Motorsports- Help! Which Lens?

ImageX Photography

Hey guys, I am doing my first event this weekend. I will be shooting some motorcycle roadracing with my D300S. I have my 18-200 but I also want to rent a nicer lens with more range and or quality. What do you motorsports guys prefer? I will be out on the track in various corners and I want to get as many angles as I can. I am an amateur and have never shot anything like this so any tips or help will be HUGELY appreciated. I was going to rent a Nikon 80-200 2.8 but now I am thinking about the Nikon 80-400mm f/4.5-5.6D. What do ya's think? I have never shot with either lens. I just want to get good pics because I can make quite a bit of money if I do..... and it will seal the deal as far as me shooting future events. So, I need your help , motorsports guys! Any and all advice will be taken with me to the track for sure. I will share my results after the weekend!

apexonephoto

I would just use what you have for your first attempt. If you are shooting during the day (which I presume you are) you'll be fine. The shallow depth of field is what a 80-200 will give you. If you plan on getting any paddock shots, you may want the 18mm range of your current lens. Not sure if you wanna carry both with you all day.

Take lots of shots, use your high speed drive setting. I have only used a 2x teleconverter with the 70-200 about three years ago. It is a little difficult to hand hold (I think), and you might wanna use a monopod if you get that 80-400. Someone else who shoots with a 400 could tell us.

I don't shoot bikes, and don't shoot road coarses, but be careful, don't chimp, don't turn your back and use your hearing to always know where the bikes are. I often won't hold my eyepiece to my face, so I can use my peripheral vision to see whats around me. I did read where you said you race yourself, so I'm sure you know more then the average photographer would know about track safety. You can never be too careful. One bike on the track affords some safety that's not present with several, so use that time to get your closer shots. I wouldn't set my goals too high for the first event. If there is a lot of money to be made, someone else would already be doing it...

ImageX Photography

apexonephoto wrote: »

I would just use what you have for your first attempt. If you are shooting during the day (which I presume you are) you'll be fine. The shallow depth of field is what a 80-200 will give you. If you plan on getting any paddock shots, you may want the 18mm range of your current lens. Not sure if you wanna carry both with you all day.

Take lots of shots, use your high speed drive setting. I have only used a 2x teleconverter with the 70-200 about three years ago. It is a little difficult to hand hold (I think), and you might wanna use a monopod if you get that 80-400. Someone else who shoots with a 400 could tell us.

I don't shoot bikes, and don't shoot road coarses, but be careful, don't chimp, don't turn your back and use your hearing to always know where the bikes are. I often won't hold my eyepiece to my face, so I can use my peripheral vision to see whats around me. I did read where you said you race yourself, so I'm sure you know more then the average photographer would know about track safety. You can never be too careful. One bike on the track affords some safety that's not present with several, so use that time to get your closer shots. I wouldn't set my goals too high for the first event. If there is a lot of money to be made, someone else would already be doing it...

So, you think I would be fine shooting with the 18-200.... and not bother with the 80-200 2.8? A few people have said I would be fine. I just want good results! There IS another photographer making money.... but he is on his way out.... but just doesn't know it yet. He's there, not taking great pics... and he's STILL charging WAY too much money. I come from within the club.... unlike him. Now that I am into photography pretty heavily.... one of us doesn't belong. Plus, as a racer.... I know what angles to shoot MUCH better than he does. I can also sell for HALF of what he sells for. He charges broke ass racers $8 for (1) 4X6 print.... in this economy!!

I'm going to be doing a lot of experimenting when I first go out on the track. I have only had my D300S for a few weeks now. I want to play with trap focus as well as panning shots... and shutter speeds. I think the other guy damn near leaves the camera in P or Auto mode all day. lol I want wheels and backgrounds blurred! His shutter speeds freeze the wheels and I think that looks really bad.

As far as safety..... let's just say that I won't be camped out on the outside of a corner! haha

Anyway, thanks for your reply.... I really appreciate it. It sounds like I may be fine with my 18-200(instead of renting the 80-200 2.8) but I really wanted to hear from you guys first and see what you prefer to use. Would it be worth getting the 70-400? I think it would open up TONS of new angles on the road course. I almost HAVE TO have more zoom to get everything. I think the reach would be worth the money.

cletus

Definitely stick with the glass you've got for your first time out. It's what your familiar with.

mercphoto

FocusPhotography wrote: »

So, you think I would be fine shooting with the 18-200.... and not bother with the 80-200 2.8? A few people have said I would be fine. I just want good results! There IS another photographer making money.... but he is on his way out.... but just doesn't know it yet. He's there, not taking great pics... and he's STILL charging WAY too much money. I come from within the club.... unlike him. Now that I am into photography pretty heavily.... one of us doesn't belong. Plus, as a racer.... I know what angles to shoot MUCH better than he does. I can also sell for HALF of what he sells for. He charges broke ass racers $8 for (1) 4X6 print.... in this economy!!

I'm going to be doing a lot of experimenting when I first go out on the track. I have only had my D300S for a few weeks now. I want to play with trap focus as well as panning shots... and shutter speeds. I think the other guy damn near leaves the camera in P or Auto mode all day. lol I want wheels and backgrounds blurred! His shutter speeds freeze the wheels and I think that looks really bad.

As far as safety..... let's just say that I won't be camped out on the outside of a corner! haha

Anyway, thanks for your reply.... I really appreciate it. It sounds like I may be fine with my 18-200(instead of renting the 80-200 2.8) but I really wanted to hear from you guys first and see what you prefer to use. Would it be worth getting the 70-400? I think it would open up TONS of new angles on the road course. I almost HAVE TO have more zoom to get everything. I think the reach would be worth the money.

Ugh... I'm really trying not to send this. First off, you've never done this before and you are criticizing his pricing and business model. All this before you have any idea how much work this is going to be on your end and what kind of sales you can expect. Because I think you're going to find out that $8 for a 4x6 print is a fair price for the work involved. First hint: if you cut your price in half, that will not drive 2X the number of sales...

Secondly, if you want good results, if you want better results than this other guy appears to be getting, you need to stop thinking about lenses that have 10X zoom range or more. Throw the 18-200 in the trash can if you are serious about paid photography. The big boys use 300, 400 and 500mm lenses. The 80-200/2.8 is a great lens that you just flat need to own, period, anyway. But if you get serious into the road racing a really big long prime lens is what you will want for bikes. And that means serious bucks.

What lens is this other sub-par photographer using?

apexonephoto

Mercphoto has some really good points "All this before you have any idea how much work this is going to be on your end and what kind of sales you can expect"

He is correct, beat him with your work, because once you have low prices you can't go back up.

A 70-200, 80-200 is a staple lens for sure. Thats a lot of 4x6's to pay for a f2.8. I shoot a lot of night stuff, so an 18-200's aperture range is useless to me as well.

I know Mercphoto has shot a lot of events, I have shot over 200 myself. It's a ton of work, people expect the world, and you are gonna learn a lot. By a lot, I mean it's like a job, not fun at times. It all depends on whether you wanna commit to this.

nw scout

While you do race, and that helps to find good shots, lighting and composition are just, if not more important.
A good photographer can overcome lack of knowledge with a good eye.

No where on the track is safe!!!
I preach this and have lived it.

After shooting professionally for over 15 years on tracks all over the country, the odds finally cought up to me.

Standing 50 feet off the track on the INSIDE of a corner at an MX race I got hit and this was the result.


As far as lenses to rent....
Get the 70 -200 2.8 and a 300 2.8 and make sure you have a monopod.
The 300 2.8 is a must at road courses imo. Rent it, you will be amazed!!!

mercphoto

FocusPhotography wrote: »

I just want to get good pics because I can make quite a bit of money if I do

Two more thoughts while I'm a roll here. One, there is more to making quite a bit of money than simply taking good pics. Two you're not going to make quite a bit of money by charging $4 or less for 4x6 prints.

Start asking yourself "how many prints do I need to sell simply to cover the cost of a 80-200/2.8 lens". Now ask how many to pay for a 400/4 prime telephoto. Or even just a 300/4. Let alone a 300/2.8.

Next question: hobby or business?

apexonephoto

Learning the business side of things is a weak point for myself and many others.

nw scout has lived it first hand, and when I'm on Dgrin, and think of shooting bikes, he's the first one I think of.

I don't have a strong enough amount of racetracks, or cars in my area to do it as a business.

Doing it freelance, and doing it as a track photographer are two entirely different experiences all around.

ImageX Photography

While as some of you have great points, you need to understand that this is MY club. Them guys are mostly my friends. I am NOT there to price gouge them in this recession. His pics are NOT very good at all and it appears he is lazy and shoots in auto mode all the time. This person came in off the street at the right time when our usual good shooters moved away or got busy with their 9-5 jobs. Also, we as racers don't buy over priced tiny prints. We buy CD's with all of our images from the day on there. They generally go for $40-$60.... although mine will be cheaper. I can give fair prices and STILL make a lot of money for a day's work.... plus the usual processing and uploading. So yeah, mercphoto, I am absolutely criticizing his prices and business model. In fact, the WHOLE club is! So, I'll keep my 18-200 out of the trash for now and I'll just rent proper lenses as I need them. That's pretty much what this post was about. The subpar guy uses a Canon 400mm and I haven't seen an aperture larger than 6 on any of the pics... not that that means much... and that's just from reading the data from his pics. Regardless of what he uses he is just not very good and his work speaks for itself. I KNOW mine will be better once I get a little practice. The club will be MUCH happier and I'll be glad to take care of them. I'm doing it as a hobby and maybe later I'll start a more serious business. Thanks for your replies.


nw scout, that's true... no place is 100% safe out there! Sorry about your hip! That sucks. 15 years is a good run without incident though. Congrats on that at least. lol Do you have a link to some of your pics? I wouldn't mind browsing some and I'm sure they are great.

I will look into pricing the 300 2.8 rental but I'm thinking the local camera shop won't even have one available.



Apex, I'm doing this because I love photography and want to help my club out..... while still making money. It's definitely just some freelance work as I don't have the equipment or experience to call myself THE track photographer yet. I will soon though I believe! Thanks for your help!!

mercphoto

I'm not going to go into what constitutes a "fair" price. You're doing this as a hobby for now and I think you're letting your friendship with these people getting in the way of pricing yourself properly. And as a hobby you're not focusing on the true business costs. As far as making a ton of money for a day's work at half the price this guy is charging I'd be really interested in knowing, after you get your 6th track day under your belt, how much money you are bringing in and if you feel it is as high as you expected and if its worth the work. Not after the first event, not after the third event.

It is interesting, however, that you feel compelled to price your shots, which you are convinced will be better, at a lower price.

Good luck.

ImageX Photography

mercphoto wrote: »

I'm not going to go into what constitutes a "fair" price. You're doing this as a hobby for now and I think you're letting your friendship with these people getting in the way of pricing yourself properly. And as a hobby you're not focusing on the true business costs. As far as making a ton of money for a day's work at half the price this guy is charging I'd be really interested in knowing, after you get your 6th track day under your belt, how much money you are bringing in and if you feel it is as high as you expected and if its worth the work. Not after the first event, not after the third event.

It is interesting, however, that you feel compelled to price your shots, which you are convinced will be better, at a lower price.

Good luck.

I have been on the other side of the lens for years. I know what people want and I know what they will pay... and I know what they WON'T pay. It's really quite simple. Yet you find it interesting because I have the confidence that I will be better than someone putting out lazy and overpriced garbage... that you haven't even seen no less? I won't be shooting in P mode or Auto mode all day like him. That alone will likely net me better results... AND more sales at fair prices. I think $30 per CD/rider (out of hundreds of riders) is a great price that people can and WILL afford. They surely are not going to pay $8 for a tiny 4 X 6 print. A sale is better than no sale.

mercphoto

You're missing the point of what I'm saying. You seem to think that lowering the price is going to net you more sales. $60 for a CD is a fair price. If you get more sales it will likely be because these people know you and because your photos probably will be better. But drop the price in half, do you think you'll get 2X the sales if the price goes in half? Or do you truly believe that quality motorsports photography is only worth that much to begin with? That's what I mean when you think you should be charging less for a better product. At the prices you seem to think are fair will you be able to pay for the equipment you want?

Again, I'm deferring until you get several events under your belt. Where your profits per event will be, and if you still consider it worth your time. You gotta admit, its an interesting question to ask.

ImageX Photography

mercphoto wrote: »

You're missing the point of what I'm saying. You seem to think that lowering the price is going to net you more sales. $60 for a CD is a fair price. If you get more sales it will likely be because these people know you and because your photos probably will be better. But drop the price in half, do you think you'll get 2X the sales if the price goes in half? Or do you truly believe that quality motorsports photography is only worth that much to begin with? That's what I mean when you think you should be charging less for a better product. At the prices you seem to think are fair will you be able to pay for the equipment you want?

Again, I'm deferring until you get several events under your belt. Where your profits per event will be, and if you still consider it worth your time. You gotta admit, its an interesting question to ask.

I think $60 is a fair price.... but not to our club. People won't pay it... because they just don't have it and/or they have tons of pics of themselves already. They will however pay $30 all day long. I'm not saying if I cut the prices in half that I would get twice the sales. I'm just saying that I know what people will and will not pay..... as far as our club is concerned... and that no sale is bad thing. I understand everything you are saying but I'd rather sell 10 CDs @ $300 than 3 CDs @ $180.


As far as your question.... I have no clue if it will still be worth the time after so many events. I guess that depends on sales. If they are priced too high..... there won't be many! That's all I'm saying. It HAS to be affordable for everyone to keep buying.

mercphoto

FocusPhotography wrote: »

I understand everything you are saying but I'd rather sell 10 CDs @ $300 than 3 CDs @ $180.

So would I! If I thought dropping my CD price in half resulted in greater net income I'd do it as well! I think you will be surprised though. You will probably find that photography is not that price elastic. If I'm wrong I'll be happy for you, but my personal experience and that of many others is different.

For example, I go through Exposure Manager rather than Smugmug because for event photography they have sales tools that blows SM out of the water. Coupons, packages, sell-fulfill items, sales, etc. I can run a sale or run a coupon that really brings the price down, but I won't see much impact to total sales volume, I'll just see a net drop in income to me. In other words, people either want the photos or they don't. And those that do are generally willing to pay the $60 figure for the CD or $10 for an individual file or even $8 for a 4x6.

I've been doing this since 2005. And I have been on both sides of the lens as well -- I used to race cars and karts. I have bought pictures of me on the track as well. I also understand the type of track photographer you are referring to, the high-speed-shutter guy with the boring pictures. And I know that the people who complained about my prices did not turn into customers even when I lowered my prices. And I suspect you'll find the same thing.

This is why I really am interested in what happens after your sixth event. (because the first event or two will likely garner a lot of sales purely because your shots will be different than the other guys were).

nw scout

FocusPhotography wrote: »

I won't be shooting in P mode or Auto mode all day like him. That alone will likely net me better results

This has almost nothing to do with good photos at the track!!!
Good action, light and composition are formost.

AT EVENTS I almost always shoot in AV at f4. Things happen fast, light is always changing, unpredictiable things are always happening, rider race lines are changing, people move in the way, ect.....................
You can always tweek an image in post to make it look better. But if you miss it because your manual settings were wrong and you had no time to change them, then that moment is gone!

ImageX Photography

mercphoto wrote: »

So would I! If I thought dropping my CD price in half resulted in greater net income I'd do it as well! I think you will be surprised though. You will probably find that photography is not that price elastic. If I'm wrong I'll be happy for you, but my personal experience and that of many others is different.

For example, I go through Exposure Manager rather than Smugmug because for event photography they have sales tools that blows SM out of the water. Coupons, packages, sell-fulfill items, sales, etc. I can run a sale or run a coupon that really brings the price down, but I won't see much impact to total sales volume, I'll just see a net drop in income to me. In other words, people either want the photos or they don't. And those that do are generally willing to pay the $60 figure for the CD or $10 for an individual file or even $8 for a 4x6.

I've been doing this since 2005. And I have been on both sides of the lens as well -- I used to race cars and karts. I have bought pictures of me on the track as well. I also understand the type of track photographer you are referring to, the high-speed-shutter guy with the boring pictures. And I know that the people who complained about my prices did not turn into customers even when I lowered my prices. And I suspect you'll find the same thing.

This is why I really am interested in what happens after your sixth event. (because the first event or two will likely garner a lot of sales purely because your shots will be different than the other guys were).

I do agree with most everything you are saying and I realize that you DO know better than I. If I get to where I want to be with my photos.... than they would totally be worth $60 per CD and people would buy them up. I am likely a ways from that yet though. I hope to offer above average photos for now at bargain pricing. Price increases would come later when my images themselves demanded it. I also 100% agree that sales will likely drop off after the first few events for the reasons you stated. At least until I get to where I want to be anyway. Times are tough for everyone right now and I just think it's better to offer affordable prices that EVERYONE can afford. I think that's the key for now.... everyone. It will also help get my name out faster and all that. Maybe I'll start with $40 or $45 and creep up from there. I won't really know until I see my results.

I do appreciate your help and advice though. Your feedback from your experience is quite helpful. I am going to check out Exposure Manager too! I was just about to drop the $150 for SM. Thanks for good timing!

torags

I would also consider a 70/300 variable aperture lens. They're reasonable and can keep initial costs down.

mercphoto is being up front with you and making some sound points. Truth be told, many times the quality (as determined by the photog) doesn't necessarily sell the print. An amazing capture that may be poorly done could be a good seller. The buyer doesn't always have a keen eye.

mercphoto

Definitely check out Exposure Manager. Here's an idea for pricing for you that EM sales tools will let you do. Set yourself up a price sheet that starts you at the prices that are more traditional. In other words, price yourself above what you currently think is fair and is more in line with what established photographer's charge. Now after an event set yourself up a multi-use coupon, or a discount (there are a few ways to get this done with EM) that lowers the price down to what you want to charge today. And put that discount/coupon on a one-week expiration. If they don't order quick they pay more. This will do a few things for you. One, it will encourage the quick purchase (besides, most sales of any given event will happen within that first week anyway). Two, it will give you the impression of giving the early bird a discount. Three, it conveys to the customer that you are a quality guy who gives a quality product that is priced appropriately (when not on sale).

By the way, I know of no way to do that sort of thing with Smugmug...

The hardest part is going to that of raising the prices if you ever feel the need to. You do have a leg up here in that you know these people and it is probably easier to say to them "look guys, this is a lot harder and more work than any of us ever thought. You know me, you can trust me on this, I need a higher price to justify this amount of work".

mercphoto

Here's a referral link for Exposure Manager for you, or for anyone else.

http://www.exposuremanager.com/aff/mercphoto

IdahoMotomom

Do not be surprised if you "friends" ask for you to email them a photo here, and there, and here, and there. You will be surprised at how many friends that encourage you to start charging are the ones that think they are good enough friends to get the product for free. Just sayin....

FocusPhotography wrote: »

While as some of you have great points, you need to understand that this is MY club. Them guys are mostly my friends. QUOTE]

ImageX Photography

mercphoto wrote: »

Definitely check out Exposure Manager. Here's an idea for pricing for you that EM sales tools will let you do. Set yourself up a price sheet that starts you at the prices that are more traditional. In other words, price yourself above what you currently think is fair and is more in line with what established photographer's charge. Now after an event set yourself up a multi-use coupon, or a discount (there are a few ways to get this done with EM) that lowers the price down to what you want to charge today. And put that discount/coupon on a one-week expiration. If they don't order quick they pay more. This will do a few things for you. One, it will encourage the quick purchase (besides, most sales of any given event will happen within that first week anyway). Two, it will give you the impression of giving the early bird a discount. Three, it conveys to the customer that you are a quality guy who gives a quality product that is priced appropriately (when not on sale).

By the way, I know of no way to do that sort of thing with Smugmug...

The hardest part is going to that of raising the prices if you ever feel the need to. You do have a leg up here in that you know these people and it is probably easier to say to them "look guys, this is a lot harder and more work than any of us ever thought. You know me, you can trust me on this, I need a higher price to justify this amount of work".

Love that idea!!!! It is just good all the way around. I can keep my prices in line, encourage quick sales, AND still give a deal to everyone if I want to. Thanks!!!

I'll have to check out that link. After I posted a few hours ago, I signed up right away for the Event Trial. Can I still get you the referral?


I went and checked out the 70-400 Nikon. I think that is what I am going to shoot with.... most of the time. I have my 18-200 and 35mm 1.8 for the paddock if I want. The 400 seemed like it will be pretty good for my first track go around. $40 isn't bad for a day. It will get me so many more angles!

ImageX Photography

nw scout wrote: »

This has almost nothing to do with good photos at the track!!!
Good action, light and composition are formost.

AT EVENTS I almost always shoot in AV at f4. Things happen fast, light is always changing, unpredictiable things are always happening, rider race lines are changing, people move in the way, ect.....................
You can always tweek an image in post to make it look better. But if you miss it because your manual settings were wrong and you had no time to change them, then that moment is gone!

Shutter speed is pretty important for action, isn't it? From my understanding, the camera will usually select too fast of a shutter speed in P or Auto. I was going to play around with Shutter Priority as well as Aperture Priority. I want to practice some panning shots for sure. I'll have hundreds and hundreds of tries. I will be on the track all day long. 7 hours.

ImageX Photography

IdahoMotomom wrote: »

Do not be surprised if you "friends" ask for you to email them a photo here, and there, and here, and there. You will be surprised at how many friends that encourage you to start charging are the ones that think they are good enough friends to get the product for free. Just sayin....

FocusPhotography wrote: »

While as some of you have great points, you need to understand that this is MY club. Them guys are mostly my friends. QUOTE]

Oh, I have definitely thought about that. My solution is using two of my closest friends and fastest racers. They already have a million shots from over the years and probably wouldn't buy anyway. So, their pictures are what I will use top display Hi Res unwatermarked images for all to see the quality. Everyone else will get small watermarked images to review.

I am also going to upload them all and say that that's where they are.... go and get them. I have too many friends who will want free shots BUT only two are getting them no matter what. I'll give my closer friends a discount to make them feel special and then explain that I can't make any money if I give them away to everyone.... even though they are all my friends. Some will surely frown on that and not buy..... but the point will be made for later events and/or after they "get over it". I have DEFINITELY been thinking about everyone expecting free pics. Guess I'll see how it all goes!

ImageX Photography

mercphoto wrote: »

Definitely check out Exposure Manager. Here's an idea for pricing for you that EM sales tools will let you do. Set yourself up a price sheet that starts you at the prices that are more traditional. In other words, price yourself above what you currently think is fair and is more in line with what established photographer's charge. Now after an event set yourself up a multi-use coupon, or a discount (there are a few ways to get this done with EM) that lowers the price down to what you want to charge today. And put that discount/coupon on a one-week expiration. If they don't order quick they pay more. This will do a few things for you. One, it will encourage the quick purchase (besides, most sales of any given event will happen within that first week anyway). Two, it will give you the impression of giving the early bird a discount. Three, it conveys to the customer that you are a quality guy who gives a quality product that is priced appropriately (when not on sale).

By the way, I know of no way to do that sort of thing with Smugmug...

I almost forgot. You can setup "coupon" codes on Smugmug. You can set the price or % discount. You could just make a early bird coupon..... and then delete the coupon code after a week or whenver. You can have multiple coupons for specific friends, family, or whoever.... from my understanding.


Also, I didn't see where you could add watermarks on EM. That's what I almost have to do or people will be right clicking or "the other way" to get screenshots to crop. Watermarks are the only sure security. But you know all this better than I. lol How do you watermark your images? Have a fast and easy way to recommend? lol

chuckinsocal

I have my 18-200 but I also want to rent a nicer lens with more range and or quality.

I am an amateur and have never shot anything like this

I was going to rent a Nikon 80-200 2.8 but now I am thinking about the Nikon 80-400mm f/4.5-5.6D. What do ya's think? I have never shot with either lens.

I'm going to be doing a lot of experimenting when I first go out on the track. I have only had my D300S for a few weeks now.

Given the above, it appears that you have a lot to learn and that will be extremely overwhelming on the first few events. Adding new lenses to the equation will make it even more overwhelming and will border on a melt down increasing your risk of failure or burn out. I would learn with what I have first and when comfortable with that then experiment with new lenses and whatnot.

As for the other issues, and speaking from experience, it can be a bitch when fantasy collides with reality. Just say'n. Take it one step as a time. It's not gonna come easily over night.

BCSPhotoguy

chuckinsocal wrote: »

As for the other issues, and speaking from experience, it can be a bitch when fantasy collides with reality. Just say'n. Take it one step as a time. It's not gonna come easily over night.

Amen! I have been doing track days for a few years. I was suprised to see some of my good friends taking a P&S camera and taking pics off the monitor to display elsewhere. Of course, we had a 'discussion' over that. Some people wont pay even the lowest price.

There are alot of good points posted here. I have been amazed that no one has brought up WHY you need better equipment at the track. No comments on focus speed etc. If i missed it - my bad! I have been following the thread between home and work. Anyhow, keep us updated on how the first one goes - or few go.

I dont want to go on about the pricing as others have made great points. But somethings i keep in mind. My gear isnt cheap, my talent isnt cheap and my time isnt cheap ( I remind myself of that one after about hour #5!)

ImageX Photography

BCSPhotoguy wrote: »

Amen! I have been doing track days for a few years. I was suprised to see some of my good friends taking a P&S camera and taking pics off the monitor to display elsewhere. Of course, we had a 'discussion' over that. Some people wont pay even the lowest price.

There are alot of good points posted here. I have been amazed that no one has brought up WHY you need better equipment at the track. No comments on focus speed etc. If i missed it - my bad! I have been following the thread between home and work. Anyhow, keep us updated on how the first one goes - or few go.

I dont want to go on about the pricing as others have made great points. But somethings i keep in mind. My gear isnt cheap, my talent isnt cheap and my time isnt cheap ( I remind myself of that one after about hour #5!)

I want more zoom range which.... will give me more angles. The thread really wasn't suppose to be about running a photography business. I just wanted to know what was the preferred glass for a motorsports road course. Good discussion though.


Update: After reviewing some sample shots of the 70-400 that i took today..... i am rather disappointed in the softness at full zoom. So much so that I wouldn't dare trying to sell them..... unless it was a special shot. I have one more store to call to see if they have the 300 2.8. Not sure what I am gonna do if they don't have that.

ImageX Photography

chuckinsocal wrote: »

Given the above, it appears that you have a lot to learn and that will be extremely overwhelming on the first few events. Adding new lenses to the equation will make it even more overwhelming and will border on a melt down increasing your risk of failure or burn out. I would learn with what I have first and when comfortable with that then experiment with new lenses and whatnot.

As for the other issues, and speaking from experience, it can be a bitch when fantasy collides with reality. Just say'n. Take it one step as a time. It's not gonna come easily over night.

I'm learning my camera rather quickly and will have plenty of time to dial it in out on the track. I'm not scared to try a new lense. lol I'll have my 18-200 right with me for a fail safe. It's not like I'm on the line to do a good job. No one "hired" me and I essentially just had my request granted to get out on the track. No one is expecting anything but everyone likes good images. I do understand what your saying and I agree. I'm really just not under any pressure whatsoever. That makes it much easier.

ImageX Photography

Just wanted to add that I am really happy with my 18-200. I could probably be just fine with that but I do want more zoom range for the added angles. Here's a couple pics with the 18-200. Sorry about the size. Too lazy to resize them again. haha

nw scout

FocusPhotography wrote: »

Shutter speed is pretty important for action, isn't it? From my understanding, the camera will usually select too fast of a shutter speed in P or Auto. I was going to play around with Shutter Priority as well as Aperture Priority. I want to practice some panning shots for sure. I'll have hundreds and hundreds of tries. I will be on the track all day long. 7 hours.

Shutter speed is very important, but can be used in totally different ways.
You need a fast shutter speed to stop action and a slow shutter speed to show motion.
This everyone knows.

The reason I leave my camera on AV at F4 most of the time at events is simple. I am the least likely to ever miss a shot at that setting.
Sure I adjust off of that setting a bunch throughout the day but as I move around from location to location and for many general shots, thats a setting that always works.

A sharp subject at these events is a must!!! Anything else can be changed later but if its not sharp to start off with then your in trouble.
Why AV over TP? For what I do, I just like it better, and it has the least chances for exposure problems.
If you are at TV at 1/500 and around F4 then all of a sudden a huge dark cloud rolls over the sun the second before you shoot, now you have an image that is 3 or 4 stops underexposed and goes in the trash. The same shot in AV goes to a slower shutter speed but most of the time I have more than enough leeway to still get a sharp image.

Everyone shoots differently, this is just what has worked best for me over the years.


Again, this is just settings for events.
On advertising or editorial jobs I shoot totally different because the environment is controlled and lighting is involved.
I shoot all manual on these types of jobs