D7000 announcement. Is it finally time to upgrade my D200?

greenpea

Finally, a compelling upgrade option?
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-20016377-1.html

ziggy53

That's a very compelling camera and I'm a little surprised that Nikon would produce a mid-range DX camera with features and price that would seem to draw Nikon purchasers away from the high-end DX, D300S. Normally they would use the "trickle-down" features approach.

cab.in.boston

That looks pretty sweet. Makes me very excited to see what the D400 is going to be like.

They announced two new lenses, as well. Both FX, a 35mm f/1.4, and the 200mm f/2 VRII. Both out of my league, but still good to see this announcement.

ETA: Sample stills and video from Chase Jarvis

Mav

D7000 announced - D90 Upgrade
Looks like a very interesting upgrade to a D90 which, before now, I had no interest in upgrading... but I have to say, this looks very tempting!

http://www.dpreview.com/news/1009/10091515nikond7000.asp

Pre-Photokina 2010: Nikon has released the D7000 mid-level digital SLR. Housed in a magnesium alloy body, the feature-rich camera incorporates a 16.2Mp CMOS sensor, faster 'Expeed 2'-branded processor, 921k dot 3.0" LCD and can record 1080p24 full HD movies. It features the company's latest 39-point AF system with 3D tracking and 2,016 pixel RGB metering sensor. It will start shipping with the 18-105mm VR kit lens from October 2010 at a retail price of $1499/£1299.99/€1399. We've had a pre-production D7000 in the office for long enough for us to prepare an full hands-on preview looking at the camera, its features and where it'll sit in the range.

MileHighAko

At this price point ($1200 body), I'm wondering if we're going to see a sub $2k FX camera sometime soon. With those specs, it seems to replace the D300s as well as the D90, making a new full frame entry model more likely. At least that's my thinking.

MarkR

Certainly looks impressive for the $$. The proof will be in the pudding (image quality.)

ziggy53

I merged these 2 similar threads and renamed the title of the thread. Carry on.

Mav

ziggy53 wrote: »

I merged these 2 similar threads and renamed the title of the thread. Carry on.

Dammit -I didn't search properly first. Thanks for merging

cab.in.boston

MileHighAko wrote: »

With those specs, it seems to replace the D300s as well as the D90

I doubt it. Performance-wise, the D300s and D90 have always been similar, but the larger body with more (customizable) controls, better (in my opinion and hands anyway) ergonomics, CF card, and more advanced AF system have set the D300/s apart from the D90.

Sure, if you were looking at the two models right now, you'd very possibly go with a D7000 over a D300s based on the performance specs. But I don't think this will take the place of the "prosumer" D300-class DX body. I expect we'll see a D400 (or whatever they call it) announcement in a few months or so. I'd guess the D400 will use the same sensor as D7000, but continue to have better build quality/weathersealing, higher fps, more/better AF points, etc.

FLYING EYEBALL

looks pretty sweet!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNKtFkX29IE



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMbBKukJzBk

Mav

Really great videos demonstrating the capabilities. Although, he looks like a pretty gifted filmmaker too...

FLYING EYEBALL

Mav wrote: »

Really great videos demonstrating the capabilities. Although, he looks like a pretty gifted filmmaker too...

Yep

He did a short for the D90 release as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVQX1rC-fRA

brancaleone

D800?

cab.in.boston wrote: »

I doubt it. Performance-wise, the D300s and D90 have always been similar, but the larger body with more (customizable) controls, better (in my opinion and hands anyway) ergonomics, CF card, and more advanced AF system have set the D300/s apart from the D90.

Sure, if you were looking at the two models right now, you'd very possibly go with a D7000 over a D300s based on the performance specs. But I don't think this will take the place of the "prosumer" D300-class DX body. I expect we'll see a D400 (or whatever they call it) announcement in a few months or so. I'd guess the D400 will use the same sensor as D7000, but continue to have better build quality/weathersealing, higher fps, more/better AF points, etc.

I believe that with the D7000 specs a D400 doesn't make much sense, maybe a D800 or an updated (D700) full-frame camera would fit better in the Nikon stable.
Time will tell.

rookieshooter

Cannon WAIT for their next FX body -- wow!

thegridrunner

Rumor has it that Nikon is working on a carbon fiber body for their next FX body

cab.in.boston

brancaleone wrote: »

I believe that with the D7000 specs a D400 doesn't make much sense, maybe a D800 or an updated (D700) full-frame camera would fit better in the Nikon stable.
Time will tell.

I disagree.

One could say that with the D90 specs a D300/D300s didn't make much sense, either. And yet I have both and MUCH prefer using the D300. It's not always just about specs.

There are a couple of key things that I think will differentiate the D400 from the D7000. If they simply just dropped this new 16.2 MP sensor into the current D300s body, added the improved video and made no other changes, this mythical D400 would still have better specs than the D7000. To wit:

Autofocus system:
D300s 51 pts, 15 cross-type
D7000 39 pts, 9 cross-type

Exposure, WB, and flash bracketing:
D300s up to 9 frames
D7000 2 or 3 frames

Flash compensation:
D300s -3 to +9 EV
D7000 -3 to +1 EV

Frame rate/continuous shooting:
D300s up to 7 fps (no grip)
D7000 up to 6 fps (no grip)

Memory card format:
D300s SD & CF
D7000 2x SD

Physical size:
D300s 5.8" x 4.5" x 2.9"
D7000 5.2" x 4.1" x 3.0"
(Yes, there are those, like me, to whom the larger size of the D300-class is a good thing!)

Just looking at the two bodies tells me that the D300s has more controls readily available (AF-ON button, metering mode switch instead of button+dial, focus area mode switch instead of button+dial...)

etc...

If they planned to obsolete the D300-class, I'm sure the specs of the D7000 would have been better than the D300s across the board, and they're not. The D7000 would also have been a lot more expensive. I don't think Nikon wants their top-spec DX body to compete only against the 60D and let the 7D have that share of the market all to itself.

The only thing I see in the specs that makes this D7000 better than the D300/s (which has been out for what, 3 years already?) are the video (personally I don't care about that), the resolution (16.2 vs 12.1 amounts to about an extra 300 pixels on every side - significant? yeah, I guess you can crop more, but it's not THE most important thing in the world), ISO performance, and the metering system (only these last two are truly significant, IMO). If the new sensor and metering were added to the D300s, without any other changes (and I highly doubt they'll make NO other changes), then the D400 is a superior body to the D7000.

So no, I don't think a D400 is rendered moot by this introduction. On the contrary, it makes me excited to see what improvements the D400 will hold over the D300s.

I understand the desire for a D700x (or D800 or D900, whatever it's called), but believe it or not, not everyone needs or even wants FX. Some like the smaller and more affordable lenses and the extra "reach" of DX. In fact, I've heard people who want a "D3DX," a full size pro body with a DX sensor that would compete a little more directly with the Canon 1D. I think an updated D700 would absolutely fit in the stable, and I'm sure we'll see it in the next year or so. I just don't think that this announcement means the end of the D300-class body. There's no reason we can't have both. The D300/s has been too good for Nikon to just drop it and force those of us who use and love it into a smaller, more consumer-class body.

jonh68

My theory is nikon is now adopting a trickle up approach in which new sensors are introduced into the lower end cameras, where the money is, and then the refinements of the sensor gets implemented into the high end cameras. This way, the high end cameras will have more features and the best, most refined sensor. The way it is now, the high end cameras get the new sensor, but the low end cameras get the refinements.

digger2

D7000 Announced!
Wow, just look at the specs and find a reason to still buy a D90 or even D300s.
http://nikonusa.com/Find-Your-Nikon/Product/Digital-SLR/25468/D7000.html#tab-ProductDetail.ProductTabs.Overview

Qarik

*shrugs* I still would get the d300s over that. I didn't see a dial for single point focus on the back. I assume the d300s will still have a more robust AF (it still has 12 more af points and the AF spread of any SLR i n the market). Will wait to see if ISO performance is as good as D300s. If it is AS good then that is real selling point..more pixels with same performance. Otherwise I'll take 12M with better ISO anyday. Lastly...the D7000 stil has scene modes haha.

wrt to the D90, you have an argument mostly due to the new AF system.

digger2

True, But
The D90 is a poly body Vs the Mag alloy of the new one.
Plus, its only $200 or so more than a D90 and $600 less than the 300s


wrt to the D90, you have an argument mostly due to the new AF system.[/QUOTE]

Y_Knot

digger2 wrote: »

The D90 is a poly body Vs the Mag alloy of the new one.
Plus, its only $200 or so more than a D90 and $600 less than the 300s



The D90 is $300 less & the D300S is $280 more than the D7000. I would still prefer the D300s unless the D7000 has better high ISO performance.

ziggy53

Threads merged. Carry on.

Howzit

digger2 wrote: »

The D90 is a poly body Vs the Mag alloy of the new one. ...

From what I understand the D7000 has a polycarbonate body with magnesuim alloy plates (chassis) built in. It will be interesting to see how it compares in build to the D60 with a polycarbonate body and aluminum chassis.

ziggy53 wrote: »

Threads merged. Carry on.

Can we just rename this thread to "D7000" announcement? I too almost missed it

ziggy53

Howzit wrote: »

... Can we just rename this thread to "D7000" announcement? I too almost missed it

I flipped the order of the phrases. Let's see if that cures the problem.

Howzit

ziggy53 wrote: »

I flipped the order of the phrases. Let's see if that cures the problem.

Thanks mate

Matthew Saville

jonh68 wrote: »

My theory is nikon is now adopting a trickle up approach in which new sensors are introduced into the lower end cameras, where the money is, and then the refinements of the sensor gets implemented into the high end cameras. This way, the high end cameras will have more features and the best, most refined sensor. The way it is now, the high end cameras get the new sensor, but the low end cameras get the refinements.

Nikon has been doing "trickle up" in one form or another since the D100 / D70...

For comparison, I'm sure you remember the white lens ads; Canon originally went really headstrong into the idea that if amateurs saw a ton of pros using high-end Canon gear, they'd buy a Canon beginner camera in hopes of one day achieving that high-end upgrade etc. And honestly, Canon sorta dropped the ball a few times at the beginner level, while cameras like Nikon's D70 were EXACTLY what consumers actually needed. Nikon slowly grew it's roots in the beginner DSLR world, while admittedly letting it's pros down for a generation or two. But it worked, TONS of people bought the D70, D40, D80, etc... The D40 + D40X was a particularly brilliant strategy, because you could literally choose how many megapixels you wanted (or could afford) in your camera, while Canon was *forcing* even it's most basic beginners to buy more and more megapixels...

Anyways, I digress. It's been an interesting history, to see how Canon built their DSLR empire and how Nikon built theirs. I admit there were a couple of years when Nikon was a real let-down for the high-end, low-light crowd, but they played their cards right, and used the massive beginner camera sales to fund the R&D of a KILLER FX pro system. While Canon sat back on their haunches and assumed that their 5D mk1 and mk2 would be good enough to stay on top of the mid-level pro market. But it backfired on them, and instead of upgrading from the $3K 5-series to the $8K 1Ds series, tons of people bailed for a D700. And now even the flagship D3 is getting down below $3K used, since the D3X and D3s are here. While Canon, again, is losing (portriat / wedding) pros because it's mid-level flagship system is 1.3x crop. (which admittedly is BY FAR the best system for telephoto sports, IMO. It's just misunderstood by most portrait / wedding photographers, even though the mk3 and mk4 have amazing high ISO performance.)

Alright, enough rambling! Good discussion...

=Matt=

jonh68

Matthew Saville wrote:

Nikon has been doing "trickle up" in one form or another since the D100 / D70...

For comparison, I'm sure you remember the white lens ads; Canon originally went really headstrong into the idea that if amateurs saw a ton of pros using high-end Canon gear, they'd buy a Canon beginner camera in hopes of one day achieving that high-end upgrade etc. And honestly, Canon sorta dropped the ball a few times at the beginner level, while cameras like Nikon's D70 were EXACTLY what consumers actually needed. Nikon slowly grew it's roots in the beginner DSLR world, while admittedly letting it's pros down for a generation or two. But it worked, TONS of people bought the D70, D40, D80, etc... The D40 + D40X was a particularly brilliant strategy, because you could literally choose how many megapixels you wanted (or could afford) in your camera, while Canon was *forcing* even it's most basic beginners to buy more and more megapixels...

Anyways, I digress. It's been an interesting history, to see how Canon built their DSLR empire and how Nikon built theirs. I admit there were a couple of years when Nikon was a real let-down for the high-end, low-light crowd, but they played their cards right, and used the massive beginner camera sales to fund the R&D of a KILLER FX pro system. While Canon sat back on their haunches and assumed that their 5D mk1 and mk2 would be good enough to stay on top of the mid-level pro market. But it backfired on them, and instead of upgrading from the $3K 5-series to the $8K 1Ds series, tons of people bailed for a D700. And now even the flagship D3 is getting down below $3K used, since the D3X and D3s are here. While Canon, again, is losing (portriat / wedding) pros because it's mid-level flagship system is 1.3x crop. (which admittedly is BY FAR the best system for telephoto sports, IMO. It's just misunderstood by most portrait / wedding photographers, even though the mk3 and mk4 have amazing high ISO performance.)

Alright, enough rambling! Good discussion...

=Matt=

That isn't trickle up though in the context of high end cameras vs low end. Traditionally, the newest sensors get released in the high end cameras. Then, nikon tweaks those sensors and puts them in the low end cameras about a year or two after the initial release. While the high end cameras may have better features and function, they don't get the best version of the sensor, take the d300 vs d90 as an example. Now we have a new sensor that is being introduced into the low end cameras first, the d3100 and d7000. My guess is in the first part of 2011, we are going to get a d300s replacement with this new sensor after nikon gets practical in the field feedback of this new sensor. They will take what they learn and then refine the sensor for the top of the line dx body so it will boast the best features and best possible version of the sensor technology.

thegridrunner

Hopefully they'll release the next version of the updated D700...I've been waiting for it almost 7 months already and now it looks like it will not be released until the first quarter of next year.... :cry
I would imagine that the next full frame will have at least 18MP, higher iso performance, carbon fiber body, better preview screen, higher flash syncs, 1080 30/24p (I'm really looking forward to this feature), better sound capture, etc...
The only problem is that it will not be out until next year. :

kyeezie

I have been wanting to upgrade from my D200. Want something with better low light. Waiting to see what this can do.

greenpea

kyeezie wrote: »

I have been wanting to upgrade from my D200. Want something with better low light. Waiting to see what this can do.

I'm with you! I figured this is my excuse to upgrade my D200, but no one on this thread is comparing the D7000 with the D200. So for you and me, here is a quick comparison

Effective pixels
D200 10.0 million
D7000 16.2 million

ISO rating
D200 100 - 1600 in 1, 1/2 or 1/3 EV steps (up to 3200 as boost)
D7000 100 - 6400 in 1, 1/2 or 1/3 EV steps (100 - 25600 with boost)

Max shutter
D200 1/8000 sec
D7000 1/8000 sec

Movie Clips
D200 :cry
D7000 Yes, 1920 x 1080 (HD 24fps), 1280 x 720 (HD 24, 25, 30fps), 640 x 424 (24fps)

LCD
D200 2.5" 230,000
D7000 3" 921,000

FPS
D200 5fps
D7000 6fps

In all fairness, I do still love my D200 and it still has plenty of good images left in it. Besides the Adobe guy told me that with Lightroom 3 and the new version of ACR, I don't need to ever upgrade my camera again rolleyes

kyeezie

I am waiting to see other people's experience and reviews, and pictures. As much as I liked the videos I have seen, it's not like they are done by a "normal" person like me. I don't need video so that doesn't really bother me one way or the other. I want to see what it looks like in low light conditions. I am a person that can't pre order stuff like this. I need to touch it, and hold it and use it myself. I need to compare. So those of you that are getting it, please post pictures when the time comes!!:D