Allowing customer's cropping-what's your opinion?

sein_ling

Andy wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback! In the meantime, set your galleries with Proof Delay so that you can re-adjust the crops as you see fit.

I see this is an older discussion, but I'm just re-opening my store and was surprised to find that I have no control of the "crop".

Cropping is part of composition and the "art" of the image--control of that should rest with the artist (illustrators etc who also use Smugmug, not just photographers). Allowing the buyer to "crop" is violating the artist's image. If the buyer feels they must "crop", then I'm fine with them NOT buying my images.

As an artist, I cannot sell on Smugmug if the buyer has the ability to crop (and if Smugmug doesn't allow me to disable the option).

EVEN though the artist can use that proof-delay thing, the buyer expects that their "crop" will hold--and that's what they think they're buying. I am not going to re-crop everything by hand, and also risk having an angry buyer etc. What a complete hassle!

I'm completely dumbfounded that Smugmug will not let me, the artist, disable the crop-at-shopping-cart feature. Even though I love the Smugmug Pro features, I cannot sell on Smugmug until the "crop" issue is dealt with, and I may have to look elsewhere.

I'm very disappointed. Please redesign and put the "crop" back in control of the artists.
--Shirley

leftquark

As a landscape photographer myself, this is something that I've always hoped we would do, however there's a lot more that's at stake then just a simple toggle, and because of that we've been focusing our attention on bringing other improvements to the store. For example, is it obvious that disabling cropping would also disable some of the most common print sizes? We want to give plenty of control/options to all of you, but we don't want to do build confusing tools that are hard for SmugMuggers to use.

jmphotocraft

Here's a crazy idea - talk to your customer while the order is in proof delay if they choose weird cropping or a bad print shape. Or just override their cropping if it makes sense. I think 1% of my customers even notice they can do cropping themselves anyway, so it's not like this will add much to your order flow.

Cygnus Studios

Here's another crazy idea. Only offer the size(s) that doesn't require cropping and you'll solve that problem.

leftquark

jmphotocraft wrote: »

talk to your customer while the order is in proof delay if they choose weird cropping or a bad print shape. Or just override their cropping if it makes sense. I think 1% of my customers even notice they can do cropping themselves anyway, so it's not like this will add much to your order flow.

Cygnus Studios wrote: »

Here's another crazy idea. Only offer the size(s) that doesn't require cropping and you'll solve that problem.

I do a combination of these 2. I only offer sizes that match the aspect ratio of the photo so no cropping is needed. Cropping isn't exactly obvious, and I haven't had a single case yet where someone has tried to crop a photo. If they did, I'd just use the Proof Delay to undo it (and let the customer know, obviously).

tartan snow

To be honest I don't really care if they crop it when ordering or at home with a pair of scissors if that's what they need to fit a frame or whatever. They are paying for it after all. It does annoy me though when I see the sales history that some people have cut off part of a head or a horse's legs after I'd taken the trouble to compose it to look it's best but I got fed up telling people to ask first if the want a different size. I don't have proof delay turned on, they can order a print one day and have it through their letter box the next and that is one of the reasons people come back, speed of delivery. Folk want stuff immediately.

LadyJemima

As a customer (who recently ordered some headshots), I would appreciate the ability or option to crop my images. As a photographer, I also understand the need to protect the compositional integrity of the image, but...I would allow customers to crop if purchasing one of my images.

fabthi

To put it simple, I don't see and I haven't read a single valid reason why SM should NOT leave to photographers the decision whether to allow or not customers to crop images.

leftquark

If we added this ability, it'd be an option the photographer would choose.

fabthi

@leftquark said:
it'd be an option the photographer would choose.

So you're saying that is a problem for SM? And therefore photographers (that are SM paying clients) should not be given this control over THEIR own images?
If this is what you really mean, it's a rather unfair behaviour from SM

Art Scott

It should be solely up to the photographer...a simple on off switch...
If your image is fully copyrighted...meaning registered with the US COPYRIGHT OFFICE...by allowing a client to crop you have allowed them to create a new work of art and they can claim ownership, unless you register their crop...
.
It actually has just become their work of art and their vision...
.
You could also sign each piece in photoshop with your signature...this might help stop client cropping...but a SM photographer should not have to go to all that trouble.

leftquark

@fabthi said:

@leftquark said:
it'd be an option the photographer would choose.

So you're saying that is a problem for SM? And therefore photographers (that are SM paying clients) should not be given this control over THEIR own images?
If this is what you really mean, it's a rather unfair behaviour from SM

No, it'd be an option that YOU, as the photographer, and the SM Paying customer, would have some control over.

There's 2 issues at play here:
1) Allowing other aspect ratio sizes to be printed, that require cropping
2) Allowing cropping at all

If we did anything, it'd most likely be towards item 1, a toggle, as @Art Scott mentions, that would only allow a visitor to purchase a print using an aspect ratio that doesn't require cropping. You'd have complete control over whether all the sizes would be available, or only the sizes that fit the aspect ratio would be available. For example, if the "don't allow cropped sizes" option was enabled, and you posted a 2:3 photo, then an 8x10 wouldn't be available. I'm not sure if we'd also take the step of disabling the crop tool in the cart, but that's a possibility that we could decide if / when we build this option.