What is bokeh?

135

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  • DonRicklinDonRicklin Registered Users Posts: 5,551 Major grins
    edited March 12, 2008
    264816370_ApPnn-M-1.jpg

    Don
    Don Ricklin - Gear: Canon EOS 5D Mark III, was Pentax K7
    'I was older then, I'm younger than that now' ....
    My Blog | Q+ | Moderator, Lightroom Forums | My Amateur Smugmug Stuff | My Blurb book Rust and Whimsy. More Rust , FaceBook
    .
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,707 moderator
    edited March 12, 2008
    :jawdrop Which monster of quality was this shot with ?:jawdrop

    Mk III + 300 mm f/2.8 ?

    Mk III + 500 mm ?
    :Dthumb.gif

    Nope, nothing that special Antonio

    20D ( I think you had one of these:D ) at 700mm ( Sigmonster 300-800 - I shoot birds sometimes )iloveyou.gif
    259976166_hMrU8-Ti.jpg

    70-200 f2.8 IS L ( I think you have this lens, don't you?mwink.gif ) body happened to be a 1DsMkll, but that was irrelevant, it ccould just as easily have been a 20D
    129056133_PwAHC-Ti.jpg

    My goal was to demonstrate what I think of as good bokeh. You can get similar bokehs with a 50mm f1.4, or a 35mm f1.4 or an 85mm f1.8, or a 200mm at f2.8 etc, etc The number of leaves in the iris diaphragm plays a role in how round the OOF areas are. The above mentioned EOS lenses all have nice bokeh. I am sure the comparable Nikon lenses do also.
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited March 12, 2008
    I still have the 20 D.
    :Dthumb.gif
    Sigmonster, have to go and see that "thing" on the net. :D

    70-200 Yep !thumb.gif

    :Dthumb.gifbow
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,707 moderator
    edited March 12, 2008
    I admit the Sigmonster is almost like cheating a bit. :D
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • nixternixter Registered Users Posts: 11 Big grins
    edited March 13, 2008
    Tell me if I get it right?

    265316938_a8Y3J-L.jpg
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    nixter wrote:
    Tell me if I get it right?

    265316938_a8Y3J-Th.jpg

    Excuse me but you must do better than this.:D
    The way I see the picture, you are missing the focus point. It is not very very sharp on the hair...mwink.gif
    24-70mm

    265614024_QuQPm-Th.jpg
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • nixternixter Registered Users Posts: 11 Big grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    Maybe this one?

    256891407_dXSBN-L.jpg
  • lasulaxlasulax Registered Users Posts: 34 Big grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    nixter wrote:
    Maybe this one?

    Nix (and others), i think that you may be confusing bokeh for depth of field. as posted here before bokeh can most simply be described as the quality or appearance of the out of focus (OOF) area in the shot. Ideally good bokeh will render the OOF to be undeterminable as to what it actually is. While 'less than adequate' bokeh would be something that you can clearly tell what the OOF is, even though it is blurred/OOF. With good bokeh you shouldnt see any crisp/sharp lines.

    This doesnt mean that any of the samples you have shown are bad shots, they just are not examples of good boheh.

    Hope this helps.

    Additional, once you finally are getting decent bokeh, the true debate as to 'good' or 'excellent' bokeh truly starts, as at this point "[bokeh] is in the eye of the beholder" if you will, and it is all subjective. But the
  • lasulaxlasulax Registered Users Posts: 34 Big grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    Eia wrote:
    The best explanation for me are all of the visual examples.

    soooo... Is this one 'bokeh' enough?

    Eia, i wouldnt think of an image having a little, or a lot of bokeh. Think of it more like "what is the quality of the bluriness of my out of focus area?" bokeh is used to describe this area in terms of quality, not quantity.

    In your example the out of focus areas are indeed out of focus, but i would not necessarily say they are OOF enough to notice any real bokeh effects.
  • lasulaxlasulax Registered Users Posts: 34 Big grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    pathfinder wrote:
    When I think of good bokeh, this is what comes to my mind...

    259976166_hMrU8-L.jpg

    or this

    129056133_PwAHC-XL.jpg

    i agree, i think these are not only stunning images, but great examples of good bokeh
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    What is bokeh ?
    And ... Luminous Landscape for example.
    :Dthumb.gif
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,707 moderator
    edited March 14, 2008
    Antonio,


    I posted my birds because I think they represent very pleasing bokeh - smooth, even lighted areas without sharp borders or background details that detract from the image. Andy calls it "buttery smooth" and I think that conveys the meaning very well.

    Unfortunately, many of the shots displayed in this thread, display out of focus backgrounds, but not with a pleasing bokeh. Just blurring the background does not necessarily constitute good bokeh. Some lenses can display very poor bokeh in their OOF backgrounds. What the background is can play a role in how the bokeh looks also.
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    pathfinder wrote:
    Antonio,


    I posted my birds because I think they represent very pleasing bokeh - smooth, even lighted areas without sharp borders or background details that detract from the image. Andy calls it "buttery smooth" and I think that conveys the meaning very well.

    Unfortunately, many of the shots displayed in this thread, display out of focus backgrounds, but not with a pleasing bokeh. Just blurring the background does not necessarily constitute good bokeh. Some lenses can display very poor bokeh in their OOF backgrounds. What the background is can play a role in how the bokeh looks also.


    Jim. good evening. :D

    I do understand what you mean.
    And now, I understand better what bokeh is, even if I have read about it previously.

    I can see now that some of the pictures I posted are not the best example... Sorry. I'll turn them smaller. mwink.gif

    You were right telling me about this. :D

    Have a nice week end. :Dthumb.gif

    I made some pictures smaller.
    Others I left them as they are because I think they are not so bad ... ne_nau.gif:D
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • DonRicklinDonRicklin Registered Users Posts: 5,551 Major grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    pathfinder wrote:
    Antonio,


    I posted my birds because I think they represent very pleasing bokeh - smooth, even lighted areas without sharp borders or background details that detract from the image. Andy calls it "buttery smooth" and I think that conveys the meaning very well.

    Unfortunately, many of the shots displayed in this thread, display out of focus backgrounds, but not with a pleasing bokeh. Just blurring the background does not necessarily constitute good bokeh. Some lenses can display very poor bokeh in their OOF backgrounds. What the background is can play a role in how the bokeh looks also.
    So is my spider at post #62 closer to good bokeh than some of the others? or would it need to be even smoother in the backgound?

    Don
    Don Ricklin - Gear: Canon EOS 5D Mark III, was Pentax K7
    'I was older then, I'm younger than that now' ....
    My Blog | Q+ | Moderator, Lightroom Forums | My Amateur Smugmug Stuff | My Blurb book Rust and Whimsy. More Rust , FaceBook
    .
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,707 moderator
    edited March 14, 2008
    Don, Antonio, guys & gals all,
    I died not make my post to single anyone's images out, and I certainly was not criticizing either Don's or Antonio's.

    I just thought the thread was beginning to wander from an accurate representation of good or bad bokeh, into a mishmash of some rather poor demonstrations of what I consider to be good bokeh.

    Go back to the beginning post by Andy, to see his suggestions for what is good bokeh. Then make you own decision if your shot is a good example of good or bad bokeh.

    And for the record, some great lenses can have very bad bokeh some times. I have a 500F4 IS L that is a great lens, and can offer great bokeh, but sometimes, if the light is right, the background can look awful also.

    Even though bokeh refers to the quality of a lenses out of focus areas, a busy, cluttered background can contribute to bad bokeh, that even great lens quality cannot correct.
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    pathfinder wrote:
    Don, Antonio, guys & gals all,
    I died not make my post to single anyone's images out, and I certainly was not criticizing either Don's or Antonio's.

    I just thought the thread was beginning to wander from an accurate representation of good or bad bokeh, into a mishmash of some rather poor demonstrations of what I consider to be good bokeh.

    Go back to the beginning post by Andy, to see his suggestions for what is good bokeh. Then make you own decision if your shot is a good example of good or bad bokeh.

    And for the record, some great lenses can have very bad bokeh some times. I have a 500F4 IS L that is a great lens, and can offer great bokeh, but sometimes, if the light is right, the background can look awful also.

    Even though bokeh refers to the quality of a lenses out of focus areas, a busy, cluttered background can contribute to bad bokeh, that even great lens quality cannot correct.

    As long as I am concerned, I have perfectly understood the question as you say and I quote: "...the thread was beginning to wander from an accurate representation of good or bad bokeh..."

    Having understood that the assumption was true - for my pictures - I decided to turn some of them smaller. However, I left a few where I think they have a good bokeh or an acceptable one.

    You may be the judge.:Dthumb.gif
    bowdown.gifthumb
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • DonRicklinDonRicklin Registered Users Posts: 5,551 Major grins
    edited March 14, 2008
    Understood!thumb.gif

    Thanks,

    Don
    Don Ricklin - Gear: Canon EOS 5D Mark III, was Pentax K7
    'I was older then, I'm younger than that now' ....
    My Blog | Q+ | Moderator, Lightroom Forums | My Amateur Smugmug Stuff | My Blurb book Rust and Whimsy. More Rust , FaceBook
    .
  • ktmbmwktmbmw Registered Users Posts: 5 Beginner grinner
    edited March 15, 2008
    my attempts
    Here are a couple where the depth of focus, I feel, helps the photo.
    iris.jpg
    and an other.
    DSCF0021-01.jpg
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited March 15, 2008
    This is bokeh isn't it ?
    266024980_LzooC-M.jpg
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • dank-photodank-photo Registered Users Posts: 132 Major grins
    edited March 16, 2008
    is this good bokeh?

    265399643_BoaYF-M-1.jpg

    265399264_o2ECM-M-1.jpg

    is the background too distracting in the one below to be considered good bokeh?

    264299411_qukqx-S-2.jpg


    I welcome critiques and criticism! Thanks!

    -DK

    www.dank-photo.com
  • SystemSystem Registered Users Posts: 8,186 moderator
    edited March 16, 2008
    266049761_PPgsG-M.jpg
  • sanford tullissanford tullis Registered Users Posts: 63 Big grins
    edited March 19, 2008
    How about these?
    78569676_ho8Xe-M-1.jpg


    78555115_873gL-M-1.jpg

    78557355_XSyac-M.jpg
    Capture memories one image at a time
  • pathfinderpathfinder Super Moderators Posts: 14,707 moderator
    edited March 20, 2008
    dank-photo wrote:
    is this good bokeh?

    265399643_BoaYF-M-1.jpg

    265399264_o2ECM-M-1.jpg

    is the background too distracting in the one below to be considered good bokeh?

    264299411_qukqx-S-2.jpg


    I welcome critiques and criticism! Thanks!

    -DK

    www.dank-photo.com

    Technically, bokeh refers to the rendition of out of focus points of light or highlights, and I think all three images are lovely. Bokeh does not truly require totally unrecognizable backgrounds, just smooth, soft edged highlights, not harsh, sharp edged highlights.
    Pathfinder - www.pathfinder.smugmug.com

    Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
  • xmommyxxmommyx Registered Users Posts: 5 Beginner grinner
    edited March 24, 2008
    Laughing.gif, hmmm, does this count as good bokeh?

    2007_05_31-13_55_06.jpg

    This is actually a picture of my son taken in Ga while at a playground during one of our hikes up the mountain.
  • davemj98davemj98 Registered Users Posts: 225 Major grins
    edited March 24, 2008
    Like this?
    50mm 1.4 sony Alpha 100
    DSC00673.jpg
    davidsdigitalphotography.com
    Alpha 99 & VG, 900x2 & VG; 50mm1.4, CZ135 1.8; CZ16-35 2.8, CZ24-70 2.8, G70-200 2.8, G70-400, Sony TC 1.4, F20, F58, F60.
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited April 1, 2008
    Or like this ...
    20D + 24-70 mm
    273784398_jUfLE-M.jpg
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • TPBinKCTPBinKC Registered Users Posts: 194 Major grins
    edited April 2, 2008
    How about this one?


    210576799_yDWXU-M.jpg

    The main subject is not as sharp as I wanted but I think the background blurred out nicely.
  • gb2379gb2379 Registered Users Posts: 4 Beginner grinner
    edited April 2, 2008
    How about this?
    211114966_WvEEs-L.jpg
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited April 3, 2008
    274286320_vFGPz-M.jpg

    20D + 24-70
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • ArgosArgos Registered Users Posts: 141 Major grins
    edited April 4, 2008
    2372234295_fa4750aebd_o.jpg
    Argos
    Lead dog at Old Dog Photography
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