...I totally stay away from all fast foods, and anything processed.
What about beer Andy? freaky
I tried (as an experiment) to go 100% vegan for 1 month. I almost made it a month then someone offered me a big plate of prime rib. I haven't looked back since.
What are some of the risks or pitfalls of being vegan?
Same as with any other eating pattern, I reckon:
~ the pitfall of eliminating one subset of food without replacing it with a (healthy) alternative. Closely related would be the idea that you can or need to replace x and y with a pill (vitamin/mineral/shake/supplement - it's all unregulated and pretty much a crapshoot anyhow IMO/E). I think if it makes you feel good to think the supplements are helping, they're worth taking for peace of mind if nothing else ... but I don't think they do much good, either. And certainly they're not something to take in the long-term, perhaps just in the interim as you transition from one diet to another.
~ improper nutritional intake. There are definitely junk food veg*ns just as there are junk food carnivores ... but IME that is more a personality trait/philosophy type of thing that it is necessarily a veg*n thing (YMMV).
~ yearning for foods not on The List. As addressed earlier in the thread, tastes change but it can and does sometimes take time ... a few weeks, maybe even months to adapt to a new and different palatte. Not unlike a smoker who gives up the habit, there is oftentimes a physical withdrawal period ... but that is all it is: a period. And even sometimes an emotional withdrawal if much of your eating is/has been centered on a specific type of food. Most notably an issue during holidays I'd imagine.
I just realized that I'm really new to this forum, and y'all other posters to this thread ... aren't. I don't mean to butt into a cozy corner, and I'm sorry if I have. It's just an issue near and dear to my heart a lifetime of fighting misinformations and half truths about veg*nism. That said, while the pictures of food posted above were disgusting to me ... I knew where you were going with the last picture (the "vegan"), and it still made me laugh aloud. Y'all seem like a fun group of folks, I feel like I'm looking in through the window at a dysfunctional family christmas around the table!
Here's a few dumb questions to start with until I can start reading -
1. What do you drink? I imagine my staple (Diet Coke) is pretty much out. I'm not big on teas, and plain water gets old fast. Alcohol would be no biggie for me to skip, though.
I drink water. A lot. Herbal sun tea. And I have not given up my espresso. Fruit Smoothies.
I don't drink alcohol.
2. What salad dressings are decent? Oil and vinegar only would be a tough one for me. (But I'll do it if I have to.)
It's no biggie to make your own dressings, you learn to create cool stuff. But there are plenty of very low fat dressings that taste good, too.
3. All lettuce's are not created equal, right? I eat romaine and iceburg mainly, but I assume iceburg is worthless and romaine is decent, no?
Romain is soooo good for you.
4. How about a big bowl of Wheaties or shredded wheat or something? Too processed?
I just realized that I'm really new to this forum, and y'all other posters to this thread ... aren't. I don't mean to butt into a cozy corner, and I'm sorry if I have.
I'd be pissed if you didn't join in! Now kwitcher worrying and start contributing even more. Now
What do you drink? I don't mind green tea, and a tea/lemonade mixture, and since I don't eat fruit -- fruit smoothies would be great... I do like melons..
mmmm sounds perfect. And water
And I have to give up sushi???? No, not sushi!
No, you don't. Even Dr. Furhman says it's okay. Have your Sushi if you want, just in moderation.
Does a vegan diet help with acid reflux?
Well... erem... there are definite digestive changes! Your body will have an ......adjustment period lasts about 2-4weeks. Ed will understand.
Will giving up chicken (the only meat I eat regularly) really cause me to lose weight?
What about bread? (I do like wraps and pita bread).
No cake? No sweets?
No processed sugar sweets. No white bread. Whole wheat pitas!
Baldy and Andy: Bravo on eating so healthily. Did you like veggies and fruit before you started the China Study or did they grow on you as you got into this change in habits?
My biggest problem is I really loathe the texture and taste of most vegetables...especially raw. Even fruit beyond strawberries and pineapple isn't appealing. My pallette is very limited. My best effort to date is replacing bad carbs with good and eating chicken and turkey almost exclusively.
This way of eating makes perfect sense and the vision of snacking on a carrot rather than a candy bar is dreamy. I can't stomach the carrot, so I just dropped the candy bar.
What are some of the risks or pitfalls of being vegan?
Iron Deficiency and Anemia, just to name a few things.
If you do not eat the right mixtures of foods that give you the right vitamins such things can occur.
This is what I mean about doing it properly, you can't take protein out of your diet and not replace it.
I'm no expect I'm also not a vegetarian or a vegan, I choose not to eat meat 95% of the time myself.
If your going to choose to be a Vegetarian or Vegan you have to do it properly.
Get into the habit of reading labels.
The hidden fats and sugars in processed foods is just crazy.
Most packaged foods are over processed, a lot of the good stuff has been removed during the processing stage, and other things often added.
I rarely ever eat take away food, probably the worst I'd be at doing that is when I am in USA or Canada
I prefer to prepare my meals myself, and that way I know what's in them.
It's really not that hard to make Healthy Choices.
Be aware of what your putting in your mouth.
Now having said all that, I am no stick figure in build either
This discussion is very interesting to me. I'm intrigued and might be up for a go with a stricter plan for health.
Going out? Not a problem. Salads are everywhere. Then, I can also do fine at most any ethnic restaurant: Mexican, Indian, Italian, Mediterranean, etc.
I eat mexican all the time and veggie would be fine for me but what about refried beans. I'm sure my local eatery make them with lard. I'd ask them but communication is tricky - even ordering is always an amusing adventure; wondering what food will actually be delivered to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by patch29 Andy is your family on your diet?
Wife yes, though she didn't need to lose an ounce.
And there lies one challenge for me. My daughter-of-a-butcher wife, would rather volunteer for medical experiements than to give up her beloved red meat. But I travel a lot on business and fend for myself - salads are frequently my choice anyway.
Chile! We make 4 or 5 different kinds of vegetarian Chile. One pot bean dishes that are amazing. Italian! Whole grain pastas, with garlic, basil, olive oil.
And the Andy/Baldy Smugmug cookbook is released when??
I knew, of course, that trees and plants had roots, stems, bark, branches and foliage that reached up toward the light. But I was coming to realize that the real magician was light itself.
Edward Steichen
I knew, of course, that trees and plants had roots, stems, bark, branches and foliage that reached up toward the light. But I was coming to realize that the real magician was light itself.
Edward Steichen
Well, maple syrup was permitted so I don't see why honey wouldn't be. But I could be wrong!
So today I had a huge salad, a Jazz apple (never had one, yummy) and a white peach (also yummy). Dinner will be a breeze, so my only issue it seems in the short term will be breakfast. I bought some Kashi cereal but I don't want to overdo the milk - maybe I'll just skip it and snack on fruit until lunch.
Well, maple syrup was permitted so I don't see why honey wouldn't be. But I could be wrong!
Maple Syrup though comes from a plant.
Honey, comes from an animal
So today I had a huge salad, a Jazz apple (never had one, yummy) and a white peach (also yummy). Dinner will be a breeze, so my only issue it seems in the short term will be breakfast. I bought some Kashi cereal but I don't want to overdo the milk - maybe I'll just skip it and snack on fruit until lunch.
Lose the Milk if you can. I gave a ton of breakfast sugg's above!
if this keeps up you guys are going to peer pressure me into eating healthier and cutting back on my meat intake to almost none.
Yeah, me too. I could really stand to loose the same weight Andy has. My total calories per day is not large - maybe even under average. But my opportunity for exercise now that I have a desk job is slim to nil and consequently I am not.
So I think I will start with increasing fruits and veggies many fold and decreasing meat. I worry about osteoporosis and so am reluctant to give up the tiny bit of dairy that I force myself to consume.
I am at the age where I have ill parents/aunts/uncles and a few friends are starting to be affected by disease as well. Since I want to see the world when I retire, and I cannot afford to retire yet, I guess I need to do whatever is necessary to live that long AND feel good too.
My only issue it seems in the short term will be breakfast. I bought some Kashi cereal but I don't want to overdo the milk - maybe I'll just skip it and snack on fruit until lunch.
Breakfast I am doing well with. I have Kashi or similar organic whole grain cereal, fresh blueberries and soy milk.
Lunch I am ok, usually a sandwich with whole grain bread, organic peanut butter and fruit spread, or turkey and cheese. :yikes My problem there has always been potato chips. I eat way too many, at the moment I have substituted pretzels. I eat less of them and they are probably a little better than chips.
Dinner is my big miss. I need more salads and veggies. I have been doing better.
I cut out fast food almost entirely, now it is very occasional and usually when I am traveling.
One step at a time. I don't think I can go cold turkey from cheese, yogurt, fish, chicken, meat............ NO PIZZA!! :yikes not sure I can or want to do that.
Had McDonalds for breakfast on the way to work, pizza for lunch in between meetings, couple of cookies after that, coffee and coke all day!! Now I'm sitting here, belly hanging over the belt, reading this and thinking ... I GOTTA CHANGE!!!
Had McDonalds for breakfast on the way to work, pizza for lunch in between meetings, couple of cookies after that, coffee and coke all day!! Now I'm sitting here, belly hanging over the belt, reading this and thinking ... I GOTTA CHANGE!!!
So I just ordered Eat To Live.
I'll keep ya posted.
Dave, it's the best thing you could ever do. Trust me on this.
Frankly, one my biggest problems is a reluctance to cook for myself. I'm a decent cook, I know my way around a kitchen, have worked in restaurants.
But cooking and cleaning-up dinner everyday is a massive amount of time, for 10 minutes of chew time. So guess which is my hands-down worst meal of the day?
Oh yeah, and I hate shopping.
Apparently, I'd rather have a vegetable on my sofa than on my dinner table.
BaldyRegistered Users, Super ModeratorsPosts: 2,853moderator
edited July 12, 2007
Truth be told, I've been okay with fruits most of my life but not with veggies. It was an adaptation for me and I picked them off one by one until I got used to them and eventually, strange as it seems, learned to love them. Beets and brussel sprouts were the last two. I used to detest them. Now I'm okay with them, in moderation.
The only nutritional deficiency I worry about is B-12. It used to be generated by bacteria in soils but isn't much anymore, so you have to supplement. Protein isn't a concern because leafy greens are so much higher in protein per calorie than beef is.
Food marketers are very clever and the junk, dairy, beef, and drug industries have unbelievable budgets. They love to give percentages in weight, not by calorie. So 2% milk is 2% fat by weight (lots of water in it). It's 35% fat by calorie, most of it saturated. Doesn't matter; they have the budget to put Alondra in a full-page ad with a milk mustache in Newsweek. Anyone can see milk does a body good.
The brocolli growers can't afford Alondra.
Beef marketers do the same to mask how much higher protein brocolli, leafy greens and legumes are than meat. And they'll do anything to spread FUD, like claiming they have incomplete proteins (they do, but if you eat much variety it's impossible not to get complete proteins).
The really dangerous one is iron. It's an oxidant, not an anti-oxidant, that is strongly linked to aging. The form in animals is called heme iron and the body absorbs much more of it than the plant form of iron. The body absorbs just what it needs with the plant form.
If you eat refined foods and no meat, you can become iron deficient, but it's hard to do if you eat healthy whole plants. For example, my wife can tell you I've suffered restless legs syndrome all my life, keeping both her and I from sleeping. I had to supplement iron in an attempt to alleviate them (it didn't work). They are thought to be linked to iron deficiency.
it was a big concern for me to drop meat because I was afraid of iron anemia. But it didn't happen and somehow my restless leg syndrome went away a few months after dropping meat from my diet.
There is a big re-thinking going on with iron and what constitutes iron deficiency. You'll notice it's being dropped from vitamins and fortified foods in recent years. And the thinking is that what was considered normal was based on population studies of people who ate a lot of meat. It's very clear that people who have lower iron levels, people who donate blood, people who menstruate, live considerably longer and it's thought to be related to lower iron levels in the blood. It's not water soluble, so the body has a tough time disposing of iron if you don't bleed. Eating a lot of heme iron that doesn't allow the body to regulate absorption is thought by many experts to be dangerous.
Comments
What are some of the risks or pitfalls of being vegan?
From Brown University
Brings up another question - do you take vitamin supplements?
What about beer Andy?
I tried (as an experiment) to go 100% vegan for 1 month. I almost made it a month then someone offered me a big plate of prime rib. I haven't looked back since.
initialphotography.smugmug.com
"The camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera" - Dorothea Lange
Same as with any other eating pattern, I reckon:
~ the pitfall of eliminating one subset of food without replacing it with a (healthy) alternative. Closely related would be the idea that you can or need to replace x and y with a pill (vitamin/mineral/shake/supplement - it's all unregulated and pretty much a crapshoot anyhow IMO/E). I think if it makes you feel good to think the supplements are helping, they're worth taking for peace of mind if nothing else ... but I don't think they do much good, either. And certainly they're not something to take in the long-term, perhaps just in the interim as you transition from one diet to another.
~ improper nutritional intake. There are definitely junk food veg*ns just as there are junk food carnivores ... but IME that is more a personality trait/philosophy type of thing that it is necessarily a veg*n thing (YMMV).
~ yearning for foods not on The List. As addressed earlier in the thread, tastes change but it can and does sometimes take time ... a few weeks, maybe even months to adapt to a new and different palatte. Not unlike a smoker who gives up the habit, there is oftentimes a physical withdrawal period ... but that is all it is: a period. And even sometimes an emotional withdrawal if much of your eating is/has been centered on a specific type of food. Most notably an issue during holidays I'd imagine.
I just realized that I'm really new to this forum, and y'all other posters to this thread ... aren't
As you were! :ivar
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I don't drink alcohol. It's no biggie to make your own dressings, you learn to create cool stuff. But there are plenty of very low fat dressings that taste good, too. Romain is soooo good for you. Shredded wheat, fine - I prefer Granola
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Yeah - I've seen and know plenty of "pasta-tarians"
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I'd be pissed if you didn't join in! Now kwitcher worrying and start contributing even more. Now
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Did you just stop suddenly.... if so, how long did it take your cravings (if any) to subside?
I did find that after 2 years of eating low fat, I just stopped craving a lot of stuff...
http://www.twitter.com/deegolden
My biggest problem is I really loathe the texture and taste of most vegetables...especially raw. Even fruit beyond strawberries and pineapple isn't appealing. My pallette is very limited. My best effort to date is replacing bad carbs with good and eating chicken and turkey almost exclusively.
This way of eating makes perfect sense and the vision of snacking on a carrot rather than a candy bar is dreamy. I can't stomach the carrot, so I just dropped the candy bar.
My photos
"The future is an illusion, but a damned handy one." - David Allen
Iron Deficiency and Anemia, just to name a few things.
If you do not eat the right mixtures of foods that give you the right vitamins such things can occur.
This is what I mean about doing it properly, you can't take protein out of your diet and not replace it.
I'm no expect I'm also not a vegetarian or a vegan, I choose not to eat meat 95% of the time myself.
If your going to choose to be a Vegetarian or Vegan you have to do it properly.
Get into the habit of reading labels.
The hidden fats and sugars in processed foods is just crazy.
Most packaged foods are over processed, a lot of the good stuff has been removed during the processing stage, and other things often added.
I rarely ever eat take away food, probably the worst I'd be at doing that is when I am in USA or Canada
I prefer to prepare my meals myself, and that way I know what's in them.
It's really not that hard to make Healthy Choices.
Be aware of what your putting in your mouth.
Now having said all that, I am no stick figure in build either
..... Skippy
.
Skippy (Australia) - Moderator of "HOLY MACRO" and "OTHER COOL SHOTS"
ALBUM http://ozzieskip.smugmug.com/
:skippy Everyone has the right to be stupid, but some people just abuse the privilege :dgrin
I eat mexican all the time and veggie would be fine for me but what about refried beans. I'm sure my local eatery make them with lard. I'd ask them but communication is tricky - even ordering is always an amusing adventure; wondering what food will actually be delivered to me.
And there lies one challenge for me. My daughter-of-a-butcher wife, would rather volunteer for medical experiements than to give up her beloved red meat.
And the Andy/Baldy Smugmug cookbook is released when??
I knew, of course, that trees and plants had roots, stems, bark, branches and foliage that reached up toward the light. But I was coming to realize that the real magician was light itself.
Edward Steichen
Exactly what I have been wondering.
www.zxstudios.com
http://creativedragonstudios.smugmug.com
Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
http://www.mcneel.com/users/jb/foghorn/ill_shut_up.au
The China Study is a fascinating book, with excellent advice.
I gather that Andy does not eat any yogurt either?
Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
I knew, of course, that trees and plants had roots, stems, bark, branches and foliage that reached up toward the light. But I was coming to realize that the real magician was light itself.
Edward Steichen
Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
http://www.mcneel.com/users/jb/foghorn/ill_shut_up.au
So today I had a huge salad, a Jazz apple (never had one, yummy) and a white peach (also yummy). Dinner will be a breeze, so my only issue it seems in the short term will be breakfast. I bought some Kashi cereal but I don't want to overdo the milk - maybe I'll just skip it and snack on fruit until lunch.
Personally I'm okay w/ Honey. And a bit of cream in my coffee
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Honey, comes from an animal
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Wow Andy... I had no idea. A sincere congratulations is in order.
Lee
www.zxstudios.com
http://creativedragonstudios.smugmug.com
Yeah, me too. I could really stand to loose the same weight Andy has. My total calories per day is not large - maybe even under average. But my opportunity for exercise now that I have a desk job is slim to nil and consequently I am not.
So I think I will start with increasing fruits and veggies many fold and decreasing meat. I worry about osteoporosis and so am reluctant to give up the tiny bit of dairy that I force myself to consume.
I am at the age where I have ill parents/aunts/uncles and a few friends are starting to be affected by disease as well. Since I want to see the world when I retire, and I cannot afford to retire yet, I guess I need to do whatever is necessary to live that long AND feel good too.
ann
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Breakfast I am doing well with. I have Kashi or similar organic whole grain cereal, fresh blueberries and soy milk.
Lunch I am ok, usually a sandwich with whole grain bread, organic peanut butter and fruit spread, or turkey and cheese. :yikes My problem there has always been potato chips. I eat way too many, at the moment I have substituted pretzels. I eat less of them and they are probably a little better than chips.
Dinner is my big miss. I need more salads and veggies. I have been doing better.
I cut out fast food almost entirely, now it is very occasional and usually when I am traveling.
One step at a time.
So I just ordered Eat To Live.
I'll keep ya posted.
My Photos
My Facebook
Good luck! Holler for help.
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But cooking and cleaning-up dinner everyday is a massive amount of time, for 10 minutes of chew time. So guess which is my hands-down worst meal of the day?
Oh yeah, and I hate shopping.
Apparently, I'd rather have a vegetable on my sofa than on my dinner table.
Catapultam habeo. Nisi pecuniam omnem mihi dabis, ad caput tuum saxum immane mittam
http://www.mcneel.com/users/jb/foghorn/ill_shut_up.au
The only nutritional deficiency I worry about is B-12. It used to be generated by bacteria in soils but isn't much anymore, so you have to supplement. Protein isn't a concern because leafy greens are so much higher in protein per calorie than beef is.
Food marketers are very clever and the junk, dairy, beef, and drug industries have unbelievable budgets. They love to give percentages in weight, not by calorie. So 2% milk is 2% fat by weight (lots of water in it). It's 35% fat by calorie, most of it saturated. Doesn't matter; they have the budget to put Alondra in a full-page ad with a milk mustache in Newsweek. Anyone can see milk does a body good.
The brocolli growers can't afford Alondra.
Beef marketers do the same to mask how much higher protein brocolli, leafy greens and legumes are than meat. And they'll do anything to spread FUD, like claiming they have incomplete proteins (they do, but if you eat much variety it's impossible not to get complete proteins).
The really dangerous one is iron. It's an oxidant, not an anti-oxidant, that is strongly linked to aging. The form in animals is called heme iron and the body absorbs much more of it than the plant form of iron. The body absorbs just what it needs with the plant form.
If you eat refined foods and no meat, you can become iron deficient, but it's hard to do if you eat healthy whole plants. For example, my wife can tell you I've suffered restless legs syndrome all my life, keeping both her and I from sleeping. I had to supplement iron in an attempt to alleviate them (it didn't work). They are thought to be linked to iron deficiency.
it was a big concern for me to drop meat because I was afraid of iron anemia. But it didn't happen and somehow my restless leg syndrome went away a few months after dropping meat from my diet.
There is a big re-thinking going on with iron and what constitutes iron deficiency. You'll notice it's being dropped from vitamins and fortified foods in recent years. And the thinking is that what was considered normal was based on population studies of people who ate a lot of meat. It's very clear that people who have lower iron levels, people who donate blood, people who menstruate, live considerably longer and it's thought to be related to lower iron levels in the blood. It's not water soluble, so the body has a tough time disposing of iron if you don't bleed. Eating a lot of heme iron that doesn't allow the body to regulate absorption is thought by many experts to be dangerous.