I agree a little bit with some of the above, that it does seem to violate the KISS theory (keep it simple stupid). The instructions aren't that hard, but they are multifaceted, and I could imagine that could discourage new participants.
All my photo gear was boxed up for a while, so I didn't read it at first with an eye to really consider participating right now.
I worry a little bit that this rule "Only those who have an image entered to the Final thread will be able to critique the final images. All other replies or comments will be deleted. " actually discourages critique, because (especially if you aren't around during the first stage), it's easier to critique images that are all in place, rather than through all the initial posts. I could go back to the individual posts and give my 2 cents, but I imagine those posts are a bit past their prime now.
Maybe next months I'll have more time to participate, and earlier. This seems like a lot of work for the mods!
An image that has been pre posted for constructive critiquing is when everyone can participate to critique. This is the most critical time for all to participate if they choose to not participate by entering for themselves. This is when a photographer can better what they have done, or get confirmation that they have hit a target. To have everyone who has not participated in the challenges at all to critique in the final thread only, would basically be too late. Seriously, critiquing should ultimately be done before hand.
The reason I have made it so only those who have entered in the final be able to critique, is to give closure on the final images and to help give insight not only to the people who have entered their photo, but insight on those that participated on what they truly feel about another competitor finished product. It is an exercise of sorts. It also eliminates the feeling of unfairness when the placing points are given. Thus giving those who do participate to the end a true evaluation.
Yes, I can see where you would think that having the images all in one thread easy to critique. But the point of this whole challenge is to get people to start participating at ALL levels of the challenges. If not by entering, then by critique by going to individuals threads. This is what a forum is about. The reward for making it to the final thread is the exclusiveness.
We shall see how this goes for now. I know this month has been a low turn out, but that was expected as the holidays and the fact that it will take time for things to work out. I like how the critiquing has been going so far though. Not too much work at this point. Nothing is ever set in stone though!
In the first challenge, I found myself wondering whether the people who entered in the end had looked at the preceding process. There were two items which I had not previously seen which it would have been nice to discuss, and some of the comments appeared to ignore that which had gone before. If I had the comments before I posted the final photo I could perhaps have done better. I was sorry not to see some of the practice shots in the final - particularly the sewing machine one.
This is good practice though - I had to keep in mind that I had to say something positive before anything else was said. OTOH I could feel other people perhaps straining to say something positive about what I did.
“"..an adventure is an inconvenience rightly considered." G.K. Chesterton”
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sapphire73Registered Users, Super ModeratorsPosts: 1,944moderator
edited December 21, 2013
Many thanks to all who ventured to enter this first challenge and took the time to write such thoughtful comments! Hope more will join in the next challenge round.
There will always be variety in how people interpret the challenges & execute them. That's what makes it interesting!
It took a little longer to give this kind of feedback - trying to touch on some of the aspects Andy suggested in his tips on critiquing. I hope the critiques (given and received) are as helpful to others as they were for me.
In this first challenge, my photo would definitely have seen improvements if I would have had the time to get the shot & post a thread for discussion prior to entry time. It was nice, however, to be able to participate in the entry & finals portion. I look forward to having the time to participate in the discussion part of the next challenge. I was glad I took a break from processing Nutcracker photos to try this challenge last minute & really appreciate the comments on all of the photos. It helps me a lot to see what others see in all the photos & how they react to them. I felt like the comments were well explained and helpful to each of the photos entered. Very good learning experience.
My time before Monday was consumed with the Nutcracker ballet, including making 3 Spanish costumes this year. They turned out quite nice, fit well & the dancers looked great dancing in them:
Merde!
The next challenge will be posted in the New year, so the Holiday festivities would have died down. I am hoping that is the main reason for low participation. However I feel that this small first round went well and was good practice. Not overwhelming for anyone. I think that if people do participate, they should consider doing the pre posting of images so they can work on bettering and getting help if it warrants for ideas.
I hope the new people who missed entering into the finals but tried their hand at the pre critiques, try again this next round too. For those who celebrate Christmas and for those who do not, may your days be filled with joy and peace!
I missed December due to the holiday festivities, etc. However, I'm not sure if this new format will entice me to participate. I agree that a month is way too long. If I can't shoot in the first two weeks, then I will not have another chance to participate until the next month. I think that it will be difficult to gain the kind of continuity that we had a few years ago.
However, i am excited that the challenges are back. I have been doing a lot of critiquing for photo clubs and have had the opportunity to jury a 90-piece photography show this fall. I would have offered comments on the final entries, but I hadn't entered a photo. I don't like the idea of being shut out if I don't have time to shoot.
I will keep my eyes open toward continuing to participate, but the new format seems to drag it out. Like all new efforts, this will continue to evolve.
JAG, thanks for your efforts and time on this. I admire your commttment and your willingness to try something new.
I missed December due to the holiday festivities, etc. However, I'm not sure if this new format will entice me to participate. I agree that a month is way too long. If I can't shoot in the first two weeks, then I will not have another chance to participate until the next month. I think that it will be difficult to gain the kind of continuity that we had a few years ago.
However, i am excited that the challenges are back. I have been doing a lot of critiquing for photo clubs and have had the opportunity to jury a 90-piece photography show this fall. I would have offered comments on the final entries, but I hadn't entered a photo. I don't like the idea of being shut out if I don't have time to shoot.
I will keep my eyes open toward continuing to participate, but the new format seems to drag it out. Like all new efforts, this will continue to evolve.
JAG, thanks for your efforts and time on this. I admire your commttment and your willingness to try something new.
Chris
I think what people are missing here is that the participating is at different levels. Thus, if you cannot shoot within the time frame, try to participate in the pre critiques.
I have changed the rule for the Final images critiques for this next round. It will still be that the participants who have made the final round be the only ones to critique while the final round is open. But once all the points are listed, then anyone will be able to come in an critique should they desire.
Also this round, I am giving 3 weeks to shoot and learn before the entry thread goes up. If people cannot go out and shoot with that much time, then I do not know what to do to improve it. I cannot please everyone!
The points of these challenges are to take people out of their comfort zones. Thus, more time is needed for them to learn how to use editing programs and how to learn to critique. There are many facets to this challenge and if everyone starts to get into it, I am sure it will keep everyone busy when they come in to not only participate with their own images, but critique others.
We will still give this a try as it stands now that the holidays are over. Happy shooting!
Just getting started here in the forum, and I love the idea of this kind of contest. I said I love the idea—I need to think about it in practice.
There is not much out of my comfort zone as far as "shoot and receive critique" (we were pummeled at Brooks Institute when I was a kid, ), except underwater photography, but what *is* out of my comfort zone is shooting a particular subject on any kind of schedule.
I generally shoot to convey the feeling of something that pulls me, no matter what or when it is. If I could enter past shots, it's a no-brainer for me, but that would also take away from part of the stretch. Your approach would require more discipline and focus than I am used to.
Therefore, I just might go for it, heh.
–Mark
"Conventional thinking is the ruin of our souls..." ~Rumi
_____________________________________________ My SmugMug Galleries
After a [long] hiatus from the challenges, I was looking forward to returning for '14. Was a little confused when I saw the format had been changed. I think this is an interesting approach; shifting the focus from just votes to involving the critique process as well. I originally did the challenges to be outside of my comfort zone, and many of the ideas that were conceived for them were wonderful. I do believe the time frame is a bit lengthy. Only 12 challenges for the whole year? Perhaps I'll jump in and give it a go; I do miss the challenges.
After a [long] hiatus from the challenges, I was looking forward to returning for '14. Was a little confused when I saw the format had been changed. I think this is an interesting approach; shifting the focus from just votes to involving the critique process as well. I originally did the challenges to be outside of my comfort zone, and many of the ideas that were conceived for them were wonderful. I do believe the time frame is a bit lengthy. Only 12 challenges for the whole year? Perhaps I'll jump in and give it a go; I do miss the challenges.
Welcome back! If people really find these challenges challenging, then we should see loads of people participating as time goes on. Its a matter of getting people that are here to participate first and others will come! As I mentioned before, nothing is written in stone. If needed to have more challenges and less time for each, we can change to that. But while everyone gets use to the new format and the bugs are worked out, things will remain for now.
I think that if there was a separate folder under "Shots" - call it something like, "Competition with critiques", it would be much easier to follow instead of being intermingled with the Alphabet and mini challenges. Plus it wouldn't get lost under Dgrin Challenges. The folder would be cleared out after challenge.
I think photographers would appreciate critiques as being its main value.
There will be some modifications, I am really swamped at the moment and will have the modified challenge up hopefully by the weekend. Thanks for your patience.
There will be some modifications, I am really swamped at the moment and will have the modified challenge up hopefully by the weekend. Thanks for your patience.
Thanks for the update. Hope you take all the time you need. I partly asked because I will have some free time next week!
Comments
An image that has been pre posted for constructive critiquing is when everyone can participate to critique. This is the most critical time for all to participate if they choose to not participate by entering for themselves. This is when a photographer can better what they have done, or get confirmation that they have hit a target. To have everyone who has not participated in the challenges at all to critique in the final thread only, would basically be too late. Seriously, critiquing should ultimately be done before hand.
The reason I have made it so only those who have entered in the final be able to critique, is to give closure on the final images and to help give insight not only to the people who have entered their photo, but insight on those that participated on what they truly feel about another competitor finished product. It is an exercise of sorts. It also eliminates the feeling of unfairness when the placing points are given. Thus giving those who do participate to the end a true evaluation.
Yes, I can see where you would think that having the images all in one thread easy to critique. But the point of this whole challenge is to get people to start participating at ALL levels of the challenges. If not by entering, then by critique by going to individuals threads. This is what a forum is about. The reward for making it to the final thread is the exclusiveness.
We shall see how this goes for now. I know this month has been a low turn out, but that was expected as the holidays and the fact that it will take time for things to work out. I like how the critiquing has been going so far though. Not too much work at this point. Nothing is ever set in stone though!
This is good practice though - I had to keep in mind that I had to say something positive before anything else was said. OTOH I could feel other people perhaps straining to say something positive about what I did.
There will always be variety in how people interpret the challenges & execute them. That's what makes it interesting!
It took a little longer to give this kind of feedback - trying to touch on some of the aspects Andy suggested in his tips on critiquing. I hope the critiques (given and received) are as helpful to others as they were for me.
Happy holidays everyone.
Cheers,
Gretchen
My SmugMug Galleries
My time before Monday was consumed with the Nutcracker ballet, including making 3 Spanish costumes this year. They turned out quite nice, fit well & the dancers looked great dancing in them:
Merde!
A photograph is an artistic expression of life, captured one moment at a time . . .
http://bartlettphotoart.smugmug.com/
I hope the new people who missed entering into the finals but tried their hand at the pre critiques, try again this next round too. For those who celebrate Christmas and for those who do not, may your days be filled with joy and peace!
However, i am excited that the challenges are back. I have been doing a lot of critiquing for photo clubs and have had the opportunity to jury a 90-piece photography show this fall. I would have offered comments on the final entries, but I hadn't entered a photo. I don't like the idea of being shut out if I don't have time to shoot.
I will keep my eyes open toward continuing to participate, but the new format seems to drag it out. Like all new efforts, this will continue to evolve.
JAG, thanks for your efforts and time on this. I admire your commttment and your willingness to try something new.
Chris
When you come to a door... walk through it.
If it's locked... find an open window.
I think what people are missing here is that the participating is at different levels. Thus, if you cannot shoot within the time frame, try to participate in the pre critiques.
I have changed the rule for the Final images critiques for this next round. It will still be that the participants who have made the final round be the only ones to critique while the final round is open. But once all the points are listed, then anyone will be able to come in an critique should they desire.
Also this round, I am giving 3 weeks to shoot and learn before the entry thread goes up. If people cannot go out and shoot with that much time, then I do not know what to do to improve it. I cannot please everyone!
The points of these challenges are to take people out of their comfort zones. Thus, more time is needed for them to learn how to use editing programs and how to learn to critique. There are many facets to this challenge and if everyone starts to get into it, I am sure it will keep everyone busy when they come in to not only participate with their own images, but critique others.
We will still give this a try as it stands now that the holidays are over. Happy shooting!
There is not much out of my comfort zone as far as "shoot and receive critique" (we were pummeled at Brooks Institute when I was a kid,
I generally shoot to convey the feeling of something that pulls me, no matter what or when it is. If I could enter past shots, it's a no-brainer for me, but that would also take away from part of the stretch. Your approach would require more discipline and focus than I am used to.
Therefore, I just might go for it, heh.
"Conventional thinking is the ruin of our souls..." ~Rumi
_____________________________________________
My SmugMug Galleries
http://www.infinitevisionsphotography.com
Welcome back! If people really find these challenges challenging, then we should see loads of people participating as time goes on. Its a matter of getting people that are here to participate first and others will come! As I mentioned before, nothing is written in stone. If needed to have more challenges and less time for each, we can change to that. But while everyone gets use to the new format and the bugs are worked out, things will remain for now.
My SmugMug Galleries
I think photographers would appreciate critiques as being its main value.
Just a suggestion.
"You don't take a photograph, you make it." ~Ansel Adams
Phil
Thanks for the update. Hope you take all the time you need. I partly asked because I will have some free time next week!
My SmugMug Galleries