If you're *demanding* 100% uptime for $150 a year - boy are you in the wrong market. I have a few websites that I pay to have hosted (not here). They're cheap. $7/month. They say "99.999% uptime." But, frankly, for $7/month, I don't expect it. I expect a bit of downtime. I've never had it - which is great. If I call them up and demand 100% uptime because it's a mission critical site, at $7/month, they will say "I've got this product that is $500 a month (or more)" - and rightfully so.
I just did some quick calculations and, in the 1640 hours since August 1, SmugMug has had approximately 97.5% uptime. And that does NOT include scheduled maintenance. On the web, downtime of .5% is HUGE. 2.5% downtime is totally unacceptable and WELL outside the norms.
Frankly, it worries me because it's starting to feel like a trend instead of a bunch of random events.
Although downtime is inconvenient, I can remember having to code my own websites and the time and money involved in doing so. Learning new programs, creating templates, etc. I view the price as very affordable and using smug to showcase the photos has been made very easy. If it were not for smugmug I would have given up on a website as they take way to much time to maintain (even with only 500 photos). In fact, I went without a website for nearly 5 years until I found smugmug, had a website since about 1995-96. I can also remember spending 'days' on the phone with the host trying to get things figured out as whether the problem was on their side, or my own. Smug has spoiled me, and I do appreciate it even with a few outages. I do pay for a Pro account.
Todays society expects to be spoiled, $150 per year is nothing compared to what I get in return.
Please don't lecture me or others here on being a "pro". I've paid smugmug in one form or another several thousand dollars in the last year, and my guess is that is a low number among the pro users of this site. I expect a service for those expenditures. If any one needs to step up and take responsibility for the lack of service, it is the service provider in this case and not their customers.
This is not a new issue here. It has been going for some time. I remember Andy always coming back and talking about what a great up time smugmug had when this all started, even to the point I challenged him on the statement that it was no longer true. That was months ago. It appears that all those threads on here went unheeded and you may notice he no longer offers up that statement as an answer any more........
What did you pay those "several thousand dollars" for? Not the annual fee, I assume, because I certainly don't pay that much. For commissions on print-sales commissions then, I'm thinking? Did you like the prints? Did you feel that you got your money's worth?
Its my "squirrel getting a nut" from last week when I was out and about. And no I dont shoot nature like that often. Just saw it walking to a job. As for useless art, it has no point and is better then our office expressing feelings at the moment.
If this thread keeps going with no resolve for the website Im sure I will make more art today lol.
brian
Dang, I just looked at how many viewers are reading this thread -- WOW!!
A squirrel ok...I can see it better now when I re-look at it.
All art has a point -- it's in the eye of the viewer or in the mind of the maker
If today continues as it started I can't wait to see what other art you come up with -- have fun
I just did some quick calculations and, in the 1640 hours since August 1, SmugMug has had approximately 97.5% uptime. And that does NOT include scheduled maintenance. On the web, downtime of .5% is HUGE. 2.5% downtime is totally unacceptable and WELL outside the norms.
Frankly, it worries me because it's starting to feel like a trend instead of a bunch of random events.
Mark
Maybe try Flickr then. Let us know how you like it : )
refresh you cache
Sites coming back on now in "read only" mode. If you just hit "refresh" you won't know, you'll just keep getting the site down page. Either re-enter your address in the url field or clear your cache to get your site up again.
Side note: Smugmug has all of our email addresses. Why don't they just send an email when the site is down.
It's a big deal to send out hundreds of thousands of emails like that - and then the replies crush our help desk. We've set up the status blog so you'll know what's going on - and you an pop it in your feed reader and get an email when there's an issue, thanks!
"I am trying to access Atlantic's pictures but am getting network errors. I have tried from two computers and no luck. Could you please check it out and let me know when this is fixed.
It's a big deal to send out hundreds of thousands of emails like that - and then the replies crush our help desk. We've set up the status blog so you'll know what's going on - and you an pop it in your feed reader and get an email when there's an issue, thanks!
I might suggest a cell phone text message to Pro users as an option. Since it would only be for (emergency) downtime notifications any replies could simply be ignored for the sake of expediency.
What did you pay those "several thousand dollars" for? Not the annual fee, I assume, because I certainly don't pay that much. For commissions on print-sales commissions then, I'm thinking? Did you like the prints? Did you feel that you got your money's worth?
I see you chose not to reflect on the point of the post.
But since you seem to want to divert from the main point of this thread. the answer is no, not really. I only use smugmug for the quick down and dirty transactions, simply for convenience for which I pay a nice little premium. Too me it is the total service that smugmug does or does not provide that makes the difference. Sure, I like others really do believe the hero's do a great job, better than any other place I've seen. That does not offset the continue issue of down time that appears has not been addressed over the past months.
Ever looked at what Bayphoto really charges? Ever look at a company like Whitehouse? For the record the vast of majority of my print dollars do not go to smugmug.....
Although downtime is inconvenient, I can remember having to code my own websites and the time and money involved in doing so. Learning new programs, creating templates, etc. I view the price as very affordable and using smug to showcase the photos has been made very easy. If it were not for smugmug I would have given up on a website as they take way to much time to maintain (even with only 500 photos). In fact, I went without a website for nearly 5 years until I found smugmug, had a website since about 1995-96. I can also remember spending 'days' on the phone with the host trying to get things figured out as whether the problem was on their side, or my own. Smug has spoiled me, and I do appreciate it even with a few outages. I do pay for a Pro account.
Todays society expects to be spoiled, $150 per year is nothing compared to what I get in return.
I have used smugmug practically since its launch and have had many many years of amazing service. Occasionally things go wrong for me when I am photographing a wedding or other event. For example, a camera shutter fails, a strobe light gets knocked over, someone trips on my sync cord, one of my hard drives crashes etc. Things like this just happen. It wasn't my fault, but I work my tail off to make everything flow smoothly despite some unforeseen problems. Smugmug is doing the same thing. They provide a service that is incredible for the price. Unlimited web space - that just doesn't happen for the price. Cool your jets everyone. I know smugmug has invested TONS of money making this site run. It isn't like they have a little server in a basement and are just now realizing that doesn't work. Think about your own business - things happen that are out of your control. You scramble to fix it, and don't expect your clients to threaten suing or whatever because their pictures were not available within 12 hours of when you said you thought they would be available. Despite our best planning as business people, occasionally things happen that cause some problems. It happens to smugmug too. Cut em some slack.
I see you chose not to reflect on the point of the post.
But since you seem to want to divert from the main point of this thread. the answer is no, not really. I only use smugmug for the quick down and dirty transactions, simply for convenience for which I pay a nice little premium. Ever looked at what Bayphoto really charges? Ever look at a company like Whitehouse? For the record the vast of majority of my print dollars do not go to smugmug.....
I'm sorry, but I thought the point of the post WAS the "several thousand dollars" that you claim to have paid Smugmug, which I'm still not clear what was for.
I disagree - I post all my images from weddings, portrait sessions, events on my smugmug site for viewing and sales. So you are saying that I need to pay for two different services? [I do pay for a pro account elsewhere for my videos/shows to provide an alternate hosting solution due to this same issue earlier in the year.]
I have been using smugmug for many years and up until this summer, I have been very pleased and bragged about them constantly. Too many times this summer/fall, I attempted to either upload images from a session or send a client to the site but found the site was done. [this is the case today]. I have multiple clients wanting to purchase items but they cannot view the images. [Yes, unfortunately, I stated their images would be available for viewing today. My mistake, but then again, I figured the site would be 'up'.] Will the client return on Friday to purchase the images? Maybe.
If I had a 'non' pro account, or an account that I didn't pay a fee, then maybe I could see your point.
However, I have a pro account for my images to be available for viewing an purchase by my clients.
For me to set-up a exact duplicate with shopping cart, etc. will take months and $$$ that I did not plan into my expenses for the year. However, it is something I MUST take into consideration for 2010.
frank
I totally agree.
I did not buy membership at smugmug so that I create a duplicate account elsewhere and keep both up to date. Instead of telling the members to have backup plan, why don't you stop blowing sunshine on smugmug on how great their stuff is and tell them to have backup on top of their systems. I don't normally post when these things happen but I am getting fed up with all the downtimes that keeps happening every month. And think about this lets say smugmug has 500,000 members paying 150 per year - thats 75 million dollars for the year. Thats on top of all the millions of money they rake in from commissions on print sales. So I would not call smugmug a small company by any means scraping for money. You would think they would have more than enough money to buy an army of support people and programmers and backup systems - as well as getting new features in quickly eg packages and coupons.
I am just so tired of people praising smugmug when things go wrong. Like I suggested I think smugmug should refund each member each time the system goes down - that is the only way smugmug will be forced to keep things up and build redunancy- when it hits their pocketbooks and held accountable.
I totally agree.
I did not buy membership at smugmug so that I create a duplicate account elsewhere and keep both up to date. Instead of telling the members to have backup plan, why don't you stop blowing sunshine on smugmug on how great their stuff is and tell them to have backup on top of their systems. I don't normally post when these things happen but I am getting fed up with all the downtimes that keeps happening every month. And think about this lets say smugmug has 500,000 members paying 150 per year - thats 75 million dollars for the year. Thats on top of all the millions of money they rake in from commissions on print sales. So I would not call smugmug a small company by any means scraping for money. You would think they would have more than enough money to buy an army of support people and programmers and backup systems - as well as getting new features in quickly eg packages and coupons.
I am just so tired of people praising smugmug when things go wrong. Like I suggested I think smugmug should refund each member each time the system goes down - that is the only way smugmug will be forced to keep things up and build redunancy- when it hits their pocketbooks and held accountable.
Well I will get real worried and P***ed when they go down and leave a message that it iwll be fixed real soon or down for maintaince and then a day, week and month later they have not shown back up and won't answer any email(s).....happened to me already with another really cool provider.....their servers went down and a message popped up....sever maintiance in progress we'll be back on line shortly.....that was 5 yrs ago....the email still seems to be active as it never bounces back to me but the owners never answer either..............
I totally agree.
I did not buy membership at smugmug so that I create a duplicate account elsewhere and keep both up to date. Instead of telling the members to have backup plan, why don't you stop blowing sunshine on smugmug on how great their stuff is and tell them to have backup on top of their systems. I don't normally post when these things happen but I am getting fed up with all the downtimes that keeps happening every month. And think about this lets say smugmug has 500,000 members paying 150 per year - thats 75 million dollars for the year. Thats on top of all the millions of money they rake in from commissions on print sales. So I would not call smugmug a small company by any means scraping for money. You would think they would have more than enough money to buy an army of support people and programmers and backup systems - as well as getting new features in quickly eg packages and coupons.
I am just so tired of people praising smugmug when things go wrong. Like I suggested I think smugmug should refund each member each time the system goes down - that is the only way smugmug will be forced to keep things up and build redunancy- when it hits their pocketbooks and held accountable.
I have to agree. WHen reading Andys response and, how many emails that would entail, I found kind of flippant. Also if you do indeed have that many accounts then the server should be second to none with a reliable back up serve off site that they could switch to. There is no reason with those kinds of dollars coming in that there should be down time. Unless Smugmug has decided it has become large enough it can lose long time customers because the have become big enough.
Comments
I just did some quick calculations and, in the 1640 hours since August 1, SmugMug has had approximately 97.5% uptime. And that does NOT include scheduled maintenance. On the web, downtime of .5% is HUGE. 2.5% downtime is totally unacceptable and WELL outside the norms.
Frankly, it worries me because it's starting to feel like a trend instead of a bunch of random events.
Mark
Right now some of my photos hosted by smug mug are showing, while others are not.
Does this mean that some have been lost?
Todays society expects to be spoiled, $150 per year is nothing compared to what I get in return.
Troy
What did you pay those "several thousand dollars" for? Not the annual fee, I assume, because I certainly don't pay that much. For commissions on print-sales commissions then, I'm thinking? Did you like the prints? Did you feel that you got your money's worth?
Steve
www.LateSky.com
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Dang, I just looked at how many viewers are reading this thread -- WOW!!
A squirrel
All art has a point -- it's in the eye of the viewer or in the mind of the maker
If today continues as it started I can't wait to see what other art you come up with -- have fun
www.Dogdotsphotography.com
Maybe try Flickr then. Let us know how you like it : )
http://www.flickr.com/
Steve
www.LateSky.com
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Sites coming back on now in "read only" mode. If you just hit "refresh" you won't know, you'll just keep getting the site down page. Either re-enter your address in the url field or clear your cache to get your site up again.
-Patrick
____________________________
patricklockerman.com
patchrik.smugmug.com
http://smugmug.wordpress.com
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
Portfolio • Workshops • Facebook • Twitter
"I am trying to access Atlantic's pictures but am getting network errors. I have tried from two computers and no luck. Could you please check it out and let me know when this is fixed.
thanks"
SM is down, AGAIN!
*sigh*
Keith Tharp.com - Champion Photo
I might suggest a cell phone text message to Pro users as an option. Since it would only be for (emergency) downtime notifications any replies could simply be ignored for the sake of expediency.
Steve
www.LateSky.com
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I see you chose not to reflect on the point of the post.
But since you seem to want to divert from the main point of this thread. the answer is no, not really. I only use smugmug for the quick down and dirty transactions, simply for convenience for which I pay a nice little premium. Too me it is the total service that smugmug does or does not provide that makes the difference. Sure, I like others really do believe the hero's do a great job, better than any other place I've seen. That does not offset the continue issue of down time that appears has not been addressed over the past months.
Ever looked at what Bayphoto really charges? Ever look at a company like Whitehouse? For the record the vast of majority of my print dollars do not go to smugmug.....
Steve
www.LateSky.com
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http://www.jonathanswinton.com
http://www.swintoncounseling.com
I'm sorry, but I thought the point of the post WAS the "several thousand dollars" that you claim to have paid Smugmug, which I'm still not clear what was for.
Steve
www.LateSky.com
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OK, they are showing up now.......
AMEN!
Being the Dad and handing out the discipline was not an easy or enjoyable thing...but necessary nonetheless.
This world needs more accountability.
I love my sons and SmugMug too.
Read only, but missing links -- better take the water away from the hose
www.Dogdotsphotography.com
It was up for about 20 seconds while I looked, then dropped back to read-only, then dropped back to read-only/headers only.
Oh well....
www.RichardBerryPhotography.com
Ha, I get it!
Steve
www.LateSky.com
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www.richknechtphotography.com
I totally agree.
I did not buy membership at smugmug so that I create a duplicate account elsewhere and keep both up to date. Instead of telling the members to have backup plan, why don't you stop blowing sunshine on smugmug on how great their stuff is and tell them to have backup on top of their systems. I don't normally post when these things happen but I am getting fed up with all the downtimes that keeps happening every month. And think about this lets say smugmug has 500,000 members paying 150 per year - thats 75 million dollars for the year. Thats on top of all the millions of money they rake in from commissions on print sales. So I would not call smugmug a small company by any means scraping for money. You would think they would have more than enough money to buy an army of support people and programmers and backup systems - as well as getting new features in quickly eg packages and coupons.
I am just so tired of people praising smugmug when things go wrong. Like I suggested I think smugmug should refund each member each time the system goes down - that is the only way smugmug will be forced to keep things up and build redunancy- when it hits their pocketbooks and held accountable.
:s85
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Steve
www.LateSky.com
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http://joves.smugmug.com/