurry in CS5 when I'm just looking at them, but if I grab hold of the top bar of the photo and hold it down...it looks sharp?

Anyone else notice this too?

It's almost like a noise reduction has been run on it.

Sam

Dogdots wrote: »

Why is it that my photos look blurry in CS5 when I'm just looking at them, but if I grab hold of the top bar of the photo and hold it down...it looks sharp?

Anyone else notice this too?

It's almost like a noise reduction has been run on it.

????????

Sam

racer

Are you using multiple layers when you are doing this? I have it set to zoom with the mouse scroll wheel, and I have noticed that, first, if you are between set zoom levels, say 46% zoom, it is much more blurry then if you go to the top and choose 50%. Second, I have found that when you have multiple layers, and zoom, sometimes it will look blurry, and clicking on the top bar makes it less blurry like your saying, untill you flatten the image, then it goes away, but you still deal with the first issue.
I find it rather annoying, and it is almost like using the zoom on the top bar (25%, 50%, etc) uses a different algorithem then when you zoom using the other methods.

Dogdots

Sam wrote: »

????????

Sam

I know --- It doesn't make sense, but racer explained it better

Mitchell

racer wrote: »

Are you using multiple layers when you are doing this? I have it set to zoom with the mouse scroll wheel, and I have noticed that, first, if you are between set zoom levels, say 46% zoom, it is much more blurry then if you go to the top and choose 50%. Second, I have found that when you have multiple layers, and zoom, sometimes it will look blurry, and clicking on the top bar makes it less blurry like your saying, untill you flatten the image, then it goes away, but you still deal with the first issue.
I find it rather annoying, and it is almost like using the zoom on the top bar (25%, 50%, etc) uses a different algorithem then when you zoom using the other methods.

I've noticed the same thing! It is quite maddening. Never had this problem with CS3.

Dogdots

racer wrote: »

Are you using multiple layers when you are doing this? I have it set to zoom with the mouse scroll wheel, and I have noticed that, first, if you are between set zoom levels, say 46% zoom, it is much more blurry then if you go to the top and choose 50%. Second, I have found that when you have multiple layers, and zoom, sometimes it will look blurry, and clicking on the top bar makes it less blurry like your saying, untill you flatten the image, then it goes away, but you still deal with the first issue.
I find it rather annoying, and it is almost like using the zoom on the top bar (25%, 50%, etc) uses a different algorithem then when you zoom using the other methods.

I'm so glad I'm not the only one that has noticed it. I find it so totally annoying -- to the point I'm thinking of not using CS5. Selling it if they'll let me. Never thought of the zoom factor being the cause. Why would they ever make a software program that does that especially when it's for editing photos? Wonder how many people have dumped photos they thought looked like crap if they used CS5 to check them out.

I use my Zoombrowser to check my photos and dump my dumpers. It's when I brought up a good sharp photo into CS5 I noticed it and couldn't figure out what the heck was happening.

I did have multiple photos open in CS5 too. I just tried one photo open in CS5 at 22.8% and it blurred on me, but sharpened up when I grabbed it at the top.

Whats one to do about it? How do you edit it properly?

Sam

AH.......now I gets it. Depending on your graphics card and CS5 settings you may not be able to display your images clearly except at even display percentages.

I can't remember all the settings, buttons, but my computer can take advantage of a feature that allows my images to be displayed clearly at any view percentage. Looks the same at 33% or 50%.

Sam

It's called Open GL. And takes advantage of newer graphics cards capabilities.

Dogdots

Sam wrote: »

AH.......now I gets it. Depending on your graphics card and CS5 settings you may not be able to display your images clearly except at even display percentages.

I can't remember all the settings, buttons, but my computer can take advantage of a feature that allows my images to be displayed clearly at any view percentage. Looks the same at 33% or 50%.

Sam

It's called Open GL. And takes advantage of newer graphics cards capabilities.

So my graphics card is the problem?

Does running a 32 bit instead of 64 make any difference? My understanding this would only make a difference in speed.

Also I noticed that it magnifies or shows you what it will look like when I clone. Is that the graphic card too? Or is that a new added feature in the software?

What kind of settings need to be set? I've not done anything yet as far as settings go.

Sorry for all the questions....I usually adjust pretty good to new software, but this one really has me confused

racer

Go to preferences, and there is a box to check to disable "Open GL". Certain type of zooms are rendered with the graphics card (open GL), but I dont think this problem has much to do with that. Even so, you can give it a try, but for me, it didnt make any difference, and I am using a newer Nvidia graphics card, with the latest drivers, and I have also experienced this problem on my other computer with a different card. The graphics card rendering only takes processes from the CPU, and sends them to the GPU processor, speeding things up. I think this problem is more a design flaw in the software

Dogdots

racer wrote: »

Go to preferences, and there is a box to check to disable "Open GL". Certain type of zooms are rendered with the graphics card (open GL), but I dont think this problem has much to do with that. Even so, you can give it a try, but for me, it didnt make any difference, and I am using a newer Nvidia graphics card, with the latest drivers, and I have also experienced this problem on my other computer with a different card. The graphics card rendering only takes processes from the CPU, and sends them to the GPU processor, speeding things up. I think this problem is more a design flaw in the software

I just tried it -- didn't help much. Noticed a difference in 2 photos open, but not in the rest of them. They were all good photos too that I opened. Found that really strange.

Agree with you that it must be a flaw in the software. Wonder if anyone has asked this question to Adobe.

If you have a newer graphic card and latest drivers...I'm probably out of luck to have this problem fixed.

Usually things don't bother me, but this really does

DJT

Hmm.... must not of his submit or my post will show twice

Anyhow, I haven't had a lot of time to play with CS5 yet, but found a discussion about this on Adobe Forums.
http://forums.adobe.com/thread/681729?tstart=0

basflt

i did not see this , not even with 10 layers

-do you have a real graphic card , or an on-board chip ? [ makes a big difference ]
-you have enough RAM ?

-Does running a 32 bit instead of 64 make any difference?
yes it does , but if you have a 32bit pc , you will need a 64bit pc to use it

Sam

Good find DJT.

Here is a direct link to a page with a list of graphic cards that will support open GL.

http://kb2.adobe.com/cps/831/cpsid_83117.html

Sam

racer

basflt wrote: »

i did not see this , not even with 10 layers

-do you have a real graphic card , or an on-board chip ? [ makes a big difference ]
-you have enough RAM ?

-Does running a 32 bit instead of 64 make any difference?
yes it does , but if you have a 32bit pc , you will need a 64bit pc to use it

From my understanding, this happens to everyone who owns photoshop, but the type of zoom you are using, and your ability to notice it, is were the problem is.
Inorder to replicate it, go to preferences and choose to zoom with your mouse scroll wheel, then go and zoom with the scroll wheel to 49%, then go to the top bar and chose 50%. If you were looking really close, you would notice that 50% from the bar is much sharper then 49% from the scroll zoom

racer

I guess to begin with, the only reliable way of judging sharpness is to zoom into 100%, so if we want to judge sharpness at any other zoom level, it will have to be one of the default zooms at the top (25%, 50% 100%, etc)

basflt

racer wrote: »

From my understanding, this happens to everyone who owns photoshop, but the type of zoom you are using, and your ability to notice it, is were the problem is.
Inorder to replicate it, go to preferences and choose to zoom with your mouse scroll wheel, then go and zoom with the scroll wheel to 49%, then go to the top bar and chose 50%. If you were looking really close, you would notice that 50% from the bar is much sharper then 49% from the scroll zoom

tried again
did not see it , sorry
guess its " my ability to notice it "

Dogdots

I just turned off my scroll with my mouse for making the photo bigger. Also changed back my GL to open again. Then I opened up 4 photos into CS5. As long as there are on the docking bar and I manually removed them from it they are ok. I notice a slight difference, but nothing as drastic as before. If I reopen them again then change them to Float all in Window or Float in window I have the blur again.

I'm confused

racer

basflt wrote: »

tried again
did not see it , sorry
guess its " my ability to notice it "

no, it is probably my understanding that is off I was just going by what I read from the adobe site, following the link that was posted

racer

Dogdots wrote: »

I just turned off my scroll with my mouse for making the photo bigger. Also changed back my GL to open again. Then I opened up 4 photos into CS5. As long as there are on the docking bar and I manually removed them from it they are ok. I notice a slight difference, but nothing as drastic as before. If I reopen them again then change them to Float all in Window or Float in window I have the blur again.

I'm confused

I just did exactly what you are saying, and WOW, it is VERY blurry!

I opened up two of the same photo (one named different), I chose "float all in windows", and zoomed one into 50%, and the other using the scroll wheel to 59. The 50% one remained constant sharpness no matter how I moved or messed with it. The 59% one had some MAJOR issues with blur AND sharpness, will moving the window, and trying to work with the image. I got the same results as the 59%, when I tryed using the navigation zoom slider, by moving the slider.

My only guess would be that when you click on the top of the window to move the window, it switches to a open GL rendering preview (as thats the best a computer can do while dragging a window). The reason it is looking so sharp when you click to drag the image, is not because the image is really that sharp, but because the preview is very poor quality and just adds a ton of sharpness. Try opening two of that same images to see what I mean, the preview while draging the window looks like it gets really sharp, but the image is really not that sharp, compared to the non moving image (set at a set zoom level). I really dont see the preview while dragging as a flaw, because at this point in technology, it is the best that can be done.

Now, the second issue of zooming with a scroll wheel, I believe that is a flaw, and that, like I said, it looks like the only way we will be able to judge sharpness reliably, is to use the set zoom levels that are on the top menu bar (25% 50% 100%).
Also take note, that when one is trying to judge sharpness (like when adding a shapness mask), you should be zoomed into 100%.

Anyway, I think I will just leave the scroll wheel zoom enabled, and use it for when I am editing my images. For the last step, sharpening, I will just use the top menu bar to zoom into 100%

Dogdots

racer wrote: »

I just did exactly what you are saying, and WOW, it is VERY blurry!

I opened up two of the same photo (one named different), I chose "float all in windows", and zoomed one into 50%, and the other using the scroll wheel to 59. The 50% one remained constant sharpness no matter how I moved or messed with it. The 59% one had some MAJOR issues with blur AND sharpness, will moving the window, and trying to work with the image. I got the same results as the 59%, when I tryed using the navigation zoom slider, by moving the slider.

My only guess would be that when you click on the top of the window to move the window, it switches to a open GL rendering preview (as thats the best a computer can do while dragging a window). The reason it is looking so sharp when you click to drag the image, is not because the image is really that sharp, but because the preview is very poor quality and just adds a ton of sharpness. Try opening two of that same images to see what I mean, the preview while draging the window looks like it gets really sharp, but the image is really not that sharp, compared to the non moving image (set at a set zoom level). I really dont see the preview while dragging as a flaw, because at this point in technology, it is the best that can be done.

Now, the second issue of zooming with a scroll wheel, I believe that is a flaw, and that, like I said, it looks like the only way we will be able to judge sharpness reliably, is to use the set zoom levels that are on the top menu bar (25% 50% 100%).
Also take note, that when one is trying to judge sharpness (like when adding a shapness mask), you should be zoomed into 100%.

Anyway, I think I will just leave the scroll wheel zoom enabled, and use it for when I am editing my images. For the last step, sharpening, I will just use the top menu bar to zoom into 100%

Now you brought me to my next thought....one that has been bugging me for awhile. I've edited some photos (have not sharpened them yet) that were sharp looking while veiwing in CS3 and Zoombrowser, but blurry in CS5. How has the "blur" effected my editing? Do I need to recheck them all? Also I cropped some at the 40ish setting when using the scroll wheel to inlarge the photo...will that automatically make my photos remain blurred? I would think not and that it's what you just mentioned....a preview issue in the software.

I must admit...I miss using my scroll wheel to enlarge my photos for viewing, editing and cropping. It was so easy. I will try what you just did. I'm just totally amazed that Adobe let this issue go thought without fixing it. Or if they knew it was an issue they would advise people before hand how it works. Darn it Adobe...ya should of figured that one out :cry

Checked out my graphic card -- it's a GForce 8300 GS.

basflt

after you switched from CS3 to CS5 , did you updated your driver ?
you should , as it has new features for CS5

http://www.nvidia.com/Download/index.aspx?lang=en-us

Additional Information:

* Supports the new GPU-accelerated features in Adobe CS5 .

Dogdots

basflt wrote: »

after you switched from CS3 to CS5 , did you updated your driver ?
you should , as it has new features for CS5

http://www.nvidia.com/Download/index.aspx?lang=en-us

No I didn't -- I'll do that now. Thanks

racer

Dogdots wrote: »

Now you brought me to my next thought....one that has been bugging me for awhile. I've edited some photos (have not sharpened them yet) that were sharp looking while veiwing in CS3 and Zoombrowser, but blurry in CS5.

With ZB and PS open at the same time, with the same image open, do they look the same sharpness at the set 50% and 100%? Also, if the images still look blurry in CS5, but sharp in ZB, does the sharpness match if you turn off open GL in PS?
Also, remember that ZB is rendering a preview image also. If you are viewing a raw image in ZB, you have to click on the image to open it up in a new window, then click "display original image". For a jpeg, you need to also open it up by double clicking on the image, opening it in a new window, then inorder to be able to judge sharpness, you need to click the "1:1" button. In ZB, not viewing at 1:1 will render a image that apears much sharper then it actually is.

Dogdots

racer wrote: »

With ZB and PS open at the same time, with the same image open, do they look the same sharpness at the set 50% and 100%? Also, if the images still look blurry in CS5, but sharp in ZB, does the sharpness match if you turn off open GL in PS?
Also, remember that ZB is rendering a preview image also. If you are viewing a raw image in ZB, you have to click on the image to open it up in a new window, then click "display original image". For a jpeg, you need to also open it up by double clicking on the image, opening it in a new window, then inorder to be able to judge sharpness, you need to click the "1:1" button. In ZB, not viewing at 1:1 will render a image that apears much sharper then it actually is.

I just did a comparison on ZB and CS5 with the same photo at 50%. Wow...there is a difference. The nose is the focal point in the photo. I've attached it, but sorry...I didn't make it big enough to really see the difference. This is with my GL turned on. I turned it off and the ZB was a little less sharp, but just so slightly. I had to keep turning it on and off to notice the change.

Both these images are jpeg images. I don't look at my Raws in ZB. I did, but would get confused when deleting the dumpers

What is the best way to check out your photos for sharpness and clarity when reviewing them?

racer

Dogdots wrote: »

This is with my GL turned on. I turned it off and the ZB was a little less sharp, but just so slightly. I had to keep turning it on and off to notice the change.

so your saying that when you turned off open GL in photoshop, the image was sharper, similar to the ZB image?
If that is the case, then I would keep open GL turned off!

What is the best way to check out your photos for sharpness and clarity when reviewing them?

My opinion, I dont think ZB is the best tool for checking sharpness. I just use bridge to organize my photos, and use the little 100% shot that pops up when you click on a image. I leave the sharpening for the last step in PS, and view image at 100% with the USM sharpener, to judge how much sharpness it needs. But I am far, far from a expert on this, so dont quote me
Someone else might be able to give much better advice on sharpening

Dogdots

racer wrote: »

so your saying that when you turned off open GL in photoshop, the image was sharper, similar to the ZB image?
If that is the case, then I would keep open GL turned off!



My opinion, I dont think ZB is the best tool for checking sharpness. I just use bridge to organize my photos, and use the little 100% shot that pops up when you click on a image. I leave the sharpening for the last step in PS, and view image at 100% with the USM sharpener, to judge how much sharpness it needs. But I am far, far from a expert on this, so dont quote me
Someone else might be able to give much better advice on sharpening

My GL was turned on when I looked at them and did the screen shot. That's where the ZB looked sharper and the CS5 looked "less sharp". When I turned my GL off the ZB image would get a little blurrier, but hard to notice unless you really watched it. CS5 too got a littler blurrier.

My concern is picking the right image to edit. Sometimes I may think it looks sharp in a particular area I wanted sharp in my photo, but is it? Is what I'm seeing -- what it really is?

Never used Bridge. I'll give it a try today. Always willing to learn a new way of doing things

Sam

I haven't used ZB in awhile, but one thing I did notice is that this software has the ability to really display an image really well, with great sharpness.

Canon camera, Canon software.

Sam

Dogdots

Sam wrote: »

I haven't used ZB in awhile, but one thing I did notice is that this software has the ability to really display an image really well, with great sharpness.

Canon camera, Canon software.

Sam

Your right Sam...it does display a photo really well. Also displays a poorly taken photo well too

So I wonder...is it doing something to the photo to view it or are you seeing it "as is".

Sam

Dogdots wrote: »

Your right Sam...it does display a photo really well. Also displays a poorly taken photo well too

So I wonder...is it doing something to the photo to view it or are you seeing it "as is".

Interesting question. I would need to play with this. I haven't used ZB in a long time. Can you print from ZB? Can you save as in ZB? What happens if you copy and paste into CS5?

Sam

racer

Dogdots wrote: »

Never used Bridge. I'll give it a try today. Always willing to learn a new way of doing things

sort of off topic here, but bridge is way superior to ZB and any of its features, especially CS5 bridge! Its like switching from ms paint to photoshop (okay, maybe some exageration there). A big plus with bridge is that you can right click on any photo (jpeg or raw), and open it in camera raw! A lot of the time I just edit everything in bridge with camera raw and dont even open up PS.

A step beyond bridge would be Lightroom. I am just starting to learn lightroom, but it might be a bit overkill for my needs

Dogdots

Sam wrote: »

Interesting question. I would need to play with this. I haven't used ZB in a long time. Can you print from ZB? Can you save as in ZB? What happens if you copy and paste into CS5?

Sam

Honestly I don't know what ZB can do. I just use it to view my photos, delete my dumpers and find my keepers to edit.

My usual work flow is to view and dump in ZB, then edit in photoshop. I do my photo sharpening in DPP. I know...not the best to use, but it's been working ok for me.

Just finished taking a closer look at a photo I played around with. This photo was edited in raw - a little on the extreme side on darkness. I don't edit in Raw so that was my first time playing around with it. I wanted to check the whiskers. The whiskers always help me on knowing if I was sharpening to much or not.

First photo was cropped in at 33.3% - the natural setting on CS5 with my CL turned on. Notice that the whiskers aren't jagged, but smooth. I'm not holding onto the top bar...just as in on screen.

Second photo is a screen capture and crop at 100% while holding onto the top bar of the photo. The whiskers are jagged which can happen when over sharpened. Again with my CL turned on.

I did turn off my CL and it didn't change the look on either photo. And yes...I checked the screen captured one before I did the screen capture

We all knew there was a difference, but I was surprised at how much with the whisker check.

Does Raw do some sharpening automatically?

racer -- off to take a look at bridge now. Been a busy day today so I've not had a chance yet to do it. New puppy...he keeps me runnin'