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Alien Bee Info Needed....Looking for Current USERS
Art Scott
Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
Most on here have seen my ravings about the Paul C Buff Lighting equipment: White Lightning are what i currently use.
Have any of YOU current Alien Bee users found them too powerful in the studio?
If so which model do you have and what size studio are you using them in??
I am looking at moving up to the AB 800 or 1600's ..... but running a few test shots today I found my WL5000 at 2/3 power I was shooting at f16-22 bouncing out of a gold umbrella, so I switched to my shoot thru brolly boxes and not much difference.........the WL 5K's were rated at 130 watt second which is real close to the AB400.
My Wl5K's are still working great but I can no longer get barndoors and other accessories for them....they have been real good to me for 30yrs+ but it is time to "upgrade"........
T.I.A.
Have any of YOU current Alien Bee users found them too powerful in the studio?
If so which model do you have and what size studio are you using them in??
I am looking at moving up to the AB 800 or 1600's ..... but running a few test shots today I found my WL5000 at 2/3 power I was shooting at f16-22 bouncing out of a gold umbrella, so I switched to my shoot thru brolly boxes and not much difference.........the WL 5K's were rated at 130 watt second which is real close to the AB400.
My Wl5K's are still working great but I can no longer get barndoors and other accessories for them....they have been real good to me for 30yrs+ but it is time to "upgrade"........
T.I.A.
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I have a 1600, 2 800's and a 400. My studio space is very small so I am seldom able to use the 1600 over 1/8 power and most times I use it at 1/16.
My 800's are much more suited to my space. My 400 is used as a hair light or background light.
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I have two B1600's and haven't found them to be too much
But I do use them almost all the time with 2' x 3' softboxes and shoot between f8-f14.
I also have two 200 w/s Cowboy Studio strobes that will be replaced with B800's eventually.
Without moving too much equipment out of the way my workable space is about 12' x 24' out of a total of 26' x 36'.
For one shoot at full power I had to remove the outer diffuser panels on the softboxes to bounce the light off the 10' ceiling, the standard 7" reflectors just didn't cut it.
As usual, depends what you're shooting.
Cheers, Don
Product Photography
My Acreage Bird Photographs
Do either one of notice any color shifts when using lower power on the AB's?
Thanks again.
IIRC they have changed the flash bulbs and it's not an issue with new units ?
Cheers, Don
Product Photography
My Acreage Bird Photographs
Yeah the forum scuttlebutt was pretty old...that I found.....
ahhhh I see.......Well looks like I need to get ready for a couple of AB 1600's....and a PLM system...on wait the PLM's are still on B.O.......
This was this morning playing around. 1 AB800 as back light at 1/4 power, 1 AB800 as key light at 1/8 power, 1 SB-600 as fill light.
How do you trigger your SB600?
I could save a bit of $ here and use my SB900's as back light and hair light....hmmm........
I just sold a B800 that I had about two months ago and the color shift was definitely visible. Take three shots with a manually set WB at the lowest setting, half power, and full power and you should be able to see that the low power shot has a magenta tint to it.
You could even purchase a Vivitar 285HV or LumoPro LP160 for $100-$160 for a manually controlled flash.
The LP160 has a pc connector, miniphone jack, and optical slave. I believe the GN on one of those is the same as a Canon 580EX II. You can also use radio triggers. How are you currently triggering your lights?
I'm using CLS to trigger two SB-600's and using the slave mechanism to trigger both AB800's. I am very new at this, so I could be doing everything wrong, but so far I'm getting good results. My setup:
1x AB800 with standard reflector as back light (gels to color)
1x AB800 in large softbox as key light
1x SB-600 in shoot through umbrella on boom stand as hair light
1x SB-600 in shoot through umbrella as fill light
All triggered via CLS, manually adjusted.
I have two cyber commanders that I use for the AB800's when I take them outdoors.
Truth is I never need that much power indoors. I always use my sb800 Speedlight, or two, and they provide more than enough power.
There have been a few situations, I can count them on one hand, where I could have used more light than the sb800's gave me but I could count them on one hand.
Having said that, the times I did use the Alien Bees 800 inside it was certainly plenty, usually an the edge of being to much.
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Nikon D700 (3 bodies), Nikon 14-24 f2.8, Nikon 24 f/1.4, Nikon 24-70 f/2.8, Nikon 50 f/1.4, Nikon 85 f/1.4, Nikon 70-200 f/2.g VRII, SB-900(2), SB-800(5)
How old are the lights ?
Cheers, Don
Product Photography
My Acreage Bird Photographs
Looks I have a lot to learn about CLS......I have yet to get a good image mixing my SB900's + my WL5K's....so far just blk frames.....thanx for letting me know it should be possible...
I have an email into Paul about the color shifting on lower power settings....as this was not an issue with the WL 5K's I own (and wouold have been very eveident in my film shooting from when I 1st got them), I am sure that if Paul knew of the Prob it was fixed......that is something I do not want to have to worry about.......
As to using my SB900's ...my avatar was shot with an SB900+gold umbrella.......but I was bumping everything way up (iso and aperture) and I do not like shooting above native iso on any camera (so with my D300's that is iso200 of course....this I am sure is due to my couple of decades+ in shooting with film, but I just believe that lowest native iso is the best for any and all photo work...but that is a totally different discussion :~} )..... I have got to get to reading my CLS book and watching the videos, It would be nice to run everything off SB900's but they are more expensive than PCB Einstein Vll's .......I would be more than willing to spend the ~$500/SB900 if the controllers were RF instead of IR......I just cannot believe that Nikon (or canon for that matter) is this far behind in the technology.........
Mine were new Lights. It's a problem inherit with the bees. I believe that's why the Einsteins have a specific mode to combat color shifts.
Some studio strobes reduce flash output by reducing the voltage they charge up to. The lower the voltage the lower the output. Those kinds of strobes have a color shift related to power level.
Other strobes, like like speedlites, always charge up to the same voltage but regulate the power output by length of time the fire the stobe. A short of amount of time for low power and a longer amount of time for higher power. Most on camera strobes like speedlites work this way so they don't shift color when the power level is changed.
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I am pretty sure if the color shift was real bad that they would exchange as long as under warranty......
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Which I have seen proven to be untrue.
Plenty of proof here: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=431127&highlight=alienbees+color+shift
For the last time, I have no problem with color shift either when changing power levels or shooting at low light levels. I shoot Olympus and AWB.
Obviously, your mileage varies.
Cheers, Don
Product Photography
My Acreage Bird Photographs
SOOC please.
This is my latest shot, simply a lighting and remote trigger TEST that I have yet to take further....
Both B1600's at 1/8 power. SOOC.
Cheers, Don
Product Photography
My Acreage Bird Photographs
One at full, one at half, and one at the lowest power setting.
I sold all my bees except for my abr800, which hasn't been used in a while. I'll have to pull it out. There is a visible color shift at lower power, but the shift doesn't really pose an issue until you're using the lights at low power mixed with the lights at higher power.
And that three year old thread has some very knowledgable people posting in it. I recommend you don't brush it off just because they're proving that there is a color shift. I can also find more for you if you like.
Another thread: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showpost.php?p=8490736&postcount=25
Another thread:http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=443418&highlight=Alien+bee+color+shift
....just exactly whaat is untrue???
I have been shooting with PCB lights for right at 30yrs.....if I had a concern I called and ask....(no internet in the dark ages)...the email I received from Paul was from me using the contact form that any one can use.....{{{it was a total shock to get an email directly from the owner from his home at near midnight}}}..I had a prob with a flash 2 weeks after the warranty expired...I called and asked for an estimate they gave me one...I boxed the unit and UPS'ed with a M.O.
the M.O. was in the envelope with my repair receipt......If I have a prob with something I am not going to just let it slide...I talk nicely 1st then the voice and actions get larger...until a resolution has been reached......I will not keep using products of a company that does not have 1st rate customer service....I do not have time to read the whole 10+ pages of that link, but the 1st page showed reasons for color shifting that had nothing to do with the Alien Bee Lights......Unless as one of the posts on that 1st page pointed out unless the studio is 100% solid blk or white there is room for color shift and by solid blk or wht....that means the backdrop and clothing, even skin and throw off a color cast...any thing reflective can ...........
and what was a problem 3-5 yrs ago....could very well have been taken care....If you followed the Einstein release...Paul pulled the plug more than once because things were not upto his standards............I do believe the PCB group has more integrity than most business people today.
How old are the units?? Please.
lamp age can also have a lot to do with color shift......I ran 1 bulb until it just burned out....died and could not figure where the color shifting was coming from.....then with a call I told a CSR that I had run the lamp continuously for over 12 yrs...never changed my lamp...even tho it would give me consistent light meter readings it had actually been bad for a long time and so I just moved it to the background...color shift really did not matter there as it was shooting thru colored gels all the time..........
Thanx for the pix Don...Appreciate it.
Measurebating...
Show me the images that are unacceptable
Cheers, Don
Product Photography
My Acreage Bird Photographs
That there is only a color shift of 50K. Some of the best manage only 100K and there's no way an Alien Bee stacks up to a Boncolor strobe. If that were the case, Broncolor would be out of business.
If you don't want to take to time to read those links and see the proof of a color shift larger than 50K below 1/8 power, then there's nothing I can do to change your perception that there is no problem.
I'm not arguing that AB customer service is bad, infact, they have amazing customer service that people seem to be using a lot. They replaced the reflector for my ABR800 that I broke while I was using it for free since it was under warrenty.
And it doesn't matter what color a studio's walls are. They could be blue. A noticable color shift will still show. It's the color temperature of the strobe that's being affected, the walls aren't what's changing the temp of the strobe at different powers.
Like I said, I'll take shots with the ABR800 when I have a moment. It probably won't be tonight as I have to fix my computer.
So you're dimissing results that show a color shift because it's "measurebating"?
Unacceptable is completely up to the photographer. Lots of people shoot with AB lights and don't have a problem with how they look. People also shoot with brands like Speedotron, Dynalite, Profoto, and Broncolor because they require a result that an Alien Bee can't provide.
If you're not shooting with multiple Bees mixed between higher powers and extreme low powers, then it's not really an issue, but when you start using them like that, then color shift can affect photos to where it's unacceptable to certain people.
I can't show you unacceptable results because I only have one bee right now. Maybe I could mix it with the speedotrons, but then I'm using two totally different lights which would probably prove nothing. I'll have to play around with them.
But you have to ask yourselves, why would anyone purchase a $10,000 Broncolor setup when they could get two Alien Bee B800's for under $600 that had a color temp consistency of 50K all across the power range.
Try 3 shots, all with the bees using just the reflector as modifiers can throw off color balance.
One with one light at 1/1, one at 1/2, and one at the lowest power...1/16 or 1/32?