new canon 20d observations and pics

2

Comments

  • XneyXney Registered Users Posts: 6 Beginner grinner
    edited October 3, 2004
    Here is my first run around with the 20D with a the 50mm f2.5 macro lens on it. (Mostly macro shots in the batch):

    http://www.xney.com/Pictures/2004-10-02-NatureMacro20D

    Here is one sample:

    IMG_1969.sized.jpg


    So far, the 20D is an improvement on the 10D in almost all areas.

    If you're a Canon DSLR owner, the 50mm macro lens is a pretty good value and good lens, too.

    -Karl
  • patch29patch29 Registered Users, Retired Mod Posts: 2,928 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2004
    Canon has posted a 20D firmware update here.
  • mercphotomercphoto Registered Users Posts: 4,550 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2004
    Impressions
    So far I'm very happy with auto-white-balance on my 20D. Was one of my biggest gripes on the Rebel was how often AWB failed. I will be able to shoot JPG more often in difficult situations, which is a big plus for me. I'm not a fan of shooting RAW.

    Another plus is the incredibly short mirror black-out time. This is especially helpful during bursting.

    And while I've only used the pop-up flash so far, ETTL-2 seems to be a big winner too. So far I'm happy with the 20D.
    Bill Jurasz - Mercury Photography - Cedar Park, TX
    A former sports shooter
    Follow me at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bjurasz/
    My Etsy store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/mercphoto?ref=hdr_shop_menu
  • mercphotomercphoto Registered Users Posts: 4,550 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2004
    Sample images
    Some sample images from my new Canon 20D. Mostly done with a 28-135 lens, though a few were with a 70-200/2.8. All were with auto white balance, captured JPG in-camera (large fine). A range of ISO's, a range of lighting conditions, some with the pop-up flash. No post-processing whatsoever.

    http://mercphoto.smugmug.com/gallery/241605
    Bill Jurasz - Mercury Photography - Cedar Park, TX
    A former sports shooter
    Follow me at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bjurasz/
    My Etsy store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/mercphoto?ref=hdr_shop_menu
  • Steve CaviglianoSteve Cavigliano Super Moderators Posts: 3,599 moderator
    edited October 4, 2004
    Bill,

    They look really nice to me. How do they look to you?

    I'm pretty impressed with the lack of noise in the ISO1600 still life and with the DR in the cat and white goose shots. If I wasn't already going to buy a 20D, these shots would help cement my choicebiggrinbounce2.gif

    I think you should call in sick tomorrow morning. Just tell them that your camera needs to spend some more quality time with you.....lol

    Steve
    SmugMug Support Hero
  • mercphotomercphoto Registered Users Posts: 4,550 Major grins
    edited October 4, 2004
    20d
    Bill,

    They look really nice to me. How do they look to you?

    I'm very happy as well. The AWB seems to actually work. ISO 800 is very usable, as is 1600. Impressive. Nice image quality.

    Weather permitting, 7th grade football tomorrow night, dirt bikes on Saturday.
    Bill Jurasz - Mercury Photography - Cedar Park, TX
    A former sports shooter
    Follow me at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bjurasz/
    My Etsy store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/mercphoto?ref=hdr_shop_menu
  • leebaseleebase Registered Users Posts: 630 Major grins
    edited October 6, 2004
    ginger_55 wrote:
    What do you use those high number ISOs for, Andy?
    For shots like this:

    9407874-M.jpg

    ISO 3200 -- allowed me to shoot indoors without flash and at f/4 instead of f2.8 at 1600. Being able to do so in a low noise manner is a real treat!

    Lee
  • wxwaxwxwax Registered Users Posts: 15,471 Major grins
    edited October 6, 2004
    patch29 wrote:
    Canon has posted a 20D firmware update here.

    What does it fix?
    Sid.
    Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
    http://www.mcneel.com/users/jb/foghorn/ill_shut_up.au
  • wxwaxwxwax Registered Users Posts: 15,471 Major grins
    edited October 6, 2004
    leebase wrote:
    For shots like this:

    9407874-M.jpg

    ISO 3200 -- allowed me to shoot indoors without flash and at f/4 instead of f2.8 at 1600. Being able to do so in a low noise manner is a real treat!

    Lee

    Wow, that was at 3200? Amazing.
    Sid.
    Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
    http://www.mcneel.com/users/jb/foghorn/ill_shut_up.au
  • patch29patch29 Registered Users, Retired Mod Posts: 2,928 Major grins
    edited October 7, 2004
    patch29 wrote:
    Canon has posted a 20D firmware update here.

    Check again, they released 1.0.5, to fix a bug with 1.0.4.
  • patch29patch29 Registered Users, Retired Mod Posts: 2,928 Major grins
    edited October 7, 2004
    wxwax wrote:
    What does it fix?
    This firmware fixes the problem of the shutter release not working when a lens is removed or a lens is attached when the camera is in auto power off mode, and improves the reliability when using some CF cards.
    .
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,693 moderator
    edited October 7, 2004
    patch29 wrote:
    .


    I updated my 20D to firmware 1.0.5 this morning. When I first tried to update the firmware, I had the extracted firmware file to a 16 Mb Lexar card, and this seemed to crash the update sequence in my 20D, such that I had to remove the battery to turn it off. And the update failed - Thabkfully this did not seem to harm the camera. Hmmm....

    Anyway I wrote the firmware file to a Sandisk 256 Mb card and everything went just fine. Camera still works and lists the firmware now as 1.0.5

    If you elect to update your firmware to 1.0.5 - REMEMBER - Remove ANY lens from the camera first - this seems to confuse things on some updates per Canon's website - that was why the quik upgrade from 1.0.4 to 1.0.5. ne_nau.gif
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,897 moderator
    edited October 8, 2004
    I spent some time reading the 20d review today (at work). The images look
    great. Some of the features are clearly better than the 10d.

    But one question, why not a 1Ds MKII instead?

    Ian
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,693 moderator
    edited October 8, 2004
    ian408 wrote:
    I spent some time reading the 20d review today (at work). The images look
    great. Some of the features are clearly better than the 10d.

    But one question, why not a 1Ds MKII instead?

    Ian

    You're putting me on, right!?? :D
    The 1DsMkll is not available yet, and will retail for $8,000, vs $1500 for the 20D. Also the 20D is much smaller and lighter to carry around as well. If price and weight are not a concern, then certainly the 1DsMKll will remain the epitome of the digital full 35mm frame DSLR. clap.gif
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • leebaseleebase Registered Users Posts: 630 Major grins
    edited October 8, 2004
    ian408 wrote:
    I spent some time reading the 20d review today (at work). The images look
    great. Some of the features are clearly better than the 10d.

    But one question, why not a 1Ds MKII instead?
    Money.

    Lee
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,897 moderator
    edited October 8, 2004
    pathfinder wrote:
    You're putting me on, right!?? :D
    The 1DsMkll is not available yet, and will retail for $8,000, vs $1500 for the 20D. Also the 20D is much smaller and lighter to carry around as well. If price and weight are not a concern, then certainly the 1DsMKll will remain the epitome of the digital full 35mm frame DSLR. clap.gif
    I was thinking more from a pro vs. consumer perspective. If you look at the sports guys, they're all using 1D's of some flavor or another.

    But then again, maybe at some level, it matters more who is taking the shot
    than what they use to take it?

    Ian
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • mercphotomercphoto Registered Users Posts: 4,550 Major grins
    edited October 8, 2004
    20D versus 1D
    ian408 wrote:
    I was thinking more from a pro vs. consumer perspective. If you look at the sports guys, they're all using 1D's of some flavor or another.

    But then again, maybe at some level, it matters more who is taking the shot than what they use to take it?

    To some degree, yes. On the other hand, there is a reason why the pros spend the bucks on a 1-series camera. Very, very fast and accurate auto-focus. Excellent moving subject tracking. Lots of focus points. Very fast bursting. Built-in grip. All these things mean a 1-series will create better images with a higher "hit rate" (ie. a higher percentage of the shots are usuable).
    Bill Jurasz - Mercury Photography - Cedar Park, TX
    A former sports shooter
    Follow me at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bjurasz/
    My Etsy store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/mercphoto?ref=hdr_shop_menu
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,897 moderator
    edited October 8, 2004
    mercphoto wrote:
    To some degree, yes. On the other hand, there is a reason why the pros spend the bucks on a 1-series camera. Very, very fast and accurate auto-focus. Excellent moving subject tracking. Lots of focus points. Very fast bursting. Built-in grip. All these things mean a 1-series will create better images with a higher "hit rate" (ie. a higher percentage of the shots are usuable).
    I might be mixing my reviews but I thought the 20d had improved AF and higher
    frame rate? The grip for the 20d is "only" US$169. Plus batteries :)

    Ian
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • mercphotomercphoto Registered Users Posts: 4,550 Major grins
    edited October 8, 2004
    ian408 wrote:
    I might be mixing my reviews but I thought the 20d had improved AF and higher
    frame rate? The grip for the 20d is "only" US$169. Plus batteries :)

    Improved AF? Yes. But not to Mark-II standards. Ditto on frame rate, better but not as fast (5 versus 8.5). Buffer depth on 20D is also smaller. Built-in grips feel more solid than bolt-ons, but a bolt-on can be removed to make the camera smaller.

    In my opinion, the 20D is a baby Mark-II more than it is an improved 10D. The 20D might make all but the hard-core Mark-II fans wonder why they don't have three 20D's versus one Mark-II. :)
    Bill Jurasz - Mercury Photography - Cedar Park, TX
    A former sports shooter
    Follow me at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bjurasz/
    My Etsy store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/mercphoto?ref=hdr_shop_menu
  • ShebaJoShebaJo Registered Users Posts: 179 Major grins
    edited October 8, 2004
    Help
    pathfinder wrote:
    I updated my 20D to firmware 1.0.5 this morning. When I first tried to update the firmware, I had the extracted firmware file to a 16 Mb Lexar card, and this seemed to crash the update sequence in my 20D, such that I had to remove the battery to turn it off. And the update failed - Thabkfully this did not seem to harm the camera. Hmmm....

    Anyway I wrote the firmware file to a Sandisk 256 Mb card and everything went just fine. Camera still works and lists the firmware now as 1.0.5

    If you elect to update your firmware to 1.0.5 - REMEMBER - Remove ANY lens from the camera first - this seems to confuse things on some updates per Canon's website - that was why the quik upgrade from 1.0.4 to 1.0.5. ne_nau.gif
    I just got my 20D Sunday, 1st dSLR... comments about firmware updates are making me nervous. Any tips for a 1st time updater? Is it something that should be done asap, or ok to wait a bit till I am more comfortable with the camera? Thanks (by the way, this is my 1st post, hope its right) Sheila
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,897 moderator
    edited October 8, 2004
    mercphoto wrote:
    In my opinion, the 20D is a baby Mark-II more than it is an improved 10D. The 20D might make all but the hard-core Mark-II fans wonder why they don't have three 20D's versus one Mark-II. :)
    I think this sums it up nicely. And the delta in price means you can afford to
    upgrade as technology changes.

    Ian
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,897 moderator
    edited October 8, 2004
    ShebaJo wrote:
    I just got my 20D Sunday, 1st dSLR... comments about firmware updates are making me nervous. Any tips for a 1st time updater? Is it something that should be done asap, or ok to wait a bit till I am more comfortable with the camera? Thanks (by the way, this is my 1st post, hope its right) Sheila
    The instructions are pretty straight forward.

    If this is your first time, download the new software. Print a copy of the
    instructions and read through them as many times as it takes to make you
    feel comfortable. You can "practice" if you like but the process is really
    quite simple.

    Ian
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,693 moderator
    edited October 10, 2004
    mercphoto wrote:
    Improved AF? Yes. But not to Mark-II standards. Ditto on frame rate, better but not as fast (5 versus 8.5). Buffer depth on 20D is also smaller. Built-in grips feel more solid than bolt-ons, but a bolt-on can be removed to make the camera smaller.

    In my opinion, the 20D is a baby Mark-II more than it is an improved 10D. The 20D might make all but the hard-core Mark-II fans wonder why they don't have three 20D's versus one Mark-II. :)

    A big difference between the 20D and the 1DMkll or the 1DsMkll is that the 1 series cameras have a substantially brighter image through the viewfinder and the viewfinder allows interchangeable focus screens to allow manual focus. This is not too signficant for most amateurs, but if you need to use the Tilt&shift lenses that Canon makes - autofocus may not work well when they are shifted - they may need to be manually focused. The 20D does not offer interchangeable viewfinder screens. The 1 series also allow simultaneous recording of images on CF and SD cards so that there is more than one copy of the images being stored. This may be important for photographers who are being paid to deliver the goods.

    The view through the 20D viewfinder is not real bright either, but won't be noticed by most folks unless they have a 1series camera to compare it too. The autofocus on the 20D is signifcantly faster than the 10D, but is also definately slower than a 1DMkll. On the other hand, the 20D is much smaller and ligher than the 1DMkll. And it is 1/3 the price.

    I think the poster is correct that for busy working photo-journalists that the robust build and features of the 1DMkll or the 1DsMkll will prevail. But for those folks for whom the camera is NOT a tool to generate revenue will look at the equation differently and favor a 20D. Both will make excellent images in the hands of a skilled user.

    One of the bads things about owning really nice cameras, is that then people expect you to produce excellent images, and in the hands of one unwilling to do the leg work, those nice cameras just create a lot of poor high quality snapshots. :D
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • mercphotomercphoto Registered Users Posts: 4,550 Major grins
    edited October 10, 2004
    1d
    pathfinder wrote:
    I think the poster is correct that for busy working photo-journalists that the robust build and features of the 1DMkll or the 1DsMkll will prevail. But for those folks for whom the camera is NOT a tool to generate revenue will look at the equation differently and favor a 20D. Both will make excellent images in the hands of a skilled user.

    What is the difference between the 1D and the 1Ds line of cameras? What does the "s" signify?
    Bill Jurasz - Mercury Photography - Cedar Park, TX
    A former sports shooter
    Follow me at: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bjurasz/
    My Etsy store: https://www.etsy.com/shop/mercphoto?ref=hdr_shop_menu
  • tmlphototmlphoto Registered Users Posts: 1,444 Major grins
    edited October 10, 2004
    mercphoto wrote:
    What is the difference between the 1D and the 1Ds line of cameras? What does the "s" signify?
    I'm no expert, but here what I know (or think I know :D ). The 1D series is based on a detector that is smaller than film, thus the 1.3 conversion factor. The 1Ds series is based on a full sized detector = to a 35mm negative size, so no conversion factor. The 1Ds is the high megapixel, was 11 , now 16mp, camera marketed to landscape and portrait photogs that want every pixel possible, but don't need the speed of the 1D. The 1D is marketed as the sports/photojournalism camera for those that want high frames/sec, but don't need the extra pixels. No clue about the "s".
    Thomas :D

    TML Photography
    tmlphoto.com
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,693 moderator
    edited October 11, 2004
    tmlphoto wrote:
    I'm no expert, but here what I know (or think I know :D ). The 1D series is based on a detector that is smaller than film, thus the 1.3 conversion factor. The 1Ds series is based on a full sized detector = to a 35mm negative size, so no conversion factor. The 1Ds is the high megapixel, was 11 , now 16mp, camera marketed to landscape and portrait photogs that want every pixel possible, but don't need the speed of the 1D. The 1D is marketed as the sports/photojournalism camera for those that want high frames/sec, but don't need the extra pixels. No clue about the "s".

    I could not have said it better Thomas 1drink.gif

    I don't know what the 's' stands for either ne_nau.gif But your description of the potential users of the 1DMkll and the 1DsMkll are what is generally accepted as verbatim. The 1D and the 1Ds (Mkll versions) are described as having world class build quality suitable for hard daily professional useage.
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,693 moderator
    edited October 11, 2004
    ShebaJo wrote:
    I just got my 20D Sunday, 1st dSLR... comments about firmware updates are making me nervous. Any tips for a 1st time updater? Is it something that should be done asap, or ok to wait a bit till I am more comfortable with the camera? Thanks (by the way, this is my 1st post, hope its right) Sheila

    Don't let my experience worry you too much, Sheila. Go here http://www.dpreview.com/news/0410/04100701canon_eos20dfw105.asp and you can read about installing the firmware update and find the link to the Canon firmware download link. After the file is downloaded, clicking on it will cause it to create a folder with the actual firmware file which you will then copy to a formatted CF card.

    The Canon website has the task described in great detail - just follow the bouncing ball so to speak.:D here http://www.canon.co.jp/Imaging/eos20d/eos20d_firmware-e.html

    One point I would like to emphasize and this is not real obvious - YOU MUST DO THE UPDATING OF FIRMWARE ON THE 20D WITH NO LENS IN PLACE ON THE CAMERA BODY - for some reason, some people had difficulty upgrading the firmware with a lens in place on the body, so Canon is recommending removing the lens and replacing it with the black lens mount cover that came with the 20D.

    As I said - my inital trial at upgrading with a Lexar 16MbCF chip did not seem to work and I had to remove the battery to stop the drive light on the camera - I was a little concerned, but i just reinstalled the battery and used a Sandisk 512Mb card and things went as advertised. My camera works fine and now list firmware 1.0.5
    1drink.gif
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • AndyAndy Registered Users Posts: 50,016 Major grins
    edited October 11, 2004
    firmware update
    i too, followed canon's instructions and had no probs with the firmware update.

    it's a cinch


    pathfinder wrote:
    Don't let my experience worry you too much, Sheila. Go here http://www.dpreview.com/news/0410/04100701canon_eos20dfw105.asp and you can read about installing the firmware update and find the link to the Canon firmware download link. After the file is downloaded, clicking on it will cause it to create a folder with the actual firmware file which you will then copy to a formatted CF card.

    The Canon website has the task described in great detail - just follow the bouncing ball so to speak.:D here http://www.canon.co.jp/Imaging/eos20d/eos20d_firmware-e.html

    One point I would like to emphasize and this is not real obvious - YOU MUST DO THE UPDATING OF FIRMWARE ON THE 20D WITH NO LENS IN PLACE ON THE CAMERA BODY - for some reason, some people had difficulty upgrading the firmware with a lens in place on the body, so Canon is recommending removing the lens and replacing it with the black lens mount cover that came with the 20D.

    As I said - my inital trial at upgrading with a Lexar 16MbCF chip did not seem to work and I had to remove the battery to stop the drive light on the camera - I was a little concerned, but i just reinstalled the battery and used a Sandisk 512Mb card and things went as advertised. My camera works fine and now list firmware 1.0.5
    1drink.gif
  • ShebaJoShebaJo Registered Users Posts: 179 Major grins
    edited October 14, 2004
    pathfinder wrote:
    As I said - my inital trial at upgrading with a Lexar 16MbCF chip did not seem to work and I had to remove the battery to stop the drive light on the camera - I was a little concerned, but i just reinstalled the battery and used a Sandisk 512Mb card and things went as advertised. My camera works fine and now list firmware 1.0.5
    1drink.gif

    This is probably a dumb question...but... Like I said... I am NEW at this.
    is it ok to use the same cf card I am shooting pics on if the card has no pics? Or should I have a second card for the firmware updates?
    Thanks...Sheilabiggrinbounce2.gif
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,897 moderator
    edited October 15, 2004
    ShebaJo wrote:
    This is probably a dumb question...but... Like I said... I am NEW at this.
    is it ok to use the same cf card I am shooting pics on if the card has no pics? Or should I have a second card for the firmware updates?
    Thanks...Sheilabiggrinbounce2.gif
    It's ok to use the same card. I would suggest you format the card (using the
    camera) first.

    BTW, it never hurts to have a spare card or so.

    Ian
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
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